I don't know if I'll have the cash to do it this year, but I'd still like to get something in mind to know how much I'll need, and in case I see any good deals at Xmas time. lol
Current receiver: Onkyo TX-SR604
My ideal receiver:
Preferably under $1000
5.1/7.1
Bitstream with HDMI and decoding of everything
Must output ALL video coming in (composite/s-vid/compononent) from the HDMI
Must output ANY resolution thrown at it -- My SR604 refuses to output video with a Nintendo64 plugged into it
Must have an obscene amount of inputs and easy access to them. I'm thinking at least 4 or 5 HDMIs. -- My SR604 annoys me because it only has settings for 4 video devices despite having enough different composite/component/etc inputs to hook up like 12.
Front inputs not necessary, but if they exist I'd prefer they weren't locked down like the SR604. You can't set Video #4 to anything but the front inputs. Meaning you can only set the 6 hi def (HDMI/component) inputs to Video 1-3. Too limiting for me.
Menus on the TV screen. I would expect all receivers to do that by now, but you never know. My old Sony one didn't.
I'd love an RF or Bluetooth remote. I'm quite tired of IR. Not a deal breaker though.
Sdallnct
10-12-08, 03:04 PM
I know of no receiver that meets your "ideal" request.
Maybe the newest Onkyo comes close, but don't think so. And certainly not on the budget I'm "thinking" you are talking. Tho when you say "not a lot of cash", not sure what that mean. You better put in a $$ amount to get any useful responses.
What speakers do you have? And do you plan on upgrading them as well?
Oh and for your "ideal" receiver, should it have good quality sound? Or do you care? LOL
(sorry bad joke left over from previous threads). Tho since you mentioned Sony receiver, maybe not a silly question.
Viper187
10-12-08, 03:13 PM
I'm thinking under $1000. I'm keeping my existing speakers. 5x100w and a 75w sub I don't really use.
I saw a picture of a Denon one before that had a decent amount of inputs. This was a year or two ago though.
Spiky
10-12-08, 03:21 PM
Well, you have some problematic requests. The obvious choice is the 606, same level as you have, under $500. It's ridiculously popular and handles the first three items you list. But let's look at the other items.
- ANY resolution. Not going to happen. I only know of a couple devices that can do that, and they start at about $2500. That would be external scalers, MAYBE the top Denon receiver with a Realta processor, but the top Onkyo only has a Reon and I know it doesn't. However, why doesn't the N64 work? I've never had that problem with my Onkyo 898, with either component or Svideo. Mine is about 4-6 gens before your 604. What connections have you tried from the N64? Also, despite what I said, the 606 (and your 604) should handle any standard TV resolution, which the N64 should be giving it. I think you have a weird issue rather than a standard "feature" of the 604.
- Lots of inputs. The only way to get a lot more inputs is with a lot more money. But frankly, even the $5000 Denon doesn't have THAT many more than your 604. All receivers have a set number of usable inputs, usually between 4 and 7. The extra connections are just for options, they don't give more named inputs in the menu. However, you might be able to use the extra connections through careful usage. With mine, I can often plug in 2 devices to a set of inputs. One with component video and digital audio, a 2nd with Svideo and analog audio. The trick is to match the sources up to their wiring needs. And know that digital comes before analog.
You can also use external switches for extra inputs. Some can be seamless with IR control.
- Front inputs. I think this will always be locked down, regardless of mfgr. See the prior issue about physical inputs vs named inputs. That's just how it works.
- Menus: They all do this, now. Should through HDMI, too. Pretty sure the 606 does.
- RF remote. Not common, easier just to spend $40 or less on RF extenders.
Spiky
10-12-08, 03:27 PM
Oh, and if you do spend less than $500, take the rest of your budget and get one of these:
http://www.svsound.com/products-sub-box-10nsd.cfm
You have no idea. Really. From what you said, you don't have a subwoofer, not really. This is a SUBwoofer.
Sdallnct
10-12-08, 03:31 PM
I'm thinking under $1000. I'm keeping my existing speakers. 5x100w and a 75w sub I don't really use.
I saw a picture of a Denon one before that had a decent amount of inputs. This was a year or two ago though.
But what speakers are they?
Viper187
10-12-08, 03:50 PM
Well, you have some problematic requests. The obvious choice is the 606, same level as you have, under $500. It's ridiculously popular and handles the first three items you list. But let's look at the other items.
- ANY resolution. Not going to happen. I only know of a couple devices that can do that, and they start at about $2500. That would be external scalers, MAYBE the top Denon receiver with a Realta processor, but the top Onkyo only has a Reon and I know it doesn't. However, why doesn't the N64 work? I've never had that problem with my Onkyo 898, with either component or Svideo. Mine is about 4-6 gens before your 604. What connections have you tried from the N64? Also, despite what I said, the 606 (and your 604) should handle any standard TV resolution, which the N64 should be giving it. I think you have a weird issue rather than a standard "feature" of the 604.
I don't know what native N64 resolution is, but the SR604 simply said "Not supported mode" when it was connected with the composite cable. I've seen my PS2 do the same thing though when booting the Action Replay. I think it was on s-video. PS2 games are fine, but not the AR for whatever reason. The TV supports it when plugged in directly, so why not the receiver? I don't get it.
Oh, and if you do spend less than $500, take the rest of your budget and get one of these:
http://www.svsound.com/products-sub-box-10nsd.cfm
You have no idea. Really. From what you said, you don't have a subwoofer, not really. This is a SUBwoofer.
I don't really have space for or desire a sub. I rarely plug mine in.
But what speakers are they?
Sony speakers that came with a home theater in a box. They sound fine to me. I can't justify blowing money on anything better. This is a bedroom, btw, not a movie theater. They serve their purpose.
Spiky
10-12-08, 04:12 PM
I don't know what native N64 resolution is, but the SR604 simply said "Not supported mode" when it was connected with the composite cable. I've seen my PS2 do the same thing though when booting the Action Replay. I think it was on s-video. PS2 games are fine, but not the AR for whatever reason. The TV supports it when plugged in directly, so why not the receiver? I don't get it.
Like I said, that is just weird. Composite only has one possible resolution with the system in place in the country, and that is standard NTSC 480i. Same for Svideo, for that matter. I guess I'm assuming you're in the USA. In Europe it would be standard PAL 525i, still only one choice.
I can't say what these games might be doing.
Viper187
10-12-08, 04:44 PM
Like I said, that is just weird. Composite only has one possible resolution with the system in place in the country, and that is standard NTSC 480i. Same for Svideo, for that matter. I guess I'm assuming you're in the USA. In Europe it would be standard PAL 525i, still only one choice.
I can't say what these games might be doing.
U.S./NTSC... My VCR (Sony SLV-N55) actually has the same issue. I can't see the status (blue) screen or the menus, but I can see movies when they're playing.
Edit: Looked up N64. The resolutions it could supposedly output are 256 × 224, 320 × 240, and 640 × 480. Could that be a problem when the receiver is trying to output everything upconverted to component? Maybe component standards don't allow the lower resolutions and the receiver can't resize?
Spiky
10-12-08, 06:10 PM
Well, those lower game resolutions shouldn't be the actual signal. To match with TVs, it is still technically 480i. But obviously something is wrong.
There have been growing problems with upconversion in receivers, seems like yours is very touchy with the signal. I think they are better now, but I haven't played with it myself. I imagine there would owners threads over at AVS for many receivers you might look at.
Sdallnct
10-12-08, 08:50 PM
I don't really have space for or desire a sub. I rarely plug mine in.
Sony speakers that came with a home theater in a box. They sound fine to me. I can't justify blowing money on anything better. This is a bedroom, btw, not a movie theater. They serve their purpose.
Well, IMO, you are silly to spend a grand on a receiver with those speakers and no sub. And IMO your waisting getting the "newest and all audio formats" with those speaker and no sub.
You would be better off in overall sound to forget the newest formats, get a decent sounding receiver, upgrade your speakers, get a decent sub and if you need HDMI switching, just get a Monoprice 5 X 1 HDMI switcher. The monoprice has remote, so you can integrate it into a universal remote (like the harmony) and it will be seamless. Your budget would be about the same only you would have better sound.
Mr. Salty
10-12-08, 09:23 PM
Well, IMO, you are silly to spend a grand on a receiver with those speakers and no sub. And IMO you're wasting getting the "newest and all audio formats" with those speaker and no sub.
I agree completely. There's no point in chasing the new high-res audio formats if you're going to use crap speakers, and Sony HTiB speakers are the definition of crap, no offense. You're just not going to hear an improvement.
kefrank
10-12-08, 09:44 PM
well, imo, you are silly to spend a grand on a receiver with those speakers and no sub. And imo your waisting getting the "newest and all audio formats" with those speaker and no sub.
+1
Viper187
10-12-08, 10:30 PM
Well, I'm not spending $500 on a goddamn sub. How much would a decent set of speakers cost? btw, I like the inputs on the Denon 5805, but that's obviously too expensive.
p.s. Is there any online store that's better with shipping on these types of items? I don't like these places that don't make any effort to prevent things from getting FUBAR in transit. Are packing pellets/etc really that expensive? :(
Sdallnct
10-12-08, 11:14 PM
Well, I'm not spending $500 on a goddamn sub. How much would a decent set of speakers cost?
(
What exactly are you trying to do? Are you trying to get the best overall sound for the money? You trying to completely integrate your system? You mentioned this is a bedroom room system, is this your main system? If it is "only" a bedroom system, why spend a grand on a receiver? What exactly is wrong with your current system.
I guess many (including me) would question why you would be willing to spend a grand on a receiver and not $500 on on a sub. What do expect that grand receiver to do for you?
Speakers on a budget. Lets see; the usual suspects are recommended overall:
I think you can get the SVS 5.1 speaker system for a grand or there about.
http://www.svsound.com/products-sys-sbs_black.cfm
The basic KEF system is about $550 (I have the Celestion set up that is kissing cousins to this and enjoy it)
http://www.accessories4less.com/make-a-store/item/KEFKHT2005SLVB/KEF/KHT2005.2-5.1-Home-Theater-Speaker-Package-in-Silver/1.html
Also speakers from Klipsch, Polk, NHT, Boston Acoustics, Mirage, Definitive Technology are some favorites (I'm sure I'm missing some). Though again with no offence, most would argue about anything is an upgrade from the Sony.
Viper187
10-12-08, 11:28 PM
What exactly are you trying to do? Are you trying to get the best overall sound for the money? You trying to completely integrate your system? You mentioned this is a bedroom room system, is this your main system? If it is "only" a bedroom system, why spend a grand on a receiver? What exactly is wrong with your current system.
I guess many (including me) would question why you would be willing to spend a grand on a receiver and not $500 on on a sub. What do expect that grand receiver to do for you?
It is my main system. Mainly, I want everything upconverted to HDMI output (without those resolution issues I mentioned), and everything plugged in. I'm always out of inputs. I don't like compromising between inputs on the TV and inputs on the receiver. I'd also like to see one with a bluetooth remote, but I guess nobody does that yet. What I don't need is all this multi-zone shit they all advertise.
Sdallnct
10-13-08, 12:09 AM
It is my main system. Mainly, I want everything upconverted to HDMI output (without those resolution issues I mentioned), and everything plugged in. I'm always out of inputs. I don't like compromising between inputs on the TV and inputs on the receiver. I'd also like to see one with a bluetooth remote, but I guess nobody does that yet. What I don't need is all this multi-zone shit they all advertise.
What do you see as the compromise of using inputs on your TV? Have you thought about a HMDI switch box? As an example, my surround receiver has no HDMI inputs. Yet I currently have three HDMI sources (HD Dish box, HD DVD player, PS3). I use a Monoprice HDMI switcher for video (its output goes to my projector). Then each of the digital audio (optical or coaxial) goes to my surround receiver. Since my Harmony can control everything (except of course the PS3), it is a seamless set up.
Sure one day I'll upgrade to get the newest audio. But not until I can upgrade my speakers and sub.
Viper187
10-13-08, 12:41 AM
What do you see as the compromise of using inputs on your TV? Have you thought about a HMDI switch box? As an example, my surround receiver has no HDMI inputs. Yet I currently have three HDMI sources (HD Dish box, HD DVD player, PS3). I use a Monoprice HDMI switcher for video (its output goes to my projector). Then each of the digital audio (optical or coaxial) goes to my surround receiver. Since my Harmony can control everything (except of course the PS3), it is a seamless set up.
Sure one day I'll upgrade to get the newest audio. But not until I can upgrade my speakers and sub.
Why is it so much to ask to be able to plug everything into 1 box and switch between it easily? Get an HDMI switch? Ok, but I still only have like 3 optical. What do I do when I'm out of those? ANOTHER switcher? bullshit. I want the least amount of cables possible. HDMIs, component, whatever all to 1 box and video out via HDMI. Even if I bought a slightly better receiver and used my old one as a pass through, I'd probably still find limitations. Like I'm pretty sure my SR604 won't pass along the HDMI audio, not sure about optical/coax. For that matter... Most receivers, even some of the $1000+ models, STILL only have 2 HDMIs. That just pisses me off. All that money and they can't even throw 4 or 5 on? What's the point?
Geofferson
10-13-08, 10:01 AM
The basic KEF system is about $550 (I have the Celestion set up that is kissing cousins to this and enjoy it)
http://www.accessories4less.com/make-a-store/item/KEFKHT2005SLVB/KEF/KHT2005.2-5.1-Home-Theater-Speaker-Package-in-Silver/1.html
Anyone know how these compare to Orb's satellite speakers?
http://www.orbaudio.com/
Sdallnct
10-13-08, 07:37 PM
Why is it so much to ask to be able to plug everything into 1 box and switch between it easily? Get an HDMI switch? Ok, but I still only have like 3 optical. What do I do when I'm out of those? ANOTHER switcher? bullshit. I want the least amount of cables possible. HDMIs, component, whatever all to 1 box and video out via HDMI. Even if I bought a slightly better receiver and used my old one as a pass through, I'd probably still find limitations. Like I'm pretty sure my SR604 won't pass along the HDMI audio, not sure about optical/coax. For that matter... Most receivers, even some of the $1000+ models, STILL only have 2 HDMIs. That just pisses me off. All that money and they can't even throw 4 or 5 on? What's the point?
The point is it cost what it cost. You are correct, some of the best receivers in the world (say something like an Outlaw) for limited inputs. Why? "What's the point"? The point is good sound. That is the point.
Just how many digital AUDIO inputs do you need? As mentioned, I have three HDMI's sources with three digital audio outputs. If I wanted to hook back our old PS2 or a VHS receiver, I could use the inputs on the receiver.
Dispite using a HDMI switcher, my system is seemless thanks to my Harmony remote. You wouldn't even know I had a switcher if I didn't point it out. I love the sound of my older H/K. That is why I'm not in a hurry to upgrade.
Sdallnct
10-13-08, 07:41 PM
Anyone know how these compare to Orb's satellite speakers?
http://www.orbaudio.com/
I have not heard the Orb. I am a KEF pimp and love them. This basic system is just that, basic. Oh it is good. And if you look around you can probably find reviews telling how good they were when they sold for a grand.
KEF is a British speaker maker. They make excellent products and I highly recommend them. If you budget permits go up a level or two and they are really sweet. Don't underpower KEF, they like good clean power.
Spiky
10-14-08, 12:41 AM
Just how many digital AUDIO inputs do you need? As mentioned, I have three HDMI's sources with three digital audio outputs. If I wanted to hook back our old PS2 or a VHS receiver, I could use the inputs on the receiver.
Yes, that is the question at this point. Viper, what exactly are you trying to plug in?
Viper187
10-14-08, 08:28 AM
Yes, that is the question at this point. Viper, what exactly are you trying to plug in?
Well, just off the top of my head...
PS3 -HDMI
Xbox 360 -HDMI
Toshiba A3 HD-DVD player -HDMI
DVD recorder -component
VCR - composite
PS2x2 -Svid/composite
Xbox (old) - Component
PC - DVI/VGA
Obviously, the 5 named inputs on this SR604 don't cut it. Maybe if the damn things would automatically catch the analog inputs when the digital aren't there it'd be tolerable. Still, 1 HDMI device too many, and I'd like to get component cables for the PS2s. What the hell am I gonna do when new game systems or anything come around? How bout if I pickup another N64, Dreamcast, etc? When I think "future proof," I think about actually having inputs free to buy more stuff. Is there something around with shitloads of inputs and all HDMI output that's more like a switchbox? I only seem to see switchers for a specific type of input when I look around.
hoyalawya
10-14-08, 09:06 AM
The Denon AVR 2809CI could be what you are looking for
http://usa.denon.com/AVR-2809CI_Lit702.pdf
http://usa.denon.com/ProductDetails/4484.asp
Again, like the others said, I would budget in new sub + speakers too.
Viper187
10-14-08, 11:35 AM
That's a little expensive for my taste. I'm not ruling it out though. Just for argument sake, what's the cheapest unit I can get with at least 2-3 HDMIs that upgrades all input signals to HDMI? It'd also be nice if it could intelligently select its input source. i.e. When HDMI/component/optical isn't sensed form the assigned input, then show analog input if there is any. My 604 would be halfway tolerable if it did that. btw, what changed from HDMI 1.1 to 1.3a? I noticed my 604 is only 1.1.
I looked up the 606 and it's somewhat appealing. Hard to believe it has less component inputs (and optical) than the 604 though. WTF!? If I actually have room to keep both receivers, I could conceivably use the old one as a switcher (as opposed to buying one). I dunno. Seems stupid to spend so much and still not be totally satisfied. The 705 has 1 more optical, but still only 2 component. Don't they expect people to actually hook stuff up to these things?
hoyalawya
10-14-08, 02:52 PM
That's a little expensive for my taste. I'm not ruling it out though. Just for argument sake, what's the cheapest unit I can get with at least 2-3 HDMIs that upgrades all input signals to HDMI? It'd also be nice if it could intelligently select its input source. i.e. When HDMI/component/optical isn't sensed form the assigned input, then show analog input if there is any. My 604 would be halfway tolerable if it did that. btw, what changed from HDMI 1.1 to 1.3a? I noticed my 604 is only 1.1.
I looked up the 606 and it's somewhat appealing. Hard to believe it has less component inputs (and optical) than the 604 though. WTF!? If I actually have room to keep both receivers, I could conceivably use the old one as a switcher (as opposed to buying one). I dunno. Seems stupid to spend so much and still not be totally satisfied. The 705 has 1 more optical, but still only 2 component. Don't they expect people to actually hook stuff up to these things?
You can get the Denon 2809ci on eBay right now for $599 after Microsoft Live Search $200 rebate. I think that the 2309ci is around $450. The catch is that the warranty will not be honored by Denon. I pulled a trigger on a 2809ci this morning from a seller that has a 21-day return policy.
Viper187
10-14-08, 03:22 PM
You gotta be kidding. I wouldn't trust ebay sellers for anything expensive. Hell, I hardly trust actual stores to pack electronics so they won't get mutilated during shipping.
Anyway, I'm curious as to what makes the 2309CI worth so much more than say the 606. They both have that same Faroudja processor, among other similarities. And why don't these damn things have VGA/DVI in? I suppose a DVI-HDMI adapter will serve my purpose on that front, until I need the HDMI for something else.
Sdallnct
10-14-08, 07:17 PM
Your making this really difficult. No ebay. Very selective on-line retailers. Yet your on a budget and want some specific things.
Some of the best service I have every gotten from anyone on any product was from eBay. You should not "rule them out". I bought my theater chairs you see in my signature-and yes one chair was had a small tear that occurred during shipping. The seller sent me a replacement seat and did not even have me send the torn one back -I just sent them a picture. I paid about $550 for them all 6 of them. I also bought BOTH my H/K receivers from eBay. Well, H/K has an eBay store, so it is sort of like buying direct from H/K. I also bought the screen material for my theater room (again you can see screen in my signature). I just bought the material and built the frame for it. I also bought wiring from them, but have since found Monoprice, so I only buy wiring from them now.
I'd take Denon over Onkyo in overall sound quality.
Spiky
10-14-08, 08:41 PM
Viper,
You need to slow down and relax.
Is there something around with shitloads of inputs and all HDMI output that's more like a switchbox? I only seem to see switchers for a specific type of input when I look around.
Not really. So what? You have a few needs, they aren't that hard to meet. A receiver and 2 switchers will cover you for the next decade. If you use the front input for what it is intended, hooking up a temporary item (aka: old video game), you won't need more than the receiver.
That's a little expensive for my taste. I'm not ruling it out though. Just for argument sake, what's the cheapest unit I can get with at least 2-3 HDMIs that upgrades all input signals to HDMI? It'd also be nice if it could intelligently select its input source. i.e.
Probably the Onkyo 606. Onkyo came out with HDMI faster than everyone else, so they are a step ahead right now. Sony has more HDMI inputs perhaps, but their receivers really suck otherwise.
Auto-select is ok, but not perfect. You would probably need to jump up a couple price levels to get that in a receiver. However, HDMI switchers for under $100 will offer a bit of that. It's strange, really. A good universal remote solves this problem, and several others.
I looked up the 606 and it's somewhat appealing. Hard to believe it has less component inputs (and optical) than the 604 though. WTF!? If I actually have room to keep both receivers, I could conceivably use the old one as a switcher (as opposed to buying one). I dunno. Seems stupid to spend so much and still not be totally satisfied. The 705 has 1 more optical, but still only 2 component. Don't they expect people to actually hook stuff up to these things?
Well, you only have 2 items that you want to hook up via component, sounds like it fits to me. And since HDMI is the future, you most likely won't have any more. Also, you can skip the component on the DVDR, because you are going to use something else to play DVDs, anyway. Like the vastly superior HDDVD player. I only actually view my DVDR when recording, to see the onscreen display. Svideo is overkill.
You mentioned a PC hookup. No receiver will convert from a PC because PCs now have a virtually unlimited # of modes, resolutions, timing rates and setups. They just aren't in the same product group and receivers aren't going to do this. However, you can try a DVI-HDMI adapter and try it out. It is a painful game to get this working with your TV directly for most people, but many do manage it. Going through a receiver or switcher will complicate it. Often times it would be best to go direct to the TV. This is why people use specific hardware for HTPCs.
And the answer to why is the 2309 more than the 606 is quality. Audio quality is the most expensive electronic item you can purchase. Would you like to see some $10000 one channel 8 watt amps to blow your mind?
And one more vote of confidence for Ebay Stores. It is a different concept than Ebay auctions. Sure, you want to check them out first, but they can be very trustworthy. I just bought a DSLR camera from one.
Sdallnct
10-14-08, 08:50 PM
Would you like to see some $10000 one channel 8 watt amps to blow your mind?
.
I want to see :)
I still get a hard on when I'm near a pair of Krell Monoblocks....LOL
this one, along with an upcoming Outlaw (997) or Emotiva are on my list.
Ditto. But the Outlaw really isn't looking like what I want. They are once again going to skimp on modern features, touting their audio quality only. While that is very important to me, they seem to completely ignore video. Maybe mated with an Edge.
Sdallnct
10-14-08, 10:59 PM
Sdallnct,
Will this suffice? It's stereo and only 7wpc, but it's over $20K, I believe. Averages out. :D
http://www.combak.net/reimyo/PAT-777.htm
Tubes :drool:
Spiky
10-14-08, 11:43 PM
HEY! Drooling on the tubes is a bad idea. Back up a little!
Viper187
10-15-08, 08:51 AM
Looking at the back of the 2309CI, the input names give me the impression that they're locked to specific named inputs. I would hope this isn't the case.
Sdallnct
10-15-08, 07:03 PM
HEY! Drooling on the tubes is a bad idea. Back up a little!
I had a 2 channel NYAL (New York Audio Labs) hybrid amp. Actually I still have it, just not using it. But anyway...use to freak me out as my cat would sleep on it in the winter cause it was so warm.
Capn Trips
10-17-08, 02:11 PM
Viper: If you care more about number of inputs and switching capability than about the absolute supreme audio quality (and based upon your described speaker setup, that is the case), I might blaspheme and suggest you look at the Pioneer line of receivers. Personally, I think their sound quality is just fine for a bedroom, and the one big advantage they have that might appeal to you is that any HDMI inputs are separate inputs, and do not get "mapped" to one of the other inputs (Component video and digital audio inputs still have to get mapped, so they consume a "named" input if you use them). It still may be hard to stay below your $1000 threshold, but you could get close.
Pioneer isn't bad. I seldom talk about them because they are usually a bit overpriced in my mind. And I'm not into the piano-black high gloss they generally use.
SoSpacey
10-20-08, 09:37 AM
You can get a Yamah rx-v1800 for under $800. I am not going to pull up the spec sheet and do a checklist to see if it covers all of your needs, but you should check it out.
Weighs about 45lbs so be aware before you buy it.
Viper187
04-06-09, 04:53 PM
Starting up an old thread, but I figured why start a new one for the same purpose.
I still haven't gotten around to getting a new receiver. I've decided to pick up some switchers from monoprice, so my need of extra inputs should be somewhat handled. Only problem with monoprice's component switcher is that it's coax only. For the price, I'll deal with it. Main thing that's irritating me now is the resolution support my SR604 lacks. It's apparently touchy about the analog input. Some Dreamcast games show video and some cause the receiver to go apeshit but work fine when connected directly to the TV. :(
I've updated my list below. I'm curious if there are any receivers now or planned in the next few months that would suit me. I'd sort of like to go Denon this time, but I'll consider all suggestions. I hope to finally upgrade by fall, possibly sooner.
Current receiver: Onkyo TX-SR604
My ideal receiver:
Preferably under $1000
5.1/7.1
Bitstream with HDMI and decoding of everything
Must output ALL video coming in (composite/s-vid/compononent) from the HDMI
Must output ANY resolution thrown at it -- My SR604 refuses to output video with a Nintendo64 or Dreamcast plugged into it
Menus on the TV screen. I would expect all receivers to do that by now, but you never know. My old Sony one didn't.
I'd love an RF or Bluetooth remote. I'm quite tired of IR. Not a deal breaker though.
Spiky
04-07-09, 01:20 AM
I'm liking the Denon 2309 specs right now.
You won't get RF remote easily, get RF remote extenders if it is necessary. Or possibly route IR directly into the receiver. There's really all sorts of control choices if you step up a level.
You want ANY resolution input, you need the DVDO iScan VP50, 'round $2500. Luckily, I'd say that isn't really what you mean. I can't see why basic 480 sources like N64 and DC wouldn't work (they work in my 7 year old Onkyo), so that sounds like some weird problem with your current model, not a typical issue.
Viper187
04-07-09, 08:40 AM
I'm liking the Denon 2309 specs right now.
You won't get RF remote easily, get RF remote extenders if it is necessary. Or possibly route IR directly into the receiver. There's really all sorts of control choices if you step up a level.
You want ANY resolution input, you need the DVDO iScan VP50, 'round $2500. Luckily, I'd say that isn't really what you mean. I can't see why basic 480 sources like N64 and DC wouldn't work (they work in my 7 year old Onkyo), so that sounds like some weird problem with your current model, not a typical issue.
Good to know. Thanks
SoSpacey
04-07-09, 09:16 AM
your 2 best bets are either the 2909 or the yamaha rx-v1900
they both do composite/component/svideo conversion to hdmi, have 4 HDMI ins, and a multitude of other inputs.
Compare at Crutchfield (http://www.crutchfield.com/App/Product/CompareTo.aspx?g=10420&s=0&c=4&cc=01&compareItems=022RXV765&compareItems=580TXS806B&compareItems=1583400ES&compareItems=033AV2809C&compareItems=022RXV1900)
You can do much better than those prices.
Viper187
08-30-09, 11:57 AM
I'm looking at the Denon 2310CI right now. What do you guys think of it? and what's really different in comparison to the 2809 or 1910? There seemed to be some mention of different menus with the 1910 but I dunno.
I keep putting this off, but I really hope to have the cash within the next month or two. I might look into speakers later. Kind of pisses me off my current center speaker doesn't have a threaded hole for bolting to mounts like the other 4 do. I'd like to bolt it to the bottom of the shelf my TV sits on.
trespoochies
08-30-09, 06:20 PM
Viper, a few months ago I got the Denon 3808 from Amazon for $989 through 6ave. Like you, I spent months asking for opinions here and some other places, doing demos at stores, etc. I went with the 3808 over the 2809 primarily due to the higher watts per channel and the GUI that the 3808 has, although the 2809 does have one as well, but is a little difficult to use. They improved greatly on the screen menus with the 3808. After reading about Denons, it sounded like it was really difficult to setup if it didn't have some kind of screen menu. The 3808 has now been replaced by the 3310, but for the most part is identical. But I love my new Denon, the thing is a beast - and meets all those reuirements you had mentioned a few posts earlier. In regards to your question, I believe the 2310 replaced the discontinued 2809. They seems to refresh their models every year with minimal to no changes, only the model number.
But I did invest in some good money to get some new speakers (B&W 600 series). I figured this will be the last upgrade for the foreseeable future.
Viper187
09-03-09, 06:02 PM
Why aren't any of the sites I've actually heard of selling the 2310 for under $850? If you google search, there are a few random places selling them for $600!
JimRochester
09-04-09, 12:28 PM
My Pioneer 91 is tremendous. I noticed the better sound over my Yamaha right away.
mattysemo247
09-04-09, 01:32 PM
Can you still get the Pioneer SC-05 from 6ave? If so, pick that bad boy up from the name your price promotion they have going on right now. That is the best $700 I have ever spent.
Spiky
09-04-09, 11:52 PM
Why aren't any of the sites I've actually heard of selling the 2310 for under $850? If you google search, there are a few random places selling them for $600!
Because Denon doesn't allow authorized dealers to sell below MAP. And they have few authorized internet dealers. Sometimes they have zero.
Viper187
09-05-09, 08:40 AM
Because Denon doesn't allow authorized dealers to sell below MAP. And they have few authorized internet dealers. Sometimes they have zero.
So what? It's a question of how bad you want the warranty then? Is it really worth like $250 more?
Spiky
09-05-09, 11:16 AM
You asked a business question, and I answered it factually.
Perhaps your twisted, uncensored view of Denon's sales methodology could be blogged. I doubt it will be noticed by Denon, however.
Viper187
09-05-09, 06:12 PM
Ok, so the 890 and 2310 have essentially all the same features. According to the Denon site, the 890 has been available since July, so why doesn't anyone have them!?!? Amazon doesn't have an ETA on getting them, and half the other "Authorized" dealers don't seem to carry it.
I might sign up for the Prime trial on Amazon, 2-day the damn 2310CI, and be done with it. I have a friend willing to buy my Onkyo TX-SR604 when he comes to town to visit next weekend, so I might as well do this. :)
Spiky
09-05-09, 08:22 PM
When Denon has different product lines, it is to sell them in different stores. So your local giant chain can sell the 890 and the local high-end shop can sell the 2310, and they can be the exact same machine inside (assuming you are correct). And they don't have to compete on the "We match competitor prices!" sales. Also, note the "CI", that stands for Custom Install so the high-end store can brag about it. And Denon is well known for dumping stores that break their rules. So they come and go at particular stores.
My point being that maybe you are looking at stores that would never sell the 890. Maybe Amazon isn't supposed to have both series. Not Amazon itself, although they are a storefront for others.
Viper187
09-06-09, 12:47 PM
Well, I ordered the 2310CI from Amazon. $4 to overnight it with a free trial of Prime. I just hope those A1 assholes aren't handling packages in western PA. I've always gotten UPS/USPS up to this point, so I'm guessing living in a rural area nobody gives a shit about might be to my benefit for once. lol
12thmonkey
11-04-09, 10:08 AM
Anyone here using the Denon AVR-1910?
Feedback and thoughts welcome...
I'm in the market to upgrade from my old Onkyo TS-595 (due to acknowledged issues decoding digital broadcast signals), and my price range is $500-ish.
I'm also eyeballing the Sony ES STR-DA2400ES. A little out of price range, but I could be swayed.
Sonny
11-04-09, 09:30 PM
Best Buy has the Denon 890 for $799.
Spiky
11-04-09, 11:15 PM
You know, that Onkyo has a multichannel input. You could look at the Emotiva UMC-1 preamp, which has just about (finally!!) started shipping. $699.
This will absolutely give the best sound of anything remotely close in price. No amps, obviously, but for anyone with amps already...great sound and a great upgrade path for the future.
12thmonkey
11-05-09, 08:18 AM
Dumb question of the day:
If my speakers are rated at 80w should I steer clear of a 100w per channel receiver?
cpgator
11-05-09, 02:28 PM
Dumb question of the day:
If my speakers are rated at 80w should I steer clear of a 100w per channel receiver?
No.
dick_grayson
11-05-09, 02:56 PM
I'm thinking of getting this.....if/when it's released:
Buy: