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Old 06-07-05, 06:12 PM   #1
Julie Walker
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Lions Gate on unrated dvd releases...(High Tension etc)

I got a reply from Chela on the LG forums regarding this issue. Since I have been pushing for/inquiring about the lack of unrated versions of various films.

+ quite a few of us have made it clear,that while we will see High Tension in theaters. We will not be purchasing the R rated version on dvd if that is all that is released in the U.S.

Here are her two replies



#14 Today, 11:26 AM
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We are trying to release unrated cuts when possible. The thing that none of the DVD buying crowd understands is that often we do not have the UNRATED cut finished in time to release initially on DVD. With SAW, we did not have ANY clearances for the original short nor cleared music. The director wanted to go back and color time the ENTIRE uncut film to get it to the point where he was happy with the look. The UK and other territories did not have this new version. Understand that these dvd releases are as much for the filmmakers as they are for the fans. Though other territories may do it, we do not want to go out with anything less than what the filmmakers feel is perfect. Often, this takes more time and a lot of work - especially considering the filmmakers schedules' and new projects.

There is no future in making dvds that people do not like. We do as much as we can with what we have.

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#15 Today, 11:32 AM
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Also, to addrses your complaint about the many films we released R RATED instead of UNRATED... we never had complete versions of those titles. To this day, and Rob Z will tell you as well, there is NOT an existing UNCUT version of HOUSE OF 1,000 Corpses. The rumor of uncut versions of the titles you mention is not true. I am a huge horror fan. I put everythign i can on the title I work on (which is every LG acquired or produced Horror flick).

High Tension will be released both as a Rated R disc and as an UNRATED disc.
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Old 06-07-05, 06:14 PM   #2
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Seems reasonable. If I were you, however, I would be just as concerned about the crap dubbing that exists during part of the rated release. I'm hoping for an unrated, undubbed release.
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Old 06-07-05, 06:39 PM   #3
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That reply from Chela is a little cryptic. By "unrated" did Chela mean the "uncut" version.... because we all know how studios love to play word games.
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Old 06-07-05, 07:12 PM   #4
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again rubbish on the 1000 Corpses issue. there IS an uncut version, its the version that was turned down by every other film company when he was trying to get it released. THAT version was NEVER released yet on DVD. if she means it just needs worked on before it can be released, or that Zombie is no longer interested (which he has said amongst other excuses in this comical history) then fine just say that, but dont act like this whole thing is non-existant.

ask her about directors like eli roth and roger avary being promised an uncut DVD and then not being able to do it. i would be curious on that. both have been vocal about this situation, especially avary.
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Old 06-07-05, 11:17 PM   #5
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I am confused about the Rules issue in this case(one of the films I asked if/when a uncut release would come out). Since I talked to Roger Avary personally before the dvd was released. He had said he had worked on both the R & Unrated versions.

Basically he gave the R version a 2.0 only soundtrack for two reasons. Since it's the compromised version,he didn't feel it needed a 5.1 mix. + the numerous commentaries took up alot of space as well.

Yet he did mention working on the unrated print and mixing it in 5.1 for the dvd. I do not know if he recorded a commentary for that version yet. But it seemed like he and Ellis were going to be recording commentary tracks for that version.

I then emailed him once only the R rated version was being released and he told me he was not aware of that and just as surprised as the rest of us!


Anyway I do think it is good news since at least uncut versions are possible eventually,even if we don't get them immediately.

And I'm sure when she said unrated,she meant 'uncut'. So the paranoia of "It'll be just a gimmick and not the 'real' uncut version" is pretty foolish.

Oh and we are giving them hell(politely but directly) so to speak and making it known we object to the dubbing on High Tension more than anything else. We can understand why they cut the film abit for an R rated wide release(ie-to make profit). But the dubbing is uncalled for.

At least it appears we will be getting the real version on dvd. Which is all we can really ask/hope for. Of course keep a look out for the announcement. Both versions better be released immediately(which her comments make it seem). If that is not the case,then they are holding out again for a possible future cash in.


Regarding Corpses. I am pretty sure this happened durring the studio shuffle/3 year delay. The complete print was screened and turned down. Then LG bought the rights and got it rated. It got an NC-17. So it was then re-edited down to an R. Thus the original master was now conformed to the R version. To get it back to uncut status,the master would need to be reedited to place the cut footage back into the print.

That can be the only explanation for the 'uncut print not exisitng' comments Zombie and LG use and how it would need to be reedited to get it 'uncut'.
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Old 06-07-05, 11:23 PM   #6
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Ill definitely pick up the Uncut High Tension when it comes out. Ive seen it a few times now and its pretty good.
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Old 06-07-05, 11:44 PM   #7
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This response is very vague, and while she does mention at the bottom of her post that High Tension will get both an R rated and Unrated release, for some reason I feel that will fall through.

Personally I think what she says is a lot of bull; many times directors are ready and willing to present an uncut version for release on DVD, but for some reason or another the DVD company is unwilling to release it themselves, Rules of Attraction being a case in point.
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Old 06-07-05, 11:55 PM   #8
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Since an uncut Saw release is probably coming out when the sequel is released. I can only assume the uncut Rules will show up whenever Avary gets Glamorama made.

Also the uncut Corpses is rumored to be out sometime when the sequel is released(on dvd most likely).

+ notice they are rereleasing American Psycho uncut this time,to cash in on Bales Batman Begins staring role.

..and Audition is being released uncut in August. So uncut releases are not 100% impossible with Lions Gate and will happen....eventually
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Old 06-08-05, 01:06 AM   #9
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Tension to get an Unrated and R-Rated release...

hmm... just like when LG stated they would release it in theatres completely uncut and NC-17... then backed out completely on that...
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Old 06-08-05, 02:26 AM   #10
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I am confused. she says that sometimes they dont have uncut versions available to them. Wasn't the Toolbox Murders released fully uncut in other countries, but with the Lions Gate DVD the cut footage ended up being "deleted scenes"? Also with ROTLD 3, it was available uncut in the UK (although full screen) and the DVD released here was rated R.

Also with High Tension, I have the French 2 disc and the UK disc, so unless there is some rad extra, I might have to pass on it.

By no means am I ragging on lions gate, they put out some great DVDs for a lot of movies I like (Irreversible being one example), I just am disappointed at times that a lot of other movies I do like they choose to release in cut form.
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Old 06-08-05, 03:12 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by asianxcore
I am confused. she says that sometimes they dont have uncut versions available to them. Wasn't the Toolbox Murders released fully uncut in other countries, but with the Lions Gate DVD the cut footage ended up being "deleted scenes"? Also with ROTLD 3, it was available uncut in the UK (although full screen) and the DVD released here was rated R.

Also with High Tension, I have the French 2 disc and the UK disc, so unless there is some rad extra, I might have to pass on it.

By no means am I ragging on lions gate, they put out some great DVDs for a lot of movies I like (Irreversible being one example), I just am disappointed at times that a lot of other movies I do like they choose to release in cut form.

It turns out all other releases of Toolbox Murders are the same as the U.S R rated version. The 'uncut' mention on the international dvds refers to them not being(further) cut by their censors at all.

So the only way to see the uncut gore scenes are on the region 1 dvd release. Also reading interviews with the filmmakers in Rue Morgue I think it was. They mention only creating one print/cut of the film(the R version) since they want the widest releases possible. Since they ran out of money near the end of production. They could only afford to create one version of the film. So they had to go with the R version to make any sort of profit. If they had enough money to create another print,they would have released both R & Unrated versions.

My guess on Saw is,the UK version was uncut,but not colortimed as the director wanted(since he didn't have input on the print). Thus whenever it gets released in the U.S.,it should be color timed correctly.


She told me "legal & techinical" reasons were why they couldn't/have'nt released the uncut version of Return of the Living Dead 3 on dvd. She also happens to be a huge fan of this film(& worked on the dvd). So I guess even she would be upset that the heavily censored R version is on dvd since they could'nt release the uncut version.
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Old 06-08-05, 08:55 AM   #12
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Definitely an interesting response from LG. Part of it could be bullshit to cover up some legal issues or something, but from the sound of it, she seems pretty sincere on releases. I do hope the 'Unrated' disc of Haute Tension is an Uncut version of the film, undubbed as well. We shall see.

I for one appreciate the fact that LG puts themselves on the line for releasing stuff most studios wouldn't touch. For the majority, their releases are well done and what we as DVD fans want.
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Old 06-08-05, 09:38 AM   #13
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Same ol' same ol' from Lion's Gate. Big sincere-sounding promises, and no follow-through. No big deal - there are excellent DVDs of the uncut, undubbed "Haute Tension" available from other, better DVD makers.*

[*I wish they'd follow-through on their promises with regard to theater releases as it's not very easy to take a transatlantic flight to view an uncut/undubbed print. But in terms of DVD, they are simply not relevant until they can come forth with a product on-par with the competition.]
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Old 06-08-05, 09:58 AM   #14
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Thanks for the update, Julie. Looking forward to seeing High Tension again ... but I'm waiting for the DVD. The dub version will be cool as a curiosity, perhaps, but I'd like to add the original, uncut, non-dubbed version to my collection.
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Old 06-08-05, 10:26 AM   #15
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i don't know much about this issue but it always really annoyed me that the lion's gate r1 "dead alive" release is "unrated" but not uncut like the r2 version available by other companies under the name "braindead"
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Old 06-08-05, 12:34 PM   #16
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Thanks for clearing all that up Julie.

Also I think it is really weird that Haute Tension is coming out dubbed. I understand it is probably due to audiences over in the states, but there isn't that much dialogue in the movie, I forgot how much but probably only like 9-10 minutes tops of dialogue.
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Old 06-08-05, 01:55 PM   #17
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Dialog runs throughout the film, from the opening establishing scenes that center around the two girls' relationships - which, of course, is crucial to the plot - as well as the constant, though mostly one-sided dialog that continues throughout the film, carefully treading the line between...

Spoiler:
the different realities the characters are experiencing


Unlike most horror films, the acting here is impressive and needs to be. The dialog is crucial to this film in precisely the way that the usual inane blather between killings in lesser horror films is not. Though I find redubbing to be a travesty in general, it is particularly so when the subtle inflections of the actors' performances are as important as they are here, and when the performances are as good as they are here.

The notion that redubbing is not important here because there's not much dialog or that the dialog is not important - and I don't believe asianxcore supports this idea - is completely absurd. Lion's Gate is reaching here for the lowest common denominator, dumbing down the film to meet the expectations of those who surely will fail to appreciate what makes it better than the usual tripe. On top of that, they've cut the film so that it could be distributed to said troglodytic masses in their natural habitat, the strip mall googolplex that has assumed the duty of moral watchdog in communities that apparently put a great deal faith in the pronouncements of the MPAA's ratings board.

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Old 06-08-05, 02:09 PM   #18
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from what i have read over in the movie forum, only certain scenes were dubbed, and that many scenes are still subtitled.
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Old 06-08-05, 02:33 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rypro 525
from what i have read over in the movie forum, only certain scenes were dubbed, and that many scenes are still subtitled.
From what I've read on the DVD Maniacs forum, every bit of dialog between the two main characters has been redubbed and the rest is subtitled. If you've seen the film, you'll understand that this means essentially everything is dubbed. Except for a few brief interjections by a convenience store clerk and a passing motorist, I can't think of another character with a speaking part, certainly nothing of any import.
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Old 06-08-05, 02:41 PM   #20
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She had very good reasons to your addresses. That's good news for High Tension's dvd, SAW is understandable, and I knew that Corpses issue.

LGF is a great genre company, and while its a company trying to make $, I believe they are trying to please the fans.
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Old 06-08-05, 03:46 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard Malloy
From what I've read on the DVD Maniacs forum, every bit of dialog between the two main characters has been redubbed and the rest is subtitled. If you've seen the film, you'll understand that this means essentially everything is dubbed. Except for a few brief interjections by a convenience store clerk and a passing motorist, I can't think of another character with a speaking part, certainly nothing of any import.
There is a long article in Sunday's Boston Globe that talks about the movie. The part relevant to the dub/sub discussion is: "The film would be subtitled and dubbed, and it would be explained through a simple turn of plot. Marie would remain French, and Alex and her family would be Americans who had a country home in France. So Marie would speak in dubbed English to Alex and her family, and in French everywhere else. Alex and her family would speak in dubbed English with American accents. And everyone else (slight spoiler removed) would speak in French." Marie's lines have been dubbed by the original actress (Cecile de France) and American actors were hired for the roles of Alex and her family.
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Old 06-08-05, 03:52 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard Malloy
The notion that redubbing is not important here because there's not much dialog or that the dialog is not important - and I don't believe asianxcore supports this idea - is completely absurd.

I never said the dialogue wasn't important. It is important for a film like this because for the majority of the movie, the dialogue that is spoken reveals much about the movie and a lot of the "secrets" it holds. I just hate dubbing in general. I hate it for this movie not because I feel that dubbing "isn't important" but because I prefer to see movies in their original language tracks and that there is so little dialogue in the movie why have it dubbed over? I do understand that it is to appeal to the mass audience who complain about "reading subtitles" but I hope you see my point in all this. Just because it's being released this way doesn't mean that Alexandre Aja is completely happy with it. I know there is an interview that I read where he completely went off on his movie being released this way, but in the end let it go simply because yes it will see a much wider release this way, and the more people see it, the more people will buy it when it is released on DVD in the ultra special super edition.

If I didn't like the movie, as much as I do, I wouldn't have paid 40+ bucks for the movie when I was in France on DVD and I wouldn't have imported the UK version. Dialogue is important in this film, VERY important, but dubbing the little dialogue this movie has is absurd.
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Old 06-08-05, 04:18 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by asianxcore
I never said the dialogue wasn't important. It is important for a film like this because for the majority of the movie, the dialogue that is spoken reveals much about the movie and a lot of the "secrets" it holds. I just hate dubbing in general. I hate it for this movie not because I feel that dubbing "isn't important" but because I prefer to see movies in their original language tracks and that there is so little dialogue in the movie why have it dubbed over? I do understand that it is to appeal to the mass audience who complain about "reading subtitles" but I hope you see my point in all this.
I suspected we agreed on this (and I made sure to point that out when I used your post as a springboard to my own anti-dubbing rant)!

Quote:
Originally Posted by asianxcore
Just because it's being released this way doesn't mean that Alexandre Aja is completely happy with it. I know there is an interview that I read where he completely went off on his movie being released this way...
I also recall reading about that, back when Lion's Gate was making big brave noises about releasing "Haute Tension" uncut in North America (the notion of a dub seemed entirely beyond the pale). But, like I said when first reading LGF's response to Julie: "some ol' same ol'".

I know how important it is to many of us to see films projected in theaters, as intended, and I know this is the only form that most of you will be able to see in the theaters. But if you can live with viewing this in your home theaters alone, I urge you to get one of the uncut/undubbed DVDs instead, especially if this will be the first time you see the movie. Perhaps one day LGF will finally follow-through on their brave promises to bring undiluted, uncut, undubbed, unflinching, and unusual fare to North American audiences... but so far they've proven only that they cannot be trusted to do so, whatever noises they may make to the contrary.
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Old 06-08-05, 10:23 PM   #24
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The thing that none of the DVD buying crowd understands is that often we do not have the UNRATED cut finished in time to release initially on DVD.
I don't know about the rest of the DVD buying crowd, but I would rather they push the date back and tell us that it's because they're getting the UNRATED cut put together. I'd accept that and wait. Rather then saying "an Unrated Version doesn't exist." Then 6 months to a year later they release the "Special, Director's, New, Super, Uber, Extended, Blah Blah Blah Cut" of the flick.

Just my opinion.
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Old 06-09-05, 01:44 AM   #25
Julie Walker
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Originally Posted by ManWNoName
i don't know much about this issue but it always really annoyed me that the lion's gate r1 "dead alive" release is "unrated" but not uncut like the r2 version available by other companies under the name "braindead"

Well it was Peter Jackson himself who created the 97 minute cut of the film

Durring the wait for U.S release,he decided to cut the film down abit and actually prefers the 97 minute edit,over the 104 minute version.

Uncut does not always mean 'longer. The Dawn of the Dead(1978) being a great example. Sure their is an extended rough cut of the film. But it is not a 'directors cut'(though many have called it that based on it's longer length). The shorter 126 minute theatrical version is the real directors cut.


Just be glad they didn't release the R version on dvd. If you want to see what Dead Alive is like without it's gore,there is your chance


Since only a minute at most was cut from High Tension. I am sure the unrated version will be the uncut version. So no paranoid delusions of it being another 'hybrid gimmick' version(that adds say extra dialogue,but none of the extra gore) are needed.
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