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View Full Version : The 2012 NFL Offseason Thread


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clappj
01-12-12, 01:01 PM
If you throw out '94, when he was interim, I count 6 winning, 5 losing, 5 8-8. So he has more winning than losing.

There's no tying in football!

Red Dog
01-12-12, 01:02 PM
There's no tying in football!

Ok, Donovan McNabb.

LurkerDan
01-12-12, 01:03 PM
141-115 not counting the interim stint.

11 Seasons of 500 or better.

what a loser!

starman9000
01-12-12, 01:05 PM
This looks like fun, I'll play!

11 Seasons of 500 or worse, counting all of his seasons.

LurkerDan
01-12-12, 01:05 PM
And you definitely can't count the interim stint, he took over a team that was 1-9.

LurkerDan
01-12-12, 01:06 PM
This looks like fun, I'll play!

11 Seasons of 500 or worse, counting all of his seasons.

But a winning record overall, and not even close.

starman9000
01-12-12, 01:12 PM
And you definitely can't count the interim stint, he took over a team that was 1-9.

Why count any of his seasons? Do they really mean much of anything to how he'll do in his next stint?

Like Red Dog said re: Haynesworth, if you think he's good at getting the most out of his players and like his system it's a good hire.

Larry C.
01-12-12, 01:13 PM
Yeah Fisher is no loser. Well maybe if he doesn't come to my Fins. ;)

Drexl
01-12-12, 01:14 PM
How do you calculate that 6 > 10?
Fisher had 17 seasons as coach for the Jags, but one year he was interim coach so I knocked 11 down to 10.

"Jags?"

"Forget it; he's rolling."

starman9000
01-12-12, 01:15 PM
:lol:

LurkerDan
01-12-12, 01:18 PM
"Jags?"

"Forget it; he's rolling."

well played :lol:

davidh777
01-12-12, 01:19 PM
Someone on ESPN was speculating that he's holding out to see what happens in Indy

Larry C.
01-12-12, 01:24 PM
Someone on ESPN was speculating that he's holding out to see what happens in Indy

I was thinking the same. But the new GM said he will take a week or so to make any decisions.

clappj
01-12-12, 01:28 PM
"Jags?"

"Forget it; he's rolling."

:lol:

Yeah, I was talking to a friend about the Jags earlier, so I spaced that one big time.
Sub in Tits for Jags.

p.s. - I like Fisher as a coach, and was hoping that he would've come to coach the Panthers. :)

TGM
01-12-12, 02:01 PM
so striving for .500 is acceptable now? ROFL. OK.

starman9000
01-12-12, 02:04 PM
Dude, he's .540 that is not even close to .500. ;)

Larry C.
01-12-12, 02:27 PM
so striving for .500 is acceptable now? ROFL. OK.

Were not talking about what he is striving for. If he is striving for anything less than 1000 he is an idiot.

clappj
01-12-12, 02:28 PM
so striving for .500 is acceptable now? ROFL. OK.

But it's not losing.

sleepyhead55
01-12-12, 02:30 PM
It isn't the 6 winning seasons out of 17 that's concerning to me. It's 6 playoff appearances in 17 years. Someone mentioned Coughlin, well he has 10 playoff appearances and he and Fisher pretty much started at the same time (1995 as the first full year).

As for the lack of talent, you guys do realize that Fisher has had a huge say in personnel and roster construction while he was in Tennessee. I mean he chose to start Justin Gage even when there were better options on his own roster. He had final say over the 53 man roster for the last few years in Tennessee and chose to do things like release Legarette Blount and keep a useless S.

He is a good coach but I'm not quite sure he is an elite coach that deserves all this attention. I will say this in his favor though--how he managed to win over 50% of his games with Vince Young as his starter is impressive given what has transpired with Young.

Red Dog
01-12-12, 02:32 PM
I'd take 6 playoff appearances in the last 17 years in a heartbeat.

clappj
01-12-12, 02:38 PM
With this new math, I feel like I sold John Fox short for only having 3 winning seasons in his 10 years as the Panthers head coach.

Considering the Panthers finished 8-8 three of those 10 years, I can look on the bright side of things and realize that they only had 4 losing seasons.

Way to finish in mediocre fashion Foxy! :)

LurkerDan
01-12-12, 03:23 PM
He is a good coach but I'm not quite sure he is an elite coach that deserves all this attention.

I never said he was elite, and I agree with you that he really isn't. But he's a good coach, certainly better than a lot of guys out there.

Larry C.
01-12-12, 03:26 PM
No one is calling him elite. I think no one is calling him elite.

Apple Gooncha
01-12-12, 03:31 PM
Haynesworth only tried in contract years for the Titans. I'm thinking fisher had little to do with that.

Also, the vast majority of his success was from 99-03... Sure, he the Titans were rebuilding, but his conservative brand of football left me cold long ago.

Oh, that and Lamont Thompson starting for 3 straight seasons. Or the Volek/Collins fiasco, Eddie George carrying the ball 20 times a game for about 3 years when he was completely washed up....

Larry C.
01-12-12, 03:41 PM
Haynesworth only tried in contract years for the Titans. I'm thinking fisher had little to do with that.

Also, the vast majority of his success was from 99-03... Sure, he the Titans were rebuilding, but his conservative brand of football left me cold long ago.

Oh, that and Lamont Thompson starting for 3 straight seasons. Or the Volek/Collins fiasco, Eddie George carrying the ball 20 times a game for about 3 years when he was completely washed up....

That's the only thing that concerns me is his conservative nature. I hope getting a year off of coaching let him re-evalueate some of that.

clappj
01-12-12, 04:09 PM
That's the only thing that concerns me is his conservative nature. I hope getting a year off of coaching let him re-evalueate some of that.

Perhaps a change of venue might help also.
I thought more than once this season, if the Panthers still had John Fox as hc, that Cam Newton would've never stepped foot on the field.
But now he's in Denver, and it's Tebow Time.

sleepyhead55
01-12-12, 05:27 PM
Eddie George carrying the ball 20 times a game for about 3 years when he was completely washed up....

This pisses me off the most as he wasted 3 years of McNair's prime by giving George over 300+ carries in those three years. In those 3 years (2001-2003) Eddie George had 3 of the worst 10 years for any RB with over 300+ carries.

That's the only thing that concerns me is his conservative nature. I hope getting a year off of coaching let him re-evalueate some of that.

To me he can be progessive on offensive but once he gets a lead, he just sits on the damn lead and waits for the defense to make a stop and win the game.

Typical Fisher offense with a lead: run up the middle (2x) and incomplete pass on 3rd down. Then punt.

He is very good at clock management though. He's one of the best at understanding rules and nuances. So he's no Andy Reid in that respect.

For fantasy purposes if he is the coach of the Dolphins:

Bump up: Reggie Bush and Dan Carpenter.

Stays the same: Brandon Marshall

I think Daniel Thomas might get a bump up if he gets used as a gl vulture/short yardage back like Fisher used Lendale White in 2008. The TE (Fassano) should probably see an increase in targets since Fisher loves short passes to the tight end.

Decker
01-12-12, 06:30 PM
Someone on ESPN was speculating that he's holding out to see what happens in Indy

Maybe he wants to feel like a winner again:

https://encrypted-tbn3.google.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSdJsxRCO9NPsYmM_ZIT6CUlYlUhG3dWZqrqzDed3fQDELxLn8

My Other Self
01-12-12, 08:18 PM
I've never listened to Fisher but somebody said when he talks to the media he's really dry and offers nothing. He seemed to have a sense of humor with that whole Manning jersey thing. :shrug:

Drexl
01-13-12, 02:11 PM
Well, I'll be damned. Peter King is saying that Fisher has chosen the Rams after all. I thought sure it would be the Dolphins, what with all that was tweeted.

Deftones
01-13-12, 02:13 PM
Fisher is going to the Rams. He's just holding out for them to pony up more money. Watch.

Damn, I'm good.

Larry C.
01-13-12, 02:17 PM
Damn, I'm good.

50/50 odds. Yeah your awesome.

Larry C.
01-13-12, 02:42 PM
The Fins should have been all over Rod Chudzinski anyways. I know Billick hasn't gotten the time of day cause he is a reported egomaniac, but it wouldn't surprise me for Ross to panic and go after him just to get a name.

Drexl
01-13-12, 02:48 PM
^Yeah, I was just going to suggest Chudzinski. He's the guy I would have wanted for the Rams if Fisher had chose the Dolphins. His background at Miami would seem to make him a good fit.

Deftones
01-13-12, 02:54 PM
50/50 odds. Yeah your awesome.

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/01/13/report-dolphins-feel-fisher-used-them/

Larry C.
01-13-12, 02:56 PM
^Yeah, I was just going to suggest Chudzinski. He's the guy I would have wanted for the Rams if Fisher had chose the Dolphins. His background at Miami would seem to make him a good fit.

Well I wanted him 1st being a Hurricanes fan. But they haven't even interviewed him yet. Pathetic.

sleepyhead55
01-13-12, 03:02 PM
I feel sorry for the Dolphins since this is the 2nd year they've been turned down by a high profile coach. Chudzinski wouldn't be a bad choice and I think Todd Bowles is well regarded in the NFL.

Billick? Wasn't there a rumor out there that he was thinking about interviewing for the Falcons OC job? Personally, I hope he stays in the broadcast booth because I think he's one of the better color commentators on Fox.

The Rams giving Fisher full personnel isn't going to end well. Steven Jackson just saw his career shortened as Fisher loves to give RB's 300+ carries.

Red Dog
01-13-12, 03:07 PM
Yeah, I like Billick too in the booth. I can't see him taking a coordinator position.

Larry C.
01-13-12, 03:21 PM
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/01/13/report-dolphins-feel-fisher-used-them/

Yeah I read that before I always have Prosports open on my desktop. What about it? They didn't come out a say that it was leaked by someone.

Deftones
01-13-12, 03:41 PM
Yeah I read that before I always have Prosports open on my desktop. What about it? They didn't come out a say that it was leaked by someone.

I said he was going to pick the Rams and he was going to use the Dolphins job to leverage more money from the Rams. That report pretty much confirms that's what he basically did. :shrug:

CRM114
01-13-12, 03:43 PM
I'll take Billick next year when Andy Reid inevitably gets fired. Worth a shot.

Larry C.
01-13-12, 03:50 PM
I said he was going to pick the Rams and he was going to use the Dolphins job to leverage more money from the Rams. That report pretty much confirms that's what he basically did. :shrug:

Ok I get that but who didn't think he was using leverage? Schefter? Please.

Deftones
01-13-12, 03:53 PM
Ok I get that but who didn't think he was using leverage? Schefter? Please.

I made that post yesterday morning before Schefter even started talking about him taking the Rams job or anyone else did.

Deftones
01-13-12, 05:51 PM
I will say that I'm not terribly happy the Rams got Fisher, but I'm ecstatic that they did not hire Ray Horton away from the Cards.

Larry C.
01-13-12, 05:55 PM
Well there is a report that they might interview Chudzinski now. :banana:

dsa_shea
01-13-12, 06:00 PM
Well there is a report that they might interview Chudzinski now. :banana:

CannibalisticHumanoidUndergroundDwellerzinski?

tommyp007
01-16-12, 03:43 PM
Tebow officially the Broncos starter next season.

http://www.denverpost.com/broncos/ci_19753106

Broncos executive president of football operations John Elway opened up the season wrap-up news conference today by answering the first question on everyone's mind.
Yes, Tim Tebow will be the starting quarterback entering next season.
"Tim is the starting quarterback going into training camp," Elway said. "He made great strides. He has earned the right to be the starter going into training camp next year."
Also, Elway said the team will "be in the market to find more quarterbacks" via free agency or the draft.
Elway said he expects Tebow to become a better player before next season.
"Obviously, the passing game was not where we want it to be," Elway said. "We're looking forward to the offseason to see the improvement he can make, and I think he will do that.
"Where I can help him, and give my experiences, as well to others, I'll do that."

Noonan
01-16-12, 03:46 PM
I don't see why that would of even been a question. As a first year starter he took a failing team to/into the playoffs and outed a team that a lot of people had winning the SB.

Deftones
01-16-12, 04:35 PM
I don't see why any coach or owner would even state he'll be a starter for next season.

LurkerDan
01-16-12, 08:54 PM
I don't see why any coach or owner would even state he'll be a starter for next season.

Elway stated that he's the starter going into camp next year. You don't think any coach or owner should say that? That seems pretty standard to me (and it seems Tebow has at least earned that).

Deftones
01-16-12, 09:17 PM
Elway stated that he's the starter going into camp next year. You don't think any coach or owner should say that? That seems pretty standard to me (and it seems Tebow has at least earned that).

If your QB is Tom Brady or Drew Brees, sure, say it all you want as a coach. For the Broncos, it doesn't make a ton of sense given all the votes of no-confidence in the past few months Elway has lobbed his way. Plus, who the fuck knows what happens in the next 4-5 months Maybe they trade for a QB or sign a better FA. Given Elway's hesitance to anoint him their QB for the future, it just seems like a very quick turn of events. Plus, after the Patriots finally exposed him for what he really is, why commit to that?

My Other Self
01-16-12, 09:20 PM
You can't possibly think the Patriots exposed him in that game. Did you not see the Buffalo game, the first Pats game, or when they lost to the Chiefs 7-3? I think he was exposed well before that. :lol:

Deftones
01-16-12, 09:28 PM
You can't possibly think the Patriots exposed him in that game. Did you not see the Buffalo game, the first Pats game, or when they lost to the Chiefs 7-3? I think he was exposed well before that. :lol:

Well of course. He's been exposed in the past, but I think this was the one game where he really showed he just is lost out there. But in all those other games, the Denver defense kept them close, at least. Shows that he can only be a good QB when he's ahead or only losing by less than one score.

My Other Self
01-16-12, 09:40 PM
Shows that he can only be a good QB when he's ahead or only losing by less than one score.Which eludes to this "phenomena" surrounding him. I think your approach is most accurate. If they can acquire someone better they will. I think at this point if they want him to be the franchise QB it's going to take a hell of a lot of grooming. There's only so much they can do with the option. Luck doesn't win you championships.

His story is fun but realistically they have to be looking at other options.

dsa_shea
01-16-12, 09:56 PM
Which eludes to this "phenomena" surrounding him. I think your approach is most accurate. If they can acquire someone better they will. I think at this point if they want him to be the franchise QB it's going to take a hell of a lot of grooming. There's only so much they can do with the option. Luck doesn't win you championships.

His story is fun but realistically they have to be looking at other options.

You better tell the Colts before they waste a draft pick on him.

LurkerDan
01-17-12, 12:56 AM
If your QB is Tom Brady or Drew Brees, sure, say it all you want as a coach. For the Broncos, it doesn't make a ton of sense given all the votes of no-confidence in the past few months Elway has lobbed his way. Plus, who the fuck knows what happens in the next 4-5 months Maybe they trade for a QB or sign a better FA. Given Elway's hesitance to anoint him their QB for the future, it just seems like a very quick turn of events. Plus, after the Patriots finally exposed him for what he really is, why commit to that?

What does it hurt to say he's your starter entering camp? Why say that he's NOT your starter? I don't think the Broncos are trading for Manning, so why not say he's your starter entering camp? It doesn't prevent them from bringing someone in, it doesn't prevent them from drafting someone, all it does is give him some confidence going into the offseason and make his teammates -- who also seem to like him -- feel good. It commits them to nothing; it doesn't annoint him as the QB of the future. Seems to me that Elway is just doing the smart PR thing here.

Tom Brady and Drew Brees don't need to be told they're the starter entering camp, they're the starter no matter what; there is no competition for their spot. Elway didn't say there'd be no competition for the QB spot, he just said that Tebow starts the competition as the #1. Which, given the fact that they dumped Orton (ie, they don't seem likely to trade for or sign a high priced QB) and then made the playoffs, is a reasonable thing to say. :shrug:

Hell, even if they trade for Manning, all Elway has to say then is "We planned on Tim being our number 1, but this was too good an opportunity to pass up".

wishbone
01-17-12, 02:38 PM
It's official...

http://i39.tinypic.com/dw89pw.jpg

It was interesting hearing local news figuring as of last night that he would be kept as head coach. I 'spose not.

Red Dog
01-17-12, 02:42 PM
Funny how one neck injury ends up gutting an entire franchise.

Daryl
01-17-12, 02:46 PM
:lol: at SportsCenter reporting that he was being retained, and then literally 4 minutes later reporting that he'd been fired. At least Linda Cohn acknowledged the changed story.

There are reports that Caldwell was so surprised that he actually blinked. That hasn't been confirmed, though

wishbone
01-17-12, 02:48 PM
I think the neck injury was the tip the iceberg with Bill Polian and the installation of his son Chris as GM being the underlying issues.

kenbuzz
01-17-12, 02:48 PM
For those keeping score at home:

<table border=1><tr><td>Team</td><td>Former Coach</td><td>New Coach</td></tr><tr><td>Buccaneers</td><td>R. Morris</td><td></td></tr><tr><td>Chiefs</td><td>T. Haley</td><td>R. Crennel</td></tr><tr><td>Dolphins</td><td>T. Sparano</td><td><strike>J. Fisher</strike></td></tr><tr><td>Jaguars</td><td>J. Del Rio</td><td>M. Mularkey</td></tr><tr><td>Raiders</td><td>H. Jackson</td><td></td></tr><tr><td>Rams</td><td>S. Spagnuolo</td><td>J. Fisher</td></tr><tr><td>Colts</td><td>J. Caldwell</td><td></td></tr></table>

Morris hired as Redskins DB Coach
Sparano hired as Jets OC

Red Dog
01-17-12, 02:57 PM
Jeff Fisher and Gregg Williams reunited -- Williams leaves the Saints to be the DC for the Rams. Get used to a lot of blitzing, Rams fans. Looks like Brian Schotty will be the OC.

JumpCutz
01-17-12, 03:23 PM
Sparano hired as Jets DC

Sparano is actually the OC for the Jets.

Decker
01-17-12, 04:38 PM
From the Indy Star : A long and and somewhat far-fetched list of possible Colts coaches.

Next coach up? Here’s a list of candidates who could be considered for the Colts head coaching job.

Bill Cowher: He won a ring with Pittsburgh but resigned after 15 seasons in January 2007. Since then, he’s been an NFL analyst. While his name always gets mentioned for coaching jobs, if he expects to have front-office control then he probably won’t end up in Indianapolis.

Jon Gruden: He, too, has a Super Bowl ring, won it with a Tampa Bay team he inherited from former Colts coach Tony Dungy. Like Cowher, Gruden has also been doing TV work and just signed a contract extension. But he gushes about Manning and calls him “The Sheriff.” Perhaps Gruden would jump at the chance to coach the NFL’s only four-time MVP.

Wade Phillips, Houston defensive coordinator: He doesn’t hide his desire to again be a head coach. He’s done it for Denver, Buffalo and Dallas (career .581 win percentage) in addition to being an interim coach in New Orleans and Atlanta. His first season with the Texans this year, he converted them to a 3-4 and the franchise is in the playoffs for the first time.

Dom Capers, Green Bay defensive coordinator: Like Phillips, he’s a guy known for developing defenses. Capers also has AFC South experience as a coach with Houston from 2002 to 2005. Question is, could a new coach switch the Colts from a 4-3 to a 3-4?

Perry Fewell, NY Giants defensive coordinator: His name seems to come up a lot. He had a 3-4 record with Buffalo on an interim basis to close out the 2009 season, and has since been with the Giants, who when healthy boast one of the NFL’s best pass rushes.

Gregg Williams, New Orleans defensive coordinator: Another guy looking for a second chance at a head coaching chance, Williams had Buffalo’s job from 2004 to 2007. He’s known for developing aggressive, attacking 4-3 defenses. His defense closed out the Colts in Super Bowl XLIV when the Saints won 31-17 in Miami about 23 months ago.

Dennis Allen, Denver defensive coordinator: He’s only been with the Broncos for a year, but Denver had one of the NFL’s top defenses. Before that, the 39-year-old Allen was New Orleans’ secondary coach, which includes when the Saints beat the Colts in the Super Bowl.

Jim Tressel: While some will snicker at the thought of having a coach who departed from Ohio State in disgrace after lying to the NCAA about a scandal, he is a proven winner. And the NFL is about that bottom line. Tressel has been on the Colts staff as a replay assistant since October.

Tony Dungy: OK, so it probably won’t happen. But what if Colts owner Jim Irsay made a serious pitch to get his former coach to leave that NBC TV job and come back? It’s often been speculated that Dungy will one day return to coaching. Still, it’s probably a long shot. His son, Eric, is playing college ball at Oregon. Father probably wants to see a few more of son’s games.

Marty Mornhinweg: Philadelphia’s offensive coordinator didn’t fare so well as a head coach in Detroit, where he went 5-27 in 2001 and 2002. But he’s been the Eagles’ playcaller since 2006 and is highly regarded for his grasp of offenses.

Kirk Ferentz: The University of Iowa coach is signed through 2015 but has been rumored for NFL openings since 2006. Each time his name surfaces as a possibility, he quickly shoots down the speculation by saying he has a great job already.

Mike Sherman: He had a 59-43 record with Green Bay from 2000 to 2005, but was fired after a 4-12 season his last year. He’s currently unemployed after going 25-25 with Texas A&M through Dec. 1, 2011. He didn’t coach the Aggies in their bowl game victory.

Mike Zimmer: Cincinnati had one of the NFL’s best defenses this season with Zimmer as coordinator. He’s been with the Bengals since 2008. His name has surfaced as a candidate for current openings, most recently in Miami.

Marty Schottenheimer: He last coached in the NFL with San Diego in 2006. He has a 200-126-1 career record in stints with the Chargers, Kansas City and Cleveland. Now 69, he’s mentioned as a candidate for Tampa Bay’s job. This past year, he led the Virginia Destroyers to the United Football League title and was named coach of the year.

Brad Childress: Another former head coach who the Buccaneers are reportedly considering. Childress was 39-35 in almost five seasons with Minnesota before he was fired Nov. 22, 2010, after a 31-3 home loss to Green Bay to fall to 3-7. Jim Caldwell was among those the Vikings interviewed before Childress was hired in 2006.

Joe Philbin: Green Bay’s offensive coordinator has been mentioned as a possible candidate for the Miami job. A coordinator since 2007, the Packers have ranked in the top 10 in points and total yards each year. Philbin coached in Sunday’s NFC divisional playoff loss to the N.Y. Giants six days after his 21-year-old son, Michael, was found dead in the Fox River in Oshkosh, Wis.

kenbuzz
01-17-12, 04:47 PM
From the Indy Star : A long and and somewhat far-fetched list of possible Colts coaches.

Next coach up? Here’s a list of candidates who could be considered for the Colts head coaching job.

Bill Cowher: He won a ring with Pittsburgh but resigned after 15 seasons in January 2007. Since then, he’s been an NFL analyst. While his name always gets mentioned for coaching jobs, if he expects to have front-office control then he probably won’t end up in Indianapolis.

Jon Gruden: He, too, has a Super Bowl ring, won it with a Tampa Bay team he inherited from former Colts coach Tony Dungy. Like Cowher, Gruden has also been doing TV work and just signed a contract extension. But he gushes about Manning and calls him “The Sheriff.” Perhaps Gruden would jump at the chance to coach the NFL’s only four-time MVP.

Wade Phillips, Houston defensive coordinator: He doesn’t hide his desire to again be a head coach. He’s done it for Denver, Buffalo and Dallas (career .581 win percentage) in addition to being an interim coach in New Orleans and Atlanta. His first season with the Texans this year, he converted them to a 3-4 and the franchise is in the playoffs for the first time.

Dom Capers, Green Bay defensive coordinator: Like Phillips, he’s a guy known for developing defenses. Capers also has AFC South experience as a coach with Houston from 2002 to 2005. Question is, could a new coach switch the Colts from a 4-3 to a 3-4?

Perry Fewell, NY Giants defensive coordinator: His name seems to come up a lot. He had a 3-4 record with Buffalo on an interim basis to close out the 2009 season, and has since been with the Giants, who when healthy boast one of the NFL’s best pass rushes.

Gregg Williams, New Orleans defensive coordinator: Another guy looking for a second chance at a head coaching chance, Williams had Buffalo’s job from 2004 to 2007. He’s known for developing aggressive, attacking 4-3 defenses. His defense closed out the Colts in Super Bowl XLIV when the Saints won 31-17 in Miami about 23 months ago.

Dennis Allen, Denver defensive coordinator: He’s only been with the Broncos for a year, but Denver had one of the NFL’s top defenses. Before that, the 39-year-old Allen was New Orleans’ secondary coach, which includes when the Saints beat the Colts in the Super Bowl.

Jim Tressel: While some will snicker at the thought of having a coach who departed from Ohio State in disgrace after lying to the NCAA about a scandal, he is a proven winner. And the NFL is about that bottom line. Tressel has been on the Colts staff as a replay assistant since October.

Tony Dungy: OK, so it probably won’t happen. But what if Colts owner Jim Irsay made a serious pitch to get his former coach to leave that NBC TV job and come back? It’s often been speculated that Dungy will one day return to coaching. Still, it’s probably a long shot. His son, Eric, is playing college ball at Oregon. Father probably wants to see a few more of son’s games.

Marty Mornhinweg: Philadelphia’s offensive coordinator didn’t fare so well as a head coach in Detroit, where he went 5-27 in 2001 and 2002. But he’s been the Eagles’ playcaller since 2006 and is highly regarded for his grasp of offenses.

Kirk Ferentz: The University of Iowa coach is signed through 2015 but has been rumored for NFL openings since 2006. Each time his name surfaces as a possibility, he quickly shoots down the speculation by saying he has a great job already.

Mike Sherman: He had a 59-43 record with Green Bay from 2000 to 2005, but was fired after a 4-12 season his last year. He’s currently unemployed after going 25-25 with Texas A&M through Dec. 1, 2011. He didn’t coach the Aggies in their bowl game victory.

Mike Zimmer: Cincinnati had one of the NFL’s best defenses this season with Zimmer as coordinator. He’s been with the Bengals since 2008. His name has surfaced as a candidate for current openings, most recently in Miami.

Marty Schottenheimer: He last coached in the NFL with San Diego in 2006. He has a 200-126-1 career record in stints with the Chargers, Kansas City and Cleveland. Now 69, he’s mentioned as a candidate for Tampa Bay’s job. This past year, he led the Virginia Destroyers to the United Football League title and was named coach of the year.

Brad Childress: Another former head coach who the Buccaneers are reportedly considering. Childress was 39-35 in almost five seasons with Minnesota before he was fired Nov. 22, 2010, after a 31-3 home loss to Green Bay to fall to 3-7. Jim Caldwell was among those the Vikings interviewed before Childress was hired in 2006.

Joe Philbin: Green Bay’s offensive coordinator has been mentioned as a possible candidate for the Miami job. A coordinator since 2007, the Packers have ranked in the top 10 in points and total yards each year. Philbin coached in Sunday’s NFC divisional playoff loss to the N.Y. Giants six days after his 21-year-old son, Michael, was found dead in the Fox River in Oshkosh, Wis.


The Indy media are so pedestrian. The only dudes they left off this list are dead.

Joe Philbin?!? Might as well add Regis Philbin to the article while they're at it!

http://img717.imageshack.us/img717/8299/coachregis.jpg

kenbuzz
01-17-12, 04:54 PM
Sparano is actually the OC for the Jets.

NFL Network had a typo then. I'll fix the table.

sleepyhead55
01-18-12, 01:18 AM
Jeff Fisher and Gregg Williams reunited -- Williams leaves the Saints to be the DC for the Rams. Get used to a lot of blitzing, Rams fans. Looks like Brian Schotty will be the OC.

I don't think they'll blitz as much as you think, Long and Quinn are better than the DE's that Williams had in NO.

On the OC front, Fisher interviewed Hue Jackson today. That ought to be an interesting pairing if Jackson gets hired. Two egomaniacs clashing, the one with the mustache will always win.

The Rams might be pretty good on defense. Cortland Finnegan probably won't be resigned by Tennessee and I'm betting that Fisher will make a big push to sign him. They need help at DT though. If they can shore up that spot, they won't be total pushovers against the run like this past year.

Random Skins question for Red Dog--Laron Landy, is he worth the gamble in FA? I've read that he probably won't be back with the Skins. The Titans will probably let Michael Griffin be overpaid by someone else. So they need a SS.

JumpCutz
01-18-12, 03:58 PM
Colts fan Rob Lowe has tweeted that Peyton Manning is retiring.

Yes that Rob Lowe.

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/01/18/the-first-peyton-manning-retirement-report-from-an-unlikely-source/

Red Dog
01-18-12, 04:10 PM
I don't think they'll blitz as much as you think, Long and Quinn are better than the DE's that Williams had in NO.

On the OC front, Fisher interviewed Hue Jackson today. That ought to be an interesting pairing if Jackson gets hired. Two egomaniacs clashing, the one with the mustache will always win.

The Rams might be pretty good on defense. Cortland Finnegan probably won't be resigned by Tennessee and I'm betting that Fisher will make a big push to sign him. They need help at DT though. If they can shore up that spot, they won't be total pushovers against the run like this past year.

Random Skins question for Red Dog--Laron Landy, is he worth the gamble in FA? I've read that he probably won't be back with the Skins. The Titans will probably let Michael Griffin be overpaid by someone else. So they need a SS.

Williams blitzed a ton when he was the Skins DC, so I don't expect him to change regardless of what the personnel is.

Landry missed a lot of action this year, so who knows.

wishbone
01-18-12, 04:12 PM
http://i44.tinypic.com/2usy5i0.jpg

He li'-tra-lly could be right... or wrong.

stevevt
01-18-12, 04:52 PM
Colts fan Rob Lowe has tweeted that Peyton Manning is retiring.

Yes that Rob Lowe.

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/01/18/the-first-peyton-manning-retirement-report-from-an-unlikely-source/

Wake me up when Detlef Schrempf weighs in.

Deftones
01-18-12, 05:58 PM
:lol: to the last 2 posts

raven56706
01-18-12, 08:43 PM
Dallas Cowboys began their offseason

http://www.nbcdfw.com/blogs/blue-star/Lil-Wayne-Involved-In-Dez-Bryant-Altercation-137590653.html

rotfl

JumpCutz
01-18-12, 09:16 PM
Oh lordy....:lol:

Red Dog
01-18-12, 09:36 PM
"Dez Bryant Altercation"

I'll take "Phrases you expect to hear" for $200, Alex.

Cory02
01-18-12, 10:26 PM
In a report Tuesday, we learned that the altercation between Bryant and another club patron may have started when said patron began hurling insults at Bryant, based on the Dallas Cowboys’ receiver’s on-field performance as well as his debt issues, which came into the public eye around a year ago.

rotfl

eXcentris
01-18-12, 11:50 PM
He was neither arrested, nor detained. Much ado about nothing. It's not like he shot himself in the leg. :)

Deftones
01-19-12, 08:53 AM
He was neither arrested, nor detained. Much ado about nothing. It's not like he shot himself in the leg. :)

You do realize that just because he wasn't arrested on the spot, doesn't mean he can't be arrested later, right?

raven56706
01-19-12, 10:05 AM
He was neither arrested, nor detained. Much ado about nothing. It's not like he shot himself in the leg. :)

http://www.midwestsportsfans.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/01/jerry-jones-facepalm.jpg

B.A.
01-20-12, 09:18 AM
Rams fans are pissed about losing a home game over the next three seasons so the team can go to London, particularly since they lose the Pats game next season.

Here is Demoff's letter to season ticket holders.

Wow, what an exciting few weeks it has been! As I said at the press conference on Tuesday, we felt that the time for bold action for this organization was now, and we hope you are as thrilled as we are about the hiring of Jeff Fisher as head coach of the St. Louis Rams.

I want to thank you for your patience as we went through the search process to find the next head coach who will return winning football to St. Louis. We were fortunate to meet several great candidates with bright futures ahead of them. However, when we had a chance to hire a proven winner, we knew we wanted Coach Fisher to lead our football team. I can’t tell you how excited we were when Mr. Kroenke received the phone call from Coach Fisher informing us that he wanted to be the next head coach of the St. Louis Rams. With Coach Fisher, we hired the third-winningest active coach in the NFL, a coach who has been to the Super Bowl (and thankfully lost), a coach who is chair of the prestigious NFL Competition Committee, and a coach who will bring a confidence and swagger to the St. Louis Rams.

One thing that should be noted – we have all of you to thank for helping us land Coach Fisher. Throughout the process, he spoke of St. Louis’ reputation as a great sports city, the passion of our fan base and the excitement surrounding our Club as reasons for wanting to be a St. Louis Ram. Together, we share a vision of rewarding this community by building a model franchise both on and off the field that will make St. Louis proud. When Coach Fisher walked into his office for the first time on Tuesday, he looked out the window towards the practice field and smiled, knowing that this is the beginning of many great things to come.

As we enter the weekend, Coach Fisher is hard at work building a top-notch coaching staff that will put us in position to compete for the division titles our fans deserve. We are hopeful to have both coordinators hired by the end of the weekend and the rest of the staff in place within the next week or so. As for the General Manager search, we will conduct interviews late next week in St. Louis with many of the league’s rising personnel stars. We have identified roughly a half dozen candidates to meet with and our goal is to find a bright mind that will bring the same passion, energy and skill to our personnel department that Coach Fisher brings to our coaching staff.

Lastly, in a week full of news, we wanted you to be the first to hear that the NFL will be making an exciting announcement later this morning that the St. Louis Rams have been selected to play a home game in London for each of the next three seasons. The International Series kicks off this fall on October 28 when we play the New England Patriots at Wembley Stadium. It is a tremendous honor to be selected by the NFL to represent our community and country in such an important league initiative as we look to grow our game internationally. We believe our selection by the league speaks to the promise and direction of the St. Louis Rams and we look forward to helping shine the international spotlight on our region as few games deliver this degree of publicity and exposure.

As we learn more about the London opportunity from the NFL in the coming weeks and months, we will share information about how you can travel to the United Kingdom to be part of the festivities. All season ticket holders will have a chance to purchase tickets to the game at Wembley Stadium, and we are making plans to reward lucky season ticket holders with free trips to the game and opportunities to fly with the team as part of a lottery system. More details are forthcoming as plans are finalized.

In closing, the hiring of Coach Fisher has brought an energy and buzz to our fan base that we have not seen since the Greatest Show on Turf, and we are eager to finish the search process for a General Manager so that we can get started on rebuilding the St. Louis Rams for the 2012 season and beyond. From the hiring of Coach Fisher to the International Series selection, the St. Louis Rams are proving to the rest of the NFL that we are serious about establishing ourselves as an elite franchise. We hope that we are most importantly proving to you that we are committed to turning the St. Louis Rams around and rewarding your loyalty with winning football!

Sincerely,
Kevin

Kevin Demoff
Executive VP/Football Operations & Chief Operating Officer
St. Louis Rams
http://www.stlouisrams.com
twitter: @stlouisrams

Decker
01-20-12, 09:39 AM
Wonder how they'll feel about losing the other seven to Los Angeles.

Larry C.
01-20-12, 09:42 AM
Looks like the Fins next coach is going to be McCoy.

B.A.
01-20-12, 09:58 AM
Wonder how they'll feel about losing the other seven to Los Angeles.

A lot of people in the area already think they are doomed in terms of NFL football in a few seasons.

It is well known that the terms of the team's lease on the dome are not optimal for the city and its fans.

TGM
01-20-12, 10:01 AM
since I will be going to the AFC championship game, that likely means my Patriots will lose. :(

Decker
01-20-12, 11:03 AM
We can only hope. :fc:

Red Dog
01-20-12, 11:06 AM
Rams fans are pissed about losing a home game over the next three seasons so the team can go to London, particularly since they lose the Pats game next season.

I can definitely see why the season ticket holders would be pissed. They really should avoid inter-conference matchups for these London games since you only get to see such an opponent come to your town once every 8 seasons.

B.A.
01-20-12, 11:18 AM
I can definitely see why the season ticket holders would be pissed. They really should avoid inter-conference matchups for these London games since you only get to see such an opponent come to your town once every 8 seasons.Yep.

Rumors going around on Twitter that the other two games they are going to lose will be the Saints and Cowboys.

Red Dog
01-20-12, 11:20 AM
Damn - that's a triple kick in the nuts. It's almost like the NFL wants to piss off season ticket holders so much that they bail so it's gives them a great excuse to head back to L.A.

LurkerDan
01-20-12, 11:30 AM
I can definitely see why the season ticket holders would be pissed. They really should avoid inter-conference matchups for these London games since you only get to see such an opponent come to your town once every 8 seasons.

OTOH, one could argue that ticket holders would be more pissed about losing a rivalry game. :shrug:

B.A.
01-20-12, 11:42 AM
OTOH, one could argue that ticket holders would be more pissed about losing a rivalry game. :shrug:
They wanted a chance to boo the Patriots. They are still loathed by many because of the cheating scandal.

Red Dog
01-20-12, 11:44 AM
OTOH, one could argue that ticket holders would be more pissed about losing a rivalry game. :shrug:

If one wants to sound like a fool in this case. Who is the Rams rival? No way a ticket-holder would be more pissed off losing a Seahawks, Cards, Niners game over a Pats game. And that's even if the Niners win the Super Bowl.

Now if one is talking about a NFC East team, sure - they are all big rivals with one another.

If I ran things, if we must have a London game, I'd automatically make it your (home) 'positional' intra-conference game - one of the 2 each year that is determined by where you finish. That way it doesn't impact a divisional race (it would be unfair IMO to turn a home divisional game into a neutral one) and it doesn't impact the rotation of teams you get to see every 6/8 years.

Deftones
01-20-12, 06:30 PM
Looks like the Fins next coach is going to be McCoy.

Buzzzz. ESPN is now reporting Joe Philbin is the teams' new head coach.

the_dude8
01-20-12, 07:39 PM
Buzzzz. ESPN is now reporting Joe Philbin is the teams' new head coach.

i think the fins will sign matt flynn as their franchise QB as well, since JP is the fins HC.

My Other Self
01-20-12, 08:09 PM
Couldn't this also be a test of the NFL by seeing if the Rams can sustain a fan base in the London market? Would they move there instead of LA?

sleepyhead55
01-20-12, 08:10 PM
Don't know how accurate this is since it comes from Jason La Confora but the Colts want to interview Brad Childress for their vacant head coaching job.

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/01/20/colts-want-to-talk-with-brad-childress/

Tarantino
01-21-12, 01:24 AM
Brad Childress? :lol: ...worst...coach...ever.

DJLinus
01-21-12, 10:56 AM
Don't know how accurate this is since it comes from Jason La Confora but the Colts want to interview Brad Childress for their vacant head coaching job.

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/01/20/colts-want-to-talk-with-brad-childress/

And they've talked to Jim Tressel (twice):

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/7486645/indianapolis-colts-interview-jim-tressel-coach-job-reports-say

Larry C.
01-21-12, 11:59 AM
i think the fins will sign matt flynn as their franchise QB as well, since JP is the fins HC.

Everyone thinks that this will be a package deal and that JP will bring in Tom Clements from GB to be OC. I hope we keep Bowles as DC.

HistoryProf
01-22-12, 08:41 PM
@KGWSports: KGW's Michael Berk reports Chip Kelly working to finalize a deal that would make him head coach of the Tampa Bay Bucs.

Pharoh
01-22-12, 08:44 PM
@KGWSports: KGW's Michael Berk reports Chip Kelly working to finalize a deal that would make him head coach of the Tampa Bay Bucs.

Hammer about to drop?

shadowhawk2020
01-22-12, 10:14 PM
Ugghhh Do not want Chip Kelly

Daryl
01-22-12, 10:43 PM
Hammer about to drop?

From the Pete Carroll school of "get out before the NCAA takes a blowtorch to your program".

shadowhawk2020
01-22-12, 10:47 PM
Great go from a guy who had never been a head coach at any level, to a coach who has as much experience in the NFL as I do.

Decker
01-22-12, 10:52 PM
From the Pete Carroll school of "get out before the NCAA takes a blowtorch to your program".

Or the slight variation of that school of thought that Jim Tressel is following?

BTW : I don't for a second believe that Irsay would hire Tressel as head coach. The one thing that outsiders fail to appreciate about Indiana sports fans is how old fashioned and conservative they are. They pride themselves on their so-called "Midwestern Values". They're totally appalled by controversy (excluding only Bobby Knight) and would totally be off the Colts bandwagon if the hire was somebody that controversial and ethically challenged. I read they were going to interview the Saints' OC. That would be a popular hire, I think.

HistoryProf
01-22-12, 11:47 PM
Ugghhh Do not want Chip Kelly

i honestly can't think of a worse idea than taking a coach who's only success is in college w/ a gimmicky offense and trying to put him in the NFL. Chip Kelly is about the last college coach I would ever consider for an NFL gig. he must be one smooth talker.

TheMovieman
01-23-12, 09:36 AM
So much for the "hammer coming down" idea :lol: It's been reported in the Register Guard this morning that Chip Kelly is staying.

Here's an online source:

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/ncaaf-dr-saturday/chip-kelly-ends-first-nfl-fling-now-105739650.html

University of Oregon football coach Chip Kelly told a highly placed UO source late Sunday night that he has reversed course and decided to turn down an offer from the NFL's Tampa Bay Buccaneers.

The source told The Register-Guard earlier Sunday night that Kelly had reached an agreement to become Tampa Bay's head coach. "It's done," the source said. Just before midnight, Kelly changed his mind, telling the source: "I'm staying."

Kelly told one assistant coach Sunday night that he had been offered the Tampa Bay job, but Kelly told him he wasn't certain what he would do.

So he might bolt in the future but it won't be the Bucs, so rest easy.

Mr. Cinema
01-23-12, 10:42 AM
I wonder if Harbaugh would go after Peyton if the Colts cut him and he is healthy enough to play in 2012. The Niners are very close and #18 would be a great fit. But I have a feeling Harbaugh will stick with Smith for a couple more seasons.

ericmylad
01-23-12, 01:38 PM
Well, we know what Jay Cutler did during his offseason:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/early-lead/post/kristin-cavallari-jay-cutler-are-having-a-baby/2012/01/23/gIQAL8irKQ_blog.html

the_dude8
01-23-12, 03:47 PM
Well, we know what Jay Cutler did during his offseason:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/early-lead/post/kristin-cavallari-jay-cutler-are-having-a-baby/2012/01/23/gIQAL8irKQ_blog.html

he needs to keep with Tom Brady and his super model wife, and their kids.

Mr. Cinema
01-23-12, 04:38 PM
On Adam Schefter's blog, he tossed out Marques Colston as someone who the Niners might consider in the off-season. He would provide a huge boost at the receiver position.

Red Dog
01-23-12, 04:43 PM
On Adam Schefter's blog, he tossed out Marques Colston as someone who the Niners might consider in the off-season. He would provide a huge boost at the receiver position.

Hmmm. Or he could very well be average when you take him away from Brees and a fast track.

LorenzoL
01-23-12, 05:09 PM
Hmmm. Or he could very well be average when you take him away from Brees and a fast track.
Plus he's injury prone.

shadowhawk2020
01-23-12, 05:52 PM
http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a78/nursetpd/PAC%2010/Chip_Kelly_NFL.gif

Deftones
01-23-12, 06:21 PM
that is awesome. :lol:

the_dude8
01-23-12, 06:57 PM
On Adam Schefter's blog, he tossed out Marques Colston as someone who the Niners might consider in the off-season. He would provide a huge boost at the receiver position.

i think Vjax would be a better deep threat than Colston for the 49ers.

slymer
01-23-12, 07:06 PM
i think Vjax would be a better deep threat than Colston for the 49ers.

Vjax is just a better WR than Colston period. Jackson better not go anywhere besides San Diego.

Dave99
01-23-12, 10:23 PM
I wonder if Harbaugh would go after Peyton if the Colts cut him and he is healthy enough to play in 2012. The Niners are very close and #18 would be a great fit. But I have a feeling Harbaugh will stick with Smith for a couple more seasons.

I've thought that would be a likely place also, would have really thought that had they gotten beat by the saints. Tough to sit alex smith after a trip to the nfccg. I just don't think smith is the guy to lead a team to the super bowl though.

That's the most ready made spot for manning though, if he just wants to go to a SB contender.

HistoryProf
01-23-12, 10:28 PM
Terrell Suggs does America a favor and calls Skip Bayless a douchebag on air rotfl

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/eGCZffZGD24" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

LurkerDan
01-23-12, 10:41 PM
That's the most ready made spot for manning though, if he just wants to go to a SB contender.

that or the jets.

My Other Self
01-23-12, 10:44 PM
that or the jets.Manning is no fool. I could not see him walking in to that toxic environment. There's just too much turmoil in the locker room. Not only that but he runs the offense. There's no way Rex would let him make the calls.

Dave99
01-23-12, 10:55 PM
that or the jets.

maybe, but really don't think he would want to be part of that media circus or, probably more important to him, bring that kind of pressure on eli. Great defense in SF, good running game, v davis/morgan. Might be able to get crabtree motivated, and I think he can appreciate how harbaugh has really brought that team together in such a short amount of time. The same might not be said for rex..:lol:

the_dude8
01-23-12, 11:13 PM
Vjax is just a better WR than Colston period. Jackson better not go anywhere besides San Diego.

I think lucky sperm spanos and AJ NO ring smith are too cheap to sign Vjax to a long term deal as a chargers.


the 49ers can go after D. Bowe, Deshean Jackson, as their #1 WR threat for Alex smith.

the_dude8
01-23-12, 11:15 PM
maybe, but really don't think he would want to be part of that media circus or, probably more important to him, bring that kind of pressure on eli. Great defense in SF, good running game, v davis/morgan. Might be able to get crabtree motivated, and I think he can appreciate how harbaugh has really brought that team together in such a short amount of time. The same might not be said for rex..:lol:

The 49ers needs major help on the WR position as well. Maybe 49ers can sign manning as long as they also sign Reggie Wayne to a 2 years deal to help the offense, and let alex smith UFA in 2012.

wishbone
01-24-12, 05:00 PM
Colts fan Rob Lowe has tweeted that Peyton Manning is retiring.

Yes that Rob Lowe.

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/01/18/the-first-peyton-manning-retirement-report-from-an-unlikely-source/"I never thought 'Sodapop Curtis' would announce my retirement," Manning said, laughing, referring to Lowe’s character in the 1983 movie "The Outsiders."

When it's time to make an announcement one way or the other, Manning hopes he can do it on his own terms.

"Hopefully, Sodapop Curtis doesn't tweet it before I can say anything," he said.http://www.indystar.com/article/20120124/SPORTS15/120124015/Kravitz-Manning-says-Irsay-not-Grigson-will-decide-his-future-Colts?odyssey=tab|topnews|text|IndyStar.com

:lol:

the_dude8
01-24-12, 05:02 PM
http://www.indystar.com/article/20120124/SPORTS15/120124015/Kravitz-Manning-says-Irsay-not-Grigson-will-decide-his-future-Colts?odyssey=tab|topnews|text|IndyStar.com

:lol:

who the hell is sodapop curtis?

Dave99
01-24-12, 05:17 PM
a character rob lowe played in the outsiders.

And that article pushes me up to about 75% that manning is done in Indy.

LurkerDan
01-24-12, 05:33 PM
And that article pushes me up to about 75% that manning is done in Indy.

sure does sound like it. I suspect it will depend in part on what they can get for him. But at this point, it seems to make more sense for the long term to trade him and draft Luck.

The Cow
01-24-12, 05:43 PM
sure does sound like it. I suspect it will depend in part on what they can get for him. But at this point, it seems to make more sense for the long term to trade him and draft Luck.

It is my understanding that they cannot trade him, only release him (to get out of that big bonus due in March).

Dave99
01-24-12, 06:13 PM
yep, it's cut or keep. The colts cap would be destroyed if they traded him, so it's a no-go.

LorenzoL
01-24-12, 06:14 PM
It is my understanding that they cannot trade him, only release him (to get out of that big bonus due in March).
They could technically trade him if they give him the bonus but the other team would be responsible in clearing the salary cap space for him.

LurkerDan
01-24-12, 06:20 PM
Why couldn't they renegotiate with him first then trade him? IOW, he agrees to restructure his contract with the other team? Sure, that gives him tremendous leverage, but I thought that was an option.

ETA: Yep, this says exactly that: http://blogs.nfl.com/2011/12/07/lombardi-ways-to-trade-peyton-manning-exist/

fujishig
01-24-12, 06:27 PM
Why couldn't they renegotiate with him first then trade him? IOW, he agrees to restructure his contract with the other team? Sure, that gives him tremendous leverage, but I thought that was an option.

ETA: Yep, this says exactly that: http://blogs.nfl.com/2011/12/07/lombardi-ways-to-trade-peyton-manning-exist/

Why would he do this? Is it because there are more options for teams with enough cap space to sign him if they do it via a trade? Because otherwise, why would he want to weaken the team he's going to (who would potentially be giving up something valuable in the trade)?

LurkerDan
01-24-12, 06:32 PM
Why would he do this? Is it because there are more options for teams with enough cap space to sign him if they do it via a trade? Because otherwise, why would he want to weaken the team he's going to (who would potentially be giving up something valuable in the trade)?

Presumably more options for teams and more money for him. Because he loses a lot of money if the Colts just waive him; he might be able to keep some of that money and find a contender (and choose which one).

Decker
01-24-12, 07:20 PM
Man, it'll be painful to watch Peyton play and win for another team, but in the Big Picture, I think it's what HAS to happen for both sides -- especially if it's not 100% clear he's good to go on March 8th (and how on earth could it be certain if we don't know by this point after waiting all season just to see him throw?). It's going to be a sad day in Indy to watch him go, but there's no sense in hindering the team's cap structure for years to come (like the Niners at the turn of the century) and re-signing a bunch of aging veterans when you've got the future of the franchise sitting on the bench. Makes me wonder how things would have played out if the backup scrubs had managed to eek out another win or two and put them out of the Luck/RGIII position.

fujishig
01-24-12, 07:32 PM
We'll never know, but I don't think you get rid of Peyton for RGIII, even with his stock rising (depending on Manning's health, of course). I know Manning and pop have said that they believe that 1st round QBs need to play right away, and I know Luck is seen as a sure thing, but the team without Manning was terrible (and built around Manning) and I still don't get why they think that's the kind of environment you want Luck starting in. I thought with the new rookie contracts that they were more reasonable than ever anyway?

Dave99
01-24-12, 09:03 PM
Presumably more options for teams and more money for him. Because he loses a lot of money if the Colts just waive him; he might be able to keep some of that money and find a contender (and choose which one).

Not really, there will be other teams plenty willing to pay him out the ass for a 3 year deal, similar to what he is due from the colts. And why let the colts dictate who he would go to in a trade, when he can be a free agent (assuming they are forced to cut him) and pick who he wants? Someone will pay him 3 year @ 40-45 million, essentially what he would have been making with the colts.

LurkerDan
01-24-12, 09:18 PM
Not really, there will be other teams plenty willing to pay him out the ass for a 3 year deal, similar to what he is due from the colts. And why let the colts dictate who he would go to in a trade, when he can be a free agent (assuming they are forced to cut him) and pick who he wants? Someone will pay him 3 year @ 40-45 million, essentially what he would have been making with the colts.

The Colts wouldn't get to choose in my scenario, because he would have to agree to a restructured contract with the other team. I'm not saying you're wrong, but I don't think you should be so dismissive of the alternative, because from what I have read, it might happen that way.

Dave99
01-24-12, 09:37 PM
My best guess is that if manning feels he is healthy enough to play, and the colts don't want to keep him for business reasons, he isn't going to go the extra mile and restructure and have his choices limited (the colts won't trade him in the afc south for example, or likely anywhere in the afc). It could happen sure, but manning likes control, and if the colts don't want him, he wants the control - by making them cut him. That's my guess. He very much understands this is a business, it's not personal, and he has to make the best choices for himself, and for the next guy in his situation - he has said this directly previously.

LurkerDan
01-24-12, 10:35 PM
Dave, I agree that he wants control. But getting released doesn't necessarily give him more control or unlimited choices. Because unless he's willing to play for a very low salary, some teams won't be able to afford him as a FA. Going the trade route still allows him control, because he still gets to choose, he just gets a different choice, with different parameters.

Decker
01-24-12, 10:58 PM
You know, what makes it so interesting is that it's not just Peyton's bonus and his questionable health now, it's everything happening all at once that makes it so dramatic : We have the bonus deadline, the slow-healing injury, the #1 pick in the "Can't Miss" draft, the firing of the Polians, the surprise last-minute firing of Caldwell and the secretive coaching search with an arbitrary deadline. You have the simultaneous impending free agency of Mathis, Jeff Saturday and Reggie Wayne, arguably three of the four most important Colts after Peyton (the other, Freeney will be up in a year). And on top of it all, you have a Superbowl match-up of the Colts' biggest nemeses vs Peyton's brother's team, being played right there, in the house Peyton built.

If the 2011-2012 Indianapolis Colts were a Godfather movie (and let's be honest, it would have to be Godfather Part III), this is the part where you have the rapidly cutting montage set against a dramatic aria where everyone is getting whacked.
If only Michael Corleone were a little crazier and had a Twitter account...

sharkstank
01-25-12, 05:48 AM
The Raiders have hired Denver defensive coordinator Dennis Allen as their head coach.. cautiously optimistic I am.

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/01/24/report-raiders-to-hire-dennis-allen/

Tarantino
01-25-12, 11:05 AM
Hiring a guy to be head coach who has had one year coordinating a defense in Denver...

Smart move, Raiders.

Mr. Cinema
01-25-12, 11:25 AM
Heard on ESPN Radio that the Niners have or will offer Alex Smith a 2 yr/$8 million contract.

I really hope they lock up Dashon Goldson. I read they may plan a 5 yr/$25 million offer for him.

raven56706
01-25-12, 12:05 PM
More Cowboy Offseason news


08:03 AM ET 01.25 | Former Florida cornerback Janoris Jenkins, who played this past season at North Alabama, reportedly had a meeting planned with the Cowboys on Tuesday. Jenkins was kicked off of Florida's team last April after his second drug-related arrest in three months. In June 2009, Jenkins was also arrested near a Gainesville, Fla., bar for fighting and resisting arrest. In January and April of 2011, he was arrested twice for misdemeanor marijuana possession. But Jenkins is highly skilled. Jenkins has impressed NFL scouts this week at the Senior Bowl, but considering his troubles in the past there is no guarantee that the Cowboys would consider taking a chance on him. ... Jenkins said he had already talked to five NFL teams.

The Dallas Morning News

Dave99
01-25-12, 02:19 PM
You know, what makes it so interesting is that it's not just Peyton's bonus and his questionable health now, it's everything happening all at once that makes it so dramatic : We have the bonus deadline, the slow-healing injury, the #1 pick in the "Can't Miss" draft, the firing of the Polians, the surprise last-minute firing of Caldwell and the secretive coaching search with an arbitrary deadline. You have the simultaneous impending free agency of Mathis, Jeff Saturday and Reggie Wayne, arguably three of the four most important Colts after Peyton (the other, Freeney will be up in a year). And on top of it all, you have a Superbowl match-up of the Colts' biggest nemeses vs Peyton's brother's team, being played right there, in the house Peyton built.

If the 2011-2012 Indianapolis Colts were a Godfather movie (and let's be honest, it would have to be Godfather Part III), this is the part where you have the rapidly cutting montage set against a dramatic aria where everyone is getting whacked.
If only Michael Corleone were a little crazier and had a Twitter account...

And if the colts embrace rebuilding mode and let manning walk, don't be surprised if they cut freeney. He is due a lot of dollars this season, both real & cap hit $, so there is real savings if they cut him.

the_dude8
01-25-12, 03:43 PM
Hiring a guy to be head coach who has had one year coordinating a defense in Denver...

Smart move, Raiders.

maybe the raiders are hoping he's the next Jim Harbaugh.

So only the bucs and colts are still searching for their HC at the momment.

The Cow
01-25-12, 03:57 PM
I still think the Colts go with Tressel.

sleepyhead55
01-25-12, 04:20 PM
Looks like Baltimore DC Chuck Pagano will be the new Colts head coach. So no sweatervest in Indy as head coach.

the_dude8
01-25-12, 04:45 PM
Looks like Baltimore DC Chuck Pagano will be the new Colts head coach. So no sweatervest in Indy as head coach.

maybe Chuck might bring his brother as the colts' DC from the chargers.

The Cow
01-25-12, 04:47 PM
:lol: They must have been waiting for my post.

Decker
01-25-12, 05:15 PM
I really thought they'd go with an offensive-minded guy -- someone to mold Luck.
Wonder who they'll tap for OC now.

Dave99
01-25-12, 09:02 PM
They haven't fired Clyde, no need of an OC...yet.

Daryl
01-26-12, 10:55 AM
Adam Schefter is reporting that the Bucs will name Rutgers head coach Greg Schiano as their new head coach

Red Dog
01-26-12, 11:03 AM
Can't go wrong with a Bucknell grad. :)

Obey The D
01-26-12, 12:05 PM
Adam Schefter is reporting that the Bucs will name Rutgers head coach Greg Schiano as their new head coach

Breaking news: Rutger's sees 85% drop in season ticket sales.

shadowhawk2020
01-26-12, 02:42 PM
Actually pretty happy with the hire. Much happier than if they signed Chip Kelly

Larry C.
01-26-12, 03:11 PM
I like it. He is a great coach I love him for his days at the http://s7d2.scene7.com/is/image/Fathead/61-61283_ncaa_miami_logo_prod?layer=comp&wid=175&hei=175&fmt=jpeg&qlt=95,1&op_sharpen=1&resMode=bicub&op_usm=0.5,0.2,0,0&iccEmbed=0&bgc=0xeeeeee&bgColor=0xeeeeee

Decker
01-26-12, 11:48 PM
If the 2011-2012 Indianapolis Colts were a Godfather movie (and let's be honest, it would have to be Godfather Part III), this is the part where you have the rapidly cutting montage set against a dramatic aria where everyone is getting whacked.
If only Michael Corleone were a little crazier and had a Twitter account...

Thank you, Jim Irsay, for totally illustrating my point:

Colts owner Jim Irsay introduced his new head coach and then stunned everyone by calling his franchise player a "politician" who had decided to air dirty laundry.

"I don't think it's in the best interest to paint the horseshoe in a negative light, I really don't," Irsay told reporters, referring to the team's longtime logo. "The horseshoe always comes first, and I think one thing he's always known, because he's been around it so long, is that, you know, you keep it in the family. If you've got a problem you talk to each other, it's not about campaigning or anything like that."
http://www.jacksonfineart.com/images/artists/large/3051.jpg

Decker
01-26-12, 11:53 PM
BTW : Here is Bob Kravitz's sad "Farewell Peyton" article from tomorrow's Indy Star:

Kravitz: Jim Irsay's remarks bringing curtain down on Peyton Manning's Colts career

It is so sad and so hard to write it again, but it's true: Peyton Manning is done in Indianapolis.

After listening to Manning Monday night, after listening to owner Jim Irsay characterize Manning Thursday as "a politician" who should keep his concerns "in house," there's no other conclusion to be reached by a sane, sober human being: Manning's days in Indianapolis are over, and they have been over for quite some time. On a day when the introduction of Chuck Pagano as the Colts new head coach should have been the story, Irsay stole the headlines.

What matters now is for this once-beautiful relationship, which produced so much success and joy to central Indiana, to stop deteriorating and to start moving forward in a more appropriate manner.

After talking Thursday about Manning as "family," Irsay said, "He's a politician. When it comes to being competitive on a scale of one to 10, 10 being the highest, we're both 11s. There have been plenty of eggshells scattered around this building by him (Manning) with his competitive desire to win.

"I don't think it's in the (best) interest to paint the Horseshoe in a negative light, I really don't. . . The horseshoe always comes first. One thing (Manning has) always known, and he's been around it so long, you keep it in the family. If you've got a problem, talk to each other. It's not about campaigning or anything like that."

Manning responded with an exclusive comment to The Star, saying by phone Thursday night:

"At this point, Mr. Irsay and I owe it to each other and to the fans of the organization to handle this appropriately and professionally, and I think we will. I've already reached out to Mr. Irsay. I wasn't trying to paint the Colts in a bad light, but it's tough when so many people you've known for so long are suddenly leaving. I feel very close to a lot of these guys and we've done great things together. It's hard to watch an old friend clean out his office. That's all I was trying to say.

"I just want to keep rehabbing and working hard, and when the time is right for Mr. Irsay and I to sit down, I look forward to a healthy conversation about my future. I've worked too hard and have such great respect and have so many great relationships inside the building and out, and it's incredibly important that those remain."

Irsay and Manning have meant too much to each other, to this franchise and to this city, for the relationship to turn into some kind of a battle for the hearts and minds of Indianapolis.

"I want to separate the personal and the business," Manning said Monday night. "I've seen it get personal in other situations, and I don't want that to happen here."

Too late.

Sadly, too late.

Is Irsay angry?

Yeah, he's angry.

Irsay was not happy after reading Manning's comments in The Star, during which the iconic quarterback spoke wistfully about the unsettled atmosphere at the West 56th Street facility. Irsay felt, at some level, like Manning was painting himself as the selfless hero who was using the media (namely, me) to garner the favor of the fans and paint the Colts as the heavies in this passion play.

Tuesday, Irsay tweeted:

Knowing medical situation last yr. n still paying $26,000,000.00 to #18,I've no regrets.It was right thing2do,I'm not pissed,contrary2rumor


Nobody's quite sure what rumor Irsay was referring to. But he wanted it made clear, he knew Manning's neck was a mess one year ago and still had no problem giving him all that money -- which he spelled out with eight zeroes.

Ultimately, Irsay is planning to do the only thing he can do.

But now it has to be done the right way -- with class and grace.

"There's not any sort of bad situation around here for healing or anything like that," Irsay said, referring to Manning's statement that the facility atmosphere is not conducive to healing. "That's not a correct perspective. Like I said, keep it in house, in our family. Talk to each other if you have problems. We'll work it through hand and hand and continue to talk as we get closer to the league year."

Irsay was asked, "Should fans come to grips with the idea there's a legitimate chance Peyton won't be on this roster?"

He answered, "Well, I think fans have already understood that. This is a neck, not an ankle, not a shoulder. Often times the NFL is criticized for putting people out there and for putting them at risk. I'm not going to do that. . . What he's done for the city, the state, what he means to me and our fans, we're not going to be in that situation. I just think him and I have to talk and see where his health is and go from there."

My fervent hope is this doesn't continue to devolve. We are talking about good people in a bad situation, the thorniest situation since the 49ers traded Joe Montana. We're talking about one of the best owners in sports and one of the greatest quarterbacks in history, both of them good men, both of them great philanthropists.

This should end with parades and statues, not harsh words. This should end with an entire region paying tribute to the greatest Indianapolis Colt of all time, not a blizzard of words.

The pair need to talk and they need to talk, honestly and forthrightly, right now. And Irsay needs to tell him exactly what he plans to tell him later:

"We're going to cut you. It hurts my heart and soul, but we have no choice. Our team is in cap hell. We have no flexibility. Even if we wanted to make one last run with a bunch of veterans, we couldn't because of cap issues. It's time to start over, and you start over with a 21-year-old kid, not a guy with age and health problems. This is not the way any of us wanted this to end, but it must end this way, and we must make it end in the best way possible."

This is over.

Has been for a while.

Everybody is talking around the $28 million-dollar elephant in the room. It's there. Deal with it. And deal with it in a way that elevates Irsay, Manning and their beloved horseshoe, and doesn't diminish them all.

My Other Self
01-27-12, 12:20 AM
The more interesting point to the saga is whether or not he's going to play again, and if he does for whom. It would be really strange not seeing Manning in a Colts uniform.

LurkerDan
01-27-12, 12:30 AM
Wouldn't it be crazy if Peyton ends his career in a different uniform and with 1 SB win, and Eli ends his career in one uniform and 2 SB wins (or more). A few years ago, that wouldn't have seemed possible, now it does.

My Other Self
01-27-12, 12:37 AM
Wouldn't it be crazy if Peyton ends his career in a different uniform and with 1 SB win, and Eli ends his career in one uniform and 2 SB wins (or more). A few years ago, that wouldn't have seemed possible, now it does.Is there any team he could viably go to that just needs a QB? If he signs with another team it would have to be an instant Super Bowl contender.

The only team I could think of is the 49ers but that seems like a long shot. The constant rumors are the Redskins and the Dolphins.

Dave99
01-27-12, 12:49 AM
49ers or jets would be the 'drop in a good QB' places that could instantly be a legit SB contender.

LurkerDan
01-27-12, 12:50 AM
At this point, the only teams that absolutely don't want him are NE, NO, GB, CAR, NYG, PIT, maybe DET, maybe SD, maybe PHI, maybe CIN. Not saying all the other teams are in play, because I don't know the financials, but can you 100% count them out? I don't know.

kurupt
01-27-12, 05:56 AM
Is there any team he could viably go to that just needs a QB? If he signs with another team it would have to be an instant Super Bowl contender.

The only team I could think of is the 49ers but that seems like a long shot. The constant rumors are the Redskins and the Dolphins.

As good as Manning is, it's hard to imagine that he will pick that back up instantly with another team with another offensive scheme featuring receivers and linemen that aren't on the same page as him.

If there is one of those teams, though, I agree that it would be the 49ers. Without knowing the playbook he would be an immediate upgrade to Alex Smith, who improved this year, but is still nowhere near the top 10 qb's. They might need another impact receiver too, but they seem to have all the other parts.

starman9000
01-27-12, 07:30 AM
I highly doubt it would happen, but I think the Ravens should go for him. (actually, I think they should try their damnedest to get Brees, that would become an awesome offense in a hurry)

FantasticVSDoom
01-27-12, 08:27 AM
Wait, did he really say:

"I don't think it's in the best interest to paint the horseshoe in a negative light, I really don't," Irsay told reporters, referring to the team's longtime logo. "The horseshoe always comes first...

I now have a team I hate more than the Jets...

Red Dog
01-27-12, 09:17 AM
"I don't think it's in the best interest to paint the horseshoe in a negative light, I really don't," Irsay told reporters, referring to the team's longtime logo. "The horseshoe always comes first, and I think one thing he's always known, because he's been around it so long, is that, you know, you keep it in the family. If you've got a problem you talk to each other, it's not about campaigning or anything like that."

STFU about the 'horseshoe,' you fuck. Your father forever painted the horseshoe in a negative light when he snuck the team out in the middle of the night.

raven56706
01-27-12, 09:17 AM
Peyton on the Cardinals would be awesome!

Decker
01-27-12, 09:40 AM
It would be the Colts' worst nightmare, but what about Tennessee? Great running game, good WR corps, decent O line, stout defense. Peyton probably wants a more veteran head coach and would feel funny about going to another AFC South team, but it wouldn't be a bad fit.

Red Dog
01-27-12, 09:48 AM
I think he would be a good fit there but I can't see the Colts trading him to a division rival barring some too-good-to-be-true deal. But if they feel he has nothing left in the tank like the Eagles did with McNabb, I suppose.....

Decker
01-27-12, 09:57 AM
Trading doesn't enter into it; the Colts will have no say where he ends up. They'll cut him on March 8th to avoid the cap-killing $28M bonus he'll be owed and he will be an unrestricted free agent at that point.

PopcornTreeCt
01-27-12, 10:15 AM
I'm really not optimistic about Peyton Manning recovering and being back to his normal self. I think that's the real reason why he won't be with the Colts.

Decker
01-27-12, 10:41 AM
Sure, that's the big concern. Nobody knows if he'll ever be able to play at all, let alone play like Peyton again. With the March 8th deadline looming, I don't really think the Colts have a choice but to cut him to avoid that bonus payment. What's changed is the tenor of the discussion (and the entire front office staff). The assumption (and Jim Irsay's assertion) has always been if they thought Peyton could play in 2012, that he'd be back regardless of Andrew Luck. Now it looks like there's no way he'll be on the roster in April no matter what his health is like.
I hope that idiot Irsay can at least patch things up with dignity and send him out the door like the hero Peyton has been to this team and the state of Indiana.

And Irsay needs to put $28M into the Douchebag Jar for referring to his organization as "the horseshoe".

Deftones
01-27-12, 11:14 AM
Peyton on the Cardinals would be awesome!

As a Cardinals fan, I completely agree. Provided he is healthy, of course.

LurkerDan
01-27-12, 11:20 AM
I highly doubt it would happen, but I think the Ravens should go for him. (actually, I think they should try their damnedest to get Brees, that would become an awesome offense in a hurry)

I thought about the Ravens, that team would be a juggernaut with him.

That defense, and an offense with Peyton, Rice, Boldin, etc? Fuck they'd be good.

Deftones
01-27-12, 11:42 AM
Article about T.O. being broke: http://thebiglead.com/index.php/2012/01/24/terrell-owens-is-broke-after-playing-15-years-and-making-80-million/

I know it is his responsibility to make sure he stays on top of his money, but I have no doubts that guys like Rosenhaus prey on athletes with tons of money.

Decker
01-27-12, 11:45 AM
I thought about the Ravens, that team would be a juggernaut with him.

That defense, and an offense with Peyton, Rice, Boldin, etc? Fuck they'd be good.

There's no way you jettison or demote a solid young QB like Flacco who has won playoff games every year he's been in the league for a 36 year old with neck injury. That would be a terrible move.

Red Dog
01-27-12, 11:49 AM
Article about T.O. being broke: http://thebiglead.com/index.php/2012/01/24/terrell-owens-is-broke-after-playing-15-years-and-making-80-million/

I know it is his responsibility to make sure he stays on top of his money, but I have no doubts that guys like Rosenhaus prey on athletes with tons of money.



Terrell Owens has four children with four different women, with child support totaling $44,600 – each month – and he needs to come up with money at the same time he tries to lower the support amount because he is no longer working.

Yikes - over half a million a year in child support? -eek-

Burgundy LaRue
01-27-12, 01:01 PM
The more interesting point to the saga is whether or not he's going to play again, and if he does for whom. It would be really strange not seeing Manning in a Colts uniform.

I'm a Colts fan and I can't get my head around it just yet. I know it's going to happen, and I understand why. But the idea of #18 being in colors other than blue and white? :(

That said, I hope Irsay handles this situation well. I doubt it, but I'll hold out hope. Without Peyton, there would be no Lucas Oil Field, no Super Bowl victory, no Super Bowl in Indy next week, no witnessing the most cerebral guy to play the position.

Sadly, I think this will end with bad blood and hurt feelings. And that's a bummer.

Yikes - over half a million a year in child support?

Sounds right. About $10K a month per child X 4. That's average for most athletes. Makes that $8 for a box of Trojans look a swell investment now. :lol:

Red Dog
01-27-12, 01:04 PM
That said, I hope Irsay handles this situation well. I doubt it, but I'll hold out hope. Without Peyton, there would be no Lucas Oil Field, no Super Bowl victory, no Super Bowl in Indy next week, no witnessing the most cerebral guy to play the position.


Hell, without Peyton, they'd be the L.A. Colts.

Burgundy LaRue
01-27-12, 01:05 PM
Hell, without Peyton, they'd be the L.A. Colts.

*nods head*

So true.

Red Dog
01-27-12, 01:08 PM
Ravens promoting LBs coach Dean Pees to def. coordinator, and in a move that probably won't go over well with Ravens fans, they are retaining offensive coordinator Cam Cameron.

davidh777
01-27-12, 01:11 PM
A little surprised that the new Colts coach was only a coordinator for a year but I'm not familiar with his work

Decker
01-27-12, 04:34 PM
Friday, January 27, 2012
Peyton Manning, Jim Irsay have talk
Associated Press

INDIANAPOLIS -- Peyton Manning and Colts owner Jim Irsay insist they are just fine after a week filled with complaints and comments suggesting a rift had developed following one of the most miserable seasons in team history.

"We would like to dispel any misperception that there might be any hard feelings between us," the two said Friday in a statement issued by the team. "Since 1998, we have enjoyed a great relationship, based upon mutual respect and trust. We have always been able to talk and address matters we've faced over the years, not just as owner and player, but as friends.

"We had a long talk today and we want to assure Colts fans everywhere that we are both committed to maintaining our close relationship and to working together through any challenges the future may bring."

That would be welcome news to Colts fans, who first watched Manning publicly complain about the down-in-the-mouth atmosphere at team headquarters and then two days later saw Irsay call out his franchise quarterback at a news conference intended to focus on the new head coach.

It's been a dizzying week.

On Tuesday, Manning told The Indianapolis Star that his only real conversation so far with the new general manager Ryan Grigson had come in passing and the flurry of firings had those around the team complex walking on "eggshells."

Irsay didn't like that Manning went public with his frustrations and he said so Thursday, calling Manning a "politician."

"I don't think it's in the best interest to paint the horseshoe in a negative light, I really don't," Irsay told reporters following Chuck Pagano's introduction as coach. "The horseshoe always comes first, and I think one thing he's always known, because he's been around it so long, is that, you know, you keep it in the family. If you've got a problem you talk to each other, it's not about campaigning or anything like that."

Apparently, Manning got the message.

Just a few hours later, Manning told the newspaper that he didn't intend to create a public spat. Instead, Manning said he was speaking from the heart after watching so many of his friends lose their jobs.

"At this point, Mr. Irsay and I owe it to each other and to the fans of the organization to handle this appropriately and professionally, and I think we will. I've already reached out to Mr. Irsay," Manning said. "I wasn't trying to paint the Colts in a bad light, but it's tough when so many people you've known for so long are suddenly leaving. I feel very close to a lot of these guys and we've done great things together. It's hard to watch an old friend clean out his office. That's all I was trying to say."

And Irsay tweeted after that: "Peyton and I love each other,that goes without saying..I humbly serve n protect the Horseshoe..it is bigger than any individual,including me."

Whether the two have mended their misunderstanding, there are still huge questions pending. Irsay must decide by March 8 whether to pay Manning a $28 million bonus. Manning missed the entire 2011 season after having his third neck surgery in September.

Irsay just this month has fired vice chairman Bill Polian, general manager Chris Polian, coach Jim Caldwell and most of the staff. Pagano, the Baltimore Ravens' defensive coordinator this past season, is just getting started, as is Grigson.

Indy's poor season has given it the No. 1 overall pick, which Irsay has said they will use for their quarterback of the future, presumably Stanford's Andrew Luck. If so, Irsay must decide if he wants to pay a No. 1 quarterback and Manning, who signed a five-year, $90 million contract in July and will be 36 in late March.

Irsay has said his choice will come down to Manning's health, not money.

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_s440RiiMhzI/TJ40degvGsI/AAAAAAAAFI4/alKurC1gASw/s1600/Godfather-Part-II-Fredo-and-Michael.jpg

B.A.
01-27-12, 04:34 PM
St. Louis Rams must play all home games at Dome, commission says

FROM STAFF REPORTS | Posted: Friday, January 27, 2012 2:45 pm

Responding to the Rams' plans to play games in London, the St. Louis Convention and Visitors Commission said today the team is required by its lease to play all home games at the Edward Jones Dome.

"We immediately brought this to the Rams' attention and are awaiting their response," the commission, which manages the Dome, said in a statement.

The Rams announced last week that they would play one home game over the next three years in London, where owner Stan Kroenke also owns the Arsenal soccer club. The Rams are slated to play the New England Patriots this year in London's Wembley Stadium.

The commission acknowledged that the Rams playing overseas would "elevate an awareness of St. Louis on global stage." But it added, "Our lease with the Rams requires that the Rams play all their home games in the Edward Jones Dome."

CVC President Kathleen "Kitty" Ratcliffe was unavailable for comment today. A commission spokeswoman, Donna Andrews, said she couldn't offer any additional details.

A section of the the Rams' lease at the Dome calls for the team "to play all its home NFL Games (other than pre-season NFL Games) at the Facilities." The Rams can disregard this rule if the Dome is not in useable condition or if the lease is terminated, according to that section of the lease.

The planned home games in London would be a financial boost for the Rams. NFL teams that have played in London have been guaranteed ticket revenue equivalent to a sellout, plus expenses.

Wembley Stadium seats 82,000, while the Dome seats 66,000. And while general admission tickets at the Dome ranged from $25 to $160 this season, prices for the Rams-Patriots game at Wembley range from $70 to $155.

The CVC's stance on the London games comes on the cusp of negotiations with the Rams about the condition of the Dome. The Rams can opt out of the lease by 2015 if the Dome is not a "first tier" NFL stadium. The CVC must deliver a plan to the Rams by Wednesday explaining how the Dome can be refurbished to meet that standard. That will trigger a series of negotiation deadlines in 2012. The lease, however, does not offer a clear-cut definition of what constitues "first tier."

http://www.stltoday.com/news/local/metro/st-louis-rams-must-play-all-home-games-at-dome/article_94108892-4928-11e1-a0da-001a4bcf6878.html

Red Dog
01-27-12, 04:41 PM
The lease, however, does not offer a clear-cut definition of what constitues "first tier."

I believe I read somewhere that the Dome is considered top-tier if its puts the Rams in the top-quarter in stadium revenue. It was a terrible deal by the city but like many cities, they were desperate in the mid-90s. So silly that a dome that is barely over 15 years old is considered inadequate.

starman9000
01-27-12, 05:21 PM
Maybe if they decide to build the new Vikings stadium at the Metrodome site, they could just play their home games in London instead of TCF Bank stadium. If they really want to increase interest over there, having a single team for them to follow could help (well, not if they continue to lose games like this season I suppose). I'm guessing the other owners wouldn't be to fond on that either, so never mind.

LorenzoL
01-27-12, 05:39 PM
Irsay is a freaking hypocrite! Telling Peyton to keep it "in house" while he used to tweet personnel and lineup decisions throughout the season often second guessing his coach and GM. Idiot!

Red Dog
01-27-12, 06:02 PM
Irsay is a freaking hypocrite! Telling Peyton to keep it "in house" while he used to tweet personnel and lineup decisions throughout the season often second guessing his coach and GM. Idiot!

Well, at least he didn't fire a coach at halftime and call plays from the owners box like his daddy did.

Larry C.
01-27-12, 06:03 PM
Fins hired Mike Sherman to be the OC and Kevin Coyle as DC.

I like it.

wmansir
01-27-12, 07:04 PM
Irsay is a freaking hypocrite! Telling Peyton to keep it "in house" while he used to tweet personnel and lineup decisions throughout the season often second guessing his coach and GM. Idiot!

I don't know much about the man. Question: Is "the horseshoe" a common nickname for the Colts organization? Because his use of it kind of set off my douche detector.

I can't blame Peyton for speaking out, especially if the front office isn't keeping him in the loop.

My Other Self
01-27-12, 08:05 PM
I don't know much about the man. Question: Is "the horseshoe" a common nickname for the Colts organization? Because his use of it kind of set off my douche detector.

I can't blame Peyton for speaking out, especially if the front office isn't keeping him in the loop.I am not by any means a Colts fan but I've never heard of them being nicknamed "the horseshoe". That come off as ridiculously douche-y.

His Twitter account isn't much better. He's just a big goofball. That whole Rob Lowe thing was ridiculous. There's no way Lowe would have done that by himself without Irsay feeding him something.

Red Dog
01-27-12, 08:08 PM
Well the Colts name never made sense for Indiana to begin with.

The Cow
01-27-12, 08:17 PM
This is "the Horseshoe" (tHorseshoe?) :)

http://i59.photobucket.com/albums/g316/PurpleLava/imagesqtbnANd9GcSn56Ww95W-r1YN2WWrD.jpg

kurupt
01-27-12, 08:45 PM
This is "the Horseshoe" (tHorseshoe?) :)

http://i59.photobucket.com/albums/g316/PurpleLava/imagesqtbnANd9GcSn56Ww95W-r1YN2WWrD.jpg

*salutes*

I live in east Tennessee, the land where Peyton Manning is a deity (even though he's not actually from here and never actually won a championship for UT, but that's beside the point) and everyone here suddenly became blue blooded Colts fans (for some reason, I don't think Michigan fans started pulling for the Patriots and something tells me that Purdue people are not die-hard Saints fans) and I've never heard anyone refer to the 'Horseshoe'. Sounds like Irsay is trying to pull a Jerry Jones, who repeatedly references 'the Star' when referring to the Cowboys.

Decker
01-27-12, 10:02 PM
Called my best friend in Indy, a season ticket holder for over 20 years. Asked him if he ever heard Irsay or anyone else refer to the Colts as "The Horseshoe" before. He hadn't. Maybe Irsay was just speaking off the cuff, or maybe that's next year's marketing slogan.

BTW Red Dog : The Indianapolis Colts have a weird hang up in dealing with the team history. The media guide refers to records from Baltimore, but almost nothing else in Indy acknowledges the Baltimore history. I think folks are too embarrassed about the Mayflower trucks to this day.
When I arrived there in 1999, there was one player on the Ring of Honor (I forget who -- nobody I knew, and not Eric Dickerson) and Bob Irsay. There were two Wild Card banners in the rafters. And that was it. Funny how one great player can change an entire football culture.

tommyp007
01-27-12, 10:19 PM
*salutes*

I live in east Tennessee, the land where Peyton Manning is a deity (even though he's not actually from here and never actually won a championship for UT, but that's beside the point) and everyone here suddenly became blue blooded Colts fans (for some reason, I don't think Michigan fans started pulling for the Patriots and something tells me that Purdue people are not die-hard Saints fans) and I've never heard anyone refer to the 'Horseshoe'. Sounds like Irsay is trying to pull a Jerry Jones, who repeatedly references 'the Star' when referring to the Cowboys.

salute!

kurupt
01-28-12, 08:00 AM
salute!

A fellow Kingsportonian!

nickdawgy
01-28-12, 05:43 PM
Aldon Smith got arrested for a DUI in Miami. When I saw 49ers Smith, I wasn't sure if it was him, Justin, or Alex :lol:

Anyhow, dumb move, and I hope he learns from it.

raven56706
01-28-12, 06:03 PM
Aldon Smith got arrested for a DUI in Miami. When I saw 49ers Smith, I wasn't sure if it was him, Justin, or Alex :lol:

Anyhow, dumb move, and I hope he learns from it.

Who's got it better than the 49ers???? f off... bartender, give me another!

:)

nickdawgy
01-28-12, 07:23 PM
Yeah you think he would have gotten smashed the night of the game, and not a week later.

LorenzoL
01-29-12, 09:16 AM
Reports indicate that Bruce Arians will become the new OC for the Colts:

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/7513729/source-bruce-arians-indianapolis-colts-new-offensive-coordinator

Tarantino
01-29-12, 10:37 AM
The Pro Bowl is on today. Anyone watching?

HistoryProf
01-29-12, 03:07 PM
As good as Manning is, it's hard to imagine that he will pick that back up instantly with another team with another offensive scheme featuring receivers and linemen that aren't on the same page as him.

If there is one of those teams, though, I agree that it would be the 49ers. Without knowing the playbook he would be an immediate upgrade to Alex Smith, who improved this year, but is still nowhere near the top 10 qb's. They might need another impact receiver too, but they seem to have all the other parts.

it seems to me that Peyton needs a team with either a Defensive head coach or a milquetoast guy that will let him do what he does. I don't see any way on earth how he could work with someone like Harbaugh in SF. too headstrong. Peyton is basically the player/OC and needs a coach who will let him do that.

Somewhere like KC w/ Crennell would be ideal for him.

starman9000
01-29-12, 03:22 PM
How about with the Browns? Childress let Favre run the show in MN, so I'm sure he'd love to have Manning run the offence for him.

My Other Self
01-29-12, 03:36 PM
How about with the Browns? Childress let Favre run the show in MN, so I'm sure he'd love to have Manning run the offence for him.The Browns need a franchise QB. More likely than not I see them trading up for RG3

starman9000
01-29-12, 03:46 PM
I hope so.

kurupt
01-29-12, 03:51 PM
As a Browns fan, I would welcome either Manning or RGIII.

Jericho
01-29-12, 07:06 PM
it seems to me that Peyton needs a team with either a Defensive head coach or a milquetoast guy that will let him do what he does. I don't see any way on earth how he could work with someone like Harbaugh in SF. too headstrong. Peyton is basically the player/OC and needs a coach who will let him do that.

Somewhere like KC w/ Crennell would be ideal for him.

I don't know if either is exactly true. Sure, Manning had his best success with Dungy. But I'd be careful to draw too many conclusions from that. However, I'd agree that Manning has basically operated as a de facto Offensive coordinator. so going to a team with an offensive head coach wouldn't be the best fit. Manning's smart and should be able to adapt, but it does not seem to be a maximum use of assets.

Jericho
01-29-12, 07:12 PM
The Browns need a franchise QB. More likely than not I see them trading up for RG3

Maybe, maybe not. I do think its between them and the Redskins. One of them will jump up into the top 2 picks. Depends on how much each team likes Grffin and how much they're willing to trade.

The concern for the Browns is I don't see Manning as a viable option. If he's released, there's no way he signs there over other options. If he's traded, I'd say Manning would at least grumble about it. Cleveland suck right now, particular with skill players on offense.

While Cleveland may also make a play for Flynn, the question becomes can then out duel Washington for a QB? Because I don't see Shanahan punting on the position for a third year. After getting burned by McNabb and then passing on Gabbert/Ponder/Dalton/Kapernick, I doubt the Redskins don't try and get someone. I suppose that someone could be Manning (although I'd say Manning has better options if healthy) or Flynn (who I feel is widely overrated). But reports indicate they want Griffin. I'm not sure the Browns feel they have to have Griffin now. They have a ton of holes and next year's draft won't be bad either. We'll see...

NORML54601
01-29-12, 07:39 PM
This probowl is a joke. I love that the crowd is sitting all over it.

Tarantino
01-29-12, 07:45 PM
The Pro Bowl in general is a joke.

Dave99
01-29-12, 08:57 PM
it seems to me that Peyton needs a team with either a Defensive head coach or a milquetoast guy that will let him do what he does. I don't see any way on earth how he could work with someone like Harbaugh in SF. too headstrong. Peyton is basically the player/OC and needs a coach who will let him do that.

Somewhere like KC w/ Crennell would be ideal for him.

I'm the opposite, I think Harbaugh being a former QB could understand how good manning is and let him do his thing.

davidh777
01-29-12, 10:14 PM
After the SAGs ended, I surfed all the obscure cable channels trying to find the Pro Bowl. Never thought it'd be on a major network (insert NBC joke here). :lol:

LurkerDan
01-29-12, 10:58 PM
I'm the opposite, I think Harbaugh being a former QB could understand how good manning is and let him do his thing.

I agree. I think the best thing for Manning would be to work with an offensive coach who knows what he has in Peyton and can maximize his talents. Because as good as Manning is and as much as he is a coach on the field, someone else is still setting up the offensive schemes. I think he'll do well no matter where he goes, but he'll do even better with a good O coach.

Decker
01-29-12, 11:35 PM
Colts add Pittsburgh Steeler Linebacker coach Keith Butler as Defensive Coordinator. Steelers didn't want to lose him, but he wanted a DC job and Dick LeBeau is coming back for his 94th season as DC next year. Butler, OC Bruce Arians and head coach Chuck Pagano all worked together under Butch Davis at the Browns. Looks like a total sea change in culture and identity in Indy.

Xander
01-30-12, 11:24 AM
Phil Emery is named as the Bears GM. Not sure if this is a good thing or not. Kinda seems like they picked the guy who will get along with Lovie the best. :rolleyes: Hope that works out for them...

Decker
01-30-12, 04:19 PM
New logo for the Panthers. First change since expansion.

http://static.foxsports.com/content/fscom/img/2012/01/30/panthers_logo_pi_20120130081340684_660_320.JPG

Check out how much more intimidating it is. They probably don't even need Cam Newton any more, that logo should be enough to frighten most of their competition.

FWIW, here's their far less frightening old logo for comparison:
http://l.yimg.com/j/assets/p/sp/editorial_image/1d/1d323d5f197c62e8f732a8396a6056ae/the_carolina_panthers_have_a_new_logo.jpg

wmansir
01-30-12, 06:39 PM
I think the old logo looks more intimidating, but I like the lines of the new logo better. Except maybe the eyes, which make it look a bit confused.

TGM
01-30-12, 07:13 PM
such a non-story

My Other Self
01-30-12, 08:08 PM
I dislike it, and I've been a Panthers fan since the beginning. Just a pointless dumb tweak. I know logos need updating, but meh. If it's not broke don't fix it. Their new text is very plain as well.

JumpCutz
01-30-12, 08:09 PM
The Pro Bowl in general is a joke.

As are some of the forum members at DT. -wink-

chrisih8u
01-30-12, 10:44 PM
Sounds like all this Manning speculation may be moot. More and more reports saying he may never play again. :(

davidlynchfan
01-30-12, 10:57 PM
Rob Lowe may be the prophet afterall.

onebyone
01-30-12, 11:07 PM
Sounds like all this Manning speculation may be moot. More and more reports saying he may never play again. :(

Did new reports come out today? If so please share with me. I must be slacking in my Manning watch.

chrisih8u
01-30-12, 11:17 PM
INDIANAPOLIS – For all the discussion over Peyton Manning’s future with the Indianapolis Colts, the underlying issue is that people close to him don’t believe he’ll resume his career.

The nerves in Manning’s arm are not healing as quickly as hoped and, worse, don’t appear to be progressing at enough of a rate to indicate that he will play again, according to two sources with knowledge of Manning’s rehabilitation from neck surgery. The vertebrae in his neck that were fused have healed as expected and Manning began throwing in December. But he hasn’t shown improvement in velocity on his passes, and the two sources fear he likely never will again.

http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news;_ylt=Air0V9cG5j6q5JoR4yxIGeZDubYF?slug=jc-cole_peyton_manning_colts_neck_surgery_jim_irsay013012

onebyone
01-30-12, 11:28 PM
INDIANAPOLIS – For all the discussion over Peyton Manning’s future with the Indianapolis Colts, the underlying issue is that people close to him don’t believe he’ll resume his career.

SNIP

Thanks for posting that link. I had missed it entirely.

Not sure if there's anything meaty in there or if it is Irsay leaking like a sieve and the media blowing it up, but alas, I may be in denial.

PopcornTreeCt
01-30-12, 11:45 PM
At least he'll always be a Colt.

My Other Self
01-30-12, 11:51 PM
A lot of the reports I heard today sounded more like he wouldn't play again, either. He's been throwing but his speed has been way down.

I can imagine if he signs some big contract with a team then ends up blowing in comparison to Manning of old.

wmansir
01-30-12, 11:57 PM
Thanks for posting that link. I had missed it entirely.

Not sure if there's anything meaty in there or if it is Irsay leaking like a sieve and the media blowing it up, but alas, I may be in denial.
That article in particular had the whiff of a spin job from "the horseshoe".

Decker
01-30-12, 11:58 PM
That's awful news (if indeed true). I'd MUCH rather Peyton join another team than have him never play again. Can't blame the Colts for releasing him if that's even partially true. Hope the story is wrong, but if it's right, I hope they give Peyton the proper send-off he deserves. And start working on that statue right away.

In other far less important, but still bad news for the Colts :

Keith Butler changes mind on Colts, will stay with Steelers

Posted by Michael David Smith on January 30, 2012, 8:39 PM EST

AP
Steelers linebackers coach Keith Butler has had a change of heart about becoming the next defensive coordinator of the Colts.

The Pittsburgh Post-Gazette reports that Butler decided against going to Indianapolis after meeting today with team president Art Rooney II and head coach Mike Tomlin.

Butler’s contract with the Steelers had expired and he was free to leave for the Colts whether the Steelers wanted him to go or not, but he has apparently agreed to a new deal. Presumably, Rooney gave him a significant raise to keep him around.

The 55-year-old Butler is expected to become the Steelers’ defensive coordinator whenever the 74-year-old Dick LeBeau retires.

CRM114
01-31-12, 10:10 AM
It seems to me that Peyton Manning won't ever play again and he knows it and the Colts know it AND Rob Lowe knew it. Doesn't it make sense to release this news AFTER the draft to at least leave some mystery as to the #1 pick in the draft? If the illusion is out there that Peyton may come back, don't teams think that pick may be in play for the right price and the Colts just sit back and wait for someone to pull a Ditka? If everyone knows Peyton is out, there is no way they would deal that pick.

And are they really going to build a statue for the guy? What's next? A statue for his more successful brother? ;)

raven56706
01-31-12, 10:49 AM
It seems to me that Peyton Manning won't ever play again and he knows it and the Colts know it AND Rob Lowe knew it. Doesn't it make sense to release this news AFTER the draft to at least leave some mystery as to the #1 pick in the draft? If the illusion is out there that Peyton may come back, don't teams think that pick may be in play for the right price and the Colts just sit back and wait for someone to pull a Ditka? If everyone knows Peyton is out, there is no way they would deal that pick.

And are they really going to build a statue for the guy? What's next? A statue for his more successful brother? ;)

would be hilarious...

Sweet Baby James
01-31-12, 11:17 AM
What's next? A statue for his more successful brother? ;)



The Giants haven't won just yet.

davidh777
01-31-12, 11:53 AM
Maybe Peyton should just walk away. What does he have left to accomplish other than another Super Bowl ring, which he'd have to go to the right situation to have any chance at? Walk away, stay a Colt forever, and let us remember the awesome times rather than one season of being a shell of himself.

starman9000
01-31-12, 12:24 PM
Let him come to Minnesota, where all great quarterbacks go to die.

Goat3001
01-31-12, 12:42 PM
Maybe Peyton should just walk away. What does he have left to accomplish other than another Super Bowl ring, which he'd have to go to the right situation to have any chance at? Walk away, stay a Colt forever, and let us remember the awesome times rather than one season of being a shell of himself.

Easier said than done though. We see athletes hold on for "just another year" because they rather know they left it all out there than think they hung it up with something left in the tank.

I agree with you. He should retire now and respect his legacy as a Colt. But I think something like legacy takes back seat to playing another year and going for a championship. Truth is that if he doesn't retire it's because he thinks he can play at that same level he always has. And if that's the case then he thinks he can stroll onto a number of teams and make them a SB team right away... and IF he can play to that level, he WILL instantly elevate that team.

PopcornTreeCt
01-31-12, 07:22 PM
It seems to me that Peyton Manning won't ever play again and he knows it and the Colts know it AND Rob Lowe knew it. Doesn't it make sense to release this news AFTER the draft to at least leave some mystery as to the #1 pick in the draft? If the illusion is out there that Peyton may come back, don't teams think that pick may be in play for the right price and the Colts just sit back and wait for someone to pull a Ditka? If everyone knows Peyton is out, there is no way they would deal that pick.

And are they really going to build a statue for the guy? What's next? A statue for his more successful brother? ;)

But how did Rob Lowe know?

The Cow
01-31-12, 07:32 PM
It seems to me that Peyton Manning won't ever play again and he knows it and the Colts know it AND Rob Lowe knew it. Doesn't it make sense to release this news AFTER the draft to at least leave some mystery as to the #1 pick in the draft? If the illusion is out there that Peyton may come back, don't teams think that pick may be in play for the right price and the Colts just sit back and wait for someone to pull a Ditka? If everyone knows Peyton is out, there is no way they would deal that pick.


His $28 million bonus is due in early March. The draft is in late April.

WallyOPD
01-31-12, 08:09 PM
His $28 million bonus is due in early March. The draft is in late April.

His theory doesn't even make sense beyond that. His premise seems to be that if Peyton Manning isn't going to play, there's no way in hell the Colts will trade the pick. But, secretly, the Colts know Peyton isn't going to play, but they still want to trade the pick? :hscratch:

Drexl
01-31-12, 08:52 PM
He's saying that teams wouldn't bother to make serious offers because they know the Colts will keep Luck. The theory is that if other teams think that Luck could be had, some team could blow them away with an offer so crazy that the Colts would trade the pick and look elsewhere for a QB.

LurkerDan
01-31-12, 09:37 PM
Easier said than done though. We see athletes hold on for "just another year" because they rather know they left it all out there than think they hung it up with something left in the tank.

I agree with you. He should retire now and respect his legacy as a Colt. But I think something like legacy takes back seat to playing another year and going for a championship. Truth is that if he doesn't retire it's because he thinks he can play at that same level he always has. And if that's the case then he thinks he can stroll onto a number of teams and make them a SB team right away... and IF he can play to that level, he WILL instantly elevate that team.

You make it sound like he was on the downslide before his injury, and is trying to "hold on". If he can return to his pre-injury form -- and none of us know that he can't -- he won't just be hanging on, he'd be one of the very best in the league.

will travel
02-02-12, 02:06 AM
Let him come to Minnesota, where all great quarterbacks go to die.

His daddy, Archie. played for the Vikings in the early 80's.

CRM114
02-02-12, 10:49 AM
If Manning thinks he can play, is anyone interested in Michael Vick? ;)

Decker
02-02-12, 04:25 PM
It took a while, but the Colts finally have hired a Defensive Coordinator.

Greg Manusky is the latest piece in place in the Indianapolis Colts’ coaching staff puzzle.

The long-time NFL assistant is the team’s new defensive coordinator.

“The ink’s dry on that,’’ general manager Ryan Grigson said today during an interview at the JW Marriott.

Manusky, he added, has the flexibility of overseeing a 3-4 or a 4-3 defense.

“It’s all part of the philosophy of not trying to fit a square peg into a round hole,’’ Grigson said. “He lines right up with that. He’s a football guy, passionate, fire in his eyes. If you sit with him for two seconds, you see he’s an intense football guy.

“He’s ready to come in and do some great things for us.’’

Manusky, 45, was San Diego’s defensive coordinator this season. He held the same position with San Francisco from 2007-10. Prior to that, Manusky was linebackers coach with the Chargers (2002-06) and Washington (2001).

Grigson also confirmed Clyde Christensen will remain on the staff, likely as quarterbacks coach. Also, Roy Anderson will serve as secondary/safeties coach and Marwan Maalouf will handle special teams.

“It’s one after another,’’ Grigson said of building coach Chuck Pagano’s staff, “but we want to get the right guys.’’

Decker
02-02-12, 04:32 PM
Bob Kravitz's weekly "Say goodbye to Peyton" article. I think it's a good, well thought-out, heartfelt one this time.

Bob Kravitz: No easy way for Colts, Irsay to say goodbye to Peyton Manning
6:00 AM, Feb. 2, 2012 |

After Peter Pocklington traded hockey icon Wayne Gretzky in 1988, the one-time Edmonton Oilers owner was overwhelmed with death threats, "hundreds of them," he said from his home in Palm Desert, Calif.

After Carmen Policy dealt quarterback great Joe Montana in 1993, the former San Francisco 49ers executive said the public view of him changed -- forever.

"I had a pretty good reputation and persona in the Bay Area," he said recently from his home in the Napa Valley. "But when I'd go out, I could see it and feel it. People wouldn't be rude, but they were looking at me like, 'How could you do it? How could you do it?' "

Pocklington and Policy, along with Green Bay Packers General Manager Ted Thompson, pulled the triggers on the three biggest front-office decisions in recent American sports history: Gretzky, Montana and Brett Favre. Now Jim Irsay, the Indianapolis Colts' eccentric but mostly beloved owner, is less than a month from telling quarterback Peyton Manning that if he doesn't retire, he will be cut.

While Irsay and the city revel in the Super Bowl celebration, the team's owner faces the toughest decision of his football life.

Pocklington and Policy both said what Irsay is going to say: It's not personal; it's business. Even though we are here at a Super Bowl that wouldn't have been possible without Peyton Manning, at a game being played in a stadium that would not have been built without Peyton Manning, Irsay has to find a right way -- if it exists -- to say goodbye.

"The one regret I had was, I didn't feel like there were enough hugs for Joe near the end," Policy said. "It got too businesslike, even if it was incredibly emotional. I thought the actual deal (to trade Montana to the Kansas City Chiefs) dragged on too long. And as a result, we didn't have the separation on terms or conditions our humanity might have otherwise wanted."

The moves were made, ultimately, because they had to be made. Because as late, great 49ers coach Bill Walsh once said, you're best to move a player one year too early than one year too late.

"I would do it again," said Pocklington, who wrote a book called, "I'd Trade Him Again." "If you looked at our finances at the time, the state of the Canadian dollar, there was really no choice. There was no other rational conclusion to be reached.

"And that's the thing: You have to separate the emotion from the equation. It took me a long time to do that because I loved Wayne Gretzky. Everybody loved Wayne. Not just Edmonton but the entire country. But in the end, you have to do the best thing for the franchise."

Policy knows what Irsay is experiencing because he went through it, and he saw his team's owner, Eddie DeBartolo, go through it. Irsay is ready to make a wildly unpopular, unsentimental move; the right move, the only move, but one that will forever cast him as "the man who cut Peyton Manning."

"I don't think people understand fully how much emotional turmoil is created by these kinds of potential departures," Policy said. "I mean, Joe Montana was the heart, the soul, the substance and the form of our team. All of us loved him. Our owner, I thought he was going to die of a broken heart. It got so bad, even Joe couldn't tell Eddie to his face when Joe went back to meet with him to tell him he'd been traded and was leaving. To his credit, Joe understood and handled it like a complete gentleman.

"And now to think what Jim Irsay is facing with Peyton, I mean, who better personifies all the best qualities of the NFL than Peyton Manning?"

He laughed. "I just thank God there wasn't an Internet when we made the trade. That would have been unbearably cruel and crushing."

In some ways, Irsay and Manning are heading toward a divorce, and with that, some old wounds have been opened. Manning opened up to me last week, talking about the unsettled state of the franchise, and Irsay came back on the day he hired Chuck Pagano as coach, calling Manning a "politician." The two have since talked at length and plan to talk again soon, and a decision is at hand. (Manning said he hopes it's "sooner rather than later," although Irsay said this could go into early March.)

None of the mildly testy words of the past week should come as any surprise.

"There were some tough moments," Pocklington said of the weeks before the Gretzky trade. "It got emotional at times; mostly it was people around me and Wayne who got emotional. But we parted on very good terms and our relationship never suffered. Look at my book. He wrote the foreword. He understood what I had to do and I understood what he had to do."

Policy has watched the Manning-Irsay drama unfold from afar -- he owns a Napa Valley winery -- and has seen it get a bit uncomfortable in recent weeks.

"Somehow, some way, you've got to try your darnedest to keep it as civil as possible and keep it from becoming a 'War of the Roses'-type divorce," he said. "You're still going to come out of it with some hurt feelings, some bruises and scratches, but hopefully without any deep wounds."

Nobody wants this to happen. Policy didn't want to trade Montana, but Steve Young's growth and the newly installed salary cap made it a must. Pocklington didn't want to trade Gretzky, but with contract talks stalled and free agency on the horizon, it was a must. Now, with Manning, his health is questionable, he's due lots of money, quarterback and likely No. 1 overall draft pick Andrew Luck is waiting in the wings . . . it's a must.

"I just hope Jim Irsay has somebody around him who not only can advise and support him, but someone he can lean on in a very personal way," Policy said. "And maybe that's two different people who serve two different purposes. I can promise you this is very emotionally wrenching for him, just as it is for Peyton."

The time is near, and there will be tears. Pocklington has lived it. Policy has lived it.

"I always say, 'A brave man only dies once; a coward dies every day,' " Pocklington said. "Sometimes, as unpopular as it is, you have to do the brave thing."

Irsay and Manning seem to be ready.

Central Indiana? That might be a different matter.

Red Dog
02-02-12, 04:40 PM
While I agree that Peyton Manning is the biggest Indy sports figure (at least pro) ever, to compare him to Wayne Gretzky and his relationship with Edmonton, given how Gretzky was the greatest ever and the obsession over hockey in Canada, is kind of absurd. Plus Gretzky was still in his prime with plenty of years left and no injury issues.

Now the comparison to Montana and the Niners is much more valid.

Pharoh
02-02-12, 05:19 PM
While I agree that Peyton Manning is the biggest Indy sports figure (at least pro) ever, to compare him to Wayne Gretzky and his relationship with Edmonton, given how Gretzky was the greatest ever and the obsession over hockey in Canada, is kind of absurd. Plus Gretzky was still in his prime with plenty of years left and no injury issues.

Now the comparison to Montana and the Niners is much more valid.

I agree about Gretzky, but I think this is bigger than Montana. I mean, Indy is not San Fran. Football, and Peyton, mattered much more than Joe did to the Bay area.

Red Dog
02-02-12, 05:43 PM
I don't know. The Niners were a huge deal there in the 80s and early 90s. Montana with 4 rings and who many considered the greatest QB ever (I don't think many regard Peyton that way). No Raiders at that time and baseball was a distant second even with some good Bay Area teams in that era. I'd have to think Montana is the biggest pro sports figure in Bay Area history. I suppose an argument could be made for Mays, but those Niners teams and their dynasty/titles trump IMO.

We have to view it w/o the benefit of hindsight knowing that Young picked right up where Montana left off. Granted, Young was much more of known commodity at that point than Luck is.