toddly6666

As a casual comic book reader, I picked up this Squadron Supreme (Utopia) book the other day only because I liked the Alex Ross cover and I love 80s Marvel art. I read Squadron Supreme (Utopia) in one day straight and I was surprised that I never even heard of this comic or superhero team. I am also surprised that I rate this book right up next to WATCHMEN now as being the best Superhero Comic series that I have ever read. On the surface of just skimming through the pages, the artwork gave the impression of some typical "wam-bam" action comic, but the length of the series, the detailed complex characters, its political/sociological storyline, not being dated, very appropriate for today's current world affairs, and its epicness is just amazing. I have never read a comic book with so many superheroes in it that have complexity, such as in X-Men, Avengers, Justice League. I may have not read the right ones, but I feel like when i've read X-Men, Avengers, or Justice League for example, there's nothing really that gripping in the storyline or it's all over the place spreading into some other series. I do love everything about Spiderman, Batman, Fantastic Four, X-Men, Superman, and Daredevil, but as an adult now, I have never read anything so compelling/interesting in those comics series. All those comic book famous storylines - Jean Gray turning to Dark Phoenix, Superman/Louis Lane relationship crap, Gwen Stacey death, Goblin father/son issues, Bruce Wayne origins, Wolverine's memory/past, etc - these storylines are okay, but they are all sort of just "blah" and just so what. I don't think they are really that as interesting/complex as in Watchmen or Squadron Supreme.

Right after WATCHMEN and SQUADROM SUPREME, I love Kingdom Come and The Dark Knight Returns, but I see KC and TDK as more visual works of art with an okay storyline, while Watchmen and Squadron are the more interesting reads with simple nice art.

Is Squadron Supreme (Utopia) known to be some sleeper/underrated/unknown masterpiece? How is this Utopia series respected by serious comic book fans?


This is my favorite Superhero series starting with the best:
1. Watchmen
2. Squadron Supreme
3. Kingdom Come
4. The Infinity Gauntlet series
5. The Dark Knight Returns
6. Spiderman: Kraven's Last Hunt
7. Frank Miller's Daredevil Visionaries
8. Justice
9. Ultimate Avengers

(On an unrelated note, the Non-Superhero Graphic novels that I love are Speigelman's Maus, Satrapi's Persepolis, Saco's Palestine, and Ennis' Preacher)

ytrez

I bought that series as it was being released and did not like it. I've re-read a couple of times since and have a better appreciation for it. I don't know if I'd put it on par with Watchmen. The concept was better than the execution both in terms of writing and artwork (which was uneven with the switching of artists).

slop101

SS was okay, but it's nowhere near as good as the best runs from the other books you mentioned (FF, Xmen, etc.). And it's certainly not worth mentioning in the same breath as Watchmen.

toddly6666

Slop, what are the best runs from F4, Xmen, and Spiderman then for a not-so-much comic book fan?

slop101

Not so sure about "for not-so-much comic book fan", since that's hard for me to judge, but I'd put Byrne's run on both Xmen and FF up there as satisfying as any superhero book, certainly more than the old SS (speaking of which, I think I liked the JMS/Gary Frank SS update a little better). Joss Whedon's run on Xmen has been pretty good, as was Grant Morrison's. Spiderman's a bit more scattered, but there's definitely some good arcs throughout the years - a lot of it by David Michelline or J.M DeMatteis.

toddly6666

Slop,
are there any softcover/hardcovers that I can just buy as a whole? I don't like fussling around searching for individual issues and I don't like waiting at least for a month (I was very tempted to read Alex Ross' Justice every month, but I just held off till the third volume was released). Can you link me to good ones? I have trouble reading the current DC/Marvel comics, because I don't like this CGI/computer-looking art. The only current Marvel/DC artist I like is Alex Ross and whoever does the art for Marvel's Civil War (which I haven't read yet). Is there an organized way of reading Civil War? It seems scattered all over the place with all different titles. Is it realistic that the Civil War series will be released in one whole mega-softcover/hardcover volume anytime soon?

I forgot that I liked the two Ultimate Avengers volumes too, I'll add that too my list...

I also love Silver Surfer (the later human-looking one, not the early alien-looking one), but his stories seem to be scattered/guest starring in other comics.

slop101

That's a lot of questions.

Grant Morrison's entire 41-issue run on X-men (which I thought was exemplary, though with some inconsistent art, was mostly drawn pretty well) was collected in "New X-men Omnibus", which is unfortunately out of print. I got it for $50, but it's going for around $200 these days. You can get Morrison's run in smaller chunks in trade form though - but if you can find the Omnibus, snatch that shit up! I'd say it's even worth the $200...

Speaking of Omnibuses - check out the one that collects Brubaker's first 25 issues of Capitan America, while it's still in print. It's not just one of the most consistently satisfying superhero runs in recent memory, but it's brilliant as all hell - in all my years of reading comics, very few books, if any, have had the singularity of vision that Brubaker's CA has had. From his very first issue, up to #25 and even now (it's up #32 or so), he's maintained his immaculate storyline and has flushed out CA characters like no other writer before him. There are things he set up in his very first issue that are still playing out and paying off 30 issues into his run.

You can get Joss Whedon's first arc on Xmen in a nice hardcover, though I'd wait for the inevitable Omnibus that'll collect his entire run.

If you like Frank Miller's run on Daredevil, his entire run is collected in a single Omnibus book (with "remastered" colors, and bonus material, not unlike a super-duper dvd limited edition), and a second volume that just came out collects everything else Miller did with Daredevil, including Born Again, which I think is one of the best things Miller has ever written (I would say even better than Dark Knight or Sin City). The art on Born Again by David Mazzucchelli is just astounding. This Daredevil Omnibus companion also has Miller's Elektra with Bill Sienkiewicz on art along with Miller's DD origin story.

You can get John Byrne's entire FF run in trades (here's volume one of eight).

As for Civil War, I wasn't a big fan, but if you must read it, just get core mini-series, and don't bother with the off-shoots, which don't add much to the story, unless you were already following the books that had the off-shoots.

toddly6666

Slop,
Those Omnibuses make some painful toilet reading, so damn heavy!!! ...Thanks for all the info - I will definitely buy all the John Byrne FF4s - I'm assuming Skrulls, Captain Marvel, Kree, Silver Surfer, and Galactus show up in them?

slop101

Yeah, they're all there except for Cpt. Marvel, who had "died" just prior to Byrne taking on the book.

Oh, another great book I forgot to mention, that's great for non-comic-fans is Jeff Smith's Bone. It's available in either a single B&W edition, or 9 separate volumes in color, though only 1-7 are available so far. And don't forget Rose, which is sort of like The Hobbit to Bone's Lord of the Rings.

fujishig

I liked the original SS miniseries. When it first came out, I was a kid and liked it because of all the unfamiliar "new" heroes (that were mysteriously familiar), as I didn't remember their connection to the Avengers or previous stories. I don't think I appreciated the story as much as the colorful characters. Later on, it dawned on me on how cool it was that they took these characters that were pretty much just Justice League ripoffs and gave them a different (at the time) take on the genre.

I bought the trade when it first came out because I had missed the follow up graphic novel. Turns out, the original miniseries holds up pretty well (though some of the dialogue is obviously dated) but the follow ups were terrible. On a weird sidenote, all of the first printings had the ashes of miniseries editor Mark Greunwald mixed into the ink, as he had died shortly before.

Marvel resurrected the team in a modernized form in the Supreme Power and now Squadron Supreme series, but the pace is/was glacial (not sure if it's still coming out). You'll recognize a lot of familiar faces, though.

As far as more modern superhero series with a similar vibe, I'd try Warren Ellis's Authority (or his Stormwatch, which serves as the prequel) for another take on "superhumans take over the world" or his Planetary, which is something else entirely.

toddly6666

yeah, I would like that ash first printing. That's one mother of all collector items to have...is it selling anywhere?

Rocketdog2000

I'd second that. You should still be able to get the Stormwatch trades for ...
- Force Of Nature - collecting Stormwatch issues 37-42, and the begining of Ellis run on the series
- Lightning Strikes - issues 43-47
- Change Or Die - issues 48-50, and 1-3 of Stormwatch Vol 2. The first part of which is a particularly excellent story, and very much in line with Squadron Supreme, Kingdom Come and Watchmen.
- A Finer World - issues 4-9 of Stormwatch Vol 2, introduces the characters of Midnighter and Apollo
- Final Orbit- issues 11 and 12 of Stormwatch Vol 2, plus the WildC.A.T.S./Aliens crossover, which leads to the end of the Stormwatch series and the birth of The Authority.

...and from there, just start up with The Authority trades.

I also can't recommend enough to any comic fan, or non, the Planetary series. Quite possibly one of my favorite comic reads, ever!

toddly6666

I read some Authority, and wasn't that impressed...

Rocketdog2000

Which part, as it definitely jumped around from consistency depending on who was writing it?

But regardless, if you just want to read a good story along the lines of Squadron Supreme, I still recommend checking out Stormwatch - "Change Or Die". I don't think you even really need to be all that familiar with the characters to be able to enjoy it thoroughly.