Dieting - Is this normal?

[The Bus]

Originally Posted by D.Pham00

artificial sweeteners may not be that good for weight loss.

Best thing to do is just cut out anything with sugar. As much as I love Corn Pops, I've stopped buying sugared cereals. There's just no upside to them. The only sugar I add to anything right now is a bit of honey I add to my oatmeal. I've cut out soda and I can now drink coffee without sugar.

I still have sweet things every once in a while, but not every day or every other day.

[D.Pham00]

Originally Posted by The Bus

Best thing to do is just cut out anything with sugar. As much as I love Corn Pops, I've stopped buying sugared cereals. There's just no upside to them. The only sugar I add to anything right now is a bit of honey I add to my oatmeal. I've cut out soda and I can now drink coffee without sugar.

I still have sweet things every once in a while, but not every day or every other day.

i agree with just cutting out sugar. i try not to keep anything sweet in the house (cookies, cake, whatever) because if it's there then i'm always tempted to eat it. i've long cut out soda, but that's because when i was in college, i overloaded on soda in my freshman year, and got sick of it.

i don't eat cereal that often, but when i do, i eat cheerios (plain, not the honey nut). it has one of the lowest sugar contents out of any cereal out there.

[superdeluxe]

Originally Posted by C-Mart

So as you can probably tell by the thread title, I've started a diet. I've never dieted before. My wife and I are doing it together, but I don't want to bring my problems to her because then she'll think I'm just complaining and will give up.

Basically we are limiting calorie intake to about 1800-2000 calories a day. I haven't checked to see what is ideal for me (I am 5'10", about 220lbs, and 32 years old). We have a 400 calorie breakfast, 400 calorie lunch, 400-600 calorie dinner, and 5-100 calorie "snacks" throughout the day.

We started the diet yesterday morning. After breakfast I was fine, but by 10am when I had my first snack I have been hungry and it has not abated. I realize that this is probably a normal effect of eating below the optimum calorie intake, but I wanted to be sure. I have also cut out soda completely so the withdrawls from that could be a factor as well.

At least we aren't doing the diet she was on before which didn't allow ANY sugar or carbs. (It was not Atkins, but I can't remember what it was called). I just can't eat anything with any form of artificial sweetener. The aftertaste gets me every time.

Being hungry when you start a new eating lifestyle happens, eat some more filling low calorie/healthy options. Apples, carrots, popcorn are good

[superdeluxe]

Originally Posted by C-Mart

Lets see... excercise. We are going to walk at least on the weekends, and hopefully in the evenings as well. Its really cold at night right now, so that isn't the easiest thing since I don't even get home until 7pm usually. Mornings aren't much better as we're out of the house by 6-6:30 usually and there's no way I'm getting up at 4 to go walking.

Seems like you guys don't really feel like exercising, like others have said, longterm weightloss is going to be difficult just by eating right.

[The Bus]

Originally Posted by superdeluxe

Seems like you guys don't really feel like exercising, like others have said, longterm weightloss is going to be difficult just by eating right.

I don't think it's generally that hard, if you've got genetics on your side. If you've got genetics on your side and watch what you eat, you can stay un-fat for the rest of your life. My entire mom's side of the family is like that.

Is it healthy? No, it's not. But it's possible. Just like you can't just exercise and then eat anything you want and still have a six-pack, unless you're training as hard as Michael Phelps.

[Dave7393]

Originally Posted by Sdallnct

It is what it is. You have to take in less calories then you burn in a day to lose weight. Trust me, I have had to work hard to lose what I have lost. I know what your saying. I workout every day.

But the point is still the same. Lets say based on your size and weight you burn 2,500 per day doing NO exercise. You then workout 45 minutes per day burning 500 calories. But you eat 4,000 calories per day. What is going to happen? You will gain weight.

Now, don't workout. Take in 2,000 calories a day. What will happen? You will lose weight.

Well yeah, the peson in the first example has a net gain of 4,000 calories over the peson in the second example. Someone who's overeating and doing a 45 minute workout, only burning 500 calories (must be a crappy workout ) won't lose weight. If someone's overeating and not working out (or not working out enough), yes, ofcourse weight will be gained. Also, burning excess calories by eating under your BMR won't last forever-- at some point, the weight will stop coming off because your body will lower it's BMR closer to 2000 (i.e. you'll have to increase your caloric deficit up from 500 just to maintain your new, lower weight).

You could actually raise that basal metabolic rate from 2,500 (from your example) by adding cardio, meaning your body will now consume more resting calories due to increased exercise. If you starve yourself, BMR actually goes down, which means that extra calories you eat (when you go back above the new, lowered BMR) get stored as fat. This is one reason why people gain more weight, compared to pre-dieting, after the diet fails.

Originally Posted by Sdallnct

Here you go...from Mens Health taken from guys that have lost weight "successfully". Well this is their "Belly off club" so it makes sense about the working out!

96% cut out refined grains and sugars (white bread, soda's, candy, potato chips, etc)
93% now eat more protein, healthy fats, and fiber-rich produce and whole grains
75% eat breakfast every day (they talk about a study where the biggest losers had a 610 calorie breakfast!)
90% weight lift 3 times a week
80% do cardio workouts
100% are highly motivated (x-factor)

Again, I think that weightlifting is really underutilized by people trying to lose weight (usually people only do it if a trainer tells them/instructs them). I've seen a ton of injuries from people "doing it wrong," so it really pays to have an instructor, at least initially. Stretching before and after is very important, and the soreness factor can really turn people off initially, even if everything is done by the book (once the program is under way, some people find taking 5 or 6 grams of Vitamin C an hour before working out really helps with this).

One of the best things about doing cardio in a gym is that it gives people respect for what calorie is, in terms of diet and exercise. Let's say that someone's starting off on a treadmill program, and the person only makes it 10 minutes at about 5 mph the first time (in real life, this is probably at least twice as long as an exercise newbie would last). So after this five minute jog, have him or her look at the calorie indicator on the treadmill afterwards, and they'll see that they've burned off less than a piece of plain white bread (yeah, these indicators aren't terribly accurate, but they're in the ballpark). So they're sitting there, sweating, and huffing and puffing, and it shows how little they've actually done. It can really make people think the next time they read "250 calories" on a 20 oz soda bottle (or anything else), and they'll remember what it takes to burn off a calorie.

In term of calorie intake, some of the best advice is don't drink your calories. You can cut out hundreds of empty calories a day simply by changing what you drink. After I run, I like drinking lemon seltzer (purposely left a little flat) w/a little lemon juice added. Tastes great and it's incredibly cheap, with no calories.

[C-Mart]

Originally Posted by superdeluxe

Seems like you guys don't really feel like exercising, like others have said, longterm weightloss is going to be difficult just by eating right.

We do plan on exercising... but our preferred method was to walk together with our dog in the evenings. It is just looking like that won't happen at least until it warms up a bit again. My wife is walking with a friend at work during her lunch, and I started that today as well. Luckily, for my diet anyway, my boss's driveway is incredibly steep and long, as is the road just beyond it. So I walked up and then jogged down. Got my heart going, got my legs tingling... pretty soon I'll be able to run the whole thing.

Beyond that, we are going to see if we can borrow my in-law's treadmill... I wonder if my dog will walk the treadmill with me?

Interesting story btw - a few years back I decided to start running. So I would run half-way around the block, then a couple of days later I would be able to run around the whole block, then 2 blocks, etc... So I was able to run about 2-3 blocks and walk the rest back to my house - one night my mom happened to be home (I lived with her at the time) and I asked if she wanted to go running with me. She had been going to the gym consistently for a couple of years doing yoga and pool exercising, stuff like that, so I thought she would be fine. About 1/2 a block away she stopped and said "I have to go back! I can't keep going!" I thought it was so odd. Here I was, with little-to-no drive for exercise, eating everything I could possibly want, and after only about a week and a half of running I was able to outlast my mom who had been eating healthy and exercising for several years. Granted, her exercise was a lot different than mine, but she was still MUCH more active than I was in general.

[kvrdave]

Did I miss something, or is the question, "Is it normal to feel hungry on a diet?"

[Sdallnct]

Originally Posted by Dave7393

Well yeah, the peson in the first example has a net gain of 4,000 calories over the peson in the second example. Someone who's overeating and doing a 45 minute workout, only burning 500 calories (must be a crappy workout ) won't lose weight. If someone's overeating and not working out (or not working out enough), yes, ofcourse weight will be gained. Also, burning excess calories by eating under your BMR won't last forever-- at some point, the weight will stop coming off because your body will lower it's BMR closer to 2000 (i.e. you'll have to increase your caloric deficit up from 500 just to maintain your new, lower weight).

You could actually raise that basal metabolic rate from 2,500 (from your example) by adding cardio, meaning your body will now consume more resting calories due to increased exercise. If you starve yourself, BMR actually goes down, which means that extra calories you eat (when you go back above the new, lowered BMR) get stored as fat. This is one reason why people gain more weight, compared to pre-dieting, after the diet fails.




Again, I think that weightlifting is really underutilized by people trying to lose weight (usually people only do it if a trainer tells them/instructs them). I've seen a ton of injuries from people "doing it wrong," so it really pays to have an instructor, at least initially. Stretching before and after is very important, and the soreness factor can really turn people off initially, even if everything is done by the book (once the program is under way, some people find taking 5 or 6 grams of Vitamin C an hour before working out really helps with this).

One of the best things about doing cardio in a gym is that it gives people respect for what calorie is, in terms of diet and exercise. Let's say that someone's starting off on a treadmill program, and the person only makes it 10 minutes at about 5 mph the first time (in real life, this is probably at least twice as long as an exercise newbie would last). So after this five minute jog, have him or her look at the calorie indicator on the treadmill afterwards, and they'll see that they've burned off less than a piece of plain white bread (yeah, these indicators aren't terribly accurate, but they're in the ballpark). So they're sitting there, sweating, and huffing and puffing, and it shows how little they've actually done. It can really make people think the next time they read "250 calories" on a 20 oz soda bottle (or anything else), and they'll remember what it takes to burn off a calorie.

In term of calorie intake, some of the best advice is don't drink your calories. You can cut out hundreds of empty calories a day simply by changing what you drink. After I run, I like drinking lemon seltzer (purposely left a little flat) w/a little lemon juice added. Tastes great and it's incredibly cheap, with no calories.

Now, I think we are getting in agreement

By and large the vast majority of people over eat. Period. Most people simple eat to much and to many calories. Look at a "standard menu" at any resturant and it is increadible. It is easy, very easy to eat 1,500 calories in ONE meal!!

Lets me be clear. I 100% agree, the BEST way to lose weight is eat less, eat right, do cardio, do weight.

However, especially when getting started. I think more important then working out for 45 minutes is skipping the cheeseburger, super size fry and large coke and instead getting a 6" Subway turkey on wheat bread with mustard (or no dressing). Heck, hungry again in 3 hours? Have another one!! Your still nowhere close to the Cheeseburger super meal!

One I finally got serious and was done with all the "short cuts", the first thing I did was still eat whatever I wanted at a resturant, but I just split everything with wife. We would split a meal and maybe add another salad. That alone lost me weight.

[C-Mart]

And that saves you money!

Originally Posted by kvrdave

Did I miss something, or is the question, "Is it normal to feel hungry on a diet?"

The original question was "is it normal to constantly feel hungry on a diet?

I wasn't even feeling like I had eaten anything - even after a WW chicken dinner at Applebee's last night! Its ok though, I'll get used to it.

[Sdallnct]

Oh, one important note:

Watch out for the liquid calories. They can be the worse. Of course there is the obvious like a 1,000 calorie milk shake (and that is usually a medium).

But of course there are the 250 calorie bottle cokes. Or one to really watch out for, is that bottle of Gatorade. After your 500 calorie workout it is easy to grab that bottle and then suck down 350 calories out of that big bottle.

And the worse part of calories in liquid form, is they generally don't make you feel full. So you end up having the calories say in a coke + you will eat just as much. I've gotten into the habit of having a snack (usually yogurt or almonds) about 1.5 hours before lunch and dinner. This means I'm not starving at meal time and eat less. The same wouldn't hold true for a Coke (I know, I use to do that!).

[big whoppa]

Originally Posted by D.Pham00

artificial sweeteners may not be that good for weight loss.

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases...0210183902.htm

http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/OnCall/Sto...4271246&page=1

I've seen many of those articles. Most of them point towards diet sodas which I can't stand. How many fat people have you seen drink lots of diet sodas? I find that funny.

The key to anything is moderation. I don't chug syrup. You can eat junk food or something sinful on occasion.

[D.Pham00]

Originally Posted by C-Mart

Beyond that, we are going to see if we can borrow my in-law's treadmill... I wonder if my dog will walk the treadmill with me?

i tried getting my dog to walk on the treadmill several times w/o success.

Granted, her exercise was a lot different than mine, but she was still MUCH more active than I was in general.

she's also a lot older...

[D.Pham00]

Originally Posted by big whoppa

I've seen many of those articles. Most of them point towards diet sodas which I can't stand. How many fat people have you seen drink lots of diet sodas? I find that funny.

The key to anything is moderation. I don't chug syrup. You can eat junk food or something sinful on occasion.

one of the ones i linked to was for yogurt or something like that.

i agree though, moderation is key.

[The Bus]

Yogurt's still a ton of sugar, even if it's plain. Go with Greek yogurt or cottage cheese.

[Tracer Bullet]

I've lost about 70 pounds since 2007 and I've maintained my current weight for almost a year. Two biggest changes I made to my diet were cutting out 95% of the sugar I used to eat (including almost a complete personal ban on high-fructose corn syrup) and eating six times a day.

[big whoppa]

Eliminating high-fructose corn syrup is not an easy one. So many stuff in the grocery stores have the stuff. Even whole grain breads have/had the stuff. I didn't realize most ketchup contains the stuff.

Oh, no enriched bread either.

[superdeluxe]

C-Mart: Ever try mall walking? Nice and tempature controlled.

[Sdallnct]

Tell you what I'm continuing to have trouble with...salt! I'm amazed at how much salt in is in turkey and ham. And even a low cal "good" sandwich (grilled chick-fil-a, subway, etc) seems to have a lot of salt.

I'm working hard to get off blood pressure meds. I know some question if salt is really a factor, but I'm getting weight under control. Working out. Thought I'd try to cut back on salt.

[big whoppa]

I thought salt contributed to high blood pressure. Doctors don't seem to get overworked about it these days though.

[FantasticVSDoom]

Dave hit the nail on the head with weightlifting... Problem is that the majority of personal trainers don't know the first thing about proper weightlifting, then people get hurt and then they stop doing it. If you can, learn to squat, press (standing and bench), deadlift, powerclean, and upright row properly and you will be a beast. Thing is, they arent difficult just need someone who knows how to teach them. Throw in some pull-ups, push-ups, sit-ups (not crunches), and some sprints a few times a week and believe me, you will be jacked.

Also, that blurb that The Bus posted about protein is spot on

[The Bus]

Originally Posted by FantasticVSDoom

Dave hit the nail on the head with weightlifting... Problem is that the majority of personal trainers don't know the first thing about proper weightlifting, then people get hurt and then they stop doing it. If you can, learn to squat, press (standing and bench), deadlift, powerclean, and upright row properly and you will be a beast. Thing is, they arent difficult just need someone who knows how to teach them. Throw in some pull-ups, push-ups, sit-ups (not crunches), and some sprints a few times a week and believe me, you will be jacked.

Also, that blurb that The Bus posted about protein is spot on

I still don't do power cleans, deadlifts, etc. because although I have an idea of what I should be doing, I don't have someone who knows what I should be doing watching me the whole time and I don't want to "guess" that my deadlift is good enough.

Don't let the fact that you don't know anything stop you. Don't let the fact that you don't have someone to help you stop you. This is how I was for, oh, a good ten years of my life. No one is going to come along and *want* to train you. And if you rely solely on machines, you'll get an "OK" workout, at best.

Here's three sites that show you exercises:

http://www.iwantsixpackabs.com (free registration, probably the most user friendly)
http://www.exrx.net (very clinical but great)
http://www.crossfit.com (gives you lots of ideas once you're tired of doing the same exercies all the time)

The first link shows you how to do stuff at home with, at most, a $20-$40 investment into equipment, if that.

[The Bus]

Originally Posted by big whoppa

Eliminating high-fructose corn syrup is not an easy one. So many stuff in the grocery stores have the stuff. Even whole grain breads have/had the stuff. I didn't realize most ketchup contains the stuff.

Oh, no enriched bread either.

General good advice is to stick to the outside of the supermarket: meats, dairy, produce, etc. Once you start buying a lot of packaged food, that's where the trouble starts.

Also, at least for me, it's good to think of goals in terms of months or years, not weeks.

[4KRG]

Originally Posted by C-Mart

The original question was "is it normal to constantly feel hungry on a diet?

ok, I missed that. No, it's not normal. That means you are doing it wrong

First, go see a professional instead of getting crackpot advice on this crazy ass forum. As someone who has lost a substantial amount of weight and kept the majority of it off for 12 years or so now, I can tell you what worked for me, I can't say that will work for you.

1. stop eating sugar, I think everyone here agrees with that (that includes refined flour products like white bread, but not natural sugars like apples)
2. as for artificial sweeteners, ever since giving up sugar, I have eaten them, but IN SMALL DOSES, ONE diet beverage a day or equivalent.
3. exercise - walking the mall for 30 minutes 3-4 times a week qualifies. As you increase in capability, step up the speed/duration, for the first month a nice easy walk will do.
4. I double dog dare you to eat 2000 calories of broccolli or romaine lettuce for your entire daily calorie intake - you won't want to do it what the pros taught me is that the daily calorie intake (which for me was like 2400 calories) is HARD TO EAT if you eat the right foods to meet the 2400. If you eat the wrong foods, then it is easy to eat more than 2400 (or whatever your calorie intake should be, mine was profesionally determinied by my endocrinologist)
5. stop eating specific fats - saturated fats, transfats. eat more good fats, monosaturated, etc google the list.

I tease a little, I think I felt a little hungry for like a 2-3 days, once I got into the rythem of it all, I was fine. The only times I really started to feel hungry was once I was on a roll and exercising 5-6 days a week for an hour +, I started to double what I was eating and was still losing weight.

You have to find the balance that fits your body. Advice is just that, something that worked for someone else. You have to figure it out, take in all the knowledge, experiement, find something that works for you. You can tell by when you lose weight, gain weight, or stay even what is going on.

Do not be obessed with weighing yourself or with what the scale says. Weigh in the morning right after you wake up (after you pee) and then don't get on the scale anymore that day. 5lbs one way or the other is irrelevant. More than 5 lbs one way or the other after 3-4 weeks starts to be meaningful.

Do not fall prey to fad diets, it is really hard to weed out the snake oil in today's society. Even some of the snake oil appears to work in the short run, but don't fall for it.

You have to really want to do it, not just say you want to do it. I am not sure I can explain that further. I always 'wanted' to do it, but once it became life or death for me, I actually did it.

[The Bus]

Originally Posted by 4KRG

Do not be obessed with weighing yourself or with what the scale says. Weigh in the morning right after you wake up (after you pee) and then don't get on the scale anymore that day. 5lbs one way or the other is irrelevant. More than 5 lbs one way or the other after 3-4 weeks starts to be meaningful.

I weigh myself every once in a while out of curiosity but the best way to judge is to look at yourself. Also, how do you feel? More energy, strength, etc?

Originally Posted by 4KRG

You have to really want to do it, not just say you want to do it. I am not sure I explain that further. I always 'wanted' to do it, but once it became life or death for me, I actually did it.

It's a cliché but it's completely true: The only way to do it is to do it.