DaveWadding

So what albums do I need from KISS that came out between 1978-82? I already have Ace's solo and Creatures...any other suggestion would be welcome. Thanks.

Hokeyboy

The only ones you really DONT need are Gene's and Peter's solo albums. There are worthwhile songs on every other album of the era. Between 1978 and 1982? Here's my recommendations (IN CHRONOLOGICAL ORDER):

1. Ace Frehley (solo) -- nothing short of a great rock-and-roll record, period. Notable songs: Rip It Out, Snowblind, Ozone, Speeding Back To My Baby, New York Groove, Fractured Mirror

2. Paul Stanley (solo) -- as good as Ace's, but less blustery rock and more refined melodic rock. Notable songs include: It's Alright, Together As One, Move On, Wouldn't You Like To Know Me, Tonight You Belong to Me, Aint Quite Right

3. Double Platinum -- yes it's a "Greatest Hits", but many of the earlier songs have been remastered and remixed extensively (a new outro for Black Diamond, Firehouse, other fixes and rejiggers). Worth a listen, I think the Love Gun here is better than on the Love Gun album.

4. Dynasty -- the weakest of the era. More of a reflection of its era, "I Was Made For Lovin You" and "Sure Know Something" are good songs though, disco pop hits with some killer hooks. But you can't overlook Ace's classic cover of "2,000 Man" and his "Hard Times" original. The rest of the album is forgettable.

5. Unmasked -- UNDERRATED ALBUM. Not Kiss's best record, but their best pop rock album. Great hooks and pop songs, although with its more slick commercial sheen its not a favorite amongst fans of their harder-edged material. I particularly enjoy "Is That You?", "Shandi", "Easy As It Seems", "Torpedo Girl", "Talk To Me" (easily Ace's best pop performance, ever), "Tomorrow". and no real stinkers to speak of. It may not have the groups highest highs, but it's enjoyable and consistent throughout.

6. Music from The Elder -- ah yes, either viewed as the complete AntiChrist, OR touted as the groups most "underrated" album. In my opinion it isn't quite as awful as people think it is. But it's still not all that great. I think "The Oath" is one of the heaviest tunes Kiss has *EVER* done (would have been quite at home on either REVENGE or CREATURES OF THE NIGHT, even DESTROYER), "Just A Boy" is cheese (those falsettoes!!) but enjoyably melodic cheese, "World Without Heroes" is easily one of Gene's best tunes and a great slow burner. "Dark Light" has one of Ace's best solos and guitarwork ever in his time in Kiss. "I" is an serviceable rocker, a bit cheesy in the lyrics department though ("Yes I believe in me!!"). The rest of the album though... pretty much crap. "Odyssey" might be the worst song kiss ever recorded. Still though, I find myself listening to "The Elder" more than I do, say, "Destroyer". The forgettable songs on Destroyer -- the ones that aren't totally played out -- are pretty terrible too (Sweet Pain, Flaming Youth, Great Expectations).

7. Creatures of the Night -- you got it. It rocks. Kiss came back in full form... and nobody cared. It would take a Vinnie Vincent Invasion to bring them back to the Platinum spotlight.

So yeah, all worthwhile except Gene and Peter's solo albums. Run. Run SCREAMING!

nodeerforamonth

Matt Millheiser knows his KISS. Everything he said was 100% right on the mark.

Rocketdog2000

I'll pretty much agree with all that, ESPECIALLY on Unmasked.

The only thing I'd change is that Gene's solo album isn't that bad, at least not when compared to Peter's. Sure it's nowhere near as good as Ace's and Paul's , but there's decent stuff to be found there - "Radioctive", "See You Tonite", "Always Near You/Nowhere To Hide", "Mr. Make Believe", "Man Of 1,000 Faces". Sure, it doesn't all sound like KISS, but it's still alright.

B5Erik

IMO Paul's solo album is the strongest of the four of them.

I would recommend Paul's solo album, Ace's solo album, and if you're feeling adventurous and want to hear Gene's Beatles influences pick up his solo album.

AVOID PETER'S 1978 SOLO ALBUM LIKE THE PLAGUE!!!

Double Platinum is kind of interesting. Some of the remixes are effective, some aren't. They're really dry (not as much reverb as in the original mixes), but some of them are cool. (One of the songs, and I can't remember which, was sped up and went up a half note in pitch - that is annoying as hell!)

Dynasty - is NOT, I repeat, NOT a Disco album. It has ONE, count it, ONE Disco-ROCK song in, "I Was Made for Lovin' You," and the rest ranges from Power Pop to Hard Rock. It is a very good album. "Magic Touch," "Charisma," "Hard Times," "Save Your Love," and "Sure Know Somethin'" are all top notch Rock tracks. If you like KISS, and don't have a problem with the Power Pop (Cheap Trick meets Journey trying to write a KISS album), then this is a must have.

As is Unmasked. A very well produced Pop Rock album, Unmasked shows even more Journey influences than Dynasty did (as Journey was more successful each year up to 1982 or so that isn't surprising). The songs mentioned by Matt are all good, but just as good, IMO are, "What Makes the World Go Round," "Two Sides of the Coin," and, "Naked City," (which may be the album's 2nd best track, really). GREAT stuff - for Power Pop in a slightly ballsier Journey style.

Music From The Elder (or The Elder, for short) is a really interesting album. I got it for Christmas the year it came out. I loved it then, and I like it a lot now. There are some great tracks there, but there is one embarassingly bad song - "The Odyssey," which at least is a song they can honestly say that none of them had a hand in writing. "The Oath," "A World Without Heroes," and, "I" are among their best songs ever (funny, that sounds like the set list that they played on Fridays).

If you like KISS then The Elder is certainly worth buying just to hear what they were trying to do in 1981 to recapture their fanbase.

It's a shame that the earlier version of the album that they were demoing up - the straight ahead Hard Rock album - didn't become the final release. ("Deadly Weapons" is a GREAT song, and it has yet to see the light of day on an official release. The version I've heard sounds as muddy as hell - but it's still great!)

Hokeyboy

As much as I want to like or appreciate Gene's album, I just never could really get into it. "Unplugged" got me to re-listen to "See You Tonite", as well as some of the other OK cuts like "Man of 1,000 Faces", but in the end its just forced indifference.

Words to live by. YIKES! That the kind of sugar that Papa poops on.

Well it is a product of its era, if not a disco album. I would argue what "Sure Know Somethin'" is as much a disco song as "Lovin You", just a slower vibe.

You know, I watched that episode of "Fridays" as well as their apperance on "Solid Gold" where they performed (well, lip-synched) "I" and broadcast the video for "World Without Heroes", back when they were first on. I rushed out to get the album soon afterwards (I was all of 10 or 11) and was massively disappointed. I remember wanting to kick a pigeon after listening to both "Odyssey" and "Mr. Blackwell".

Are you talking about the "Elder Demons"? I love that collection!! Too bad the sound totally blows -- that live version of "Rock n Roll Hell" sounds amazing, I just wish it weren't under 10 tons of concrete.

Spiderbite

It's funny because those two are my favorites of the solo albums. Gene's my favorite, followed by Peter, then Ace, then Paul's. But I always seem to be o the outside of everyone else's preference.

I own everything Matt listed and love every album. What's funny is Ace's and Paul's solo albums are listened to the least out of all the ones he listed (except Double Platinum since I don't listen to greatest hits to often...especially when I already have everything).

Jason

When there's a relatively small number of albums and they're all in print and budget priced, I always recommend that people just get the entire catalog. However, in this case, I would recommend skipping the Gene and Peter solo albums. They're truly awful.

But if you must torture yourself, get the Gene Simmons solo album. It's a total train wreck, where Peter's is just dull pop music.

SkullOrchard

I think Gene's and Peter's solo albums (1978) accomplish what solo albums are supposed to do, that is allow the artist to express a side of their personality that wouldn't necessarily be appropriate within the context of a group setting.

Paul's '78 solo sounded like a KISS album, it was good, but it broke no new ground, it was a safe choice.

Ace's album was great because at that point we had only heard a couple of songs where he took the lead vocal.

Like 'em or not, Gene and Peter went out on a limb and produced very personal albums that were heartfelt and fairly adventurous. I appreciate their effort, and I enjoy both albums.

cactusoly

Ace's album is the best. I think he was the only one who took it seriously. Paul's is OK.

responding to an earlier post, Creatures was recorded with Vinnie Vincent (Ace is just on the cover and made a few appearences)

cultshock

This is actually my favourite KISS era, maybe because that was the period where I first got into them as a 9-10 year old. I agree that Dynasty, Unmasked, Elder and Ace and Paul's solo albums are great, they are among my favourite KISS albums period. I can handle about half of Gene's album, I remember listening to it a lot as a kid, so I guess it really grew on me.

Peter's album, bleh! And I don't think it's that much of a "personal album". I've read that at the time he was recovering from an auto accident and was way behind schedule (the other guys were almost finished theirs and they wanted them released at the same time). So Peter had to resort to "borrowing" already written songs from Stan Penridge, Sean Delaney, etc. and came to a financial arrangement that allowed him to add his name to the songwriting credits with very minimal actual contribution to the songs.

Hokeyboy

Ya know, here's the thing about being a hardcore KISS fan...

We all know the hits. We grew up with the hits. We hear the hits on radio and on TV over and over. We see the hits performed live. We are inundated with the hits time and time again.


We are so bleedin' sick to death of "the hits".

I think the late makeup era albums are so interesting to Kiss fans because they weren't as big (OK "Dynasty" was huge, but non-fans or extremely casual fans really only remember "I Was Made For Lovin You" and *MAYBE* "2,000 Man". I doubt most have ever listened to "Unmasked", "Elder", or most of the solo albums past Ace's "New York Groove". There's a lot of great songs there, so for a big fan it's sometimes more fulfilling to listen to the deep tracks from Dynasty or Unmasked or Paul's solo LP than it is to hear "Beth" or "Rock N Roll All Nite" for the umpteenth-million-time.

That having been said, I can never stop listening to "Alive!", "Kiss!", "Hotter Than Hell", or "Love Gun". Those are my blood. But it's sometimes a lot more fun to take "The Elder" for a spin on the old turntable. Even if it's just for the cringey moments.

An4h0ny

you sir, are a fcking pimp

no additions needed

listen to this man
he knows his KISS

nodeerforamonth

Ace's is not only the best of the four solo albums, but one of the greatest albums ever!

Paul's is good. It's the closest of the solos albums to another KISS album.

The Cow

I agree with that and most of what has been said here.

I just have to get it out. I don't know why, but **I can't stand listening to New York Groove anymore**

Okay, I'm better now.

Rocketdog2000

A bit off topic, but how many people here have heard the original Russ Ballard version of "New York Groove"?

Like most of Russ Ballard's songs (and I am a fan), I find them often better when covered by other artists. Ace's version, for instance, smokes the original.

Oh, and I also forgot to say in my original post that I don't find Dynasty weak, at all. True, I prefer Unmasked overall, but Dynasty is still a good album. It'll also always hold a personal special place for me, as that was the first tour I ever got to see KISS on.

Hokeyboy

I actually heard it for the first time recently...while playing GRAND THEFT AUTO IV! Yes, it's on the soundtrack as they play it on the local Vice City rocks tation.

I was probably too hard on Dynasty, but there's a LOT of junk on that album. Of the era, it's my least favorite.

How do you all feel about UNPLUGGED? That's the one album I can't get enough of, if for no other reason it cuts pretty deep into the Kiss discography.

DaveWadding

That's one of my few little annoyances with GTA...I dunno who owns th rights to the song (whether it's ACe or KISS or what) but how hard would it have been to get Ace's version of Groove ovfer the Russ Ballard original?

I love Unplugged...that version of Comin' Home is my favorite KISS track right now.

Giantrobo

Unplugged is a great album. "Sure Know Something", "I Still Love You", "Coming Home", and others sound awesome played acoustically.

I've always considered the "Unplugged" series to be a great opportunity to prove your band has something beyond BS partially recorded "live" shows and heavily produced albums that cover up your crappy playing.

B5Erik

Unplugged and Alive III are Eric Singer's finest moments.

Two totally different playing styles, and yet he plays both amazingly well. He can also play Jazz as well.

Unplugged is a fantastic album. (The long version from KISSOLOGY 3 has some great outtakes, too.)

nothingfails

no matter what you do, after Gene Simmons' idiotic and greedy remarks about Radiohead and NIN, two groups who actually still have something to say and aren't solely in it for the money, download the KISS albums you don't have off a torrent site or have a friend burn it for you

I love KISS and everything, but Gene is really out of the loop and proves he's not in it for any artistic reasons for giving those two groups hell for trying different types of practices, as opposed to refusing to record another album out of fear someone might download it for free. It must sting that NIN and Radiohead can still excite interest in new material instead of having to stick in a 1977 time warp in order to sell concert tickets. I just can't believe how stupid Gene sounds because Trent and Radiohead are actually in it for the love of music instead of pure greed.

Hokeyboy

God forbid Gene Simmons expresses his own opinion... and one that is, essentially, correct. (By giving away the store for free, you devalue your assets.)

(How those 96 kbps Radiohead tracks sounding, anyhow?)

And since Radiohead and Reznor have already made millions in the music industry already, there were scarcely motivated by altruism... more like desparation, really. I'd have more respect for them if they were struggling up-and-commers.

That having been said, "In Rainbows" is a pretty swell album. Reznor has never recorded anything worth a damn, so screw him.

Hokeyboy

You know, when's KISSOLOGY 4 coming out anyhow?

Incidentally, while the "Unplugged" performance has a bunch of outtakes (including Gene's infamous screwup on the second verse of Domino), I was unaware of how *many* takes were done. I think may 2-3 songs during that performance were done in 1 take.

KissFAQ has an excellent track-by-track recap of the recording session.

nothingfails

well, I think the difference is that Trent and Radiohead are artists. Yes, they love $$$$ as anyone else, but money isn't the sole reason they're in it. As opposed to KISS, who won't even record anything new because someone might download it for free (I don't see the argument, Psycho Circus barely scraped gold and that was pre-Napster, so it wasn't like they were selling millions of albums and would have to worry about selling 100k. If they do a Wal-Mart thing like Eagles or Journey, they could do well). If anything, downloading has made artists work harder on their albums that the consumer would feel like it's worth purchasing. But Gene just threw in the hat and is living in the past, when I think KISS could still have good music to make if Gene wouldn't worry so much that a few people might download it (and let's face it, the downloading generation is under 30 and more into hip hop and nu-metal, KISS shouldn't be affected anymore than The Eagles or Journey were).

People like Radiohead and NIN are moving into the future and showing that they aren't greedy whores who would do a hip hop album if it means more people will buy it. They care about their fans and don't live in a time warp like KISS does these days. Putting the makeup back on was the best thing financially but the worst thing artistically they ever did. It turned them into an oldies act when Revenge and Carnival Of Souls proved that Kiss could've remained a relevant CURRENT act for many years to come.

Giantrobo

Yep, and Gene has never pretended to be anything but "Gene". So you know where he's coming from. Everyone knows Gene got into Rock for $$$$ and Pussy and he'd tell you that if you asked him.