B5Erik

Well, it is based on the original comic, more or less.

Personally, I think a Victor Von Doom that creates tech (including robot soldiers and his flying iron suit of armor loaded with weaponry) and overthrows the oppressive communist government of his Eastern European home country to become an oppressive dictator with designs on getting Reed Richards is far more interesting than either version of Doom we've seen to date.

And I think it would make for a far better movie than any FF we've seen. The source material is actually quite good and quite compelling dramatically if written well.

PhantomStranger

Here is the crux of the Doom versus Richards conflict. Reed Richards is literally the smartest man on the planet. Tony Stark wishes he could be as smart as Reed Richards. Who is the second smartest man? Victor von Doom. That is the essence of the conflict between the Fantastic Four and Dr. Doom. The other FF members don't drive this conflict except when they get used by Doom to humiliate or unwittingly undermine Reed Richards. There is a rich, layered story to be told in a two-hour movie about that conflict.

The problem is that Fox didn't want to build a summer movie franchise around two thirty-something men in direct conflict. That doesn't play well with the younger teen audience that is actually buying the summer movie tickets.

brayzie

From what I understand, when they first came out, Fantastic Four, and later Spider-man, was really popular with teenagers and helped Marvel keep an edge over DC in the years to come. So why was whatever formula they were using then, for the characters, not able to work now?

lastActionHero

Marvel's greatest asset is that it's willing to go out on a limb, far more than most other studios. It has the confidence in its characters to do weird things. Other companies' corporate suits, in contrast, simply don't trust anything that deviates from what they think will sell.

DaveyJoe

That's like asking how teenagers of the 60s are different from teenagers of today. Are they? Do even our youngest members understand modern teens?

brayzie

Well the original basic concept of Spider-man still works today. In fact Spider-man is a grown man in the comics, having been married, but the movie reboots want to keep the focus on the Stan Lee and Steve Ditko version from the '60s when he's still in high school.

So I don't understand why, if it's true that they're aiming for young audiences, that Fox wants to skew younger for all the FF characters. WB doesn't feel compelled to add Robin to any of the Batman movies to appeal to young audiences even though they're shooting for that demographic anyways. Then again this is built on Phantom Stranger's premise that this is Fox's reason. Like others already mentioned, I think they're just trying to distinguish this version from the previous series, and not because they think a 30 something Reed Richards will discourage teenage movie goers.

DaveyJoe

Because studio execs think teenagers will relate to younger characters more easily? Wouldn't that explain why the Fantastic Four have been aged down and after five movies they want to keep Spider-Man in high school?

brayzie

Well I was thinking about the movie versions of Batman and Superman and they're all up there in age and X-Men too...wait. Oh shit, they're all getting younger.

B5Erik

Exactly. It's not like we're talking about The Expendables in age here. We're talking about two characters in their 30's, not their 50's. And Johnny would be there as a 20 year old or so to keep the younger audience engaged.

I agree that Fox is making changes just for the sake of making changes to be different from the previous FF movies. They didn't do it to make better movies, just to make changes and be different. What they did in doing so was sacrifice good storytelling. The original conflict between Reed and Doom is extremely dramatic and compelling.

And Nolan's Batman movies proved that you can base movies around middle aged characters and get boatloads of teenagers to come see them with the adults. What you want to do is cross generational lines to get maximum appeal, not focus on any one age group.

ddrknghtrtns

The best stories for both the FF and Spider-Man are from 1964~1966 respectively.

majorjoe23

I think Bruce Wayne was supposed to be 25 in the first movie (Bale was 30 during filming), and Rachel felt like a teen, despite being the same age. It was certainly a much younger Batman than any previous film.

Of course, Caine/Neesan/Freeman brought the average age up a lot.

B5Erik

Rachel couldn't have been a teen, or even in her early twenties, and didn't really feel like it - she was an assistant District Attorney! She just looked like a woman in her mid 20's.

Solid Snake

She, physically, looked out of place in a crowd of solid actors and grown men. She ain't a bad actress but visually she didn't match up w/ the rest of the cast.

bluetoast

At his birthday party that Ra's crashes, he was turning 30. I think he was around 25 with Ra's Al Ghul/when Rachel slaps him. The script has the ages at the different points in time.

fumanstan

The idea that younger audiences don't want to see 30 something heroes in a summer blockbuster is pretty stupid and makes little sense when you look at the highest grossing movies of all time.

Mike86

Agreed. Young people look up to older people as what they aspire to be and don't necessarily have to see someone their age for a character to be relatable. That doesn't mean there can't be younger characters too but this idea that the cast has to be younger to appeal to a younger demographic is silly.

B5Erik

It's not just silly, it's stupid.

But so are a lot of the people running movie studios...

Solid Snake

But I don't think it's something they're taking w/ the property for the hell of it. A younger FF has been done in the comics. So seems like they're taking that aspect of it. From what I can see Ultimate FF seems to be a main source for the skeleton but everything else still harkens to what FF is.

That Doom though...

Obi-Wanma

RDJ is 50. The defense rests.

Hokeyboy

The dude who played Automan was easily over 30. I don't get this logic.

Big Boy Laroux

The only movies I like seeing with younger thespians are referenced in Otter.

Wait, did I say thespians?

majorjoe23

I do think there's a distinct difference between a 40 something Tony Stark and a 40 something Reed Richards. One is the cool uncle you want to hang out with, the other is a stuffy dad.

The former will always be more appealing to audiences. I guess they could rewrite history and change Reed so that he's cooler. As long as they don't mess with skin tone.

B5Erik

But, see, that's the point of the makeup of the team. You've got the stuffy genius, the streetwise former athlete, the strong, beautiful woman, and the wisecracking hothead kid. That appeals to a wide group of people - no changes from the original concept remotely necessary.

Big Boy Laroux

All of which we have no indication to believe WON'T be in this movie, personality-wise. The trailer even reflects those personalities.

Just the age has changed, but again, this is in line with the Ultimate versions of the characters. Just like many changes to the MCU have pulled from the Ultimate versions, not to mention changes made for the MCU specifically with no source material (ultron's creation, for example).

Your gripes about concept changes need to be taken up with Marvel for the whole Ultimate universe, not this movie. I'm sure there will be plenty to gripe about with this movie, but the more people complain about it, it makes me want to see it more.

Solid Snake

Sue is the hardest one to make apparently cuz strong developed female characters are hard things to have for big budget things. I fucking hated her in the previous films.