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Please help with score-related question

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Please help with score-related question

Old 04-20-03, 11:20 PM
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Please help with score-related question

This is really a movie/music question, and I'd appreciate any help I could get. I need to write a paper on something dealing with classical/romantic/early modern music... and I'd like to do it on a music director's use (or misuse) of said music in modern cinema. But I'm having a hell of a time finding examples... I know there are a ton of movies that have used pre-arranged music from an earlier time-period in a modern setting... one example would be the Liebestod from Wagner's Tristan und Isolde used at the end of Baz Luhrmann's Romeo and Juliet... I'm looking for things like that... if anyone could offer up examples I'd really appreciate it... there have to be some film/classical music buffs hiding around here somewhere...

'E

note to mods: move this to music if you feel it's appropriate but I think more people who could help would be in here... besides, this has as much to do with movies as music.
Old 04-21-03, 12:19 AM
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Stanley "Bollocks to an original score, I'll use preexisting classical stuff" Kubrick.

Barber's Adagio For Strings is forever synonymous with Platoon.

The film Aria uses famous Opera bits that several directors build little pieces around.

Was Carmen Jones within reason? Or Carmem: A Hip Hopera?
Old 04-21-03, 12:54 AM
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actually, i didn't realize that classical composers are listed at imdb for all movies their works are used in... pretty interesting stuff... i have a lot of movie watching to do this week to see the context of a million different uses of Wagner's Valkyre... But thanks DonnachaOne for the help.

'E
Old 04-21-03, 04:16 PM
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Criterions "Hopscotch" with Walter Matthau and Glenda Jackson has a lot of clasical opera music in it with Matthau as Miles Kendig singing the operas word or for word.

I am a audiophile and have over 475 movie sound tracks and who wrote the music for each song if their is more than one composer involved. Take the western movie "Stagecoach" 1939 it has 5 composers and one arranger for the 65 year old film.

My earliest is 1934 "Midnight The Stars and You" by the Ray Noble orchestra with vocalist Al Bowley, song released on February 16, 1934 and is the theme for the Kubrick movie "The Shining". Music is simular in sound to the late Guy Lombardo Orchestra. I hope this helps
Old 04-21-03, 05:17 PM
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In his later films Kubrick used a lot of preexisting music.
Barry Lyndon uses a TON

Magnolia uses Bizet's Carmen

Apocalypse Now uses Wagner quite famously

Casino uses Bach at the end

Seven uses Bach

Raging Bull uses somebody

DEFINATELY CHECK OUT David Lean's film Brief Encounter. It uses Rachmaninoff concerto No. 2 for its entire score.

Last edited by Pants; 04-22-03 at 11:19 AM.
Old 04-21-03, 09:37 PM
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Would Fantasia be modern enough? How about Fantasia 2000?

History of the World, Part I uses "Also Spach Zarathustra" in a parody sequence of 2001. I'm sure there must be other movies that use this as a parody but I can't think of any others.
Old 04-21-03, 11:22 PM
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You might want to check out Carl Orff's 'Carmina Burana,' specifically 'O Fortuna.' It is very popular with directors as they have a tendency to put it in their temp tracks. And it is used many times in movie trailers.

You can hear it unadulterated in Excalibur.

You can hear James Horner's take on it in Glory.

You can hear Trevor Jones' version in Last of the Mohicans.
Old 04-21-03, 11:23 PM
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Thanks everyone for the info. I've found that despite IMDB I do still need some help because a ton of movies possibly have fleeting moments where these pieces are audible but the scene has no great relevance in the overall plot, or at least the music doesn't contribute to it. So I'm going to focus on Wagner, Mozart, Bach, and Beethoven. But I'm looking particularly for instances of the same song beingused multiple times under different circumstances... something to show both sides of the spectrum as far as a music director's respect/disrespect for the original intentions behind a composition. For example, Wagner's Die Walkure is used in Casper (the friendly ghost), My Girl 2, Blues Brothers, and Apocalypse Now, among other things. There's no way it has the same significance in all those films or is even significant at all in a couple. I think you guys see what I'm getting at. Suggestions for similar commonly used pieces or movies where you know the composition is relevant would be greatly appreciated. This paper is going to be fun to write, but it will require hours of "research" watching movies. Thankfully I've already gotten an extension because the professor is intrigued by the topic.

'E

P.S. Thanks for the tip... I'll look into Orff's "Carmina Burana"
Old 04-22-03, 12:20 AM
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Here are the pieces I'm thinking of using along with movies I know they are used in... please let me know if you have anything to add to this list or have any insight on whether or not the piece is actually used during a significant event... or if it's just like transitional background music... I'm also being selective in the films I list, opting for ones that have a greater chance of having been scene by the general public. And cross Bach off the list... unfortunately he doesn't fit into my time period.

Beethoven's 9th:
Eat Drink Man Woman
Die Hard
Raising Arizona
Sophie's Choice
Clockwork Orange
Help!

Tchaikovsky's Swan Lake:
Bring it On
Billy Elliot
Ed Wood
Welcome to the Dollhouse

Mozart's... this is a tough call, here are my options:

Die Zauberflöte:
Miss Congeniality
The General's Daughter
Face/Off

Figaro:
The Man Who Wasn't there
Shawshank Redemption
Trading Places

Requiem:
Eyes Wide Shut
Elizabeth
Incredibly True Adventures of Two Girls in Love
The Big Lebowski
Primal Fear

Wagner's Die Walkure:
Apocalypse Now
The Blues Brothers
Excalibur
My Girl 2
Small Soldiers
Casper

Those are the pieces I'm considering... but again, there are tons of movies listed at IMDB with no reference to the exact piece used, so if any of you know other examples, please let me know.

Thanks,
E
Old 04-22-03, 11:35 AM
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Some notes on what I know:

Die Hard: Michael Kamen's whole score consisists of varitations on the 9th. Well worth looking at

Clockwork Orange: Wendy/Walter Carlos did an all synthesizer/moog version of the 9th for this film which plays during an important sequence when Alex is being "rehabilitated"

Ed Wood: Swan Lake is only used in Ed Wood when they watch Dracula (1931). It may be of more interest to you to know that Swan Lake was used for the opening credits of both Dracula and Frankenstein. Neither film had an original score and used only previously existing music.

Shawshank Redemption: very important scene where main character plays Mozart over the loudspeakers of the prison

Apocalypse Now: Big Important scene (you MUST watch this film)

Small Soldiers: Uses the same music in a parody of Apocalypse Now (may be usefull to compare)

Blues Brothere: Valkyre plays briefly when two Nazis crash their car in a rather extreme way

Last edited by Pants; 04-22-03 at 11:39 AM.
Old 04-22-03, 12:04 PM
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Thanks for the help Pants... Though my request for help was merely all-encompassing... I remember the roles of the pieces in Clockwork, Shawshank, and Apocalypse Now... I am a member here ya know.

'E
Old 04-22-03, 12:58 PM
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Magnolia - Also Sprach Zarathustra - Robert Strauss

Old 04-22-03, 01:47 PM
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Originally posted by Evolution
Thanks for the help Pants... Though my request for help was merely all-encompassing... I remember the roles of the pieces in Clockwork, Shawshank, and Apocalypse Now... I am a member here ya know.

'E
Yeah, but the way you ask is like, "I got these off the IMDb. Can anyone tell me how the music was used or whether or not the piece is actually used during a significant event... or if it's just like transitional background music." It sounded to me like you'd never seen them.
Old 04-23-03, 12:13 AM
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Yeah... I know how it sounded... sorry bout the misdirection. I only need clarification on the ones that wouldn't be generally considered "required viewing" or wouldn't be extremely memorable.... shoulda been more clear about that, but I appreciate you taking the time to respond.

'E

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