Let's continue here.

Last thread:
http://forum.dvdtalk.com/politics-world-events/539886-new-improved-sarah-palin-thread-part-3-a.html

wait a sec...she's not my fav hockey mom...

favorite pit pull?

favorite pit pull?

how about, according to Obama, lipstick wearing pig?

acutally, i think a more appropriate term would be cute cat with sharp claws.

I took the liberty of ghost writing Sarah Palin's talking points for the inevitable hard question coming at her in the V.P. debate.

There have been questions about your readiness for assuming the presidency, particularly regarding your lack of foreign policy experience, how do you respond?

Does any president have enough foreign policy experience? Seems to me that’s why every president has foreign policy advisers. I think what the American people really want are leaders that have the good judgment to surround themselves with talented and experienced people. People that can be trusted to serve up the various solutions and issues so that the president can make informed decisions.

What was Ronald Reagan’s vast experience in foreign policy as governor of California? What the American people really want is leadership. Leaders that don’t dwell on the negatives of past administrations but focus on what can and will be done for a better life for hard working Americans and their families. Americans should demand and expect more from their elected leaders. And that is where Sen. Obama and Sen. Biden come up lacking.

Leaders need to know that foreign policy issues mean little to someone trying to figure out how to scrape up their next mortgage payment or save their small business or farm or wonder how they will pay their increasing credit card debt when they fuel up their cars at the pump. How it means little to a mother and father looking across the kitchen table at their kids, giving them the disappointing news that need to move.

If being most qualified for office were to be judged just on experience, Senator Obama wouldn’t even be in the race. Why didn’t the Democrats choose to nominate Senator Biden or Senator Clinton, if experience was the one key factor? The difference between me and Senator Obama couldn’t be more clear. We both can give can give great speeches but I work for the American people whereas Senator Obama works on his memoirs.

It seems to me that what Americans really want is someone that first does something for the American people and then writes about it, not the other way around.

Through all the tumbles of the last few weeks...............she is still hot!

ctyankee - that's pretty good. If only she had been giving that answer over the last few weeks.

Back to the SCt cases, I'd like to question Joe Biden, former head of the Judiciary Committee, to see how deep his knowledge of case law is. ;)

ctyankee, if she had said something like that instead of that story about her seeing Russia out of her window, then I wouldn't be in this thread today.



What was Ronald Reagan’s vast experience in foreign policy as governor of California? What the American people really want is leadership. Leaders that don’t dwell on the negatives of past administrations but focus on what can and will be done for a better life for hard working Americans and their families. Americans should demand and expect more from their elected leaders. And that is where Sen. Obama and Sen. Biden come up lacking.



On a lighter note...


Of course, Reagan had foreign experience, after all, there is a (former) Russian fort in California. Also, California was stolen acquired after the Mexican-American war. That's two foreign countries right there.

btw, I'm surprised Palin didn't bring up Seward's Folly (so, it's a few years before her time, minor detail), after all she was the governor of Alaska, and this actually involved the US negotiating with Russia about Alaska...oh wait, that's probably too much history for her...

also, there are Indian reservations in Alaska. I'm surprised she didn't bring that up in her foreign policy experience, since Indian reservations have limited national sovereignty.

Through all the tumbles of the last few weeks...............she is still hot!

I don't think any of us would be complaining if she were running to be McCain's personal "secretary".

Do we really need Joe Six-Pack one heartbeat from the Presidency right now?

ctyankee, if she had said something like that instead of that story about her seeing Russia out of her window, then I wouldn't be in this thread today.


How true. How can we hear the crap coming out of her mouth and not assume she's full of it?

Can we start up a new VP debate thread?

"Who am I? Why am I here?"

Can we start up a new VP debate thread?

"Who am I? Why am I here?"

you forgot, "Where am I?"

Someone can start a thread on it if we think there is enough to talk about to keep it on topic

I’d love to have Palin answer a question with ctyankee’s prepared statement. It would be a disaster for the McCain campaign.

McCain’s whole campaign is built around the concept that he has the experience in foreign affairs. That answer is telling the American people that foreign policy experience is not important. Minus one McCain

Then the whole talking points about being concerned about families and making the mortgage isn’t really a territory McCain can comfortably tread into. Who will the American people think really understands the American people, a person who married into wealth, (did even earn it on his own hard work) has seven houses and thirteen cars or the individual who has one house, one car and has earned everything he has by his own hard work? Minus two McCain

One last point, I’m not really certain the wise crack about working for the American people while Obama is working on his memoirs works either. First of all, Palin doesn’t work for the American people she works for the state of Alaska. Obama as a Senator has the better claim of working for the American people because his votes at least have the potential to affect everyone.

I'm surprised she didn't bring up her connection to Abraham Lincoln and the core beginning of the GOP.

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_Mkn6cpsv0k8/SOLjMje9MHI/AAAAAAAAAA8/Ma_LIRSlCtE/s400/ak.png

How true. How can we hear the crap coming out of her mouth and not assume she's full of it?

Yeah you would.

You would have complained regardless of who McCain picked - admit it.

There's nothing wrong with being a partisan. ;)

Classicman2 brought up the Gwen Ifill book deal in the now-closed Part III of the Sarah Pailin threads, so here's another link to the hoopla (or not).

http://www.jossip.com/how-gwen-ifills-book-on-black-politics-got-spun-into-a-pro-obama-tome-20081001/

There is a monetary conflict of interest for Ifill and her role as a moderator for the debate tomorrow, and the future earnings of her upcoming book being released on Inauguration Day next year.

There's not only only a monetary conflict - simply watch Ifill a few Friday nights on PBS. ;)

favorite pit pull?

That sound way too kinky for Palin.

:lol: The debate hasn't even begun and Patman's already coming up with reasons for why it's unfair.

:lol: The debate hasn't even begun and Patman's already coming up with reasons for why it's unfair.

You don't think it's worth mentioning?

Back to the SCt cases, I'd like to question Joe Biden, former head of the Judiciary Committee, to see how deep his knowledge of case law is. ;)

biden did go to law school, so i expect at least a little knowledge of case law.

biden did go to law school, so i expect at least a little knowledge of case law.


Yeah, but how little? ;)

I expect a former head of (and current member) the Judiciary Committee to be extremely knowledgeable on the subject of constitutional law.

You don't think it's worth mentioning?

certainly not in the context he presented - i.e. her having some agenda because of it. it's a book about FOUR different black politicians who have broken many barriers. it's not about Obama - it's about the changes in political culture that have allowed men like Obama to attain the positions they have. If you don't think his nomination is historic then there's not much anyone can say to change your mind.

She's a black political reporter/commentator...she's writing about the rise of black politicians. Unless you subscribe to WorldNetDaily it's a non story.

CBS is apparently airing both Senator Biden's and Governor Palin's responses to the question about Supreme Court cases tonight.

IMO, the non-partisan debate commission should make every effort to select a moderator who is as non-partisan as possible. I don't believe Gwen Iffil meets that test.
I base my opinion only her 'performances' on Friday evenings on PBS.

Michelle Malkin and World Net Daily have made a lot of noise today about the fact the Gwen Ifill, the moderator of Thursday's VP debate, has a new book coming on Inauguration day about Barack Obama and the politics of race -- it's now leading on the front of Drudge.

Fox's Greta Van Susteren reports that the McCain campaign didn't know about it.

"I am stunned….the campaign (actually both) should have been told before the campaign agreed to have her moderate. It simply is not fair -- in law, this would create a mistrial."

But one didn't have to go the lengths of oppo research to find out about a book that was hiding in plain sight on Amazon and the Random house website.

Not to mention, Ifill discussed it with Howard Kurtz last month in the Washington Post, in the only profile she's done before the debate. (And I'd imagine someone in the campaign should have read it).

To the extent she can carve out any spare time, Ifill is working on a book called "Breakthrough: Politics and Race in the Age of Obama." She focuses on the Democratic nominee and such up-and-coming black politicians as Massachusetts Gov. Deval Patrick and Newark Mayor Cory Booker.

"We're very lazy when we think about race in this country," Ifill says. "We try to put it in a box. It's Jesse versus Al, or Jesse and Al versus everyone else," she says, referring to Jackson and Sharpton. "We love simplistic conflict. There's a whole group of people who have Ivy League degrees and immense accomplishments who actually benefited from the things their parents were fighting for."

Regardless, the story's getting major play on cable news, especially Fox.

This morning with Bill Hemmer, Fox analyst Juan Williams spoke admirably of Ifill as a journalist but admitted that "it looks like she has some investment" in the outcome of the election, and that "there's a perception problem." The FoxNews.com headline: "VP Debate Moderator Pens Pro-Obama Book."

I think Malkin and other critics have a right to raise questions about whether Ifill should be moderating, but at the same time, it's not as if the veteran PBS journalist has been keeping the book under wraps until now. It's also a logical question to ask whether an Obama book would sell better or worse depending on the outcome of the election. I don't think I'm going out on a limb to say that if Obama's sworn in on the Jan. 20 pub date, a book with "Obama" in the title will sell more copies.

Legitimate questions, indeed. So why is this coming up less than 36 hours before Palin and Biden hit the stage?

(h/t TVNewser who had this clip of Ifill discussing the book).

UPDATE: A spokesperson for PBS's NewsHour said that Ifill is en route to the debate in St. Louis. When asked whether Ifill might disclose that she's writing this book during the debate, the spokesperson said he had no knowledge that she would, and declined to comment further. I also have a call into the Commission on Presidential Debates, and will update if they have a comment.

UPDATE 2: McCain's first responses.



http://news.yahoo.com/s/politico/20081001/pl_politico/22742

Right right...they didn't know about it. :rolleyes:

certainly not in the context he presented - i.e. her having some agenda because of it. it's a book about FOUR different black politicians who have broken many barriers. it's not about Obama - it's about the changes in political culture that have allowed men like Obama to attain the positions they have. If you don't think his nomination is historic then there's not much anyone can say to change your mind.

She's a black political reporter/commentator...she's writing about the rise of black politicians. Unless you subscribe to WorldNetDaily it's a non story.

The book sells better if it is released on the day where one of the main characters becomes the president than if what I'm guessing will be a major theme of the book, how far African American politicians have come, is undercut by McCain becoming president.

IMO, the non-partisan debate commission should make every effort to select a moderator who is as non-partisan as possible. I don't believe Gwen Iffil meets that test.
I base my opinion only her 'performances' on Friday evenings on PBS.

I find it hard to believe that the McCain camp didn't research this before, considering that Gwen Ifill was the moderator for the 2004 Cheney Edwards debate...

If having an opinion means that one is incapable of being impartial, then we'd only have a handful of judges in this country. You can speculate all you want about potential bias, but until you actually watch the debate and hear the moderating, it is ridiculous to pre-judge. In fact, it would actually be a great dis-service to the Democratic party for Ifill to show bias in her questioning or moderating.

Hardcore Republicans are putting this out there right now so that if and when Palin tanks on Thursday, they have a built in excuse without actually having to defend the substance of Palin's remarks, because they know that's pretty much impossible given her interview with Couric. And if she doesn't totally flub it, they can say, look how amazing she did in spite of overwhelming bias! (Even if the questioning or moderating isn't biased at all.)

Oh, and where was the problem in the 2004 VP debates that she also moderated?

Yeah, but how little? ;)

I expect a former head of (and current member) the Judiciary Committee to be extremely knowledgeable on the subject of constitutional law.

As chairman (for most of the time) of The Judiciary Committee I thought possessed an attribute that is equal, IMO, to being knowledgeable on constitutional law - fairness.

The book sells better if it is released on the day where one of the main characters becomes the president than if what I'm guessing will be a major theme of the book, how far African American politicians have come, is undercut by McCain becoming president.

authors don't choose what date their books are published.

certainly not in the context he presented - i.e. her having some agenda because of it. it's a book about FOUR different black politicians who have broken many barriers. it's not about Obama - it's about the changes in political culture that have allowed men like Obama to attain the positions they have. If you don't think his nomination is historic then there's not much anyone can say to change your mind.

She's a black political reporter/commentator...she's writing about the rise of black politicians. Unless you subscribe to WorldNetDaily it's a non story.
Wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong. wrong.

Well, right, right, wrong, wrong, right, wrong.

Okay, more right than wrong.

Those parts that are right, do not preclude you from sucking, those parts that are wrong are based on your bias, which is an element of you sucking, but can in no way be seen as the majority of the reason you suck.

I find it hard to believe that the McCain camp didn't research this before, considering that Gwen Ifill was the moderator for the 2004 Cheney Edwards debate...

Why would they research it?

Again - if I was running the McCain-Palin campaign I would tell them not to mention it. IMO, it's, politically, the wise thing to do. Wait until after the debate, and then divulge it.

:lol: @ kvrdave

Wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong. wrong.

Well, right, right, wrong, wrong, right, wrong.

Okay, more right than wrong.

Those parts that are right, do not preclude you from sucking, those parts that are wrong are based on your bias, which is an element of you sucking, but can in no way be seen as the majority of the reason you suck.:lol:

I love you so much. :lol:

If having an opinion means that one is incapable of being impartial, then we'd only have a handful of judges in this country. You can speculate all you want about potential bias, but until you actually watch the debate and hear the moderating, it is ridiculous to pre-judge. In fact, it would actually be a great dis-service to the Democratic party for Ifill to show bias in her questioning or moderating.

Hardcore Republicans are putting this out there right now so that if and when Palin tanks on Thursday, they have a built in excuse without actually having to defend the substance of Palin's remarks, because they know that's pretty much impossible given her interview with Couric. And if she doesn't totally flub it, they can say, look how amazing she did in spite of overwhelming bias! (Even if the questioning or moderating isn't biased at all.)

Oh, and where was the problem in the 2004 VP debates that she also moderated?

i agree with you. the McCain camp is probably using it as an excuse. no way they didn't know beforehand, unless they were extremely incompetent. Hell, even in her PBS profile, they state the book:

http://www.pbs.org/weta/washingtonweek/gwen/

The book sells better if it is released on the day where one of the main characters becomes the president than if what I'm guessing will be a major theme of the book, how far African American politicians have come, is undercut by McCain becoming president.
If there's bias on the questioning, I think it'll be fairly obvious. I'm sure our conservative colleagues here will be posting each and every HINT of bias. And if there's clear bias, it actually hurts Obama's campaign. So if there's any economic incentive here, it would be to actually remain impartial.

Plus, I think you all are WAY overestimating the power of the moderator to influence the perceived outcome of the debate. If Palin sounds silly on Thurs, are you seriously going to attribute it to Ifill asking her a question that she will ask Biden as well?

I can predict Biden's view of constitutional case law - stare decisis, stare decisis, stare decisis - but only for the cases/issues that have already been 'correctly' decided. ;)

When Biden was chairman, he generally would send judicial nominations to the full Senate even though they had been defeated in the committee. I think that's a good idea.

Later, however, he changed his mind. ;)

He did not want to be a footnote in the process?

I can predict Biden's view of constitutional case law - stare decisis, stare decisis, stare decisis - but only for the cases/issues that have already been 'correctly' decided. ;)

I thought that was every judge's opinion on constitutional law. :hscratch:

umm...isn't this a Palin thread, not a Biden one?

umm...isn't this a Palin thread, not a Biden one?Sen Biden's thread, much like the man himself, is not gathering a lot of interest. :shrug:

Sen Biden's thread, much like the man himself, is not gathering a lot of interest. :shrug:

true, but see, those few posts above can be added to the Biden thread, perhaps doubling the number of posts there. :lol:

Sarah Barracuda

http://img524.imageshack.us/img524/8254/ajpegwl9.jpg

nice creek

that creek is brown

authors don't choose what date their books are published.

Yes they do. They set out to write a book by a deadline so that it can be published on a specific date. It's a GREAT time to write a book on the subject and releasing it on election day would make it very relevant.

Even if you want to argue that she didn't pick the release date she knew about it and shouldn't be moderating one of the debates. The release date isn't even the most important part, the book itself is. She should have sat this one out.

Plus, I think you all are WAY overestimating the power of the moderator to influence the perceived outcome of the debate. If Palin sounds silly on Thurs, are you seriously going to attribute it to Ifill asking her a question that she will ask Biden as well?

I won't attribute it to her but some people will. With the McCain camp's constant attack on the evil liberal media's coverage of the race why would you even give them the slightest bit of ammo? I think the Obama camp should have asked for a new moderator. It would have looked good.

:lol:

I love you so much. :lol:

:mad: Hands off!

Yes they do. They set out to write a book by a deadline so that it can be published on a specific date. It's a GREAT time to write a book on the subject and releasing it on election day would make it very relevant.

Even if you want to argue that she didn't pick the release date she knew about it and shouldn't be moderating one of the debates. The release date isn't even the most important part, the book itself is. She should have sat this one out.

Um, authors don't pick release dates. Publishers do.

Um, authors don't pick release dates. Publishers do.

There are so many different ways release dates can be decided why go into it? Ifill could have gone to the publisher and said, "This is the book I'd like to write, this is when I can have it in, could it be released by election day?" or 50 different scenarios.

Whether she set out to write it in time for election day, the publisher asked her to have it in time for election day, the publisher is holding back on the release until election day, or some combination of the three doesn't really matter.

I think the book does matter, but no one cared to look into Ifill's work so any outrage from the McCain campaign would be ridiculous.

That said, moderators do have the ability to influence elections and you can ask Dukakis if you think otherwise. So it'd be best to have her removed to remove any doubt or perceived taint.

Since having a partisan dem like Ifill as a moderator won't influence the debate much, I think we should have Hannity moderate the last debate.

Glad to see that the McCain camp already has an excuse lined up in case Palin blows the debate. :lol:

Glad to see that the McCain camp already has an excuse lined up in case Palin blows the debate. :lol:

It's not the best excuse but :shrug: they'll take what they can get.

If I were Palin, no matter what question was asked, I'd start my answer indicating that the reason that this country is having problems is conflict of interest. There were conflicts of interests caused by Fannie Mae and Freedie Mac that donated money to politicians that were supposed to regulate it. There are conflicts of interests with lobbyists and congressmen. I'd say something to the effect that conflict of interests are poisoning the atmosphere in Wash and the rest of the country.


Glad to see that the McCain camp already has an excuse lined up in case Palin blows the debate.

What Would Messiah Do if the moderator was writing a book about McCain?

What Would Messiah Do if the moderator was writing a book about McCain?

I imagine he would answer the questions asked of him.

If I were Palin, no matter what question was asked, I'd start my answer indicating that the reason that this country is having problems is conflict of interest. There were conflicts of interests caused by Fannie Mae and Freedie Mac that donated money to politicians that were supposed to regulate it. There are conflicts of interests with lobbyists and congressmen. I'd say something to the effect that conflict of interests are poisoning the atmosphere in Wash and the rest of the country.I'm sure McCain would just LOVE her bringing up his own campaigns connections to Fannie Mae and lobbyists.

Since having a partisan dem like Ifill as a moderator won't influence the debate much, I think we should have Hannity moderate the last debate.What's this? bhk is calling his favorite wahhmbulance? You're going to suggest that Ifill is as biased to the left as Hannity is to the right? I'm actually surprised we haven't had a lot of outcries of "bias!" during the Couric interviews.

This bias crap is getting old. Anything that makes a Republican politician look or sound bad is automatically tagged as "bias". It seems that it's impossible that they actually ARE that bad. It's annoying because I think the media actually holds back because of fears of accusation of bias. Call a spade a spade. Palin's a willfully ignorant average Joe from Alaska who's so friggin not qualified to be VP. Even the conservative commentators are harsher on her than the so-called "liberal media". It's so irritating that there are still so many Republicans who are willing to look past her MAJOR flaws just because they want to "win". Any person who truly gave a rat's ass about the well-being of this country wouldn't want to allow this woman ANYWHERE near the White House, much less in it.

Hey bhk, instead of blaming it on "bias", why don't you blame McCain for the 'brilliant' move of picking someone for her looks and completely ignoring substance?

What's this? bhk is calling his favorite wahhmbulance? You're going to suggest that Ifill is as biased to the left as Hannity is to the right?
I suspect that she is. But it won't matter. People are seeing through the biased media and the old media are losing eyes very fast.

Anything that makes a Republican politician look or sound bad is automatically tagged as "bias". It seems that it's impossible that they actually ARE that bad. It's annoying because I think the media actually holds back because of fears of accusation of bias.
It isn't a matter of making someone look bad, it is asking puff ball questions to liberals and asking "when have you stopped beating your wife" type questions to conservatives. Liberals that actually work in the media have admitted that they are liberally biased.
Call a spade a spade.
Is this some sort of code word?

Hey bhk, instead of blaming it on "bias", why don't you blame McCain for the 'brilliant' move of picking someone for her looks and completely ignoring substance?

I blame McCain for many things but this pick was good. There are many more people that are going to vote for him because of this pick. The ones that are carping, were never going to vote for him anyways.

I'm sure McCain would just LOVE her bringing up his own campaigns connections to Fannie Mae and lobbyists.

:lol:

I enjoy ardent devotees....

http://www.opensecrets.org/news/2008/07/top-senate-recipients-of-fanni.html


1. Dodd, Christopher J
S
D-CT
$133,900

2. Kerry, John
S
D-MA
$111,000

3. Obama, Barack
S
D-IL
$105,849

4. Clinton, Hillary
S
D-NY
$75,550

5. Kanjorski, Paul E
H
D-PA
$65,500

6. Bennett, Robert F
S
R-UT
$61,499

7. Johnson, Tim
S
D-SD
$61,000

8. Conrad, Kent
S
D-ND
$58,991

9. Davis, Tom
H
R-VA
$55,499

10. Bond, Christopher S 'Kit'
S
R-MO
$55,400

11. Bachus, Spencer
H
R-AL
$55,300

12. Shelby, Richard C
S
R-AL
$55,000

13. Emanuel, Rahm
H
D-IL
$51,750

14. Reed, Jack
S
D-RI
$50,750

15. Carper, Tom
S
D-DE
$44,389

16. Frank, Barney
H
D-MA
$40,100

17. Maloney, Carolyn B
H
D-NY
$38,750

18. Bean, Melissa
H
D-IL
$37,249

19. Blunt, Roy
H
R-MO
$36,500

20. Pryce, Deborah
H
R-OH
$34,750

21. Miller, Gary
H
R-CA
$33,000

22. Pelosi, Nancy
H
D-CA
$32,750

23. Reynolds, Tom
H
R-NY
$32,700

24. Hoyer, Steny H
H
D-MD
$30,500

25. Hooley, Darlene
H
D-OR
$28,750



[Chief Wiggum] Ha ha... where's your Messiah now...[/chief wiggum]

Since having a partisan dem like Ifill as a moderator won't influence the debate much, I think we should have Hannity moderate the last debate.
yes...because they are the same :lol:

yes...because they are the same :lol:

You're right, they aren't the same, Hannity isn't going to have a book published on inauguration day that implies that the swearing in of McCain is going to usher in a new political age.

Since having a partisan dem like Ifill as a moderator won't influence the debate much, I think we should have Hannity moderate the last debate.<b>bhk</b>, I'd like to point something out to you. In <a href = "http://forum.dvdtalk.com/politics-world-events/449269-media-bias-real-finds-ucla-political-scientist-2.html">the original media bias thread</a>, a thread you posted in frequently, the original article that claimed a left-wing media bias pointed one one newscast as being the most balanced and middle of the road. That newscast was <i>The Newshour with Jim Lehrer</i>. Gwen Ifill is one of the main correspondents on that broadcast. So, I would like for you to either recant your support of the idea that that cited study had validity, or I'd like for you to recant your contention that Ifill is "a partisan dem". You simply can't have it both ways and have any pretension of credibility.

I blame McCain for many things but this pick was good. There are many more people that are going to vote for him because of this pick. The ones that are carping, were never going to vote for him anyways.

:lol:

http://www.usatoday.com/news/politics/election2008/2008-08-30-palin-poll_N.htm


Based on what you know, do you think he/she is qualified to serve as president if it becomes necessary?

Yes, qualified No, not No opinion

Sarah Palin 39 33 29

Joe Biden 57 18 26

<b>bhk</b>, I'd like to point something out to you. In <a href = "http://forum.dvdtalk.com/politics-world-events/449269-media-bias-real-finds-ucla-political-scientist-2.html">the original media bias thread</a>, a thread you posted in frequently, the original article that claimed a left-wing media bias pointed one one newscast as being the most balanced and middle of the road. That newscast was <i>The Newshour with Jim Lehrer</i>. Gwen Ifill is one of the main correspondents on that broadcast. So, I would like for you to either recant your support of the idea that that cited study had validity, or I'd like for you to recant your contention that Ifill is "a partisan dem". You simply can't have it both ways and have any pretension of credibility.

Absolutely nothing doing. Ifill can be a partisan dem and the Newshour can be more balanced that MSDNC TV. Even though let's say ABC is better than NBC, it still was called All Bout Clinton in the '90s.

I think Palin is gaining support in Illinois, since saloon owners are starting to put up portraits of her.

:lol:

http://www.usatoday.com/news/politics/election2008/2008-08-30-palin-poll_N.htm


Based on what you know, do you think he/she is qualified to serve as president if it becomes necessary?

Yes, qualified No, not No opinion

Sarah Palin 39 33 29

Joe Biden 57 18 26

So more people than not feel she's qualified.

Absolutely nothing doing. Ifill can be a partisan dem and the Newshour can be more balanced that MSDNC TV. Even though let's say ABC is better than NBC, it still was called All Bout Clinton in the '90s.It's not just that Newshour is more balanced than MSNBC, it's also more balanced than Fox.

I thought that was every judge's opinion on constitutional law. :hscratch:

Since when?

Absolutely nothing doing. Ifill can be a partisan dem and the Newshour can be more balanced that MSDNC TV. Even though let's say ABC is better than NBC, it still was called All Bout Clinton in the '90s.

LOL, yeah the channel that was the first to interview Monica Lewinsky was the All 'Bout Clinton channel.

:lol:

I enjoy ardent devotees....

http://www.opensecrets.org/news/2008/07/top-senate-recipients-of-fanni.html

[Chief Wiggum] Ha ha... where's your Messiah now...[/chief wiggum]First of all, he's only the Messiah to you. I don't even like the guy all that much or think he'll be a very good president so you can can the "ardent devotee" nonsense.

Secondly you listed 25 names, only one of which is on the Democratic ticket. It's not a big secret that Obama was taking money from them. It's also not a big secret that McCain's campaign guys were spreading that money around.

But McCain's own campaign staffers are those special interests, a fact that casts doubt on both McCain's hiring judgment and his ability to pursue tough reforms of Fannie and Freddie.

Aquiles Suarez, listed as an economic adviser to the McCain campaign in a July 2007 McCain press release, was formerly the director of government and industry relations for Fannie Mae. The Senate Lobbying Database says Suarez oversaw the lending giant's $47,510,000 lobbying campaign from 2003 to 2006.

And other current McCain campaign staffers were the lobbyists receiving shares of that money. According to the Senate Lobbying Database, the lobbying firm of Charlie Black, one of McCain's top aides, made at least $820,000 working for Freddie Mac from 1999 to 2004. The McCain campaign's vice-chair Wayne Berman and its congressional liaison John Green made $1.14 million working on behalf of Fannie Mae for lobbying firm Ogilvy Government Relations. Green made an additional $180,000 from Freddie Mac. Arther B. Culvahouse Jr., the VP vetter who helped John McCain select Sarah Palin, earned $80,000 from Fannie Mae in 2003 and 2004, while working for lobbying and law firm O'Melveny & Myers LLP. In addition, Politico reports that at least 20 McCain fundraisers have lobbied for Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, pocketing at least $12.3 million over the last nine years.

For years McCain campaign manager Rick Davis was head of the Homeownership Alliance, a lobbying association that included Fannie Mae, Freddie Mac, real estate agents, homebuilders, and non-profits. According to Politico, the organization opposed congressional attempts at regulation of Fannie and Freddie, along the lines of what John McCain is currently proposing. In his capacity of president of the group, Davis went on record in 2003 and insisted that no further reform of the lenders was necessary, in contradiction to his current boss's sentiments. "[Fannie and Freddie] are subject to an innovative and stringent risk-based capital stress test," Davis wrote. "The toughest in the financial services industry."I just love ardent devotees. Oh wait, you don't like McCain at all and I used to be the ardent McCain devotee.

Why can't you just accept that for all McCain's talk of reform and integrity he's no different than anybody else in politics. In my opinion he wasn't always like this, but his willingness to sell out everything he believed in is why I can't vote for him.

It's not just that Newshour is more balanced than MSNBC, it's also more balanced than Fox.

I love FoxNews. They seem to be one of the few networks(esp. Megan Kelly) who actually produced the questionaire in which the Messiah in His own writing indicated that He was for banning handguns and told off one of the head priests of the church of The One complaining about the NRA ad.

<b>bhk</b>, I'd like to point something out to you. In <a href = "http://forum.dvdtalk.com/politics-world-events/449269-media-bias-real-finds-ucla-political-scientist-2.html">the original media bias thread</a>, a thread you posted in frequently, the original article that claimed a left-wing media bias pointed one one newscast as being the most balanced and middle of the road. That newscast was <i>The Newshour with Jim Lehrer</i>. Gwen Ifill is one of the main correspondents on that broadcast. So, I would like for you to either recant your support of the idea that that cited study had validity, or I'd like for you to recant your contention that Ifill is "a partisan dem". You simply can't have it both ways and have any pretension of credibility.Since when has he cared about pretensions of credibility?

I love FoxNews. They seem to be one of the few networks(esp. Megan Kelly) who actually produced the questionaire in which the Messiah in His own writing indicated that He was for banning handguns and told off one of the head priests of the church of The One complaining about the NRA ad.
Megyn Kelly?! She's a harpie-in-training. She's going to be the next Ann Coulter. Hmm, I can see why you like her.

Megyn Kelly?! She's a harpie-in-training. She's going to be the next Ann Coulter. Hmm, I can see why you like her.

Yeah she tells the truth about liberals. Oh and Megyn is quite pretty. If you want to see a harpie, look at Hillary Clinton or Helen Thomas.

First of all, he's only the Messiah to you.
Really, you should let Donna Brazile know that she should stop using the "Jesus was a community organizer..." bit. And that video of those kids singing to Obama Our Dear Leader was creepy.


I don't even like the guy all that much or think he'll be a very good president so you can can the "ardent devotee" nonsense.

It's hard to tell on the internet, so my apologies.

I just love ardent devotees. Oh wait, you don't like McCain at all and I used to be the ardent McCain devotee.

I'm guessing the love stopped when he stopped being a thorn in the side of Bush and the rest of the repubs. Just like the media love stopped then as well.

Why can't you just accept that for all McCain's talk of reform and integrity he's no different than anybody else in politics. In my opinion he wasn't always like this, but his willingness to sell out everything he believed in is why I can't vote for him.

It doesn't matter to me who anyone votes for. But I know he's a politician just like the other guy regardless of what the preists of The One's church tell you. And the One is a socialist sock puppet.

I don't know whether Iffil is a partisan Democrat, but I most cetaainly do believe she's somewhat supportive of Obama.

Unsurprisingly, you didn't bother to address all the Fannie Mae influence within McCain's campaign.

Secondly you listed 25 names, only one of which is on the Democratic ticket. It's not a big secret that Obama was taking money from them. It's also not a big secret that McCain's campaign guys were spreading that money around.
So you were a big admirer of McCain but a Mother Jones blog post is enough for you to conclude, "They're all the same"?


McCain has long fought to shrink the size of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, and earlier this month, a longtime critic of Fannie and Freddie told the Wall Street Journal of the housing giants’ unsuccessful efforts to win McCain over.

“There were quite a few lobbyists retained by Fannie and Freddie who tried to influence Sen. McCain, but they never were able to get their ‘hooks’ into him,” said Anne Canfield, who heads a lending trade group, the Consumer Mortgage Coalition, that has called for greater regulation of the government-backed entities.

http://blogs.wsj.com/washwire/2008/09/24/anyone-not-tied-to-fannie-or-freddie-please-stand-up/

:shrug:

Really, you should let Donna Brazile know that she should stop using the "Jesus was a community organizer..." bit.
Yeah, because saying two people once had the same job is exactly the same as saying they're the same person.

I'm starting to believe that it's an act with you, bhk. I have to wonder whether you're really a liberal posing as a conservative in an effort to make conservatives look over-the-top and ridiculous. Any chance that's the case, or is this for real?

Not sure what yall are talking about but it doesn't seem to be about Palin. You can take the conversation to one of the other threads

Good point. See you all in the Iraq thread!

Not sure what yall are talking about but it doesn't seem to be about Palin. You can take the conversation to one of the other threads

it's been going on for a while:

http://forum.dvdtalk.com/8976377-post47.html

ok, back on topic:



Palin: cause of global warming 'doesn't matter'

21 minutes ago

WASHINGTON (AFP) - Republican vice presidential nominee Sarah Palin said Tuesday that global warming is "real," but stressed that it "kind of doesn't matter" whether or not humans are to blame for climate change.

Human activity has "contributed to the issues that we're dealing with now with these impacts" on the earth's climate, Palin, who is Republican standardbearer John McCain's running mate, said in an interview aired Tuesday with CBS News' Katie Couric.

"I'm not going to solely blame all of man's activities on changes in climate because the world's weather patterns are cyclical, and over history we have seen changes there.

"But it kind of doesn't matter at this point in the debate what caused it. The point is it's real, we need do something about it."

Palin, who is governor of the vast and remote northern state of Alaska, said communities in her state "feel the impacts more than any other state up there with the changes in the climate and certainly it is apparent."

The 44-year-old mother of five was little known nationally until she burst onto the political scene when Republican presidential candidate John McCain chose her as his shock running in late August.

In interviews prior to McCain tapping her to be on the ticket, Palin has said she does not believe global warming is a man-made problem, putting her at odds with McCain.

Her state is one of the country's largest energy producers and she supports opening a protected Alaskan wildlife refuge to oil drilling -- a position pilloried by environmentalists and some Democratic leaders.

As Alaska governor she has also filed a lawsuit seeking to overturn the current administration's decision to list the polar bear as threatened under the Endangered Species Act.

Climate change has been a contentious issue in US politics since President George W. Bush took office nearly eight years ago. Bush remains the only leader of a major industrialized nation to have refused to ratify the Kyoto Protocol, the most far-reaching international treaty on climate change.

A devout Christian who is fiercely anti-abortion and a paid-up member of the National Rifle Association, Palin electrified McCain's campaign after being plucked from the obscurity of the far north.

But in the past week she has faced widespread ridicule for the few interviews she has given, including a previous sit-down with Couric in which Palin cited Alaska's proximity to Canada and Russia as giving her a solid grounding in foreign policy.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20081001/pl_afp/usvoterepublicanspalinclimate_081001204959

Not to channel Rachel Maddow, but if we don't know what caused it, how can we stop it?

Not to channel Rachel Maddow, but if we don't know what caused it, how can we stop it?

exactly. because global warming is an on-going issue, you must find out the cause (or in this case causes), and then analyze them, in order to find ways to reduce the cause. you can't fix global warming without knowing the cause...unless you're going to take a blind stab in the dark and hope that the solution you pick works.

btw, if she, as a politician running for the office of vice president of the United States, doesn't have a clue about the cause of global warming, then perhaps she should Google it, at the very least, or ask one of those advisors that she has.

btw, if she, as a politician running for the office of vice president of the United States, doesn't have a clue about the cause of global warming, then perhaps she should Google it.Her email address is public knowledge; maybe some one could send her a link to <b>movielib</b>'s thread. ;)

Her email address is public knowledge; maybe some one could send her a link to <b>movielib</b>'s thread. ;)

:lol: no offense, but someone aspiring for such a high office should at least have some clue on this stuff, as Cafferty(sp?) said in that popular CNN bit.

I'm basically with movielib on global warming.

There's only one other issue I can think of where I'm with movielib - well, almost with him. ;)

See, what pisses me off to no end is that the same idiots who talked about how the US would burn in ruins if Kerry was president, that the Democrats should not take majority control in Congress, and other asinine comments are now saying without hesitation that Palin was a great pick.

And pointing to Reagan and Clinton's gubernatorial foreign policy experience as equivalence is such a "pre-9/11 mindset™."

9/11 changed a bunch of things. It, however, didn't change everything - politics for one.

Basic foreign policy for another

another good topic, though it has been discussed somewhat before:




Keeping Palin sequestered
Kenneth P. Vogel Wed Oct 1, 5:10 AM ET

According to her handlers, Sarah Palin’s schedule is light on media interviews and fundraisers because she’s so popular with the Republican base that her time is better spent on the campaign trail.

But she hasn’t been hitting the hustings much, either, and her relatively sparse campaign schedule underscores the McCain campaign’s struggle to develop a strategy for effectively deploying its vice presidential candidate.

Large chunks of time in Palin’s public schedules have gone mostly unaccounted for since John McCain selected her to be his running mate late last month.

Since then, Palin, the governor of Alaska, has held a grand total of 17 events that were open to the general public, and many of those were joint appearances in which she stumped at McCain’s side. In fact, she’s only done five rallies by herself.

That’s well off the average pace for a modern vice presidential candidate, and Palin’s public schedule shows no signs of becoming more vigorous anytime soon.

After a Monday afternoon joint rally with McCain in Columbus, Ohio, she retreated to the Arizona senator’s Sedona, Ariz., ranch for a couple days of preparation before her Thursday debate with Joe Biden, the Democratic vice presidential candidate.

By contrast, Biden, a Delaware senator, has held more than 40 events open to the general public, and only eight of them have been with his running mate, Illinois Sen. Barack Obama. It must be noted that Biden has been a vice presidential candidate for one week longer than Palin has.

Still, the McCain campaign downplayed the idea that Palin is carrying a light campaign trail schedule.

“We’re being smart about where she goes, because her time is so valuable and so many people are interested in seeing her,” said a Palin aide who did not want to be identified discussing campaign strategy. The aide pointed out that in the past week — during which Palin held only one public event — Palin kept busy in New York, meeting with the leaders of seven countries and receiving her first national security briefing.

The aide called accommodating demands for Palin a “good challenge” and said “the overwhelming enthusiasm and excitement for Gov. Palin on the trail is clear by the sheer numbers of people coming out to see her.”

When Palin has attended rallies by herself or with McCain, they have drawn larger and more energetic crowds than have McCain-only events.

At Palin’s last solo rally — Sept. 21 at an Orlando, Fla.-area retirement community called The Villages — she drew the largest crowd of any single Republican event this cycle.

“Palin wows Villages,” story read the front page of the next day’s Orlando Sentinel, which featured a positive, nearly 1,000-word story about the rallies and included photographs of Palin and the massive crowd, which estimates placed between 23,000 and a harder-to-believe 60,000.

That’s valuable press, particularly considering the drubbings Palin’s taken after most of her handful of national media appearances.

Palin has sprinkled her schedule with smaller, invitation-only events, including a debate-watching party last week at a Philadelphia Irish pub and a Sunday breakfast with Blue Star Moms.

[B]But the McCain campaign could maximize Palin’s effect by unleashing her to do “rallies and town halls on her own in battleground states where she can make a difference,” said Brad Blakeman, a Republican strategist who ran advance operations for George W. Bush’s 2000 presidential campaign and went on to work in the Bush White House.

“Her best venue is probably speaking to large crowds. She gives a great campaign stump speech,” he said. “Her second-best venue is probably town halls, where she’s closer to the people. And then her national media exposure is probably her weakest point.”

“I’d also make her accessible to the local media,” he added. “Put a reporter in her car for 10 minutes, go on the local morning shows in these venues. They’re not out to get you. They’re so flattered that you’d even ask to do it.”[/n]

The Obama campaign has liberally deployed Biden to garner local press, but he’s presented strategy challenges, too.

Biden’s events have seldom attracted more than a few thousand folks each, and his speeches and interviews seem to garner the most national attention when they include one of his trademark gaffes.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/politico/20081001/pl_politico/14136_1

what happened to Groucho's post?

You know...I was thinking about why this Palin thing has gotten SO much press and has become such a big deal this election when the VP has never been much of a factor - outside of *maybe* Dan Quayle for similar reasons - and I realized it's Bush's fault in a way. Dick Cheney and his prominence the last 8 years has made the VP position tremendously more public than it has ever been. He is the guy that has been at the forefront of so much to do with the "war on terror" and I think that has a LOT to do with why the VP pick has become more important for people. Had Bush/Cheney not done so much to try and increase the prominence and powers of the position, this probably wouldn't be nearly as big a deal.

Discuss....

what happened to Groucho's post?It was easier to delete it than to concede that I'm an idiot.

I blame McCain for many things but this pick was good. There are many more people that are going to vote for him because of this pick. The ones that are carping, were never going to vote for him anyways.http://lotpro.com/blogphotos/Misc%20Article%20Images/tn_Nile%20River.jpg
Denial is not a river in Egypt.

I've shown the YouTube clips of the Couric interview to a couple of work colleagues, two of whom are (were) staunch Republicans. kvrdave can vouch for the fact that I work in a very conservative area of Oregon. One has now promised to vote Obama. The other one will now not vote. Not everyone's as willing to forgive ignorance as you, bhk. ;)

9/11 changed a bunch of things. It, however, didn't change everything - politics for one.

Basic foreign policy for another

What do you consider "basic" foreign policy? And regardless of whether politics is unchanged or not, does that supercede national security/interest now?

D.pham, that was something I was going to talk about and I'm glad you brought it up; the people I brought up in my post are also saying that these interviews show she's not knowledgeable but that she should go on Rush Limbaugh to keep her from bad situations. It's honestly mind-boggling.

You know...I was thinking about why this Palin thing has gotten SO much press and has become such a big deal this election when the VP has never been much of a factor - outside of *maybe* Dan Quayle for similar reasons - and I realized it's Bush's fault in a way. Dick Cheney and his prominence the last 8 years has made the VP position tremendously more public than it has ever been. He is the guy that has been at the forefront of so much to do with the "war on terror" and I think that has a LOT to do with why the VP pick has become more important for people. Had Bush/Cheney not done so much to try and increase the prominence and powers of the position, this probably wouldn't be nearly as big a deal.

Discuss....Well, I think Palin was a big deal from day one because she was clearly picked for newsworthiness - being a relatively young semi-attractive woman who less than 0.1% of population knew anything about. So in that sense, it kind of worked in that the news media temporarily forgot all about Obama and turned the spotlight on her (and thus, by proxy, McCain). However, now that same media attention is biting them in the ass because she has enormous deficits as a politician, so supporters like bhk cry "bias!" because that's all they have left to say. You reap what you sow.

Thius is such a goofy story I just had to post it here:

You CAN see Russia from here!

Posted: 10:04 AM ET
Permalink | 194 Comments

Program Note: Governor Sarah Palin said you can actually see Russia from an island in Alaska. Our Gary Tuchman went to find this island… Watch his full report tonight on AC360.

Gary Tuchman | BIO
AC360 Correspondent

When talking about what she says is her foreign policy experience, Sarah Palin told ABC news “…you can actually see Russia from land here in Alaska, from an island in Alaska.”
That quote made us want to go to that island.

So we did.

The island is called Little Diomede. It looks like a rock plopped into the Bering Strait. Only about 150 Alaskans live on the whole island. And just about two miles away; in full view of every single house on the island is the nation of Russia. Specifically, it is the Russian Island of Big Diomede which sits about 25 miles from the Russian Siberian mainland (which you can also see from the American island.) Most everybody on Little Diomede had relatives who lived on Big Diomede.

But decades ago, the Russian government sent them all to the mainland, and today, Big Diomede is limited to a Russian military presence. It’s also a full day in front of Little Diomede because it’s on the other side of the International Date Line. Little Diomede is fascinating. It looks like the moon would if you built a lunar settlement. It’s full of rocks, dirt, and craters. We were curious if Sarah Palin has ever visited this island. According to the natives, the answer is no.

As a matter of fact, no Alaska governor in the state’s nearly 50 year history has ever visited the remote outpost that still has little running water. We were curious what the Little Diomeders thought about Palin’s claim of foreign policy experience because of the proximity of Siberia. Interestingly, many of these Alaskans had no idea who Sarah Palin was! It turns out they have no TV on the island, and therefore, many don’t follow the news.

The island’s mayor has heard of her though. No American mayor resides in a city closer to Russia than Andrew Milligrock, and he says being two miles from Russia doesn’t give him any foreign policy expertise.

He does say she seems like an okay governor, but exclaims she should probably pay a visit to Little Diomede sometime. It may not help her foreign policy experience says the mayor, but would definitely help her domestic policy experience. We hope you’ll watch our story about this most unique American island tonight on AC360.

http://ac360.blogs.cnn.com/2008/09/30/you-can-see-russia-from-here/

I can't believe CNN flew a correspondent out to Little Diomede. What a waste of time!

http://i2.cdn.turner.com/cnn/2008/images/09/30/art.littlediomedealaska.jpg

You know...I was thinking about why this Palin thing has gotten SO much press and has become such a big deal this election when the VP has never been much of a factor - outside of *maybe* Dan Quayle for similar reasons - and I realized it's Bush's fault in a way. Dick Cheney and his prominence the last 8 years has made the VP position tremendously more public than it has ever been. He is the guy that has been at the forefront of so much to do with the "war on terror" and I think that has a LOT to do with why the VP pick has become more important for people. Had Bush/Cheney not done so much to try and increase the prominence and powers of the position, this probably wouldn't be nearly as big a deal.

And the same liberals who screamed bloody murder as Cheney acquired ever more power and influence are now asserting with a straight face that the McCain nominated Palin for "the second most powerful job on the planet."

I <3 partisans.

It was easier to delete it than to concede that I'm an idiot.
I'll concede that with very little trouble. :shrug:

And the same liberals who screamed bloody murder as Cheney acquired ever more power and influence are now asserting with a straight face that the McCain nominated Palin for "the second most powerful job on the planet."

I <3 partisans.huh?

huh?
It was bad that Cheney grabbed so much power -- now let's pretend the Vice Presidency has always been a serious responsibility!

It was bad that Cheney grabbed so much power -- now let's pretend the Vice Presidency has always been a serious responsibility!I don't think brizz suggested that. The position of VP has always been fairly nominal with regards to legal power. Cheney was different because of his long history in Washington and thus, he held influential power that didn't really come with his job as VP. Thus, from that aspect I don't necessarily agree with brizz's theory. I think more attention is being paid to Palin (as I said above) because A) she's newsworthy (for all sorts of reasons) and B) because there's a decent chance she could be president.

I was more or less agreeing with brizz.

It was bad that Cheney grabbed so much power -- now let's pretend the Vice Presidency has always been a serious responsibility!

For me, that's a false dichotomy; Cheney made a power grab that made him more powerful than the President, not that he was more powerful than other vice-presidents. In what you had said, I don't think Palin is going to be delegated or assume the same power that Cheney had but it's terrible that she could be the President.

I don't think brizz suggested that. The position of VP has always been fairly nominal with regards to legal power. Cheney was different because of his long history in Washington and thus, he held influential power that didn't really come with his job as VP. Thus, from that aspect I don't necessarily agree with brizz's theory. I think more attention is being paid to Palin (as I said above) because A) she's newsworthy (for all sorts of reasons) and B) because there's a decent chance she could be president.

I think mentioning Cheney without Rumsfeld is like mentioning Batman with no Robin.

You can look to the Ford administration to learn the history there. They are indeed a dynamic duo.

It was easier to delete it than to concede that I'm an idiot.

and i thought for a second that you were being funny Groucho. :sad:

Thius is such a goofy story I just had to post it here:



http://ac360.blogs.cnn.com/2008/09/30/you-can-see-russia-from-here/

I can't believe CNN flew a correspondent out to Little Diomede. What a waste of time!

http://i2.cdn.turner.com/cnn/2008/images/09/30/art.littlediomedealaska.jpg

:lol: they probably gave that assignment to the bottom of the barrel reporter.

that is pretty ridiculous.

Olbermann just mentioned this and I thought it was awesome: Exxon v. Baker reduced the payment that Exxon was ordered to after the Valdez spill in Alaska. Governor Palin told some paper in Alaska that she disagree with the ruling.

Even if you want to argue that she has no frame of reference about foreign policy, she should have known that one since she has said Energy is what she brings to the table.

<embed src="http://www.cbs.com/thunder/swf/rcpHolderCbs-prod.swf" width="370" height="361"allowFullScreen="true" FlashVars="link=http://www.cbsnews.com/video/watch/?id=4493093n&releaseURL=http://release.theplatform.com/content.select?pid=kmbZJiBysEZaxIgmdRiNHdo6IMUVVQB6&partner=newsembed&autoPlayVid=false&prevImg=http://thumbnails.cbsig.net/CBS_Production_News/835/219/eve_roevwade_100108_480x360.jpg" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" pluginspage="http://www.macromedia.com/go/getflashplayer" />

So there's a federal right to privacy, but it should be up to the individual states whether that right is enforced?

And considering that Governor Palin made public statements criticizing the ruling in Exxon v. Baker barely three months ago, I'm really surprised that she floundered so badly on the follow-up question.

5H-26MOxH34

Jesus Christ!

All she had to do was cite the recent case of Kelo and she would have satisfied most of the damn country. Deer, meet headlights.

Has any other President or VP candidate had a nude portrait painted of them?


Bruce Elliott has painted a nude portrait of Republican vice presidential nominee Sarah Palin and hung it above the Old Town Ale House, where it's now a prime attraction among his display of more than 200 celebrity portraits and other racy art.

Elliott's wife, Tobin Mitchen, owns the bar on Chicago's North Side,

Palin became Elliott's muse after he saw her on TV.

"I've been following her religiously," he said Monday at the bar. "I had never heard of her before, like everyone else. I find her bizarrely fascinating, even though I pretty much despise everything she stands for."

Despite their political differences, Elliott admits to a bit of a crush on the Alaska governor. He began painting her smile and trademark glasses, he said, before filling in the details: a gun, red high heels, polar bear rug, rugged Alaska landscape and a scared moose. His daughter, who looks a little like Palin and does a great impression of her, served as model for the governor's body.

Since Elliott, 68, hung the portrait Thursday, it's been a steady draw at the dive bar, which is a popular spot for Second City comedians to grab beers and play pinball after shows. But after the image hit the Internet on Monday, interest exploded.

"We got a bunch of people in tonight," Elliott said. "They're coming to take pictures with their camera phones. The photo is all over the place."


Mildly NSFW:

http://www.chicagotribune.com/media/photo/2008-09/42663731.jpg

" His daughter, who looks a little like Palin and does a great impression of her, served as model for the governor's body."

Wow, that's creepy.

And the same liberals who screamed bloody murder as Cheney acquired ever more power and influence are now asserting with a straight face that the McCain nominated Palin for "the second most powerful job on the planet."

Since you put quotes around that, I presume someone actually said it? Nobody with a brain thinks VP is the second most powerful job on the planet. It's probably not in the top 100.

The individual does, however, very much have the potential to, and responsibility to be prepared for, taking over that #1 slot, however.

Originally Posted by Sam Harris (http://www.newsweek.com/id/160080/output/print)
The point is that she comes to us, seeking the second most important job in the world

" His daughter, who looks a little like Palin and does a great impression of her, served as model for the governor's body."

Wow, that's creepy.Yeah, a little bit.

Only if it was posted on October 31st, would it have been more creepy.

But what's even creepier:

"I've been following her religiously," he said Monday at the bar. "I had never heard of her before, like everyone else. I find her bizarrely fascinating, even though I pretty much despise everything she stands for."

The same could said for many infamous men and women of the past.

updated article



By DAVID BAUDER, AP Television Writer 1 hour, 29 minutes ago

NEW YORK - PBS journalist Gwen Ifill, moderator of the upcoming vice presidential debate, dismissed conservative questions about her impartiality because she is writing a book that includes material on Barack Obama.

Ifill said Wednesday that she hasn't even written her chapter on Obama for the book "The Breakthrough: Politics and Race in the Age of Obama," which is to be published by Doubleday on Jan. 20, 2009, the day a new president is inaugurated.

"I've got a pretty long track record covering politics and news, so I'm not particularly worried that one-day blog chatter is going to destroy my reputation," Ifill said. "The proof is in the pudding. They can watch the debate tomorrow night and make their own decisions about whether or not I've done my job."

The day before the Joe Biden-Sarah Palin debate, columnist Michelle Malkin wrote in the New York Post about Ifill's book, saying "she's so far in the tank for the Democratic presidential candidate, her oxygen delivery line is running out."

In its online description of the book, Doubleday says that Ifill "surveys the American political landscape, shedding new light on the impact of Barack Obama's stunning presidential campaign and introducing the emerging young African American politicians forging a bold new path to political power."

The McCain campaign found out about Ifill's book in the last day or so, a spokesman said.

Ifill said Obama's story, which she has yet to write, is only a small part of the book, which discusses how politics in the black community have changed since the civil rights era. Among those subjects is Colin Powell, secretary of state in the Bush administration.

The host of PBS' "Washington Week" and senior correspondent on "The NewsHour" said she did not tell the Commission on Presidential Debates about the book. The commission had no immediate comment when contacted by The Associated Press. A spokeswoman for John McCain's campaign did not immediately return phone and e-mail messages.

Ifill's resume includes jobs at The New York Times, the Washington Post and NBC News. She moderated the 2004 vice presidential debate between Dick Cheney and John Edwards.

She said it was the publisher, not herself, who set the Inauguration Day release date. It will be released then whether Obama wins or loses.

Although Malkin raised the topic of Ifill's impartiality the day before the debate, the PBS journalist said that Time magazine noted she was writing a book in August, and that it has been available for pre-sale on Amazon.com. The book also is mentioned in a Sept. 4 interview she gave the Washington Post.

Ifill questions why people assume that her book will be favorable toward Obama.

"Do you think they made the same assumptions about Lou Cannon (who is white) when he wrote his book about Reagan?" said Ifill, who is black. Asked if there were racial motives at play, she said, "I don't know what it is. I find it curious."

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20081002/ap_on_en_ot/debate_ifill;_ylt=Auex3gtfAp5L.ouPfas4446s0NUE

Said it before. McCain camp is either incompetent or lying.

Estimates show Palin assets top $1 million


By SHARON THEIMER and BRETT J. BLACKLEDGE, Associated Press Writers 1 hour, 31 minutes ago

WASILLA, Alaska - Sarah Palin and her husband have pieced together a uniquely Alaskan income that reached comfortably into six figures even before she became governor, capitalizing on valuable fishing rights, a series of land deals and a patchwork of other ventures to build an above-average lifestyle.
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Add up the couple's 2007 income and the estimated value of their property and investments and they appear to be worth at least $1.2 million. That would make the Palins, like Democratic vice presidential rival Joe Biden and his wife Jill, well-off but not nearly as wealthy as multimillionaire couples John and Cindy McCain and, to a lesser extent, Barack and Michelle Obama.

One measure of financial health: While there is a home loan, Palin reported no personal credit card debt on her most recent financial report as Alaska governor. That compares to average household credit card debt among Americans of $9,840 last year.

A more complete picture will come when Sarah Palin outlines her personal finances in federal paperwork in coming days. It will include details of any mortgage debt and at least rough dollar totals for bank accounts and investments.

Palin this week characterized herself as "an everyday, working-class American" who knows how it feels when the stock market takes a hit.

The Palins' total income last year was split almost evenly between Sarah Palin's white-collar job and her husband's blue-collar work. Sarah Palin's salary as governor was $125,000; Todd Palin took in $46,790 as a part-time oil production operator for BP Alaska in Prudhoe Bay, plus $46,265 in commercial fishing income and $10,500 in Iron Dog snowmachine race winnings. These figures do not include nearly $17,000 in per diem payments Palin received for 312 nights spent in her own home since she was elected governor; she also has received $43,490 to cover travel costs for her husband and children.

In addition, each member of the Palin family received $1,654 in state oil royalties paid to all Alaskans.

The Palins' assets seem enviable: a half-million-dollar home on a lake with a float-plane at the dock, two vacation retreats, commercial-fishing rights worth an estimated $50,000 or more and an income last year of at least $230,000. That compares to a median income of $64,333 for Alaskans and $50,740 for Americans in 2007, according to the Census Bureau.

But in Alaska, scarce roads make private planes commonplace, it's typical to spend a month or two fishing commercially, and wilderness acreage is so plentiful the state has sold loads' worth stake-your-claim style. So, it's often the finer points that matter: How old is the airplane? Where exactly is the fishing spot? Is the house on a paved road?

Land itself doesn't necessarily translate to wealth, said Tom Hawkins of Anchorage, who paid about $2,000 for a five-acre parcel miles from the nearest road, best reached by snowmachine.

"I've got a stunning parcel overlooking a river," Hawkins said. "I took my wife to it. And she stood up and looked out at the stunning view and said, 'Dear, what are we going to do with it?'"

The Palins' main residence, a large two-story house on Lake Lucille in Wasilla, draws much of its value from its prime position along a paved road and float-plane accessible lake, said Darcie Salmon, a local real estate agent. He said lakefront land is plentiful in Alaska, but lakefront land along paved roads isn't.

The Palins' home, tucked behind a wooded field, is off Wasilla's main road, Parks Highway, a mostly four-lane road cluttered with restaurants, bars, retail stores, offices, grocery stores and big-box outlets such as Target. A store-bought "no trespassing" sign is posted near the entry to an unmarked, private gravel drive that winds about 100 yards to the lakefront home. A neighbor's property has an old metal gate at its entrance with a sign warning, "Enter at your own risk."

The Palins' four-bedroom, four-bath house, nearly 3,500 square feet, sits on just over two acres behind a tall wood-plank privacy fence that runs along one side of the property. It's one of the newest homes in the Snider subdivision lining Lake Lucille and is assessed at $552,000 — more than twice the value of a neighboring two-acre lot with a much smaller, older wood-frame home.

Todd Palin built the house with friends who were contractors, he said in a recent television interview.

The house is worth substantially more than the Palins' starter home, a three-bedroom, two-bath house house built in 1984 on the far western boundary of Wasilla. The quiet, wooded neighborhood was developed about three miles from the city center, with half-acre lots and space for young families.

In addition to the Lake Lucille home, the Palins own recreational property in two remote areas accessible by plane, all-terrain vehicle or snowmachine.

The Palins invested in five lots along Safari Lake, an undeveloped area near Denali State Park. They bought the property, once owned by the state's Department of Natural Resources and valued at $30,000 in assessment records, with friends Scott and Deborah Richter in 2004 and 2005. The Richters have since divorced.

With other friends, the Palins own a cabin on five acres southwest of Wasilla and the Iditarod National Historic Trail. The land and cabin are assessed at $55,000; property records do not show what the Palins paid for their share.

The Palins own snowmachines and an airplane. Todd Palin has a 1958 Piper float plane that he said has been in his family for about 20 years.

Though old, such planes remain in wide use. Palin's plane would be worth from about $38,000 to $78,000 depending on its condition, said Boyd Newman, owner of West One Aircraft Sales in Caldwell, Idaho.

Other family assets include Todd Palin's shoreside lease and commercial fishing permit to harvest salmon from Bristol Bay each season. Last year, the Palins took in $46,265 commercial fishing for sockeye salmon over about a month.

Todd Palin said he purchased his permit from his grandfather in the 1970s. A limited number of permits and shoreline leases have been issued, and the rights to them are often passed down through families or sold. Holders pay a fee each year to renew them.

Palin's is worth about $30,000, a shoreside lease on Coffee Point, where Palin's set-net site is located, is worth about $20,000, and Palin's skiff and gear are likely worth another $20,000, according to estimates by Paul Piercey, a broker with Dock Street Brokers in Seattle, which handles sales of fishing permits, boats and shoreside leases.

Palin's fishing spot is considered good but not great, Piercey said. And the work is backbreaking. Palin has said he expects to earn 68 cents per pound for this summer's catch.

"When you get up in the morning, your fingers are so swollen that you have to stick them in a bucket of icewater just to get movement back again" and ease the pain, said Hawkins, who fished on Bristol Bay one year.

Hawkins is former chief operating officer of the Bristol Bay Native Corp. and former chief executive of Choggiung Ltd., two native corporations in which Todd Palin, who is part Yup'ik Eskimo, is a shareholder, along with the Palin children. The Palins are among about 8,000 shareholders in BBNC and among about 1,200 shareholders in Choggiung Limited, Hawkins said.

Sarah Palin reported Todd Palin collecting $266 and each child $21 in dividends last year from BBNC, and a total of $16.50 from Choggiung Limited.

Todd Palin is still a BP employee. Company spokesman Steve Rinehart declined to describe Palin's status beyond confirming his employment. Palin's schedule is one week on, one week off, Palin said in a recent television interview.

Palin previously left BP in the 1990s to run Valley Polaris, a snowmachine, four-wheeler and watercraft dealership he pursued with a friend and business partner. They sold the business in 1997; public records do not show whether it was at a profit or a loss. At the time, Sarah Palin was earning about $61,000 a year as Wasilla mayor.

The Polaris dealership was among three business ventures the Palins explored; the others never took off. Palin's financial disclosure reports do not say how much if any money the Palins invested in the business ventures or real estate, or what if any profit they made on sales.

Sarah Palin formed a consulting business called "Rouge Cou" — French for redneck — but didn't pursue it.

The Palins teamed with another couple, Ray and Carolin Wells of Anchorage, to start a car wash in Anchorage, but it was never built. Carolin Wells described the Palins as silent partners she believes initially paid half the money to buy the land. Around the time Sarah Palin began considering a run for governor, the Palins reduced their stake to 40 percent.

Barely a year into the land ownership, the man lined up to operate the car wash backed out, and since neither couple wanted to run it, they decided to sell the land and move on, Carolin Wells said. She couldn't recall the purchase or sales prices of the land, but believes she and her husband made a modest profit and the Palins broke even.

The couples let their state paperwork lapse on the venture, Anchorage Car Wash LLC, resulting in a letter threatening to dissolve the corporation. The letterhead carried Gov. Palin's name on it.

The deal was among several involving undeveloped land the Palins have engaged in over the years.

The Palins purchased a parcel on Beaverhouse Lake in Big Lake in 2003 and sold it in 2004 for an undisclosed amount. The land has been assessed at $14,000 the past three years.

The Palins sold nearly five acres of undeveloped waterfront property on the northeast shore of Wasilla Lake in 2005 to a local developer. The sales price wasn't disclosed. The land now is subdivided into five parcels, with two waterfront lots, two others behind those, and a commercial lot. Duane Mathes, a local real estate agent showing the property for the owner who bought it from the Palins, said the leveled lots are listed for $149,500 each.

Salmon, who was mayor of the Matanuska-Susitna Borough that includes Wasilla while Palin was Wasilla mayor, recalled that as mayor, Sarah Palin shared many of his pro-development views, and said the Palins' land acquisitions weren't unusual.

"A lot of Alaskans own a lot of land," Salmon said, "and if you're bright, you buy land in the path of progress."

_____

Sharon Theimer reported from Washington. Associated Press writer Rita Beamish in San Mateo, Calif., contributed to this report.


http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20081002/ap_on_el_pr/palins_finances;_ylt=AglYxrt.X.Rk12PxXMR0iRqs0NUE

Palin, in interview, casts herself as a federalist

2 hours, 7 minutes ago

WASHINGTON - When it comes to the Supreme Court, only one case comes to Sarah Palin's mind: Roe v. Wade.
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In an interview broadcast Wednesday on the "CBS Evening News," the Republican vice presidential candidate cast herself as a federalist in explaining why she thought the court got it wrong on the landmark decision that legalized abortion.

She also could not name any other decisions by the high court that she disagrees with.

"I think it should be a states issue not a federal government, mandated, mandating yes or no on such an important issue," said Palin, who opposes abortion except in cases where the pregnancy threatens the woman's life.

"I'm in that sense a federalist, where I believe that states should have more say in the laws of their lands and individual areas," she added.

Asked what other Supreme Court decisions she disagrees with, Alaska's governor couldn't name any.

"Well, let's see. There's, of course, in the great history of America rulings there have been rulings, that's never going to be absolute consensus by every American," Palin said. "And there are, those issues, again, like Roe v. Wade where I believe are best held on a state level and addressed there. So you know, going through the history of America, there would be others but ...."

Asked again to name a decision she disagreed with, Palin replied: "Well, I could think of, of any again, that could be best dealt with on a more local level. Maybe I would take issue with. But you know, as mayor, and then as governor and even as a vice president, if I'm so privileged to serve, wouldn't be in a position of changing those things but in supporting the law of the land as it reads today."

In a separate interview, Democratic vice presidential candidate Joe Biden also was asked about Roe v. Wade. He said it was a good decision "because it's (as) close to a consensus that can exist in a society as heterogeneous as ours."

Asked what high court rulings he disagrees with, Biden cited the decision that struck down a law giving abused women the right to sue their tormentors in federal court. Biden, a senator from Delaware, wrote the law.

The interviews were part of a series on questions put to the vice presidential candidates.



http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20081002/ap_on_el_pr/palin_supreme_court;_ylt=AsCDQg2dohUcm19W._70Ceis0NUE

http://lotpro.com/blogphotos/Misc%20Article%20Images/tn_Nile%20River.jpg
Denial is not a river in Egypt.

I've shown the YouTube clips of the Couric interview to a couple of work colleagues, two of whom are (were) staunch Republicans. kvrdave can vouch for the fact that I work in a very conservative area of Oregon. One has now promised to vote Obama. The other one will now not vote. Not everyone's as willing to forgive ignorance as you, bhk. ;)

Show them this clip and see if they vote at all then.
<object width="425" height="349"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/KbpWonUzlrc&hl=en&fs=1&rel=0&color1=0x234900&color2=0x4e9e00&border=1"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/KbpWonUzlrc&hl=en&fs=1&rel=0&color1=0x234900&color2=0x4e9e00&border=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="349"></embed></object>

btw, if she, as a politician running for the office of vice president of the United States, doesn't have a clue about the cause of global warming, then perhaps she should Google it, at the very least, or ask one of those advisors that she has.

The real issue is that global warming is junk science (http://www.junkscience.com/Greenhouse/), and part of the liberal agenda. Just like drilling in ANWR would disrupt the bear and moose and caribou, as clearly is displayed below.

http://arcticportal.org/uploads/LR/at/LRatHGJfkRBnpi8PHPJW4A/caribou-alaska-pipeline.jpg
http://blog.heritage.org/wp-content/uploads/2008/06/image015.jpg
http://albanysinsanity.wnymedia.net/blogs/files/2008/06/anwr.jpg

Show them this clip and see if they vote at all then.
<object width="425" height="349"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/KbpWonUzlrc&hl=en&fs=1&rel=0&color1=0x234900&color2=0x4e9e00&border=1"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/KbpWonUzlrc&hl=en&fs=1&rel=0&color1=0x234900&color2=0x4e9e00&border=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="349"></embed></object>You're comparing this to Palin's interview with Couric? Seriously? Okay, yes, I'm going to dismiss you rather than tell you why you're wrong.

The real issue is that global warming is junk science (http://www.junkscience.com/Greenhouse/), and part of the liberal agenda.Would you like to know how I define intellectual laziness? It's when people post links showing complex and detailed explanations that they themselves have not read or understood, but because its conclusion meets their own agenda, they slap it up there and expect everyone else to believe it's legitimate, valid, and thorough. If you can't argue it or explain it yourself, don't claim the other side has an "agenda" and simult