First Superman, now the Fantastic Four movie...

Sierra Disc · 10-31-02, 06:07 PM

Read this on Dark Horizons. I'm not going to jump up and down and say the movie "SUX" before it's even filmed, but I have to admit I do not like the sound of this at all. It's not quite as bad as making Lex Luthor an alien, but it does go pretty far away from what I thought was a perfectly decent comics mythology. I know comics can't always translate to film perfectly, but really, do they have to reinvent the wheel every time? Sigh... anyway, read on:

Spoiler:

C-Mart · 10-31-02, 08:00 PM

So what is the comic origin?

Spoiler:

-CM-

Gattman · 10-31-02, 08:17 PM

C-Mart

Reed Richards and his room-mate and test pilot Ben Grimm take Reed's girlfriend Susan Storm and her younger brother in outer space and they get hit by cosmic rays and become the FF

Actually I don't mind this change it could of been worse

C-Mart · 11-01-02, 03:08 AM

Thanks Gattman

Sounds close enough I guess. This is just scripting phase right? So no word on possible actors or anything?

-CM-

kevin75 · 11-01-02, 07:04 AM

can we just have sam raimi do all comic movies? either him or bryan singer. these two guys understand what works. you don't have to go in and totally shred the original material. there is a reason that these comics are successful people!! you don't have to 'refresh' anything or change anything, the story is right there. whata bunch of idiots.

joelgee · 11-01-02, 08:03 AM

Quote:

Sounds close enough I guess. This is just scripting phase right? So no word on possible actors or anything?

That's not the horrendous bit. The horrendous bit is that per the canon, Victor Von Doom and Reed Richards were college roommates.
Von Doom, if I recall correctly, was the bastard son of a gypsy woman and Count(?) Von Doom. He lived in Latveria. From his mother he learned dark sorcerous arts.
Richards was concerned because of the types of experiments that Von Doom was involved in, a blend of sorcery and science.
It was one of these experiments that shredded his face, although some posit that under the mask, there is nothing wrong with Von Doom's face. Instead, they believe, his mind got whacked and he only sees his face as uglified.

Anyway, I may be shaky on the details, but that's the gist of the thing.
If they put Doom in space, that's a bad sign. What else would they do, make the Thing a politically correct tree hugger who hates cigars?
For that matter, would Johnny Storm be in trouble with all of the non-smoking regulations now in effect?
Could Susan Storm still be the Invisible Girl or would she be Visibly Challenged Woman?
J

Giles · 11-01-02, 08:12 AM

Huh?!?

elias · 11-01-02, 09:23 AM

In the comics, Doom is a college classmate or Mr. Fantastic (Reed Richards) who is doing some sort of science/mysticism experiment. Reed happens to see Doom's calculations and tells him he's off a decimal (or something like that). Doom's ego doesn't allow him to accept criticism or help from Richards and he goes off to doe his experiment which explodes and gets him thrown out of school. He figures Richards sabotaged the calculations out of jealousy of Doom's genius.

Basically, he was never a friend, always a rival. Never a "fifth Beetle" kind of a thing.

MrN · 11-01-02, 09:30 AM

I don't mind the change - this way they're combining the origin of the FF and Doom and Doom can still blame Reed for what happens. Of course, the purists will object...

MrN · 11-01-02, 09:34 AM

I guess this belongs in this thread:
http://www.dvdtalk.com/forum/showthr...hreadid=247499

I'm sure Susan will be Invisible Woman, as she has been in the comics the last 10+ years.
And I have a feeling they're gonna take out Doom's mystical background - unless they somehow make the film about searching for the Ark or the Holy Grail or something like that.

Groucho · 11-01-02, 09:38 AM

Like any comic book adaptation people are going to howl and howl no matter what they do. "Whine...they changed the color of Richard Reed's hair...boo hoo hoo!"

Dr. DVD · 11-01-02, 10:51 AM

We only whine because we care!

What is wrong with leaving Doom's origin in tact? Do they think people can't relate to having a rival in college that always seemed to be trying to one-up another person?
At least bring up the Knights of the Atomic Table fraternity, one to which both Richards and Doom belonged.
IMO, and this is where Batman really dropped the ball IMO, never mess with the origin of a hero or villain. Spidey and Superman did the best origin stories available IMO, and X-Men did the best thing with Wolverine by having it remain a mystery. (Mainly because it still was one when the movie arrived.)

Braddok · 11-01-02, 11:00 AM

I don't mind the change. It still sounds like a comic book story. Bring on the movie!!!!!

Dr. DVD · 11-01-02, 11:26 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Braddok
I don't mind the change. It still sounds like a comic book story. Bring on the movie!!!!!

Appropriate wording, since this is being brought in by the man who directed Bring It On.

Iron_Giant · 11-01-02, 01:45 PM

Sounds like they changed the origin of Doom, not so much the origin of the F4.

I would go to see this and buy the DVD.

Here are my favorite Superheroes on DVD:
1. Superman
2. Batman
3. Xmen
4. Spiderman

Ones I hope will also be awesome on DVD
1. Hulk
2. F4
3. DareDevil

I collect a bunch of Comics in the 70s, the movies/DVDs are going to be the new driving force for these Superheroes!

Fielding Mellish · 11-01-02, 02:50 PM

It sounds like the change was/will be made to simply help move the story along, as opposed to any desire to "monkey" with comic book canon.

The same "streamlining" can be attributed towards making the Joker the killer of Bruce Wayne's folks, movie-Spidey's organic webshooters, and bypassing Lex Luthor's "how I went bald due to Clark Kent" backstory in Donner's "Superman."

In many ways, I hold ol' Stretcho, Suzie, Match-Head and Aunt Petunia's favorite nephew as near and dear to my heart as a certain wall-crawler. If the film opens with the FF battling a giant Kirby-esque monster in midtown Manhattan, I'd certainly consider it a step in the right direction.

I just hope I can hold back my girlish squeal the first time Benjy yells "It's Clobberin' Time." Of course, if they cut out that little piece of funnybook nuance, I could possibly be encouraged to riot.

JimRochester · 11-01-02, 03:12 PM

Fantastic Four was always a favorite growing up. I hope this works as well as spiderman did.

devilshalo · 11-01-02, 03:15 PM

be glad you haven't read the scripts for Silver Surfer or Plastic Man.

and from that last line.. don't you picture the cover of issue #1

Jackskeleton · 11-01-02, 04:51 PM

Just release the already made movie.. it should do as good as this new idea in the box office.

randy1320 · 11-01-02, 05:05 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Groucho
Like any comic book adaptation people are going to howl and howl no matter what they do. "Whine...they changed the color of Richard Reed's hair...boo hoo hoo!"

You mean Reed Richards?

Sierra Disc · 11-01-02, 05:43 PM

It just seems like a lame 'cop-out' to me to always make the hero and villian intimately related, 'light and dark' sides of the same coin in movies. Examples -- Joker kills Batman's folks instead of some anonymous gunman, Green Goblin's company is responsible for Spider-Man's powers, etc. It's rather limp storytelling to fall back on the "you're my enemy, and my twisted reflection!" theory every time. Of course, I guess they do it in comic books all the time too, but I've always liked it better when the villain is JUST a villain -- not the heros' father/employer/ex-girlfriend/pet chiropractor or whatever.

cooper2000 · 11-01-02, 07:06 PM

I would like to see the original F4 movie that was made about 10 years ago. Apparently it was so bad they never released it.
Too bad they dont do that with most horrible Hollywood movies.

I always heard this movie was impossible to do because of the amount of money it would cost to do the effects.

caligulathegod · 11-01-02, 09:59 PM

You really don't want to see the 1994 Fantastic Four. I mean, really really don't.

lordzeppelin · 11-01-02, 11:13 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by caligulathegod
You really don't want to see the 1994 Fantastic Four. I mean, really really don't.

Why, it can't possibly be as bad as the Captain America film...

Jackskeleton · 11-02-02, 12:32 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by lordzeppelin
Why, it can't possibly be as bad as the Captain America film...

As amazing as it sounds, It is worse...

10-31-02, 08:00 PM	#2
C-Mart DVD Talk Platinum Edition Join Date: Aug 1999 Location: Beaumont, CA Posts: 3,877	So what is the comic origin? Spoiler: I am already not liking it because I hated Perfect Storm, but I would still go see it. -CM- __________________ "How deliciously white trash, Mommy! I want a mullet!" -Stewie “All the hospitals in the world won’t do you any good if you’re dead before you get there.” -Hassinger Wii Friend Code: 4417 3367 3281 1070 PSN: chadmart My Countdown Counting down to: 360° Tour! Rock On!

11-01-02, 03:08 AM	#4
C-Mart DVD Talk Platinum Edition Join Date: Aug 1999 Location: Beaumont, CA Posts: 3,877	Thanks Gattman Sounds close enough I guess. This is just scripting phase right? So no word on possible actors or anything? -CM- __________________ "How deliciously white trash, Mommy! I want a mullet!" -Stewie “All the hospitals in the world won’t do you any good if you’re dead before you get there.” -Hassinger Wii Friend Code: 4417 3367 3281 1070 PSN: chadmart My Countdown Counting down to: 360° Tour! Rock On!

11-01-02, 07:04 AM	#5
kevin75 DVD Talk Limited Edition Join Date: Jan 2000 Location: east texas Posts: 5,473	can we just have sam raimi do all comic movies? either him or bryan singer. these two guys understand what works. you don't have to go in and totally shred the original material. there is a reason that these comics are successful people!! you don't have to 'refresh' anything or change anything, the story is right there. whata bunch of idiots. __________________ "There are just some things you can't compromise on. Some things you can. A new suit...yeah. Dream house...maybe. But the girl...you can't compromise on the girl." -- Ed Stevens

11-01-02, 08:12 AM	#7
Giles DVD Talk Hero Join Date: Dec 1999 Location: Washington DC Posts: 29,863	Huh?!? __________________ [2ndDVDTalk Action/Adventure/Crime Challenge 2013 Film List / Unrated-Alternate-Director's Cuts: DVD (updates) / My DVD collection Entertainment or Die soundillustrated - Weekly Music Food

11-01-02, 09:30 AM	#9
MrN DVD Talk Platinum Edition Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: B.W.I. Posts: 3,699	I don't mind the change - this way they're combining the origin of the FF and Doom and Doom can still blame Reed for what happens. Of course, the purists will object... __________________ "Yeah, well, that's just, like, your opinion, man." My DVD Collection My CD Collection

10-31-02, 06:07 PM	#1
Sierra Disc DVD Talk Limited Edition Join Date: May 2000 Location: Auckland, New Zealand Posts: 5,556	First Superman, now the Fantastic Four movie... Read this on Dark Horizons. I'm not going to jump up and down and say the movie "SUX" before it's even filmed, but I have to admit I do not like the sound of this at all. It's not quite as bad as making Lex Luthor an alien, but it does go pretty far away from what I thought was a perfectly decent comics mythology. I know comics can't always translate to film perfectly, but really, do they have to reinvent the wheel every time? Sigh... anyway, read on: Spoiler: The Fantastic Four: "Buffy" scribe Doug Petrie has just spoken with Dreamwatch magazine about his plans for his version of the film script and how the origin of the heroes and villain will differ from that of the comic mythology: "The change to the origin story, which came from the earlier drafts and I adopted, is that Doom was like the fifth Beatle. He was on the spaceship with them, and in my version he saw this particle wave coming - they didn’t want to say cosmic rays because they felt it sounded fake, but in fact cosmic rays are real. I wanted to do A Perfect Storm in space, where a giant wave is coming towards them, and Victor blasts off in the escape pod, saving his own skin. He crashlands to Earth and becomes Doom because his face is lost in the reentry process, which is horrible and violent, while the four of them get bombaded by these mysterious rays and become the Fantastic Four". These origin scenes will be part of flashbacks though, as the opening is "a giant action sequence where everyone in New York City is watching The Fantastic Four kick the crap out of a giant monster on Fifth Avenue". Thanks to 'Confuscious Brown'.

10-31-02, 08:17 PM	#3
Gattman Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Melbourne Australia Posts: 769	C-Mart Reed Richards and his room-mate and test pilot Ben Grimm take Reed's girlfriend Susan Storm and her younger brother in outer space and they get hit by cosmic rays and become the FF Actually I don't mind this change it could of been worse

11-01-02, 09:23 AM	#8
elias Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2000 Posts: 818	In the comics, Doom is a college classmate or Mr. Fantastic (Reed Richards) who is doing some sort of science/mysticism experiment. Reed happens to see Doom's calculations and tells him he's off a decimal (or something like that). Doom's ego doesn't allow him to accept criticism or help from Richards and he goes off to doe his experiment which explodes and gets him thrown out of school. He figures Richards sabotaged the calculations out of jealousy of Doom's genius. Basically, he was never a friend, always a rival. Never a "fifth Beetle" kind of a thing.

11-01-02, 09:34 AM	#10
MrN DVD Talk Platinum Edition Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: B.W.I. Posts: 3,699	I guess this belongs in this thread: http://www.dvdtalk.com/forum/showthr...hreadid=247499 I'm sure Susan will be Invisible Woman, as she has been in the comics the last 10+ years. And I have a feeling they're gonna take out Doom's mystical background - unless they somehow make the film about searching for the Ark or the Holy Grail or something like that. __________________ "Yeah, well, that's just, like, your opinion, man." My DVD Collection My CD Collection

11-01-02, 09:38 AM	#11
Groucho DVD Talk Godfather Join Date: Mar 2000 Location: Salt Lake City, Utah Posts: 62,081	Like any comic book adaptation people are going to howl and howl no matter what they do. "Whine...they changed the color of Richard Reed's hair...boo hoo hoo!" __________________ Xbox Live: Runner Groucho PSN: RunnerGroucho "The Borg is a species" -- Tracer Bullet (Citation)

11-01-02, 10:51 AM	#12
Dr. DVD DVD Talk Legend Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Daytona Beach, FL Posts: 18,482	We only whine because we care! What is wrong with leaving Doom's origin in tact? Do they think people can't relate to having a rival in college that always seemed to be trying to one-up another person? At least bring up the Knights of the Atomic Table fraternity, one to which both Richards and Doom belonged. IMO, and this is where Batman really dropped the ball IMO, never mess with the origin of a hero or villain. Spidey and Superman did the best origin stories available IMO, and X-Men did the best thing with Wolverine by having it remain a mystery. (Mainly because it still was one when the movie arrived.) __________________ "The greatest trick the devil ever pulled was convincing the world he didn't exist." -Verbal Kint in The Usual Suspects

11-01-02, 11:00 AM	#13
Braddok Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2001 Posts: 866	I don't mind the change. It still sounds like a comic book story. Bring on the movie!!!!! __________________ I will listen to reason when it's avaible on cd

11-01-02, 01:45 PM	#15
Iron_Giant DVD Talk Ultimate Edition Join Date: Jun 2001 Posts: 4,792	Sounds like they changed the origin of Doom, not so much the origin of the F4. I would go to see this and buy the DVD. Here are my favorite Superheroes on DVD: 1. Superman 2. Batman 3. Xmen 4. Spiderman Ones I hope will also be awesome on DVD 1. Hulk 2. F4 3. DareDevil I collect a bunch of Comics in the 70s, the movies/DVDs are going to be the new driving force for these Superheroes! __________________ Heroes come in all kinds of shapes and sizes, but they all have the same heart...

11-01-02, 02:50 PM	#16
Fielding Mellish DVD Talk Gold Edition Join Date: May 2000 Location: A secret rebel stronghold in the Republic of San Marcos Posts: 2,285	It sounds like the change was/will be made to simply help move the story along, as opposed to any desire to "monkey" with comic book canon. The same "streamlining" can be attributed towards making the Joker the killer of Bruce Wayne's folks, movie-Spidey's organic webshooters, and bypassing Lex Luthor's "how I went bald due to Clark Kent" backstory in Donner's "Superman." In many ways, I hold ol' Stretcho, Suzie, Match-Head and Aunt Petunia's favorite nephew as near and dear to my heart as a certain wall-crawler. If the film opens with the FF battling a giant Kirby-esque monster in midtown Manhattan, I'd certainly consider it a step in the right direction. I just hope I can hold back my girlish squeal the first time Benjy yells "It's Clobberin' Time." Of course, if they cut out that little piece of funnybook nuance, I could possibly be encouraged to riot. __________________ "Thirty Helens Agree."

11-01-02, 03:12 PM	#17
JimRochester DVD Talk Legend Join Date: Sep 1999 Location: Rochester, NY. USA Posts: 11,119	Fantastic Four was always a favorite growing up. I hope this works as well as spiderman did. __________________ Panasonic 58" Plasma,Pioneer vsx91, SONY s590 312 titles, Toshiba A35 79 titles, Def-Tech speakers supercube sub. Most wanted BD: Big Red 1/Bugsy/Die Hard 4(R rated)/Dragnet/Memphis Belle/Midway (6/4/13)/Pearl Harbor(DC)/Sleepless In Seattle (7/9/13)/Tin Cup/Trapped In Paradise/True Lies/While You Were Sleeping.

11-01-02, 03:15 PM	#18
devilshalo DVD Talk Legend Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: Somewhere between Heaven and Hell Posts: 24,142	be glad you haven't read the scripts for Silver Surfer or Plastic Man. and from that last line.. don't you picture the cover of issue #1 __________________ Just once, I would like to be a puppetmaster and have nothing go wrong. Is that too much to ask? - Dwight Schrute Last edited by devilshalo; 11-01-02 at 03:19 PM.

11-01-02, 04:51 PM	#19
Jackskeleton DVD Talk Godfather Join Date: Jul 2000 Location: City of the lakers.. riots.. and drug dealing cops.. los(t) Angel(e)s. ca. Posts: 52,228	Just release the already made movie.. it should do as good as this new idea in the box office. __________________ *OTHER FORUM TEAM 7 leader*I will not say them here nor there. I will not say them anywhere. I will not say those Words you twit. I will not, will not sayI quit! Leaving a dark wet stain where your brain used to be? weird..tv? The bank is worth the risk

11-01-02, 05:43 PM	#21
Sierra Disc DVD Talk Limited Edition Join Date: May 2000 Location: Auckland, New Zealand Posts: 5,556	It just seems like a lame 'cop-out' to me to always make the hero and villian intimately related, 'light and dark' sides of the same coin in movies. Examples -- Joker kills Batman's folks instead of some anonymous gunman, Green Goblin's company is responsible for Spider-Man's powers, etc. It's rather limp storytelling to fall back on the "you're my enemy, and my twisted reflection!" theory every time. Of course, I guess they do it in comic books all the time too, but I've always liked it better when the villain is JUST a villain -- not the heros' father/employer/ex-girlfriend/pet chiropractor or whatever.

11-01-02, 07:06 PM	#22
cooper2000 Banned Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: San Leandro , CA Posts: 1,636	I would like to see the original F4 movie that was made about 10 years ago. Apparently it was so bad they never released it. Too bad they dont do that with most horrible Hollywood movies. I always heard this movie was impossible to do because of the amount of money it would cost to do the effects.

11-01-02, 09:59 PM	#23
caligulathegod DVD Talk Platinum Edition Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Grove City OH Posts: 3,144	You really don't want to see the 1994 Fantastic Four. I mean, really really don't. __________________ 2013 Fourth Annual Drive-In/Exploitation/B-Movie Challenge. List Thread. My Drive-In Challenge List My Countdown Counting down to: Fourth Annual Drive-In/Exploitation/B-Movie Challenge! April 1-April 30 2013 at Dawn (Sunday midnight thru Dawn May 1) It's over. Thanks for playing. Please enjoy the home game.