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Religion, Politics and World Events They make great dinner conversation, don't you think? plus Political Film

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Old 08-12-15, 07:12 PM   #76
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Re: One and only legal cannabis thread

From what I understand, the threshold for legal impairment is so low that a regular smoker can test positive on a blood test the morning after smoking (5 nanograms per milliliter of blood). The level was set by the writers of the initiative that legalized rec marijuana in the state, but it has very little scientific research behind it. Of course, before the initiative was passed there was no legal limit.
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Old 08-13-15, 03:22 PM   #77
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Re: One and only legal cannabis thread

I have a question for the smokers here: I've never smoked or known people who did and have recently started dating somebody who smokes pretty much everyday. He seems to be functioning well but I'm still worried it might have a negative impact on his life or on our relationship. Any thoughts?
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Old 08-13-15, 06:02 PM   #78
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Re: One and only legal cannabis thread

Get ready for him to forget your birthday, favorite color and mother's maiden name.

Seriously, it just comes down to how well your personalities click -- I know plenty of smokers who are married to or are dating non-smokers. It's really a non-issue for most of them. It sure beats being in a relationship with an alcoholic.

You'll have to get used to the fact that he'll be more forgetful and mellow during certain times of the day. The biggest negative impact he could face are legal troubles and drain on his wallet. Positive impacts: He's probably a more easy-going guy to hang out with when he's high.
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Old 08-14-15, 08:28 AM   #79
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Re: One and only legal cannabis thread

I know the memory thing was tongue and cheek, but a study showed that taking ibuprofen counteracts the memory "haze."

http://www.healthline.com/health-new...na-haze-112113
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Old 08-14-15, 08:29 AM   #80
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Re: One and only legal cannabis thread

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Originally Posted by Howiefan View Post
I have a question for the smokers here: I've never smoked or known people who did and have recently started dating somebody who smokes pretty much everyday. He seems to be functioning well but I'm still worried it might have a negative impact on his life or on our relationship. Any thoughts?
You are far and away better off with a guy who smokes daily than with a guy who drinks weekly.
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Old 08-14-15, 10:00 AM   #81
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Re: One and only legal cannabis thread

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Originally Posted by Howiefan View Post
I have a question for the smokers here: I've never smoked or known people who did and have recently started dating somebody who smokes pretty much everyday. He seems to be functioning well but I'm still worried it might have a negative impact on his life or on our relationship. Any thoughts?
So, the guy you decided that you like and want to spend time smokes regularly? That's part of the guy that you decided you like and want to spend time with! Why should it bother you? He was probably high when he was hanging out with you, before you even knew he was a smoker.

Smoking every day is no big deal. Ripping bong hits 5 minutes after he wakes up, every day, that might concern me.
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Old 08-14-15, 10:04 AM   #82
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Re: One and only legal cannabis thread

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You are far and away better off with a guy who smokes daily than with a guy who drinks weekly.
It's like anything else. It can be done to excess or not. There's nothing wrong with someone who has two or three glasses of wine on a Saturday night; there's something wrong with someone who gets blackout drunk every weekend. And there's nothing wrong with someone who smokes up most nights but there's something wrong with someone who spends all day every day getting high.
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Old 08-19-15, 08:40 AM   #83
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Re: One and only legal cannabis thread

The Menominee tribe here is having a referendum this week...how does this work? Would it only be for tribal members, or could anybody purchase from a dispensary on the reservation?

http://www.greenbaypressgazette.com/...ndum/30526187/

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Menominee Indian Tribe members will soon have a chance to weigh in on whether marijuana should be legal for recreational and medicinal use on their reservation in northeastern Wisconsin.

The tribe plans to hold a referendum vote on Aug. 19-20 to find out how its members feel about legalizing the drug. Members will be asked whether medical marijuana use should be allowed and whether anyone age 21 or older should be allowed to use the drug recreationally on the Menominee Indian Reservation.

"This is just a start," said Gary Besaw, chairman of the Keshena-based tribe. "We'll see if the tribal membership wants us to move forward and wants us to commit more energy toward this."

In 2013, the U.S. Department of Justice issued a memorandum allowing tribes to grow or sell marijuana on reservations if they follow eight guidelines. Unlike other tribes in the state, the Menominee tribe is able to take advantage of the memo because it answers to federal prosecutors.

If the referendum shows wide-ranging support for legalizing marijuana, tribal leaders want to conduct extensive research, so it could be a while before any new rules are established.

"We have a lot of concern about the social and legal implications that might come with this and we also know what the research is showing on some of the medical implications," Besaw said.

If the tribe decides to proceed with legalization, members will only be able to smoke marijuana legally on tribal land and there will be restrictions on where they can use it in public. They'll also be required to obtain a license in order to grow marijuana.

Many tribal members are in favor of legalizing marijuana, according to WLUK-TV of Green Bay

"I am for it, totally for it," said Kayla Chevalier of Neopit.

Some tribal members are against it, and others don't have much of an opinion.

"I don't care if it gets passed or not. I don't smoke or anything, but I know it helps with medical purposes, so there could be tribal members that need it," said Jon Tucker of Shawano.
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Old 08-19-15, 02:27 PM   #84
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Re: One and only legal cannabis thread

Idaho replaces mile marker 420 with 419.9 in attempt to thwart stoners

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BOISE, Idaho — If you're looking for milepost 420, you won't find it in Idaho.

Idaho transportation officials say the mile marker has been replaced with 419.9 signs to curb thieves eager to own a number associated with marijuana enthusiasts.

Turns out, Idaho isn't alone in this problem. States like Washington and Colorado have also replaced 420 signs with 419.9 after consistently having to replace them after thefts by supposed sticky-fingered stoners.

Adam Rush of the Idaho Transportation Department says officials have replaced the old sign along U.S. Highway 95 with "MILE 419.9," just south of Coeur d'Alene.

Rush added that this is the only 420 sign the department has replaced in Idaho, a state known for its strict anti-marijuana laws despite being nearly surrounded by states with relaxed pot regulations.

Most highways in the country don't cover more than 400 miles. For example, Oregon has been spared the spike in sign thefts due to having no highways long enough to reach past a 400 milepost, even though it recently legalized marijuana.

"Having a sign removed from a highway is pretty rare," Rush said. "In Idaho, people will shoot at them or write on them before stealing them completely. We spend more time mending signs than replacing them."

Rush said that the department didn't want to leave the milepost empty because the signs can be valuable for drivers tracking their journey.

The number "420" has long been associated with marijuana, though its origins as a shorthand for pot are murky.

Washington has two highways long enough to have 420 mileposts that have both been plagued by thieves snatching the sign over the years, said Barbara LaBoe, spokeswoman for the Washington State. That all stopped three years ago — the same time voters legalized pot — when officials replaced one of the signs with 419.9 along Highway 20 near the Idaho border.

The other sign on U.S. Highway 12 remains missing, with no immediate plans to be replaced, LaBoe said.

Sometimes a 420 milepost doesn't need to be stolen to make the news. In Montana, the state's largest pot busts occurred while pulling over a driver at milepost 420 along Interstate 90. Law enforcement officials found 115 pounds of marijuana hidden in the car.
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Old 08-19-15, 03:49 PM   #85
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Re: One and only legal cannabis thread

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Originally Posted by aktick View Post
The Menominee tribe here is having a referendum this week...how does this work? Would it only be for tribal members, or could anybody purchase from a dispensary on the reservation?

http://www.greenbaypressgazette.com/...ndum/30526187/
This is a very tricky question, because tribal lands are actually federal lands held in trust for the tribe. So, while MJ is still illegal everywhere regardless of what state law says, that is more complicated by it being tribal land. However, I do believe that the feds have taken the same stance WRT to tribes that they have with states, so if a tribe chooses to make it legal, the feds will not interfere so long as certain safeguards are in place.

As for non-tribal members being allowed to purchase, well, that would depend on what they passed, but assuming there's no prohibition on it, non-members would be able to purchase. Of course, as soon as they leave the reservation they would once again be subject to state law.

This is a thumbnail answer for a very confusing subject. People are still trying to figure this one out.
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Old 08-19-15, 04:47 PM   #86
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Re: One and only legal cannabis thread

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It's like anything else. It can be done to excess or not. There's nothing wrong with someone who has two or three glasses of wine on a Saturday night; there's something wrong with someone who gets blackout drunk every weekend. And there's nothing wrong with someone who smokes up most nights but there's something wrong with someone who spends all day every day getting high.
I personally think getting high every day, even if only at night after work, is also a really bad habit in most cases. It really does start to fuck with your head after a while. Most experienced smokers who have done so will acknowledge this. There are certainly worse things, though.
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Old 08-19-15, 06:03 PM   #87
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Re: One and only legal cannabis thread

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Originally Posted by Nausicaa View Post
I personally think getting high every day, even if only at night after work, is also a really bad habit in most cases. It really does start to fuck with your head after a while. Most experienced smokers who have done so will acknowledge this. There are certainly worse things, though.
Now that I think about it, I tend to agree with you.
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Old 08-20-15, 09:19 AM   #88
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Re: One and only legal cannabis thread

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Originally Posted by Nausicaa View Post
I personally think getting high every day, even if only at night after work, is also a really bad habit in most cases. It really does start to fuck with your head after a while. Most experienced smokers who have done so will acknowledge this. There are certainly worse things, though.
I'm weary of things people think about marijuana simply because so many people think that it is addictive, it kills people, and every other malady one can come up with it. So why do you think this? What makes you think most experienced smokers would agree? Are any of these thoughts based on studies, etc., or are they just "intuition?"

Here is a recent study about long term effects. 22 year study of 14 year olds. Most interesting to me is the fact that there have been recent discussions that teens using could be really bad because their brains aren't fully formed yet.

The meat of the article
Quote:
For the particular study, the subjects were classified into four groups in accordance to their reported use of marijuana. The percentage per groups are as follows: 46 percent were low or non-users, 22 percent were early chronic users, 11 percent were marijuana users only during adolescence and 21 percent were late-adolescent users, who continued using marijuana.

The findings of the study, published [pdf] in the Psychology of Addictive Behaviors, show that the subjects who engaged in chronic marijuana use did not exhibit more risks of developing physical and mental health issues during their mid-30s. As a matter of fact, the researchers wrote, no notable differences were seen between the health prognoses of marijuana trajectory groups, despite the absence of possible confounding controls on the models. This finding is said to be specifically outstanding because those who were categorized under the chronic users group have an average marijuana use of once per week during their late teenage years and persisted with the habit in a rate of about three to four times per week when they were 20-26 years old.
And don't get me wrong, I'm not saying you are wrong, but I want to understand why you believe this, even if it is just anecdotal.
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Old 08-20-15, 10:34 AM   #89
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Re: One and only legal cannabis thread



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Old 08-20-15, 10:57 AM   #90
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Re: One and only legal cannabis thread

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Originally Posted by kvrdave View Post
I'm weary of things people think about marijuana simply because so many people think that it is addictive, it kills people, and every other malady one can come up with it. So why do you think this? What makes you think most experienced smokers would agree? Are any of these thoughts based on studies, etc., or are they just "intuition?"

Here is a recent study about long term effects. 22 year study of 14 year olds. Most interesting to me is the fact that there have been recent discussions that teens using could be really bad because their brains aren't fully formed yet.

The meat of the article


And don't get me wrong, I'm not saying you are wrong, but I want to understand why you believe this, even if it is just anecdotal.
In my experience -- and it's purely anecdotal -- people who smoke daily tend to be less motivated in general. It may be a correlation rather than a causal factor, though.

I've also heard (but not researched it, so I don't know) that chronic use can exacerbate pre-existing mental health issues. This is different from the claim refuted in the article you posted (which is about use causing new mental health issues).

None of this means I think it should be illegal. To the contrary, I think it should be legal. But I would still be wary of getting into a relationship with someone who is a daily smoker, much as I'd be wary of getting into a relationship with someone who gets drunk every night.
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Old 08-20-15, 12:33 PM   #91
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Re: One and only legal cannabis thread

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In my experience -- and it's purely anecdotal -- people who smoke daily tend to be less motivated in general. It may be a correlation rather than a causal factor, though.

I've also heard (but not researched it, so I don't know) that chronic use can exacerbate pre-existing mental health issues. This is different from the claim refuted in the article you posted (which is about use causing new mental health issues).
I get what you are saying, I'm just trying to really question all the opinions I have on this because so many new things challenge them. We tend to think about stereotypical things like being less motivated and sitting on the couch, and having the munchies. But there was a pretty good CBS News thing a few years ago showing that marijuana users are less likely to be obese. No cause and effect intended, but it certainly is the opposite of the stereotype. I remember an article on reddit (can't find at the moment) that showed a study where daily users had a lower risk of lung cancer than people that don't even smoke at all.

Quote:
None of this means I think it should be illegal. To the contrary, I think it should be legal. But I would still be wary of getting into a relationship with someone who is a daily smoker, much as I'd be wary of getting into a relationship with someone who gets drunk every night.
Now that's interesting. Would you feel the same way with someone taking anti-depressants every night, or is this more of a gut reaction? I'm not trying to make this a "marijuana is medicine" type thing (even though the US has the patent on it) and we can even leave that out of it. But what health risks do you see from marijuana use that would be comparable to drinking? I completely agree about someone who gets drunk every night, but what is it about someone getting stoned every night that becomes comparable to the drunkard? Is it as simple as "I would simply not choose to be around a person who got stoned every night," or is there a basis for that statement?

Obviously not trying to argue and debate, just free flowing thoughts.
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Old 08-20-15, 02:09 PM   #92
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Re: One and only legal cannabis thread

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Now that's interesting. Would you feel the same way with someone taking anti-depressants every night, or is this more of a gut reaction? I'm not trying to make this a "marijuana is medicine" type thing (even though the US has the patent on it) and we can even leave that out of it. But what health risks do you see from marijuana use that would be comparable to drinking? I completely agree about someone who gets drunk every night, but what is it about someone getting stoned every night that becomes comparable to the drunkard? Is it as simple as "I would simply not choose to be around a person who got stoned every night," or is there a basis for that statement?

Obviously not trying to argue and debate, just free flowing thoughts.
I do see marijuana as having medicinal benefits (but so does alcohol, which in moderation promotes heart health). But it's not really a health issue, so much as it is that I wouldn't want to be around a person who gets high (or drunk) every night. And a lot of this is purely personal and reactionary, as I watched my ex go from a medicinal marijuana user to someone who was getting high to avoid dealing with other things in her life, and that in turn ultimately led to our break-up.

I guess my take-away is that recreational drugs (and I include alcohol) are a tool to escape from reality. And we all can use with a little escape now and then, but when it gets to the point where you are relying on constantly escaping, that's a red flag for me.

But I also agree that in terms of physical/physiological effects, the current science seems to strongly suggest that alcohol is a lot worse than marijuana. I would expect a chronic heavy drinker to face long-term liver or other problems, while I don't think there's any corresponding physical problems associated with long-term marijuana use (even long-term smoking doesn't appear to cause the same lung problems that long-term tobacco smoking does).
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Old 08-20-15, 02:15 PM   #93
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Re: One and only legal cannabis thread

My anecdotal evidence has led me to the conclusion that smoking every night is indeed a bad habit, much like excessive masturbation, MMORPGs, drinking soda and DVD collecting. All of the daily smokers I know have good jobs, are reasonably fit, have college degrees and stable relationships. I haven't seen much evidence of the amotivational syndrome rearing its ugly, pimpled head. Are they better off because they smoke regularly? Probably not, but it doesn't seem to be causing huge problems.

I spent a few years of my 20s as a regular smoker. I kept my job, stayed in shape and my personal relationshps didn't suffer. The affects on my memory were quite annoying, though. I was spacier and likely suffered a few points drops on the IQ scale. For example, there are a few movies that I know I watched during this time period but I very little recollection of their plot details. So I kicked the habit (which was quiet easy to do) when smoking lost the fun factor. The mental haze, which was never terrible to begin with, faded away and the amount of time I spent reading books vs. playing video games and watching movies increased.

The wake and bakers that I've known, on the other hand, have had some serious problems in regard to personal relationships and employment. For those folks, I suspect there are underlying mental problems that are interfering with their daily lives. The MJ use is their attempt to self-medicate for whatever woes ail them.
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Old 08-20-15, 02:20 PM   #94
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Re: One and only legal cannabis thread

http://www.healthline.com/health-new...-haze-112113#1

Now that it can actually be studied, it has been found that ibuprofen negates the memory issue.
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Old 08-20-15, 03:05 PM   #95
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Re: One and only legal cannabis thread

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http://www.healthline.com/health-new...-haze-112113#1

Now that it can actually be studied, it has been found that ibuprofen negates the memory issue.
That's good news for people using MJ for pain management, who might be taking the ibuprofen already (it kills the buzz, unfortunately). Regular use of that stuff can wreak havoc on your stomach, though. I'd choose hazy memory over bleeding ulcers any day.
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Old 08-20-15, 03:10 PM   #96
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Re: One and only legal cannabis thread

JasonF, twice now you've equated getting high with getting drunk. As in, the person who smokes daily is doing essentially the same thing as the person getting drunk daily. Do you really think they're the same? Is having a beer or two (glass of wine or two) "getting drunk" to you? Or is that different and no big deal? Because most of the people I know who smoke regularly (many nights of the week) would equate having a few hits to the same as having a beer or two. They're not wasted or super-impaired, they are just looking for and getting a little relaxation buzz.

Most people who smoke understand the difference, but people who don't think having a few puffs gets you wasted. That may be so when you're new to smoking, but certainly not so for someone who has smoked for a while. Stated another way, I know plenty of people who could smoke and then talk to you and you would have absolutely no idea that they had, much like you wouldn't know that someone had drank a beer 10 minutes before talking to you. Now if someone had drank a six pack, you'd be able to tell, much like you'd be able to tell if they had been taking bong hit after bong hit for the last hour.
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Old 08-21-15, 10:05 AM   #97
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Re: One and only legal cannabis thread

I will just add that I do think for kvrdave it's appropriate to equate getting high with getting drunk, because that dude gets wasted!
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Old 08-21-15, 10:13 AM   #98
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Re: One and only legal cannabis thread

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JasonF, twice now you've equated getting high with getting drunk. As in, the person who smokes daily is doing essentially the same thing as the person getting drunk daily. Do you really think they're the same? Is having a beer or two (glass of wine or two) "getting drunk" to you? Or is that different and no big deal? Because most of the people I know who smoke regularly (many nights of the week) would equate having a few hits to the same as having a beer or two. They're not wasted or super-impaired, they are just looking for and getting a little relaxation buzz.

Most people who smoke understand the difference, but people who don't think having a few puffs gets you wasted. That may be so when you're new to smoking, but certainly not so for someone who has smoked for a while. Stated another way, I know plenty of people who could smoke and then talk to you and you would have absolutely no idea that they had, much like you wouldn't know that someone had drank a beer 10 minutes before talking to you. Now if someone had drank a six pack, you'd be able to tell, much like you'd be able to tell if they had been taking bong hit after bong hit for the last hour.
Tough questions. As mentioned, I watch my ex go from someone who smoked for medicinal purposes and maybe to get a little high to someone who would walk around in a perpetual stoned state, so I can't really be objective about this. I'll fall back to my original position -- like alcohol, you can use it or you can abuse it. I don't know where the line is, but to whoever was initially asking about whether it's OK to be in a relatonship with someone who smokes, I would say, you need to determine whether the person is using or abusing (as you define those terms) and make your decision accordingly.
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Old 08-21-15, 07:03 PM   #99
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Re: One and only legal cannabis thread

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I will just add that I do think for kvrdave it's appropriate to equate getting high with getting drunk, because that dude gets wasted!




But in other news, the National Cancer Institute now includes a cannabis page that details trials and science going on, and how it appears to be beneficial as a cancer treatment. But also the real story....the primary government agency for which cancer research is conducted and they are reporting medical science, yet it is still a schedule I drug with no medical benefits whatsoever. The National Cancer Institute is obviously one of the agencies that is under the Dept. of Health and Human Services, which has a patent on medical marijuana, yet the same government that has these agencies still shows cannabis as a schedule I drug. And in fact the National Cancer Institute even says on its site, "Cannabinoids may be able to kill cancer cells while protecting normal cells,” while the DEA and the government continue on as though this is heroin, but that should be no surprise given that the last head of the DEA couldn't even say that marijuana was safer than heroin when testifying in front of a Senate committee.

Is there anyone left that believes this should be illegal? Hell, looks to me like it might just need to be added to people's daily vitamin regime.
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Old 08-28-15, 06:21 AM   #100
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Re: One and only legal cannabis thread

ResponsibleOhio sues over marijuana ballot language

Quote:
COLUMBUS – ResponsibleOhio is taking their complaints about what they say is misleading and partisan language on the November ballot to the Ohio Supreme Court.

The group promoting marijuana legalization demanded that the court remove language from the ballot initiative that ResponsibleOhio says was drafted intentionally to confuse voters, according to a 139-page complaint filed Thursday. The wording was approved last week by the GOP-controlled ballot board in a 3-2 vote along party lines.

The group says language headed to the November ballot overstates how much pot could be sold or swapped and doesn't make it clear that any store selling marijuana would need approval from local officials to set up shop, according to the court filing.

ResponsibleOhio also takes offense to the title drafted by Ohio Secretary of State Jon Husted, a Republican who opposes marijuana legalization. It reads: Issue 3 grants a monopoly for the commercial production and sale of marijuana for recreational and medicinal purposes.

But opponents of the marijuana proposal say the language is fair and properly describes how ResponsibleOhio is trying to manipulate the state constitution.

"If the supporters of Issue 3 didn't want Ohioans to call their plan a monopoly, the shouldn't have asked them to write a monopoly into their Constitution," Husted spokesman Joshua Eck said.

ResponsibleOhio's proposal would create 10 commercial pot farms in specific locations across the state and allow individuals to grow up to four flowering plants for personal use with a license. Individuals older than 21 could smoke pot legally if the ballot proposal passes.

Another proposal from lawmakers, Issue 2, would prohibit economic monopolies from being written into the state constitution. If Ohioans approve both measures, Husted said the lawmakers' ban on monopolies would trump marijuana legalization. The debate would likely be solved in court.
The full ballot language can be found here (PDF). I don't understand the "approval from local officials" complaint in particular, since the ballot language mentions the need for facilities, stores, and dispensaries to apply for a license in two separate locations.
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