Continued from http://forum.dvdtalk.com/showthread.php?t=537558

The phrase "impenetrable thicket" is not ideal when you're trying to brand someone as excessively verbose.

What? You're saying that conveying an impression succinctly in five words is "excessively verbose?"

Wasn't there someone in 1988 that said, "Joe Biden is the only person who can give a fifteen minute answer to a yes or no question."?

Stupid mods. Always closing a thread when I'm posting to it.











I keed,I keed. I salute our mod overlords

Part XXIII. :(

You even closed it before 800 posts too. ;)

What? You're saying that conveying an impression succinctly in five words is "excessively verbose?"When one of those words has five syllables, yeah.

Part XXIII. :(

You even closed it before 800 posts too. ;)Still on track so far (http://forum.dvdtalk.com/showthread.php?t=524705). :dance:

Part XXIII. :(

You even closed it before 800 posts too. ;)

I figured it was close enough... plus I wanted to use this thread title for the 22nd one but someone beat me to setting that one up ;)

Okay, remember all those things I said in the other thread? They were right, and I am brilliant.

Still on track so far (http://forum.dvdtalk.com/showthread.php?t=524705). :dance:
:lol::up:

So McCain picked a woman for his VP, interesting choice from what i've read so far not sure how it'll impact the poll numbers.

Anyone else find it funny that we have the choice of the "24" ticket (black senator white vp) or the "Air Force One" ticket (white president who is a veteran and a woman vp)

Life imitating art?

I haven't really watched too much political coverage today, but CNN, MSNBC, the networks et al seem to be almost outright campaigning for Obama.


Yet Fox News gets blasted for being too biased.

Does Jack Cafferty masturbate to pictures of Obama?

I haven't really watched too much political coverage today, but CNN, MSNBC, the networks et al seem to be almost outright campaigning for Obama.


Yet Fox News gets blasted for being too biased.

Does Jack Cafferty masturbate to pictures of Obama?
They've both been tremendously biased at least from the Convention stuff I've been watching. It's frustrating to be honest with you. Where are the journalists these days? All I see are a bunch of cheerleaders. :down:

Is it true, that as Illinois State Senator, that Barack Obama voted against the Born Alive Infants Protection Act, a law that would give medical care to babies that survive abortions, instead of allowing them to be left to die?

I mean, there's pro-choice, and there's pro-infanticide.

Is it true, that as Illinois State Senator, that Barack Obama voted against the Born Alive Infants Protection Act, a law that would give medical care to babies that survive abortions, instead of allowing them to be left to die?

I mean, there's pro-choice, and there's pro-infanticide.
You really need to pay attention. This has already been covered extensively here.

Is it true, that as Illinois State Senator, that Barack Obama voted against the Born Alive Infants Protection Act, a law that would give medical care to babies that survive abortions, instead of allowing them to be left to die?

Yes he did. He claims that he did it because the language of the bill was a backdoor for reducing abortion rights; however a number of sources have pointed out that the bill was amended to ensure that the bill would not be precedental, using the same language as a Federal bill that Obama says he'd support.

I mean, there's pro-choice, and there's pro-infanticide.

The Romans used to leave kids on the sides of mountains to die of exposure.

No big shock here to me:

http://www.zogby.com/news/ReadNews1547.html

The latest nationwide survey, begun Friday afternoon after the McCain announcement of Palin as running mate and completed mid-afternoon today, shows McCain/Palin at 47%, compared to 45% support for Obama/Biden.

In other words, the race is a dead heat.

You really need to pay attention. This has already been covered extensively here.

Well, I don't know about extensively. We gave it short shrift.

Frankly, the bigger issue to me, once again, was the faulty memory and/or lying of Senator Obama. I firmly believe he forgets that his stories, remembrances, and anecdotes can, and will be, quickly verified. It's a habit of his though. Probably tough to break.

What is Obama's current opinion of citizens being able to own handguns? I heard a fellow professor of his say in an interview that he told him that people shouldn't be able to own handguns, or something real close to that.

This Obama ad is pretty lame but I love how they managed to work that photo of McCain hugging Bush like his daddy.

2X9LypdiQFo

You really need to pay attention. This has already been covered extensively here.

His talking points got stuck "in the tubes"

What is Obama's current opinion of citizens being able to own handguns? I heard a fellow professor of his say in an interview that he told him that people shouldn't be able to own handguns, or something real close to that.

Looking on Obama's website, I don't see it anywhere under the issues tab.

Edit: Found this under Urban Policy
Address Gun Violence in Cities: As president, Barack Obama would repeal the Tiahrt Amendment, which restricts the ability of local law enforcement to access important gun trace information, and give police officers across the nation the tools they need to solve gun crimes and fight the illegal arms trade. Obama also favors commonsense measures that respect the Second Amendment rights of gun owners, while keeping guns away from children and from criminals who shouldn't have them. He supports closing the gun show loophole and making guns in this country childproof. He also supports making the expired federal Assault Weapons Ban permanent, as such weapons belong on foreign battlefields and not on our streets.

Nothing specific.

http://ontheissues.org/2008/Barack_Obama_Gun_Control.htm

I received an email from DeepDiscountDVD of all places with 15 political book recommendations. I reserved 13 of the 15 books at the library (2 were not available) and noticed that Obama's books had holds while MCain's didn't. Hhhmm. A reflection on how the voting will go?


BTW here are the books
The Audacity Of Hope Barack Obama
Why Courage Matters John McCain
Faith Of My Fathers John McCain, Mark Salter
Dreams From My Father Barack Obama
Promises To Keep Joseph Biden
Sarah Kaylene Johnson (not available... might buy this one because I really want to read it)
The Way Of The World Ron Suskind
The Dark Side Jane Mayer
The War Within Bob Woodward
Post-American World Fareed Zakaria
Mike's Election Guide Michael Moore (processing into the system, so available but not really)
What Happened Scott McClellan
Fleeced Dick Morris, Eileen McGann
The Obama Nation Jerome R. Corsi
The Third Term Paul Begala (not available)

This Obama ad is pretty lame but I love how they managed to work that photo of McCain hugging Bush like his daddy.

2X9LypdiQFo



biden represents every credit card company, payday loan and pawnshop in the country, just wait until the repubs put people on TV saying how they are paying 1000% interest to a bank in Delaware

No big shock here to me:

The latest nationwide survey, begun Friday afternoon after the McCain announcement of Palin as running mate and completed mid-afternoon today, shows McCain/Palin at 47%, compared to 45% support for Obama/Biden.

In other words, the race is a dead heat.

No big shock? The Friday after the DNC and there's a poll showing Republicans ahead by 2%? It looked like Obama had a 8% bump for 2 days and then McCain's announcement completely negated everything gained during the DNC. I'd be extremely concerned if I were the Democrats.

I heard yesterday that while the Democrats are all giddy about the Hurricane hitting during the RNC it may actually work out quite well for the Republicans. For example - my wife and I would never watch one of these conventions but we were glued to the set when Katrina hit. If the news is going to bounce between the 2 main stories there are going to be millions hearing reports from the RNC that otherwise probably wouldn't watch.

Just more proof about Bush and his weather machine..

I heard Obama is going to New Oleans right now to stand on the shore and fend off the hurricane. Everyone is cancellation their evacuations, turning around and heading back home to see his victory speech. John McCain, when asked about people driving away from the city, exclaimed, "No, get everyone a shovel and a drill. We need to drill here and drill now" Developing.

No big shock? The Friday after the DNC and there's a poll showing Republicans ahead by 2%? It looked like Obama had a 8% bump for 2 days and then McCain's announcement completely negated everything gained during the DNC. I'd be extremely concerned if I were the Democrats.
I'd be panicking if I were the Democrats.

Of course the Democratic spin on this is that due to the instant information of the internet the days of bumps in the polls are gone.

What is Obama's current opinion of citizens being able to own handguns? I heard a fellow professor of his say in an interview that he told him that people shouldn't be able to own handguns, or something real close to that.
He is opposed to the Constitution on that issue.

Squarely opposed.

He and Biden are both in favor of disarming the populace and are one of the most obviously anti-Second Amendment tickets ever.

Biden was even more zealous about banning guns in the 1994 'Assault Weapons Ban' legislation than his fellow Democrats and even the Clinton administration..

No big shock? The Friday after the DNC and there's a poll showing Republicans ahead by 2%? It looked like Obama had a 8% bump for 2 days and then McCain's announcement completely negated everything gained during the DNC. I'd be extremely concerned if I were the Democrats.

You can't compare two different polls using two different methodologies by two different polling companies.

I see nothing in the polling results that should cause the Obama campaign concern, let alone extreme concern.

You can't compare two different polls using two different methodologies by two different polling companies.

I see nothing in the polling results that should cause the Obama campaign concern, let alone extreme concern.
There's no reason for panic from the Dem camp 2 months away. Conversely, if the Dems were up by 10 points, I wouldn't throw a party either. You can peak too early and then lose steam at the end. This is going to be nip and tuck all the way to the finish line.

You can't compare two different polls using two different methodologies by two different polling companies.

Wanna bet?

I'd be panicking if I were the Democrats.

Of course the Democratic spin on this is that due to the instant information of the internet the days of bumps in the polls are gone.

Didn't they say the exact same thing with Kerry?

I received an email from DeepDiscountDVD of all places with 15 political book recommendations. I reserved 13 of the 15 books at the library (2 were not available) and noticed that Obama's books had holds while MCain's didn't. Hhhmm. A reflection on how the voting will go?


BTW here are the books
The Audacity Of Hope Barack Obama
Why Courage Matters John McCain
Faith Of My Fathers John McCain, Mark Salter
Dreams From My Father Barack Obama
Promises To Keep Joseph Biden
Sarah Kaylene Johnson (not available... might buy this one because I really want to read it)
The Way Of The World Ron Suskind
The Dark Side Jane Mayer
The War Within Bob Woodward
Post-American World Fareed Zakaria
Mike's Election Guide Michael Moore (processing into the system, so available but not really)
What Happened Scott McClellan
Fleeced Dick Morris, Eileen McGann
The Obama Nation Jerome R. Corsi
The Third Term Paul Begala (not available)

That's the only one worth reading from your list. Skip the rest.

How about the book by Bob Woodward.

gossip

http://www.nypost.com/seven/09012008/news/nationalnews/rev__strikes_again_126984.htm

REV. STRIKES AGAIN
WRIGHT'S CRUDE MICHELLE OBAMA CRACK

By GEOFF EARLE
JEREMIAH WRIGHT
Former Obama minister.Last updated: 4:11 am
September 1, 2008
Posted: 3:53 am
September 1, 2008

TOLEDO, Ohio - The Rev. Jeremiah Wright, Barack Obama's fiery ex-pastor, re-emerged yesterday with a crude reference about race and sex in the White House.

"This ordinary boy [Obama] just might be the first president in the history of the United States to have a black woman sleeping at 1600 Pennsylvania legally," Wright said, referring to Michelle Obama, in a sermon at the Wheeler Avenue Baptist Church in Houston.

It was unclear whether Wright was making a reference to prostitution, to old miscegenation laws, or to the history of illicit interracial sex under slavery.

Wright's remarks yesterday were full of praise for Obama - although several times, he referred to Obama as a "boy" who later developed into an extraordinary person, through God's work and, presumably, Wright's guidance.

"The lord turned the ordinary into the extraordinary. Y'all just saw it this past week. It was on national television," Wright said to applause.

"An ordinary black boy raised in a single-parent home . . . walked into my office 20 years ago to talk about his dream for a community that concentrated on things that we could achieve in common."

As Obama's longtime minister, Wright married Barack and Michelle, and the couple worshiped at Wright's Trinity United Church of Christ in Chicago until Wright's controversial sermons became public knowledge during the campaign.

Wright gave an over-the-top press conference that ultimately prompted Obama to leave the church this spring, after Wright blamed the United States for concocting the HIV virus and railed against US imperialism.

Wright also accused Obama of posturing in his criticism of Wright's sermons, saying, "If Senator Obama did not say what he said, he would never get elected. Politicians say what they say and do what they do based on electability, based on sound bites, based on polls."

Obama said afterward that he was "outraged by the comments that were made and saddened by the spectacle that we saw."

In recent weeks, Obama has worshipped at various churches in towns on his campaign schedule, as he did at a Lutheran church in Lima, Ohio, yesterday.

In sermons that caused the initial uproar when they emerged on video, Wright blamed the United States for the 9/11 attacks and boomed, "God damn America."

Wright also accused Obama of posturing in his criticism of Wright's sermons, saying, "If Senator Obama did not say what he said, he would never get elected. Politicians say what they say and do what they do based on electability, based on sound bites, based on polls."

Translation: "Sen Obama still believes everything we preach."

Looking on Obama's website, I don't see it anywhere under the issues tab.

Edit: Found this under Urban Policy


Nothing specific.

Ha so it's not just his speeches that are full of vague wishy washy verbiage? :)

I heard Obama is going to New Oleans right now to stand on the shore and fend off the hurricane.

I don't know about you guys, but all that arm flapping reduced this to a class two and I would like to give Obama my thanks.

There is something that bugs me about Obama still. Does he or doesn't he believe in the teachings of Wright? Did he denounce Wright just because it was hurting his bid? How can you be a member of a church with a pastor like that all those years and be unaware of this side of him?

When one of those words has five syllables, yeah.

"There are those who claim I am verbose because I am not monosalabic. I uncategorically reject their inneptitude."

Well crap. Way to kill the fun at the VP thread. I've been trying to avoid these full presidential threads.

There is something that bugs me about Obama still. Does he or doesn't he believe in the teachings of Wright? Did he denounce Wright just because it was hurting his bid? How can you be a member of a church with a pastor like that all those years and be unaware of this side of him?

He rejected what the minister said, but not the minister himself. The opposite of The Million Man March when we were told to ignore who delivers the message and just focus on the message delivered.

Wright is a loon. No doubt. And that bothers me as well. My own minister is a loon (on some things) and as a result, I rarely attend there anymore.

There is something that bugs me about Obama still. Does he or doesn't he believe in the teachings of Wright? Did he denounce Wright just because it was hurting his bid? How can you be a member of a church with a pastor like that all those years and be unaware of this side of him?

To which teachings of Reverend Wright are you referring? I would suspect that Senator Obama agrees with some of the things Reverend Wright has said and disagrees with others. I would also suspect that you agree with some of the things Reverend Wright has said and disagree with others.

Well the whole thing that the U.S. was responsible for 9/11, AIDS is a creation of America for biological warfare, G-D damn America, all the white hate, etc. etc. He's a destructive influence.

To which teachings of Reverend Wright are you referring? I would suspect that Senator Obama agrees with some of the things Reverend Wright has said and disagrees with others. I would also suspect that you agree with some of the things Reverend Wright has said and disagree with others.


Black Liberation Theology http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_liberation_theology

To which teachings of Reverend Wright are you referring? I would suspect that Senator Obama agrees with some of the things Reverend Wright has said and disagrees with others. I would also suspect that you agree with some of the things Reverend Wright has said and disagree with others.She might be refering to his subscribing to the Black liberation theology.

I may agree with something the white power movement says but I wouldn't ever sit and listen to their crap.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c3wh2XT4e8M&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c3wh2XT4e8M&feature=related

At least he got #15 right. :lol:

WACK JOB!!!!

That video is 10 minutes long and you watched it in 4!! -eek- :p

That video is 10 minutes long and you watched it in 4!! -eek- :p


I turned it off at about #11. Some are probably taken out of context, but it is obvious that this guy gets his followers wrapped up in looking at the past and not the future. He is a hate filled guy that would absolutely have to be seen in the same light as a KKK member, imo. I did also see a Howard Stern comment on him that essentially said the same. Not a guy I take politically talk from, but I don't see how a fair minded person doesn't see this as a negative for Obama.

If mcCain was a close friend of Pat Robertson, I would expect more outcry, though. No black guilt in going against Pat. But they seem like equals to me.

But no doubt, this will help end racism and help Obama unite people. :lol:

That video is 10 minutes long and you watched it in 4!! -eek- :pEvery one of those has been played to death. It just doesn’t mater.

Just like if you were a Klan member for 20 years and attended weekly cross burnings wouldn't mater as long as you didn't really mean it and were only doing it for political expediency.

EDIT: I'm scared, I'm in KVRDave's head.

We need a thread just for Palin photos:

http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2008/08/29/us/30palin3.large.jpg

Just imagine Putin sitting on the other side of the giant crab.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sarah_Palin

On September 1, 2008, in a response to unsubstantiated internet rumors that Trig Palin was actually Bristol's son[122], the McCain campaign released a statement from the Palins announcing that their 17-year old daughter is five months pregnant.[123] They further stated that she intends to keep the baby and to marry the father of her child. The McCain-Palin campaign states that John McCain was previously aware of the situation, but decided that it would not affect his choice of Palin as his vice presidential nominee. [122]

I turned it off at about #11. Some are probably taken out of context, but it is obvious that this guy gets his followers wrapped up in looking at the past and not the future. He is a hate filled guy that would absolutely have to be seen in the same light as a KKK member, imo. I did also see a Howard Stern comment on him that essentially said the same. Not a guy I take politically talk from, but I don't see how a fair minded person doesn't see this as a negative for Obama.

If mcCain was a close friend of Pat Robertson, I would expect more outcry, though. No black guilt in going against Pat. But they seem like equals to me.

But no doubt, this will help end racism and help Obama unite people. :lol:

Pat Robertson is part of the mainstream Republican Party. Isn't he the one Senator McCain denounced as an agent of intolerance in 2000 and then ran to embrace in 2008?

I know, I know. McCain was just doing it for political expediency, so it doesn't count!

They need to leave Bristol Palin alone. She is just a good Christian kid, with good no-contraceptive values. She should be praised for living that value! Forget the whole no-sex before marriage value.

Besides, everyone knows the kids of Presidents/VPs should be off limits.

Unless, of course you are John McCain making fun of Chelsea Clinton in 1998.
Or the 2000 George W Bush campaign talking about McCains black baby.

Ok, I guess everyone knows the kids of Presidents/VPs should be off limits. Unless a republican is making the joke.

We need a thread just for Palin photos:

http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2008/08/29/us/30palin3.large.jpg

Just imagine Putin sitting on the other side of the giant crab.


Isn't that Putin there behind the crab?

Pat Robertson is part of the mainstream Republican Party. Isn't he the one Senator McCain denounced as an agent of intolerance in 2000 and then ran to embrace in 2008?

I know, I know. McCain was just doing it for political expediency, so it doesn't count!


I used it as a religious example the left hates. I would put wright far worse than Pat. I think he does the same kind of "God Punishes America" crap, so on that they are equal. I don't find him to be a racist. Score one for Wright, I suppose. It would be much better to compare Wright with a KKK minister, but I don't know any.

How can she run the country if she can't even control her own daughter!?! Family values!!1! Blah, blah, blah!

They need to leave Bristol Palin alone. She is just a good Christian kid, with good no-contraceptive values. She should be praised for living that value! Forget the whole no-sex before marriage value.

Besides, everyone knows the kids of Presidents/VPs should be off limits.

Unless, of course you are John McCain making fun of Chelsea Clinton in 1998.
Or the 2002 George W Bush campaign talking about McCains black baby.

Ok, I guess everyone knows the kids of Presidents/VPs should be off limits. Unless a republican is making the joke.


I have always maintained that there is no greater sin to a liberal than holding an ideal higher than you can reach 100% of the time. :lol:

Pat Robertson is part of the mainstream Republican Party. Isn't he the one Senator McCain denounced as an agent of intolerance in 2000 and then ran to embrace in 2008?

I know, I know. McCain was just doing it for political expediency, so it doesn't count!Being an Atheist I think all of them are a bit silly but I'd argue that Wright is much more extreme. Regardless did McCain regularly attend Pat's church?

It's pointless to argue anyway. There is absolutly no way to slow the Obama love train. Everything can be explained, justified, and forgiven.

Hey I have an idea... let's talk about Reverend Wright again! :banana:

GatorDeb, I'm sorry you weren't around for it when it was the big hubbub.

I used it as a religious example the left hates. I would put wright far worse than Pat. I think he does the same kind of "God Punishes America" crap, so on that they are equal. I don't find him to be a racist. Score one for Wright, I suppose. It would be much better to compare Wright with a KKK minister, but I don't know any.

I don't think Wright is racist, and I think it shows how much of a charicature the media's depiction of him is that you could call him a racist with a straight face.

When Wright came up in the spring, I linked to a bunch of materials describing the white parishioners of Trinity United Church. If Wright were really the KKK-like man you say he is, I don't think he would tolerate white parishoners and I don't think the white parishoners would tolerate him.

I assume this is the VP thread part 4 or something. So in fairness, I think we should also talk about how hot Biden is to give them equal time. Any Biden beach photos?

At least he got #15 right. :lol:

Actually he didn't. He said the government "purposely infected African-American men with syphilis." That's not what happened. The doctors withheld treatment from infected patients (which of course is inexcusable), but they did not infect anyone.

The actual event was bad enough, he didn't need to embellish it.


http://www.tuskegee.edu/Global/Story.asp?s=1207586

I don't think Wright is racist, and I think it shows how much of a charicature the media's depiction of him is that you could call him a racist with a straight face.

When Wright came up in the spring, I linked to a bunch of materials describing the white parishioners of Trinity United Church. If Wright were really the KKK-like man you say he is, I don't think he would tolerate white parishoners and I don't think the white parishoners would tolerate him.
:lol: OK.

Like Thor said, we should probably drop this. We will NEVER agree on this. I guess we have completely diferent ideas of what a racist is.

i honestly hope the reason people are voting for Palin is because they think she's attractive.

I guess that makes Biden FILF?

VP Candidate Palin takes it off...

<img src="http://blog.reidreport.com/uploaded_images/biden-752244.jpg" height=250> <img src="http://cache.daylife.com/imageserve/05Kmasc5gA5gE/610x.jpg" height=250>

We need a thread just for Palin photos:

http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2008/08/29/us/30palin3.large.jpg

Just imagine Putin sitting on the other side of the giant crab. Could give a whole new meaing to "glasnost".

http://www.nypost.com/seven/09012008/news/nationalnews/rev__strikes_again_126984.htm


Wright also accused Obama of posturing in his criticism of Wright's sermons, saying, "If Senator Obama did not say what he said, he would never get elected. Politicians say what they say and do what they do based on electability, based on sound bites, based on polls."

Translation: "Sen Obama still believes everything we preach."And your translation: Wright speaks for Obama (despite Obama having said otherwise)

http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2008/08/29/us/30palin3.large.jpg


I guess she only hates POLAR bears.

So does the G is GILF now stand for Grandma instead of Governor?

I don't think Wright is racist, and I think it shows how much of a charicature the media's depiction of him is that you could call him a racist with a straight face.

When Wright came up in the spring, I linked to a bunch of materials describing the white parishioners of Trinity United Church. If Wright were really the KKK-like man you say he is, I don't think he would tolerate white parishoners and I don't think the white parishoners would tolerate him.


I suppose it depends on our view of racism. The man is divisive, and i can't believe anyone could think otherwise with a straight face.

Do you think Black Liberation Theology is racist? I do. If you don't, that's fine, but I will disagree.

I assume this is the VP thread part 4 or something.

Your assumption is correct.

DD is correct. I'll drop the Wright stuff. But I would be lying to say that it doesn't bother me to a degree. But hell, still voted for him in the primary. :lol:

So can I assume that Democrats are doing cartwheels that her 17 year old daughter got knocked up. ;)

Pat Robertson is part of the mainstream Republican Party. Isn't he the one Senator McCain denounced as an agent of intolerance in 2000 and then ran to embrace in 2008?

I know, I know. McCain was just doing it for political expediency, so it doesn't count!

Actually, that was Jerry Falwell, but they are two sides of the same coin.

DD is correct. I'll drop the Wright stuff. But I would be lying to say that it doesn't bother me to a degree. But hell, still voted for him in the primary. :lol:

Were you part of the "vast crossover conspiracy"? (to defeat Hillary)

Oh come on, like anyone wants to talk about Biden. There were maybe 20 new posts in the weekend after Obama announced his running mate; there've been 2000 since the Palin announcement.

Isn't that Putin there behind the crab?If you look close enough...

http://img75.imageshack.us/img75/544/30palin3largefz6.jpg

So can I assume that Democrats are doing cartwheels that her 17 year old daughter got knocked up. ;)I know that everything the Republican machine does is deliberate, so I'm waiting to see how this plays out before fully casting a 'ha-ha' to McCain. Everything seems like it's part of some diabolical plan.

Were you part of the "vast crossover conspiracy"? (to defeat Hillary)

:lol: No. My primary was before I had even heard of such a thing. Made me feel like a pioneer, though.

It was my intense dislike of McCain and Hillary.

I know that everything the Republican machine does is deliberate, so I'm waiting to see how this plays out before fully casting a 'ha-ha' to McCain. Everything seems like it's part of some diabolical plan.


If they are truly that smart, they should be leading us.

I think in this day and age, you take the person with the fewest problems to be your running mate, because there are skeletons in every closet today. Videos of many of them, even.

...and I do agree we need a Palin photo thread.

http://www.dph.com/fark/welcome_to_alaska_sfw.jpg

I know that everything the Republican machine does is deliberate, so I'm waiting to see how this plays out before fully casting a 'ha-ha' to McCain. Everything seems like it's part of some diabolical plan.

I keep thinking Ashton Kutcher is going to jump out at the RNC and announce the real VP candidate. I think we have all been punk'd.

Whew! I'm glad someone started this thread. I still feel sticky after having to post in the presidential thread.

Mmmmmm... Sarah Palin :drool:

She's hot enough to make me almost believe in God.

somebody pointed out something interesting to me about the Bristol Palin story. Here are the first three paragraphs of the New York Times article:

ST. PAUL, Sept 1 (Reuters) - The 17-year-old daughter of Republican vice presidential candidate Sarah Palin is pregnant, Palin said on Monday in an announcement intended to knock down rumors by liberal bloggers that Palin faked her own pregnancy to cover up for her child.

Bristol Palin, one of Alaska Gov. Palin's five children with her husband, Todd, is about five months pregnant and is going to keep the child and marry the father, the Palins said in a statement released by the campaign of Republican presidential candidate John McCain.

Bristol Palin made the decision on her own to keep the baby, McCain aides said.

http://www.nytimes.com/reuters/us/international-usa-politics-palin.html?_r=1&ei=5070&emc=eta1&oref=slogin

Interesting word choice from a campaign that, if it had its prefered policy implemented, would leave Bristol Palin without a decision to make.

we are screwed as a nation

Interesting that you find that interesting.

somebody pointed out something interesting to me about the Bristol Palin story. Here are the first three paragraphs of the New York Times article:



http://www.nytimes.com/reuters/us/international-usa-politics-palin.html?_r=1&ei=5070&emc=eta1&oref=slogin

Interesting word choice from a campaign that, if it had its prefered policy implemented, would leave Bristol Palin without a decision to make.


:shrug:

Could not "decision on her own to keep the baby" also mean keeping it instead of giving it up for adoption?

we are screwed as a nationDon't worry too much, I don't think Obama will win.

:shrug:

Could not "decision on her own to keep the baby" also mean keeping it instead of giving it up for adoption?NO! It goes against all preconcieved notions.

When Obama directed the media in no uncertain terms to BACK OFF the Palin wild-child preggo story, was there any winking involved?

Whew! I'm glad someone started this thread. I still feel sticky after having to post in the presidential thread.


Damn.

When Obama directed the media in no uncertain terms to BACK OFF the Palin wild-child preggo story, was there any winking involved?


He's the candidate of change. He's above all that. ;)

He's the candidate of change. He's above all that. ;)"You will not talk about the dirty, white trash slut even if she's carrying her own father's incestuous baby."

Those of you criticizing Senator Obama's response -- what would you have prefered him to say?

And your translation: Wright speaks for Obama (despite Obama having said otherwise)

I know we're backing off Wright (for now), but as has been pointed out, Obama sat and listened to this raving lunatic for something like 20 years. You know the old saying, "actions speak louder than words".

Those of you criticizing Senator Obama's response -- what would you have prefered him to say?"I concede the election."

boy, take the lame ass jokes out of these threads and they could be condensed to half a page

When Obama directed the media in no uncertain terms to BACK OFF the Palin wild-child preggo story, was there any winking involved?

I don't know if the comments he made in Detroit were his only comments. The ones he made here were pretty curt about the inappropriateness of the question. He also made clear that if any of his staffers were involved, they'd be fired. He left little to no wiggle room. (and I'm NOT an Obama supporter; however, I am glad he said what he said.)

No matter what Obama said, people are going to bitch and complain. Had he attacked her over this whole thing and ran a smear campaign, they would of called foul. Now that he didn't say anything and actually took up for her - well, he is just being dirty and sarcastic.

Those of you criticizing Senator Obama's response -- what would you have prefered him to say?


If he did a jig, I would have been impressed with his honesty.

Seriously, I posted that I agreed with and liked his comments. The rest is just jokes, dude.

No matter what Obama said, people are going to bitch and complain. Had he attacked her over this whole thing and ran a smear campaign, they would of called foul. Now that he didn't say anything and actually took up for her - well, he is just being dirty and sarcastic.

He didn't take up for her. He was absolutely clear that he considered kids "off limits" in the campaign rhetoric. He has kids too. Hopefully, it sets some rules for the media, staffers would "do anything", etc.

He might have been a little defensive as he was being asked if his campaign had anything to do with the rumors on Kos. But I have to say that his expressed disgust seemed pretty real.

boy, take the lame ass jokes out of these threads and they could be condensed to half a page


You'd just have mine left. :rimshot:


:grunt: I'm watching you, dick!

I consider myself and independent even though I voted for Bush. But does anyone, and I mean just true Republicans realize that McCain didn't choose Palin for her experience, or morals, or political beliefs he essentially chose her because she is a woman and will take some of the media coverage off of Obama. When he found out her daughter was pregnant he probably loved it because there's more media coverage on him and his running mate. Its that sort of decision that I think is very dangerous. I mean at least Obama knew that he had areas that needed to be addressed and chose a running mate that could help him.

I guess McCain believes in the old quote,
"It doesn't matter what they're saying about you as long as they're talking about you"

It's easy to say lay off the kids when they are so young. The media isn't going to go after one of his kids for throwing a spitball in class. ;)

Also, I must have missed the criticism of Obama's remarks. I thought they were good.

I consider myself and independent even though I voted for Bush. But does anyone, and I mean just true Republicans realize that McCain didn't choose Palin for her experience, or morals, or political beliefs he essentially chose her because she is a woman and will take some of the media coverage off of Obama. When he found out her daughter was pregnant he probably loved it because there's more media coverage on him and his running mate. Its that sort of decision that I think is very dangerous. I mean at least Obama knew that he had areas that needed to be addressed and chose a running mate that could help him.

I guess McCain believes in the old quote,
"It doesn't matter what they're saying about you as long as they're talking about you"


I believe you are right about why he chose her, but I think you are wrong that he believes any press is good press.

I consider myself and independent even though I voted for Bush. But does anyone, and I mean just true Republicans realize that McCain didn't choose Palin for her experience, or morals, or political beliefs he essentially chose her because she is a woman and will take some of the media coverage off of Obama. When he found out her daughter was pregnant he probably loved it because there's more media coverage on him and his running mate. Its that sort of decision that I think is very dangerous. I mean at least Obama knew that he had areas that needed to be addressed and chose a running mate that could help him.

I guess McCain believes in the old quote,
"It doesn't matter what they're saying about you as long as they're talking about you"
Seriously, I could care less about his reasons (although I don't actually agree with a thing you said). I am so opposed to Obama politically that I would need to catch McCain raping a puppy while chanting the words of Chairman Mao to techno music to not vote for McCain (or had he picked Lieberman).
So, there you have it. I'm just being honest.

Seriously, I could care less about his reasons (although I don't actually agree with a thing you said). I am so opposed to Obama politically that I would need to catch him raping a puppy while chanting the words of Chairman Mao to techno music to not vote for him (or had he picked Lieberman).
So, there you have it. I'm just being honest.

Well any argument that includes puppy raping and techno music can't be rebutted.

I'm just really glad California is a blue state so vote for who you want it'll prob go democratic anyway.

I consider myself and independent even though I voted for Bush. But does anyone, and I mean just true Republicans realize that McCain didn't choose Palin for her experience, or morals, or political beliefs he essentially chose her because she is a woman and will take some of the media coverage off of Obama.

I don't believe that at all. I believe he chose her because she'll appeal to Reagan Democrats and Rust Belters.

When Obama directed the media in no uncertain terms to BACK OFF the Palin wild-child preggo story, was there any winking involved?

No. Remember, this is the man who says his wife is off limits, and she's actively campaigning for him. He can't say that this is a legitimate issue without being hit as a supreme hypocrite.

Also, I must have missed the criticism of Obama's remarks. I thought they were good.

When Obama directed the media in no uncertain terms to BACK OFF the Palin wild-child preggo story, was there any winking involved?

He's the candidate of change. He's above all that. ;)

"You will not talk about the dirty, white trash slut even if she's carrying her own father's incestuous baby."

Although Deputy Dave clarified that he was joking. I'll assume Jack Straw and Red Dog were as well.

It's easy to say lay off the kids when they are so young. The media isn't going to go after one of his kids for throwing a spitball in class. ;)

He could have made that distinction, but he clearly didn't. I'll be honest, they were the most direct, unequivocal words I've heard him say (I'm referring to his televised comments in Detroit at the end of a labor picnic.)

Why are you giuys making me defend him? :mad: I'm for the other guy.

He could have made that distinction, but he clearly didn't. I'll be honest, they were the most direct, unequivocal words I've heard him say (I'm referring to his televised comments in Detroit at the end of a labor picnic.)

Why are you giuys making me defend him? :mad: I'm for the other guy.


Absolutely. I just think he and his staff were :banana: away from the press when they heard the news.

Although Deputy Dave clarified that he was joking. I'll assume Jack Straw and Red Dog were as well.


I guess I expected criticism to be more critical. :lol:

Absolutely. I just think he and his staff were :banana: away from the press when they heard the news.

Maybe, after they searched everyone for cameras and microphones. :)

Seriously, I could care less about his reasons (although I don't actually agree with a thing you said). I am so opposed to Obama politically that I would need to catch him raping a puppy while chanting the words of Chairman Mao to techno music to not vote for him (or had he picked Lieberman).
So, there you have it. I'm just being honest.

Is this rape of the puppy a violent crime or a crime of passion? My vote depends on it.

I wonder ho much The Bradley Effect will come into play this election

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bradley_effect

Seriously, I could care less about his reasons (although I don't actually agree with a thing you said). I am so opposed to Obama politically that I would need to catch him raping a puppy while chanting the words of Chairman Mao to techno music to not vote for him (or had he picked Lieberman).
So, there you have it. I'm just being honest.


your use of "him" in the sentence above refers to Obama and not McCain. It should be in McCain did the puppy-raping...etc (which is what I'm sure you meant), but after reading and re-reading it, it doesn't make sense the way it is.

Is this rape of the puppy a violent crime or a crime of passion? My vote depends on it.
Rape is about power, not passion. :(

your use of "him" in the sentence above refers to Obama and not McCain. It should be in McCain did the puppy-raping...etc (which is what I'm sure you meant), but after reading and re-reading it, it doesn't make sense the way it is.Yes, HIM refers to McCain doing the puppy raping. I shall fix it.

Yes, HIM refers to McCain doing the puppy raping. I shall fix it.

It's no big deal. I was just clarifying to make sure. :)

It's no big deal. I was just clarifying to make sure. :)Puppy rape is always a big deal. Which is why it could turn an election.

Puppy rape is always a big deal. Which is why it could turn an election.

true. It ruined my chances for Junior class treasurer.

Plus it's easier to get dvdtalker panties in a twist when you suggest any kind of animal abuse. :p

An interesting poll at the Republican National Committee website...

http://www.gop.mfbiz.com/#/newpalinbidenpoll/4530692820

An interesting poll at the Republican National Committee website...

http://www.gop.mfbiz.com/#/newpalinbidenpoll/4530692820
Wow, it's almost as if Democrats had the ability to access that site.

With all the baggage this woman has, it makes me wonder: Who the fuck have the Repubs got doing their Veep vetting?? Karl Rove must be turning over in his grave.

Plus it's easier to get dvdtalker panties in a twist when you suggest any kind of animal abuse. :pYeah, I almost put child rape but then I thought it needed to be more extreme. Puppys tend to rate higher than children here.

This just in Todd Palin raped a puppy when he was 17. John McCain new about this but was sensitive because its a "family matter". He still believes Sarah Palin is the best canidate for the VP spot.

:shrug:

Could not "decision on her own to keep the baby" also mean keeping it instead of giving it up for adoption?

Here's the statement from the Palin family:

Statement from Sarah and Todd Palin



ARLINGTON, VA -- Today, Sarah and Todd Palin issued the following statement regarding today's Reuters story:

"We have been blessed with five wonderful children who we love with all our heart and mean everything to us. Our beautiful daughter Bristol came to us with news that as parents we knew would make her grow up faster than we had ever planned. We're proud of Bristol's decision to have her baby and even prouder to become grandparents. As Bristol faces the responsibilities of adulthood, she knows she has our unconditional love and support.

"Bristol and the young man she will marry are going to realize very quickly the difficulties of raising a child, which is why they will have the love and support of our entire family. We ask the media to respect our daughter and Levi's privacy as has always been the tradition of children of candidates."

http://www.johnmccain.com/informing/news/PressReleases/ab547fc8-d96d-4f87-aa8a-2e52be2b66fc.htm

Pretty clearly they are talking about Bristol making a decision not to have an abortion.

Pretty clearly they are talking about Bristol making a decision not to have an abortion.

Would that be the "choice" in pro-choice? No old men in Washington told her to have it. She (okay, her parents) made the decision.

Would that be the "choice" in pro-choice? No old men in Washington told her to have it. She (okay, her parents) made the decision.

Well, that's my point. The Palins implicitly acknowledge in their release that Bristol had a choice to make, yet they would enact policies that would take Bristol's choice away from her.

Would that be the "choice" in pro-choice? No old men in Washington told her to have it. She (okay, her parents) made the decision.It does sometimes seem that some of the more strident voices in the Pro-choice crowd are more "kill babies" than anything else.

I'm pro-choice in the sense that I think a woman (and her mate if he's in the picture) have the right to choose, but I hope they would explore every other option available before deciding to go to that extreme.

I guess I'm saying I'm pro-choice but hope the choice is not abortion.

Would that be the "choice" in pro-choice? No old men in Washington told her to have it. She (okay, her parents) made the decision.
You were right in the other thread. We do need a 'grasping at straws' smiley.

I consider myself and independent even though I voted for Bush. But does anyone, and I mean just true Republicans realize that McCain didn't choose Palin for her experience, or morals, or political beliefs he essentially chose her because she is a woman and will take some of the media coverage off of Obama.
That is the truth. And since Republican claims of Obama's lack of experience don't appear to be having an effect, he figured that HER lack of experience would mean that there would be very little for the Democrats to latch on to. Picking a more experienced woman for VP increased the probability of dirt being found.

When he found out her daughter was pregnant he probably loved it because there's more media coverage on him and his running mate. Its that sort of decision that I think is very dangerous. I mean at least Obama knew that he had areas that needed to be addressed and chose a running mate that could help him.

I guess McCain believes in the old quote,
"It doesn't matter what they're saying about you as long as they're talking about you"
I disagree with this. There is no political advantage for McCain with the news of Palin's daughter's pregnancy.

I consider myself and independent even though I voted for Bush. But does anyone, and I mean just true Republicans realize that McCain didn't choose Palin for her experience, or morals, or political beliefs he essentially chose her because she is a woman and will take some of the media coverage off of Obama. When he found out her daughter was pregnant he probably loved it because there's more media coverage on him and his running mate. Its that sort of decision that I think is very dangerous. I mean at least Obama knew that he had areas that needed to be addressed and chose a running mate that could help him.

I guess McCain believes in the old quote,
"It doesn't matter what they're saying about you as long as they're talking about you"

Well it has been said the aids knew she was with child. I wouldn't be surprised if they planned to use that to bait people into attacking her. In other words to create Mindless Republican PUMAs and to get women in general to defend her.

Well it has been said the aids knew she was with child. I wouldn't be surprised if they planned to use that to bait people into attacking her. In other words to create Mindless Republican PUMAs and to get women in general to defend her.Another article posted earlier said that people in her home town knew she was pregnant.

I'm 100% sure McCain knew about it. I'm also sure it wasn't used as a positive in her consideration (except for perhaps someone sugesting it might bring a slight sympathy factor from older women).

I think it's bizarre that he would choose someone that he literally doesn't know, other than impressions from a few discussions. She might turn out to be someone that he doesn't like to be around, let alone work with. I would have expected him to select someone he knew well enough to have a good read on what the chemistry would be. I know that the ultimate role of the VP is to step into the role of president, but beyond that wouldn't you want to select someone based on a few meetings? It's very unorthodox and give me reason to questions his judgement.

Another article posted earlier said that people in her home town knew she was pregnant.

I'm 100% sure McCain knew about it. I'm also sure it wasn't used as a positive in her consideration (except for perhaps someone sugesting it might bring a slight sympathy factor from older women).
No. There is no benefit. I don't know of any Evangelical Christian women who are pleased with the selection of Sarah Palin for VP. The more information (not rumor or spin) that comes out about her and her family, the more these women dislike her.

I disagree with this. There is no political advantage for McCain with the news of Palin's daughter's pregnancy.

You never know with women. Some may sympathize with Palin because she's a Mother who's teen daughter got knocked up. Others may sympathize because the Teen didn't abort.

You just never know how these things will pan out.

I just want to know how she plans to defend abstinence on a national level if he can't defend it within her family. I believe sex education is very important and needs to be taught to teenagers. If you don't teach someone how to protect themselves we're going to have a much bigger problem than abortion. Although I don't believe in abortion I don't believe that someone unprepared should be forced into parenthood due to poor decision making. Children will make poor decisions life is all about trial and error.

So I really question Palin's agenda.

No. There is no benefit. I don't know of any Evangelical Christian women who are pleased with the selection of Sarah Palin for VP. The more information (not rumor or spin) that comes out about her and her family, the more these women dislike her.Coming from a family filled with evangelical Christian women (unfortunately) I've got to completely disagree with this. My mom, sister, sister-in-law, stepmother, and brother's wife's family are all ga-ga over Palin. Based on this unequivocal anecdotal poll McCain will get 100% of the evangelical Christian women vote.

With all the baggage this woman has, it makes me wonder: Who the fuck have the Repubs got doing their Veep vetting?? Karl Rove must be turning over in his grave.

Are you (foolishly) assuming that none of the other candidates had baggage this "severe" ( :lol: ) or worse?

You never know with women. Some may sympathize with Palin because she's a Mother who's teen daughter got knocked up. Others may sympathize because the Teen didn't abort.

You just never know how these things will pan out.The knocked up teenage mother voter segment is clearly one that the media has ignored this election. -ohbfrank-

The knocked up teenage mother voter segment is clearly one that the media has ignored this election. -ohbfrank-The "Juno" bump.

Wow, it's almost as if Democrats had the ability to access that site.

:lol:

Coming from a family filled with evangelical Christian women (unfortunately) I've got to completely disagree with this. My mom, sister, sister-in-law, stepmother, and brother's wife's family are all ga-ga over Palin. Based on this unequivocal anecdotal poll McCain will get 100% of the evangelical Christian women vote.
Well, there ya go. :)

The knocked up teenage mother voter segment is clearly one that the media has ignored this election. -ohbfrank-

Yep. About as much as they're Boyfriends ignored pulling out.

I just want to know how she plans to defend abstinence on a national level if he can't defend it within her family. I believe sex education is very important and needs to be taught to teenagers. If you don't teach someone how to protect themselves we're going to have a much bigger problem than abortion. Although I don't believe in abortion I don't believe that someone unprepared should be forced into parenthood due to poor decision making. Children will make poor decisions life is all about trial and error.



Maybe the same way a safe sex advocate defends someone getting pregnant who has attended a sex education class with condom demonstrations. Mistakes happen and kids don’t listen.

The "Juno" bump....if only they were old enough to vote. Another disenfranchised group of voters in this country. :(

It does sometimes seem that some of the more strident voices in the Pro-choice crowd are more "kill babies" than anything else.

I'm pro-choice in the sense that I think a woman (and her mate if he's in the picture) have the right to choose, but I hope they would explore every other option available before deciding to go to that extreme.

I guess I'm saying I'm pro-choice but hope the choice is not abortion.

You just described the position of most pro-choice people.

And I applaud Bristol Palin's decision to keep her child. I just think its funny that her mother's press release acknowledges that it is a decision when the policies she prefers would take that decision away from people in Bristol's situation.

...if only they were old enough to vote. Another disenfranchised group of voters in this country. :(

:lol: Awesome.

You never know with women. Some may sympathize with Palin because she's a Mother who's teen daughter got knocked up. Others may sympathize because the Teen didn't abort. And the other 90-95% of the electorate will be scratching their heads about this choice.

The media still hasn't told us who the baby's father is. I wonder which John it is - McCain or Edwards.

More fun Palin news! (http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalpunch/2008/09/members-of-frin.html)

Members of 'Fringe' Alaskan Independence Party Say Palin Was a Member in 90s

September 01, 2008 6:52 PM

The campaign of Sen. John McCain, R-Ariz., likes to herald the independence of its new running mate, Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin.

Officials of the Alaskan Independence Party say that Palin was once so independent, she was once a member of their party, which, since the 1970s, has been pushing for a legal vote for Alaskans to decide whether or not residents of the 49th state can secede from the United States.

And while McCain's motto -- as seen in a new TV ad -- is "Country First," the AIP's motto is the exact opposite -- "Alaska First -- Alaska Always."

Lynette Clark, the chairman of the AIP, tells ABC News that Palin and her husband Todd were members in 1994, even attending the 1994 statewide convention in Wasilla. Clark was AIP secretary at the time.

"We are a state's rights party," says Clark, a self-employed goldminer. The AIP has "a plank that challenges the legality of the Alaskan statehood vote as illegal and in violation of United Nations charter and international law."

She says it's not accurate to describe the party as secessionist -- they just want a vote, she says, adding that the members of the AIP hold different opinions on what Alaska should be.

"My own separate opinion as an individual is that we should be an independent nation," Clark says. Others in the AIP "believe that being a commonwealth would be a good avenue to follow." Some advocate statehood -- but a fuller statehood than exists now.

She doesn't know what Palin's position was.

"It never came up in conversation," Clark recalls. "But when she joined the party, our platform was right under her nose."

Clark says that Palin left the party and became a Republican in 1996, when she first ran for mayor of Wasilla.

The McCain-Palin campaign did not immediately respond to a request for comment.

The AIP platform states that the purpose of the party is to "seek the complete repatriation of the public lands, held by the federal government, to the state and people of Alaska in conformance with Article 1, Section 8, Clause 17, of the federal constitution ... To prohibit all bureaucratic regulations and judicial rulings purporting to have the effect of law, except that which shall be approved by the elected legislature ... To support the privatization of government services ...”

Walter Hickel, a former Republican governor, was elected to the governorship in 1990 as an AIP member -- the third-largest party in Alaska -- with a plurality vote of 38.8%. A Seattle Post-Intelligencer story that year said that "Hickel is running with the Alaska Independence Party, a fringe group advocating that the 49th state declare itself a sovereign nation. But he's not a separatist; he's an opportunist: the Independence Party was the only 11th-hour ticket to the general election."

Hickel returned to the Republican Party in 1994; he endorsed Palin in her gubernatorial run in 2006. Subsequent AIP gubernatorial candidates did not fare as well as did Hickel, garnering less than 2 percent of the vote.

Earlier this year, Palin sent a video message to the AIP for its annual convention, where AIP vice chair George Clark told the small crowd that Palin "was an AIP member before she got the job as a mayor of a small town –- that was a non-partisan job. But you get along to go along -– she eventually joined the Republican Party, where she had all kinds of problems with their ethics, and well, I won’t go into that. She also had about an 80 percent approval rating, and is pretty well sympathetic to her former membership."

Lynette Clark says that Palin is "a fine individual. She's forthright and she puts Alaska first."

She is not a fan of McCain.

"I can't understand why in God's name she has aligned herself with a candidate who opposes the development of our republic and Alaska's resource wealth," Clark says.

The campaign of Sen. John McCain, R-Ariz., likes to herald the independence of its new running mate, Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin.

Officials of the Alaskan Independence Party say that Palin was once so independent, she was once a member of their party, which, since the 1970s, has been pushing for a legal vote for Alaskans to decide whether or not residents of the 49th state can secede from the United States.

And while McCain's motto -- as seen in a new TV ad -- is "Country First," the AIP's motto is the exact opposite -- "Alaska First -- Alaska Always."

Lynette Clark, the chairman of the AIP, tells ABC News that Palin and her husband Todd were members in 1994, even attending the 1994 statewide convention in Wasilla. Clark was AIP secretary at the time.

"We are a state's rights party," says Clark, a self-employed goldminer. The AIP has "a plank that challenges the legality of the Alaskan statehood vote as illegal and in violation of United Nations charter and international law."

She says it's not accurate to describe the party as secessionist -- they just want a vote, she says, adding that the members of the AIP hold different opinions on what Alaska should be.

"My own separate opinion as an individual is that we should be an independent nation," Clark says. Others in the AIP "believe that being a commonwealth would be a good avenue to follow." Some advocate statehood -- but a fuller statehood than exists now.

She doesn't know what Palin's position was.

"It never came up in conversation," Clark recalls. "But when she joined the party, our platform was right under her nose."

Clark says that Palin left the party and became a Republican in 1996, when she first ran for mayor of Wasilla.

The McCain-Palin campaign did not immediately respond to a request for comment.

The AIP platform states that the purpose of the party is to "seek the complete repatriation of the public lands, held by the federal government, to the state and people of Alaska in conformance with Article 1, Section 8, Clause 17, of the federal constitution ... To prohibit all bureaucratic regulations and judicial rulings purporting to have the effect of law, except that which shall be approved by the elected legislature ... To support the privatization of government services ...”

Walter Hickel, a former Republican governor, was elected to the governorship in 1990 as an AIP member -- the third-largest party in Alaska -- with a plurality vote of 38.8%. A Seattle Post-Intelligencer story that year said that "Hickel is running with the Alaska Independence Party, a fringe group advocating that the 49th state declare itself a sovereign nation. But he's not a separatist; he's an opportunist: the Independence Party was the only 11th-hour ticket to the general election."

Hickel returned to the Republican Party in 1994; he endorsed Palin in her gubernatorial run in 2006. Subsequent AIP gubernatorial candidates did not fare as well as did Hickel, garnering less than 2 percent of the vote.

Earlier this year, Palin sent a video message to the AIP for its annual convention, where AIP vice chair George Clark told the small crowd that Palin "was an AIP member before she got the job as a mayor of a small town –- that was a non-partisan job. But you get along to go along -– she eventually joined the Republican Party, where she had all kinds of problems with their ethics, and well, I won’t go into that. She also had about an 80 percent approval rating, and is pretty well sympathetic to her former membership."

Lynette Clark says that Palin is "a fine individual. She's forthright and she puts Alaska first."

She is not a fan of McCain.

"I can't understand why in God's name she has aligned herself with a candidate who opposes the development of our republic and Alaska's resource wealth," Clark says.


http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalpunch/2008/09/members-of-frin.html

Maybe the same way a safe sex advocate defends someone getting pregnant who has attended a sex education class with condom demonstrations. Mistakes happen and kids don’t listen.

I actually agree with you.

The media still hasn't told us who the baby's father is. I wonder which John it is - McCain or Edwards.

They had the baby's daddy name in the release statement which was probably a big mistake because now he will be hounded without end unless the media practices some restraint.

Well, Obama belonged to a group that believed that God was the enemy of white people and would help destroy them. The past is off limits.

My dad is also a member. He's a Republican with very strong Libertarian leanings. I'll call him and ask what he thinks. I know most people in the group don't really want a separate nation. More advocates of much stronger states rights. As far as I can tell it very much falls into the true conservative beliefs.

Maybe the same way a safe sex advocate defends someone getting pregnant who has attended a sex education class with condom demonstrations. Mistakes happen and kids don’t listen.

I do agree with this, and I certainly wouldn't use a single anecdote to prove that abstinence-only education is ineffective. It is ineffictive, but that's because the data proves it so -- not because of what Bristol Palin did or did not do.

I will say that it is funny watching the social cosnervatives contort themselves into the idea that an unwed 17-year-old getting knocked up is a celebration of family values.

They had the baby's daddy name in the release statement which was probably a big mistake because now he will be hounded without end unless the media practices some restraint.

Yeah, his name is Levi. Things would have worked out better if it had been Onan.

Platform and Goal of the Alaskan Independence Party

Preamble:
We affirm that all political power is inherent in the people; that all government originates with the people, is founded on their will only, is instituted to protect the rights of the individual; that all persons have a natural right to life, liberty, the pursuit of happiness, and the enjoyment of the rewards of their own industry; that all persons are equal and entitled to equal protection under the law. We stand on a firm constitutional foundation.

Platform
We pledge to exert our best efforts to accomplish the following:

-To effect full compliance with the constitutions of the United States of America and the State of Alaska.

-To support and defend States' Rights, Individual Rights, Property Rights, and the Equal Footing Doctrine as guaranteed by the constitutions of the United States of America and the state of Alaska.

-To advocate the convening of a State Constitutional Convention at the constitutionally designated 10 year interval.

-To reinforce the unalienable rights endowed by our Creator to Alaska law, by eliminating the use of the word "privilege" in the Alaska statutes.

-To amend the Constitution of the State of Alaska so as to re-establish the rights of all Alaskan residents to entry upon all public lands within the state, and to acquire private property interest there in, under fair and reasonable conditions. Such property interest shall include surface and sub-surface patent.

-To foster a constitutional amendment abolishing and prohibiting all property taxes.

-To seek the complete repatriation of the public lands, held by the federal government, to the state and people of Alaska in conformance with Article 1, Section 8, Clause 17, of the federal constitution.

-To prohibit all bureaucratic regulations and judicial rulings purporting to have the effect of law, except that which shall be approved by the elected legislature.

-To preserve and protect the Alaska Permanent Fund, Permanent fund earnings, earnings reserve fund and individual Permanent Fund Dividends.

-To provide for the direct popular election of the attorney general, all judges, and magistrates.

-To provide for the development of unrestricted, statewide, surface transportation and utility corridors as needed by the public or any individual.

-To affirm and assert every possible right-of-way established under R.S. 2477 of July 26, 1866, before its repeal by the Federal Land Management Policy Act of October 21, 1976.

-To support the right of the individual to keep and bear arms.

-To support the complete abolition of the concept of sovereign or governmental immunity, so as to restore accountability for public servants.

-To support the rights of parents to privately or home school their children.

-To support the privatization of government services.

-To oppose the borrowing of money by government for any purposes other than for capital improvements.

-To strengthen the traditional family and support individual accountability without government interference or regulation.

-To support the right of jurors to judge the law as well as the facts, according to their conscience.

-To support "Jobs for Alaskans...First!"

I will say that it is funny watching the social cosnervatives contort themselves into the idea that an unwed 17-year-old getting knocked up is a celebration of family values.
It doesn't bother me too much because socially I fairly liberal (pro-choice, pro gay rights, atheist). I just think everything else is so important I'm willing to put up with the other crap the religious right pushes.

Oh man, do I love this pick. :lol:

Oh man, do I love this pick. :lol:It's not like its a group like La Raza. It's a political party. Not everyone in a political party agrees with everything in the platform. 99% of it is state rights issues that most conservatives should be able to get behind.

I will say that it is funny watching the social conservatives contort themselves into the idea that an unwed 17-year-old getting knocked up is a celebration of family values.
Yep. Only in politics.

After watching the DNC last week, and Obama's speech in particular, I have been convinced that I cannot vote for Obama. Unfortunately, with McCain's pick of Palin, I'm convinced that I cannot vote for McCain either.

Oh man, do I love this pick. :lol:

Oh, man, me too.

I wait with bated breath for more hilarious revelations. The vetting of Palin is beginning to sound like they checked her driver's license and that's about it.

:lol:

Oh, man, me too.

I wait with bated breath for more hilarious revelations. The vetting of Palin is beginning to sound like they checked her driver's license and that's about it.

:lol:What's been revealed that you think McCain didn't know? It's obvious the pregnancy was known and I can't believe her previous party affiliation wasn't known. People have made much more drastic jumps from Republican to Democrat and vice versa in the past. The AIP is basically what the GOP would be if they had any balls

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rotfl
"Can you tell me one decision she has made?"
"Um .... uh .... stop belittling her!"

The AIP is basically what the GOP would be if they had any balls
That platform is solid. :up:

if bush got elected with the bombshell that he hid a DUI arrest decades ago, this is nothing. clinton and bush both smoked pot, got drunk, etc

http://content.vetpalin.com/index.html

If Levi Johnston had kept his Johnson in his Levi's, none of this would have happened.

I think it's bizarre that he would choose someone that he literally doesn't know, other than impressions from a few discussions. She might turn out to be someone that he doesn't like to be around, let alone work with. I would have expected him to select someone he knew well enough to have a good read on what the chemistry would be. I know that the ultimate role of the VP is to step into the role of president, but beyond that wouldn't you want to select someone based on a few meetings? It's very unorthodox and give me reason to questions his judgement.

You seem to be under a strange delusion that Presidents and Vice Presidents are supposed to like each other.

With all the baggage this woman has, it makes me wonder: Who the fuck have the Repubs got doing their Veep vetting?? Karl Rove must be turning over in his grave.

You're kidding, right? Karl Rove is locked in the bathroom at Fox News masturbating wildly at the thought of liberals attacking a pregnant teenager. Obama may've said lay off, but Andrew Sullivan and the nuts at Daily Kos are still running with it -- they don't even believe this disproves Bristol-is-Trig's-mother theory -- and if they make enough noise, Obama will have to make further disavowals of his followers.

The "Juno" bump.

Note that a lot of conservatives liked the message of Juno.

What I was thinking was the public picked John McCain, and Barack Obama...We don't pick the VP choice.

Obama picks Biden, who brings the foreign policy experience that Barack needed.

What did Palin bring to McCain?

They had the baby's daddy name in the release statement which was probably a big mistake because now he will be hounded without end unless the media practices some restraint.

Or if his family owns guns.

Which, given this is Alaska, is probably a big 10-4.

Hey I have an idea... let's talk about Reverend Wright again! :banana:

GatorDeb, I'm sorry you weren't around for it when it was the big hubbub.

Well, see, I was going to go McCain, but now I'm having second thoughts, so I'm going back to square one and re-doing my decision. And I can't vote for Obama until I get a good enough explanation of how he attended that church for decades and didn't know what kind of stuff his pastor preached.

What did Palin bring to McCain?Boobs.

Oh man, do I love this pick. :lol:

So do I -- the Alaska Independence group is really libertarian.

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I found this to be interesting: a Frank Luntz conducted focus group of undecided Minnesota voters on the topic of Governor Palin's candidacy.

You're kidding, right? Karl Rove is locked in the bathroom at Fox News masturbating wildly at the thought of liberals attacking a pregnant teenager.

What an awesome metaphor.

Both are fantasies.

And the other 90-95% of the electorate will be scratching their heads about this choice.

Ok, maybe you're right. But they were probably doing that anyway.

Meh, none of this matters. Neither McCain nor Obama will change a Goddamn thing in America. Both will just tow their party agenda and America will continue its slide into shithood.


But it's fun to hope. :lol:

The AIP is basically what the GOP would be if they had any balls

I agree, but the nuances are going to be lost on the public. The attack ads will go:

"Did you know Sarah Palin belonged to a group that advocated secession from the United States?"

and

"Did you know Sarah Palin thinks the Iraq war is about