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Old 04-06-16, 11:40 AM   #101
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re: Man of Steel 2 - News, rumors, etc.

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/new...g-films-881265
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Several sources say Warner Bros. executives were convinced they had the goods with BvS and were shocked when negative reviews began pouring in. Now, with DC movies dated through 2020, the outcome has led to a flurry of rumors that the studio will make adjustments — maybe add a new producer? — rather than allow BvS director Zack Snyder to proceed with the two-part Justice League. But sources with firsthand knowledge of the situation say the studio has no such plans. One says the filmmakers naturally will evaluate what went wrong with BvS, but when it comes to Justice League, "we're not going to take a movie that's supposed to be one thing and turn it into a copycat of something else."
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Old 04-06-16, 01:09 PM   #102
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"we're not going to take a movie that's supposed to be one thing and turn it into a copycat of something else."
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Old 04-06-16, 01:44 PM   #103
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I don't think anyone ever asked them to copycat but for fuck's sake not everything has to be so dark and grim. Find a better balance is all that I think most of us have asked for. Also they need to get their shit together in terms of storytelling rather than over bloating films with way too many characters and plot points.
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Old 04-06-16, 01:58 PM   #104
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I don't think anyone ever asked them to copycat but for fuck's sake not everything has to be so dark and grim. Find a better balance is all that I think most of us have asked for. Also they need to get their shit together in terms of storytelling rather than over bloating films with way too many characters and plot points.
From all I've read, BVS is a bit like a bloated Star Trek TNG episode that had an A, B, AND C story. Way too much crammed in to be properly developed in it's running time.

And the characters were written pretty lamely.

They can be their own thing without forcing their movies to be so unnaturally dark and grim.
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Old 04-06-16, 02:02 PM   #105
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re: Man of Steel 2 - News, rumors, etc.

I don't mind that the DCEU is darker than the MCU; in fact I sort of prefer it to have its own feel and be a bit more grown-up than the lighter Marvel movies.

But they need a coherent long-term plan, better stories, and they have to stop trying to cram as much as they can into their films. Forfucksake, BvS: DoJ was only the second movie in the DCEU series and it was pulling in elements from Dark Knight Returns, Doomsday, and Death in the Family.
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Old 04-06-16, 03:26 PM   #106
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I don't mind that the DCEU is darker than the MCU; in fact I sort of prefer it to have its own feel and be a bit more grown-up than the lighter Marvel movies.

But they need a coherent long-term plan, better stories, and they have to trying to cram as much as they can into their films. Forfucksake, BvS: DoJ was only the second movie in the DCEU series and it was pulling in elements from Dark Knight Returns, Doomsday, and Death in the Family.
That's the problem with getting into the game so late and playing catch-up. Think about it... Marvel is already into Phase 3, and DC has only released 2 films. TWO FILMS!!
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Old 04-06-16, 03:34 PM   #107
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They did attempt to get into the game back in 2011 with the Green Lantern movie. At one point, they considered it "Action Comics #1" for their cinematic universe. Unfortunately, the film blew monkey balls and they had to re-group.
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Old 04-06-16, 04:54 PM   #108
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I don't mind that the DCEU is darker than the MCU; in fact I sort of prefer it to have its own feel and be a bit more grown-up than the lighter Marvel movies.

But they need a coherent long-term plan, better stories, and they have to trying to cram as much as they can into their films. Forfucksake, BvS: DoJ was only the second movie in the DCEU series and it was pulling in elements from Dark Knight Returns, Doomsday, and Death in the Family.
Yeah I don't buy that they have any real direction as to where they're going with these films. They have films announced but if the plot of just one film couldn't manage to be cohesive I can't imagine that the films are going to gel any better as parts of a larger cinematic universe. Warner and DC seem to have gone into this only with the goal of making Marvel money off of their properties but haven't put any of the thought that Marvel did into their films.
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Old 04-06-16, 04:59 PM   #109
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Yeah I don't buy that they have any real direction as to where they're going with these films. They have films announced but if the plot of just one film couldn't manage to be cohesive I can't imagine that the films are going to gel any better as parts of a larger cinematic universe. Warner and DC seem to have gone into this only with the goal of making Marvel money off of their properties but haven't put any of the thought that Marvel did into their films.
Isn't Geoff Johns on their board? They should have gone to Dini and Timm a long time ago to right the ship.
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Old 04-06-16, 09:15 PM   #110
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I don't mind that the DCEU is darker than the MCU; in fact I sort of prefer it to have its own feel and be a bit more grown-up than the lighter Marvel movies.
But they seem to be going out of their way to suck all the fun out of their movies. They're making things dark just for the sake of making them dark, not because it's inherent to good storytelling with those characters.

They're forcing a grim tone on their movies and at the same time they're not coming up with good scripts. Which is why MOS and BVS are, ultimately, artistic failures.

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But they need a coherent long-term plan, better stories, and they have to stop trying to cram as much as they can into their films. Forfucksake, BvS: DoJ was only the second movie in the DCEU series and it was pulling in elements from Dark Knight Returns, Doomsday, and Death in the Family.
Exactly. They threw in WAY too much for a single movie. This after failing with MOS.

Green Lantern was more entertaining than MOS. It wasn't better, but it was more entertaining. They were both seriously flawed, but just because MOS was darker and more, "Serious," doesn't make it a better movie. It was only marginally, "Better," but was less entertaining (and MUCH more draining and tiring once you got through that last 40 or so minutes).

WB is failing. I'd say that they should just reboot the whole DC Cinematic Universe, but it's way too early for that, so now it becomes damage control. Can the DCCU be fixed?

With the same crew in charge? That seems questionable at best.
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Old 04-06-16, 09:42 PM   #111
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Green Lantern was horrid.
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Old 04-06-16, 10:01 PM   #112
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Green Lantern was horrid.
Come on - Catwoman and Batman & Robin were horrid. Green Lantern was nowhere near that bad - GL was merely mediocre (and a huge letdown for most people).

Man Of Steel had huge potential, and in the end it was a mediocre movie that made the viewer feel like they had just gone 12 rounds with the middleweight champ.
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Old 04-07-16, 12:13 PM   #113
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Wow B5Erik. Even as a huge DC fan I think Green Lantern was a piece of shit. It was a corny piece of shit at that. Only good in it was Mark Strong as Sinestro.
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Old 04-07-16, 12:27 PM   #114
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MoS a good amount better than GL. GL hit every cliche it good to get to the end. At least MoS, was doing something different from the character's norm.
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Old 04-07-16, 12:42 PM   #115
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MoS a good amount better than GL. GL hit every cliche it good to get to the end. At least MoS, was doing something different from the character's norm.
Exactly - He wasn't really Superman, not fully, anyway.

Both movies were seriously flawed. Just in totally different ways.
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Old 04-07-16, 01:08 PM   #116
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Aside from lacking an embodiment of hope... that's pretty much Supes.

What changes they did to Supes for the modern still doesn't buckle it down to the crap that GL was. Jesus. The only good thing about GL was Mark Strong. And if you care about it, Blake Lively for tits.
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Old 04-07-16, 01:18 PM   #117
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Exactly - He wasn't really MY Superman, not fully, anyway.

Both movies were seriously flawed. Just in totally different ways.
Corrected

He was Superman. Just not your Daddy's Superman. The new take is new and fresh to me. Shit, I've been tired of the Romance Novel Chris Reeve Film Superman since the early 80's.
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Old 04-07-16, 01:38 PM   #118
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Cavill's Superman looks the part and has Superman's powers but lacks the humanity and caring nature of the character. Those are pretty core elements to the character and I think the lack of those traits hold the Cavill vets of the character back a lot. I think Cavill could be good in better written films but as it stands I don't like the new version of the character.
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Old 04-07-16, 01:46 PM   #119
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Cavill's Superman looks the part and has Superman's powers but lacks the humanity and caring nature of the character. Those are pretty core elements to the character and I think the lack of those traits hold the Cavill vets of the character back a lot. I think Cavill could be good in better written films but as it stands I don't like the new version of the character.
It's not even that. Is that he's an undeveloped Superman. He never, even in BvS, gets to be a complete character in definition of what he should now be. I'm not talking about waving the flag, being goofy Clark (which he hasn't been in decades), etc. He never gets to be a complete person.

I like that he had issues accepting what he is. And trying to find some calling for fulfillment of self. I thought it was a great thing to give him. It is a thing that would probably freak out some people and they'd have to reflect in their form. I like that he needed to find his purpose.

But again.. we never get a completely defined Superman. We get Clark and he's fine. I like this Clark, we don't have a lot of him in BvS but he's good. But Superman never reaches levels he can be. He's limited by Snyder believing all about the character action instead of the depth of character drama.

Aside from being an unfinished Superman character, we needed this modern take of the character and not something that no longer makes sense to keep. He just needs a goddamn soul to him and then he's complete.
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Old 04-07-16, 01:57 PM   #120
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And, to me, the ridiculously over the top last 45 or so minutes of MOS practicality erased whatever Snyder and company got right for the rest of the movie.
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Old 04-07-16, 02:07 PM   #121
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And, to me, the ridiculously over the top last 45 or so minutes of MOS practicality erased whatever Snyder and company got right for the rest of the movie.
Ehhhhh. It had a crap script no matter. It was a wishy washy film any way you put it. That and.. well... Snyder.
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Old 04-07-16, 02:38 PM   #122
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And, to me, the ridiculously over the top last 45 or so minutes of MOS practicality erased whatever Snyder and company got right for the rest of the movie.
You mean the action? That was the best part. Superman has been humanized in 5 fucking films before MOS - that's enough, IMO, it was time got to cut loose.
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Old 04-07-16, 02:49 PM   #123
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You mean the action? That was the best part. Superman has been humanized in 5 fucking films before MOS - that's enough, IMO, it was time got to cut loose.
To a degree, yes. At the same time... it could have been handled by a more competent Director and Writer.
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Old 04-07-16, 03:17 PM   #124
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To a degree, yes. At the same time... it could have been handled by a more competent Director and Writer.
This. There should have been a better balance of humanity to Superman while still being able to incorporate action elements. As it stands the last half of Man of Steel is just big dumb in your face action. It's shit tier and compared with the rest of the film feels lazy. I actually like the film somewhat up until about the point where Clark finds the suit on the ship in Antarctica. After that it goes down hill pretty rapidly.
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Old 04-07-16, 03:21 PM   #125
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This. There should have been a better balance of humanity to Superman while still being able to incorporate action elements. As it stands the last half of Man of Steel is just big dumb in your face action. It's shit tier and compared with the rest of the film feels lazy. I actually like the film somewhat up until about the point where Clark finds the suit on the ship in Antarctica. After that it goes down hill pretty rapidly.
I'd say it dips a bit down after he plays around w/ his powers bit by bit but once Metropolis starts going to hell... it really dips down.
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