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Old 04-16-10, 03:35 PM   #51
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Re: Running is stupid and it hurts

One things for sure: I've learned a lot more about the condition of Thor's feet and toenails over the last 2 weeks than I care to.
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Old 04-16-10, 05:13 PM   #52
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Re: Running is stupid and it hurts

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Urban myth...
please explain
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Old 04-16-10, 06:53 PM   #53
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Re: Running is stupid and it hurts

I can only do 8:25/mile but I started mid-January so I guess I should cut myself some slack

I love to run (and bike and swim). I run 5K twice a week for training and swim 64 laps in 1:05 or so and bike whatever I do in an hour (~17K).

My feet hurt, but I don't care lol They say everyone has their own personal treshold as to how much they can run a week mile-wise without injury. So far I'm right around 10 miles in a week for my max, no injury.
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Old 04-16-10, 07:18 PM   #54
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Re: Running is stupid and it hurts

8:25/mile for how long? That is my 5K race pace.
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Old 04-16-10, 07:31 PM   #55
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Re: Running is stupid and it hurts

Yeah, 8:25/mi is pretty fast. Good for you, Deb!
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Old 04-16-10, 10:06 PM   #56
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Re: Running is stupid and it hurts

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Originally Posted by Mabuse View Post
please explain
Most every recent research and studies show running to be very healthy and has excellent benefits including bone and muscle strength. And while other forms of exercise are surely good, most can't compete with running.

In addition, read the book, Born to Run, there is some evidence that humans were indeed "born to run". Especially for long distances.

And for full disclosure, I only took up running last year after being a person who thought running was stupid and I'd never do it. And I never had run before. I lost nearly 70 lbs doing elliptical (low impact). I did elliptical daily for 18 months and could go miles and miles and well over an hour at decent speed. It was nothing compared to running. Either in heart rate, intensity or something I like to call sweat factor.

I'm not a huge runner, I do 5k 3 times a week and run a mile 3 times a week. I occasionally stretch that out to 4 miles, but that is it. All on a treadmill.
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Old 04-16-10, 10:58 PM   #57
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Re: Running is stupid and it hurts

8:25 for one mile. My first 5K was 33:52 or 6.77 minutes per K or around 10.93 minutes per mile. But I try not to think how much that sucks and just think that in mid-January I couldn't run a minute Baby steps
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Old 04-17-10, 05:38 AM   #58
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Re: Running is stupid and it hurts

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Originally Posted by Sdallnct View Post
Most every recent research and studies show running to be very healthy and has excellent benefits including bone and muscle strength. And while other forms of exercise are surely good, most can't compete with running.

In addition, read the book, Born to Run, there is some evidence that humans were indeed "born to run". Especially for long distances.

And for full disclosure, I only took up running last year after being a person who thought running was stupid and I'd never do it. And I never had run before. I lost nearly 70 lbs doing elliptical (low impact). I did elliptical daily for 18 months and could go miles and miles and well over an hour at decent speed. It was nothing compared to running. Either in heart rate, intensity or something I like to call sweat factor.

I'm not a huge runner, I do 5k 3 times a week and run a mile 3 times a week. I occasionally stretch that out to 4 miles, but that is it. All on a treadmill.
Yeah, I find this article interesting, since people like to tell me running is bad for my knees.

http://well.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/0...lp-your-knees/

I haven't read "Born to Run", but I do think humans were made for long distance running.

I know a guy who ran the Trans Europe foot race in 2009. It was almost 2800 miles in 64 days straight. Started in Italy and ended in Norway.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trans_Europe_Foot_Race

He averaged in a day, close to what I would run in a whole week.

Makes the 20 mile run I'm about to go do seem really lame.
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Old 04-17-10, 10:40 AM   #59
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Re: Running is stupid and it hurts

Good article. I had not read that, but had read about some of the studies it references.

I started running last year at age 45 and I had concerns and "heard" all the bad things about running. Yet, I researched and read before starting which is where i found out 99% of that bad stuff is myth. My main purpose for was because of my job. I travel a lot for work and wanted cardio I could do any time, any where without special equipment (I couldn't travel with a bike for example, or hope to find a pool to swim in). Plus I was getting damn bored with the elliptical.

I did suffer one minor injury last year, a torn calf muscle. But both Dr and I agree the reason was because when I originally felt pain I didn't stop, and instead tried to "power through it". And the final "tear" that sidelined me was from stretching, not running. BTW, last several visits to my Dr. I have shown him my running logs. He looks at carefully and asks questions. And based in part on how my blood pressure is dropping and I'm slowly continuing to lose weight he encourages me to continue.

Running is not "terrible" for you. Not only that, but it is good for you and in most cases better than other things. For example, one recent study I read is that runners have much stronger bones than bikers. Again, not taking anything away from biking, but running...is wow...running!!

As with anything, if you already have problems, then running might be an issue. But that would be the case with anything.
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Old 04-18-10, 05:13 PM   #60
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Re: Running is stupid and it hurts

Bought some VFF today. I tried to map out a 1/4 mile. It's nothing, this is going to take some patience
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Old 04-18-10, 05:28 PM   #61
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Re: Running is stupid and it hurts

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Originally Posted by Venusian View Post
Bought some VFF today. I tried to map out a 1/4 mile. It's nothing, this is going to take some patience
Let us know how they work out. I've wanted to try either these or the Nike ones, but am not sure exactly where to use them, whether they can be used on trails. Also, like you, I think I will find it difficult to run 1/4 mile. Good luck to you.
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Old 04-18-10, 07:20 PM   #62
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Re: Running is stupid and it hurts

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Originally Posted by Sdallnct View Post
In addition, read the book, Born to Run, there is some evidence that humans were indeed "born to run". Especially for long distances.
Well early man probably did spend a lot of time running from sabertooth tigers.
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Old 04-18-10, 08:41 PM   #63
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Re: Running is stupid and it hurts

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Why do people run? I went for a run this morning. It was stupid and it hurts. It didn't hurt while I was running, but now there is pain in my body, which is my body's natural way of telling me not to run.

Do you run? And if so, why are you stupid?

Have you convinced yourself, by the fact that you kept running and your body stopped hurting after a while, that your body didn't simply give up on caring about you after numerous warnings?

Also: Ow.
Pain, when in moderation, is good for you. It stimulates growth. It also just...stimulates.
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Old 04-18-10, 09:07 PM   #64
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Re: Running is stupid and it hurts

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Well early man probably did spend a lot of time running from sabertooth tigers.
Well part of the theory goes that most 4 legged animal's can only breath once per stride. The limited oxygen limits how long they can run. Sure most 4 legged creatures can run faster than man, but only for short distances. Since humans can breath more often than once per stride they can continue to get oxygen as needed. There is a lot more "stuff" but that is what caught my eye.

What I found even more interesting in the book was reading about the ultra marathoners. I didn't know they even existed. But these guys just run all freaking day! And they race! 50, 100 miles!! DAMN!!

It's an easy read if your at all interested.
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Old 04-19-10, 06:05 PM   #65
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Re: Running is stupid and it hurts

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Originally Posted by Sdallnct View Post
there is some evidence that humans were indeed "born to run". Especially for long distances.
There's actually extensive, totally conclusive evidence that humans were born to run. That's how our cavemen forefathers "hunted" game, big groups of cavemen would run after an animal until it tired and then kill it. Many animals can run faster, but no animal can run longer than man.

The problem is that running was all that we were built for. And just because we were built for it doesn't mean that doing it is the best thing for long term health. There weren't any 65 year old cave men who could run-down a horse. Modern people who want to maximize their active years need to exercise in a way that prolongs life and allows them to maintain physical activity over a long lifespan (in other words: Low impact).
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Old 04-19-10, 06:17 PM   #66
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Re: Running is stupid and it hurts

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sdallnct View Post
Well part of the theory goes that most 4 legged animal's can only breath once per stride. The limited oxygen limits how long they can run. Sure most 4 legged creatures can run faster than man, but only for short distances. Since humans can breath more often than once per stride they can continue to get oxygen as needed. There is a lot more "stuff" but that is what caught my eye.
If I breathe more than once per stride, even at a walking pace, I will probably hyperventilate right away. You sure you don't have this reversed... or something? That seems like some super fast breathing and a bad idea.
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Old 04-19-10, 08:47 PM   #67
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Re: Running is stupid and it hurts

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If I breathe more than once per stride, even at a walking pace, I will probably hyperventilate right away. You sure you don't have this reversed... or something? That seems like some super fast breathing and a bad idea.
LOL...I might...I didn't get all that into the technical aspects of the book....I might have to re-read it. Most every other person I have talked to who has read it found it "life altering". I didn't. But want to keep an open mind....

BTW for those moving to barefoot running, the book does talk about that.
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Old 04-19-10, 09:06 PM   #68
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Re: Running is stupid and it hurts

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mabuse View Post
There's actually extensive, totally conclusive evidence that humans were born to run. That's how our cavemen forefathers "hunted" game, big groups of cavemen would run after an animal until it tired and then kill it. Many animals can run faster, but no animal can run longer than man.

The problem is that running was all that we were built for. And just because we were built for it doesn't mean that doing it is the best thing for long term health. There weren't any 65 year old cave men who could run-down a horse. Modern people who want to maximize their active years need to exercise in a way that prolongs life and allows them to maintain physical activity over a long lifespan (in other words: Low impact).
So your saying that runners have more injuries and/or less healthy in later years? What are their injuries? What is less healthy about them? Are there any studies that show that? As the article posted above mentions runs actually show less knee damage than non runners. Which is typically thought of as the reverse.

I'd love to read a modern study that shows runners are less healthy in later years.

A quick look found this, that states top distance runners stay healthier longer.

http://www.bsu.edu/news/article/0,1370,--55076,00.html

This one says runners slow the aging process and are more active in later years.

http://faithfulprogressive.blogspot....g-process.html

This one says running will have you live longer and healthier

http://www.healthnews.com/fitness-ex...hier-1572.html

This one seems to try to follow the logic that running will cause osteoarthritis but so far studies don't show that

http://www.jaoa.org/cgi/content/full/106/6/342

This one actually suggests you will live longer as be healthier

http://runningtimes.com/Article.aspx?ArticleID=16646

This part from the above study makes me want to go run more!

Chakravarty had 538 runners and 423 healthy non-runners, all at least 50 years old, fill out health-related surveys. The first survey was given in 1984, followed up by another 21 years later. While only 15% of the runners died during that period, 34% of non-runners did, yielding more than twice the death rate. In addition, the runners were less likely to be physically disabled at the conclusion of the study.
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Old 04-19-10, 09:28 PM   #69
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Re: Running is stupid and it hurts

Didn't Jim Fixx die of a heart attack--after running?
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Old 04-19-10, 10:44 PM   #70
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Re: Running is stupid and it hurts

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Didn't Jim Fixx die of a heart attack--after running?
Maybe...but if the last study I posted is true, for every 1 runner that dies, 2 non-runners die over the studies time line. Which group would be better to be in?
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Old 04-19-10, 11:25 PM   #71
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Re: Running is stupid and it hurts

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Originally Posted by Venusian View Post
Bought some VFF today. I tried to map out a 1/4 mile. It's nothing, this is going to take some patience
I just got mine in today and took it for a test run of a mile. Felt fine for the mile, but the arch in my left foot was cramping up near the end of the mile. I think that just means I have to adjust the way I run, but so far so good.
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Old 04-20-10, 04:28 AM   #72
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Re: Running is stupid and it hurts

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Originally Posted by Mabuse View Post
The problem is that running was all that we were built for. And just because we were built for it doesn't mean that doing it is the best thing for long term health. There weren't any 65 year old cave men who could run-down a horse. Modern people who want to maximize their active years need to exercise in a way that prolongs life and allows them to maintain physical activity over a long lifespan (in other words: Low impact).
There are many people in today's world that are 60 or older and still very active runners. There weren't any healthy 60 year old cavemen, not because running didn't keep them healthy, but because of a variety of other reasons. Cavemen didn't have medicine like we do today. If you got sick in those days, you were likely to die. Heck even the common cold was often fatal in those days. If you got injured, there were no doctors to do surgery to fix it. You break a bone, and it will always remain broken. People generally didn't live long in those days regardless of how physically active they were, and if somehow someone did manage to live until they were 60+ their bodies would be so ravaged by disease and injuries that no manner of physical activity would have helped.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Sessioner
Didn't Jim Fixx die of a heart attack--after running?
Yes he did, but it wasn't the running that directly caused the heart attack. He led a very unhealthy lifestyle for 30-some years before changing. He was a heavy smoker as well. No exercise is going to undo damage already done. Exercise will minimize future damage, but the past is the past. What's done is done. Changing his lifestyle did give him additional years to live, but it isn't going to magically erase all the past years of unhealthiness. If he had kept on living unhealthy, he would have most likely died in his 40s like his father rather than living into his 50s.

Some people tend to think that exercising gives them a license to eat whatever they want. This is not the case at all. If you eat unhealthy, you will still be unhealthy no matter if you exercise or not. Exercise isn't going to stop all those saturated fats from clogging your arteries and heart. It is more than possible to exercise a lot and still be very unhealthy internally. To be healthy you need to exercise and eat healthy. You cannot do one without the other and still be healthy.
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Old 04-20-10, 08:10 AM   #73
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Re: Running is stupid and it hurts

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I just got mine in today and took it for a test run of a mile. Felt fine for the mile, but the arch in my left foot was cramping up near the end of the mile. I think that just means I have to adjust the way I run, but so far so good.
I took the advice in the thread and just did a quarter mile yesterday in them (then a regular 7 something after that). I could definitely tell I was running differently. Almost felt like I was running on my tippy toes but really it was the balls of my feet. My calves are a little sore today and I assume it is from that and not the regular run. I felt a little cramping in the arch of my left foot too. Odd.
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Old 04-20-10, 08:14 AM   #74
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Re: Running is stupid and it hurts

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Originally Posted by Thor Simpson View Post
If I breathe more than once per stride, even at a walking pace, I will probably hyperventilate right away. You sure you don't have this reversed... or something? That seems like some super fast breathing and a bad idea.
One thing the book mentioned is that animals lose heat through breathing. Whne they are limited to one breath a stride they overheat fast. Humans lose heat through sweating so we can lose heat faster. The guy used the illustration of taking a dog out for a run. Usually the owner can outlast the dog.

From what I remember, he only refers to one scientific study in the book about the whole evolved to run long distances to chase down prey. I'm not sure that is completely accepted in the scientific world.

I think this is it:

http://www.nature.com/nature/journal...ture03052.html
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Old 04-20-10, 08:34 AM   #75
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Re: Running is stupid and it hurts

Well, then. I guess I'll stop saying I'm "sweating like a dog." Unless I'm panting.
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