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View Full Version : Box Office Chatter 6/27-7/1 (McClane vs Rats)


Mr. Cinema
06-28-07, 01:57 PM
WEDNESDAY:

1. LIVE FREE OR DIE HARD 20TH CENTURY FOX 3,175 8,865,000 2,792 n/a 8,865,000
2. EVAN ALMIGHTY UNIVERSAL 3,602 3,375,000 937 n/a 42,192,125
3. 1408 MGM 2,678 1,990,000 743 n/a 27,801,034
4. FANTASTIC FOUR: RISE OF THE SILVER SURFER 20TH CENTURY FOX 3,963 1,900,000 479 -57% 103,992,632
5. KNOCKED UP UNIVERSAL 2,972 1,345,000 453 -33% 113,690,335
6. OCEAN'S THIRTEEN WARNER BROS. 3,450 1,110,000 322 -51% 94,976,028
7. SURF'S UP SONY 3,309 1,075,000 325 -34% 50,370,679
8. PIRATES OF THE CARIBBEAN: AT WORLD'S END BVI 2,802 925,000 330 -34% 289,886,588
9. NANCY DREW WARNER BROS. 2,612 850,000 325 -33% 18,488,406
10. SHREK THE THIRD DREAMWORK 2,822 815,000 289 -37% 310,271,439

PopcornTreeCt
06-28-07, 02:11 PM
Die Hard is gonna get it's ass kicked by the rat movie.

Dan1boy
06-28-07, 02:13 PM
oooh, Fantastic Four is fading fast...

surprised to see Ocean's 13 doing so well...

starseed1981
06-28-07, 02:30 PM
Pixar > John McClaine via 1st weekend TKO.

spammied
06-28-07, 03:04 PM
I gotta agree with PopcornTreeCt. Ratatouille will definitely beat McClane, especially because its PIXAR first and foremost, and most parents will let their kids see a movie by that company.

JPRaup
06-28-07, 03:13 PM
Die Hard will definitely be number one

I predict about 50 million for Die Hard (Wed-Sun) and about 35-40 million for Ratty

Patman
06-28-07, 03:17 PM
It's doesn't work like that. For the weekend, it'll just be the box office take from Friday-Sunday for the weekly BO crown. Just because LFoDH opened on Wednesday doesn't mean you get to lump it in when comparing BO totals for the weekend. Anyway, it doesn't really mean all that much in the long run either way.

JPRaup
06-28-07, 03:22 PM
I know. I was just predicting my totals. I still believe Die Hard will be number one, even though Ratatouille is much better :/

Giles
06-28-07, 03:23 PM
I'll see Ratatouille in the theatres, but I'll just wait for the R-rated cut of Die Hard 4 on DVD.

raven56706
06-28-07, 03:29 PM
rata movie doesnt look so good...my nieces think its going to be boring

Mr. Cinema
06-28-07, 03:30 PM
Ratatouille should have a massive opening, and probably looong legs too. Transformers needs to make a ton next week since Mr. Potter follows after that.

eedoon
06-28-07, 03:30 PM
I know. I was just predicting my totals. I still believe Die Hard will be number one, even though Ratatouille is much better :/

I think so too. Die Hard already have a popularity out there and so does Bruce Willis. Business wise, a little cute Parisian rat won't hold up against anything like that.

PixyJunket
06-28-07, 03:33 PM
I'm going to wait for the R-rated cut of Ratatouille before seeing an edited and censored version. :mad:

Bandit03
06-28-07, 03:34 PM
I think it will be a close race with Ratatouille coming out on top.

pinata242
06-28-07, 03:37 PM
I think so too. Die Hard already have a popularity out there and so does Bruce Willis. Business wise, a little cute Parisian rat won't hold up against anything like that.
But Die Hard has also blown a bit of its weekend load on Wed and Thurs. Will there be enough repeat viewers of those to offset the shift?

Ratatouille dominates F-Su. DH will have a higher to-date through Sunday, however.

JPRaup
06-28-07, 03:41 PM
rata movie doesnt look so good...my nieces think its going to be boring

it's great, don't worry

Artman
06-28-07, 03:55 PM
50 mill for Rat, 30 for DH4.

Daytripper
06-28-07, 03:58 PM
I think so too. Die Hard already have a popularity out there and so does Bruce Willis.

No, not really

http://www.boxofficemojo.com/people/chart/?id=brucewillis.htm

onebyone
06-28-07, 03:59 PM
I thought for awhile Ratatouille wasn't going to do well, but everything seems to have fallen in place for it of late. The campaign really came together. I think it has the 3 day weekend easy.

eedoon
06-28-07, 04:03 PM
But Die Hard has also blown a bit of its weekend load on Wed and Thurs. Will there be enough repeat viewers of those to offset the shift?


Probably not, but 3000-4000 screen for two days lead can only take so many audiences which is probably only a fraction compared to the number of potential customer of the movie.

pinata242
06-28-07, 04:05 PM
Probably not, but 3000-4000 screen for two days lead can only take so many audiences which is probably only a fraction compared to the number of potential customer of the movie.
But the people that went to go see it on weekdays are the, um, die-hard Die Hard fans. They were guaranteed sales on the weekend already.

eedoon
06-28-07, 04:06 PM
No, not really

http://www.boxofficemojo.com/people/chart/?id=brucewillis.htm

Hmm. OK. Let me rephrase then. Die Hard have popularity, and everyone knows Bruce Willis. That's enough to draw people's attention even if it's only a little bit.

eedoon
06-28-07, 04:14 PM
But the people that went to go see it on weekdays are the, um, die-hard Die Hard fans. They were guaranteed sales on the weekend already.

Well you got your point. But we don't know how many fans of those kind compared to mainstream moviegoers.

chris_sc77
06-28-07, 04:28 PM
Per screen average wise I am sure Sicko will kick some ass.
Rat will not make more than 35 million this weekend.

PixyJunket
06-28-07, 04:36 PM
Pixar opening weekends, to compare to the lowball numbers being thrown around.

THE INCREDIBLES
$70,467,623

FINDING NEMO
$70,251,710

MONSTERS, INC.
$62,577,067

CARS
$60,119,509

TOY STORY 2
$57,388,839

A BUG'S LIFE
$33,258,052

TOY STORY
$29,140,617

PixyJunket
06-28-07, 04:41 PM
Die Hard opening weeknds.

DIE HARD: WITH A VENGEANCE
$22,162,245

DIE HARD 2: DIE HARDER
$21,744,661

DIE HARD
$7,105,514

DRG
06-28-07, 05:39 PM
I don't think Pixar's Rats will reach the $60 mil+ opening of their past few, but I'd be shocked if it didn't clear at least $40 mil. I'm thinking it'll land somewhere in the $50-60 mil range, which should be good enough to trump Die Hard.

QuePaso
06-28-07, 06:12 PM
die hard already did 9 mil on wensday. It will do quite well me thinks.

Artman
06-28-07, 07:01 PM
DH4 will be lucky to reach 100m (still well below the adjusted grosses of the previous ones). It would have to hit 60 next Thurs to put it on track for that, assuming a 50% drop each wk after. (which, given the current trends, would actually be better than average)

Supermallet
06-28-07, 07:05 PM
Ratatouille will dominate.

TropicalRobot
06-28-07, 07:07 PM
Ratatouille will probably have a solid weekend but I'd bet it will end up as Pixar's lowest grossing film.

Zodiac_Speaking
06-28-07, 07:26 PM
Ratatouille is a great film, Die Hard is a good film, I think this w/e will be close but family film will win out.

gotrice487
06-28-07, 10:05 PM
Ratatouille will come on top

mdc3000
06-28-07, 10:11 PM
I think Pixar will probably steal it, but both are worthy...a great week for movies IMO. Ratatouille is a really fun family flick that I loved and Die Hard is the action flick of the summer (until Monday night)... word of mouth will be huge on Die Hard as both times I've seen it, the crowd cheered and clapped (and of course, I've seen it twice in two days, so the repeat business factor is there IMO).

MATT

RayChuang
06-28-07, 10:18 PM
I think Ratatouille will come out on top because it will attract a larger family audience. Mind you, this movie will of course be shoved aside by Transformers the next weekend. :)

Supermallet
06-28-07, 11:26 PM
I think Ratatouille will hold its own against Transformers and Harry Potter. Not to say it will be number one, but it will have massive legs and continue to do good business.

B5Erik
06-28-07, 11:52 PM
Well, all I know is that I'm going to see Die Hard 4 on Sunday. (With my dad - who wanted to see it even before I suggested it!)

Rogue588
06-29-07, 02:51 AM
I'll put a 10 spot on da rats..

Yip-ee-kay-yay-mother---, indeed.

Mittman
06-29-07, 07:15 AM
Even after seeing the Wednesday numbers, and the amazingly consistent track record of Pixar, people are picking Bruce to beat the Rat?

Ratatouille's 3 day total > Live Free or Die Hard's 5 day total

Mr. Cinema
06-29-07, 02:57 PM
THURSDAY:

1. LIVE FREE OR DIE HARD 20TH CENTURY FOX 3,175 5,900,000 1,858 n/a 15,012,000
2. EVAN ALMIGHTY UNIVERSAL 3,602 3,320,000 922 n/a 45,512,125
3. 1408 MGM 2,678 1,980,000 739 n/a 29,781,034
4. FANTASTIC FOUR: RISE OF THE SILVER SURFER 20TH CENTURY FOX 3,963 1,860,000 469 -53% 105,852,632
5. KNOCKED UP UNIVERSAL 2,972 1,295,000 436 -34% 114,985,335
6. OCEAN'S THIRTEEN WARNER BROS. 3,450 1,075,000 312 -51% 96,051,028
7. SURF'S UP SONY 3,309 1,040,000 314 -31% 51,410,679
8. PIRATES OF THE CARIBBEAN: AT WORLD'S END BVI 2,802 910,000 325 -33% 290,796,588
9. NANCY DREW WARNER BROS. 2,612 850,000 325 -27% 19,338,406
10. SHREK THE THIRD DREAMWORK 2,822 840,000 298 -29% 311,111,439
11. MIGHT HEART, A PARAMOUNT 1,355 305,000 225 n/a 5,347,971

Is Knocked Up going to end up outgrossing Fantastic Four 2? FF2 is dropping quick.

PopcornTreeCt
06-29-07, 03:03 PM
I guess Pirates 3 won't break $300 million domestically.

Jericho
06-29-07, 03:13 PM
I guess Pirates 3 won't break $300 million domestically.

Huh? It's like $9 million short, and will probably be $4 million of so short after the weekend. It'll break $300 million

Bluelitespecial
06-29-07, 03:29 PM
Is Knocked Up going to end up outgrossing Fantastic Four 2? FF2 is dropping quick.

I certainly hope its does, since it is the better movie.

Terrell
06-29-07, 03:46 PM
Ratatouille will obliterate Die Hard on the opening weekend. If DH 4 can keep it within 20 million, I'd be surprised.

JPRaup
06-29-07, 04:15 PM
Some of you guys are delusional, thinking Rats can beat Die Hard

The Antipodean
06-29-07, 04:27 PM
Some of you guys are delusional, thinking Rats can beat Die Hard

(This space reserved to make a snarky comment to the OP when box office figures come out Sunday) ;)

PixyJunket
06-29-07, 04:28 PM
Some of you guys are delusional, thinking Rats can beat Die HardI'd suggest the opposite. We'll see on Sunday.

Terrell
06-29-07, 04:45 PM
Some of you guys are delusional, thinking Rats can beat Die Hard

:lol: I want some of what you're smoking. But stranger things have happened, though not very often. We'll see. If I'm wrong I'll gladly eat crow. But I don't think I'll have too. Die Hard is already fighting a losing battle against Rata, because it opened on a Wednesday. It would have been closer had it opened on a Friday. Rata opens on a Friday. Big difference.

Die Hard already have a popularity out there and so does Bruce Willis.

Neither have anywhere near the popularity they once had. Pixar on the other hand is as popular as ever.

PopcornTreeCt
06-29-07, 05:04 PM
Bruce Willis is the man but not a box office champ.

Bruce's greatest opening was Over the Hedge at $38,457,003. And that movie was, wait for it, a CGI animated family film.

Dr. DVD
06-29-07, 05:12 PM
Ratatouille all the way. I might pay to see that and then maybe sneak into Live Free or Die Hard, as I refuse to give my money to a PG-13 Die Hard.

Terrell
06-29-07, 06:24 PM
Bruce Willis is the man but not a box office champ.

Agree! I like Willis, but he's never been a huge box office draw. Certainly made some successful films.

misterchimpy
06-29-07, 10:52 PM
FF2 is doing so badly now, that i think that there is a good chance there won't be a 3rd one, at least not with the same budget. According to IMDB it cost $130 mm to make, according to boxofficemojo it's done $164 mm to date worldwide(the first one did $330 mm worldwide, this will be lucky to break $200 imo). But the cost doesn't include prints and advertising, and the box office includes the theatre's take. I would guess Fox maybe makes some money on it when all is said and done, but with a 40% dropoff from the first one, chances are that they are going to think long and hard before doing a 3rd one...

fumanstan
06-29-07, 11:05 PM
FF2 is doing so badly now, that i think that there is a good chance there won't be a 3rd one, at least not with the same budget. According to IMDB it cost $130 mm to make, according to boxofficemojo it's done $164 mm to date worldwide(the first one did $330 mm worldwide, this will be lucky to break $200 imo). But the cost doesn't include prints and advertising, and the box office includes the theatre's take. I would guess Fox maybe makes some money on it when all is said and done, but with a 40% dropoff from the first one, chances are that they are going to think long and hard before doing a 3rd one...

Has it been released in the other major markets outside of North America?

JPRaup
06-29-07, 11:10 PM
yes it has

PopcornTreeCt
06-30-07, 01:57 AM
FF2 is doing so badly now, that i think that there is a good chance there won't be a 3rd one, at least not with the same budget. According to IMDB it cost $130 mm to make, according to boxofficemojo it's done $164 mm to date worldwide(the first one did $330 mm worldwide, this will be lucky to break $200 imo). But the cost doesn't include prints and advertising, and the box office includes the theatre's take. I would guess Fox maybe makes some money on it when all is said and done, but with a 40% dropoff from the first one, chances are that they are going to think long and hard before doing a 3rd one...

I would imagine the they must have spent at least $75 million on advertising alone. This movie was EVERYWHERE the weeks leading up to its release.

Super X
06-30-07, 07:14 AM
Actually, with the movie still pulling in nearly $2 million a day during the week and having just had a $20 million dollar weekend in its second weekend, 20th Century Fox is probably willing to wait until it actually has stopped making significant money before declaring it a success or failure. It's still far from "doing so badly now".

misterchimpy
06-30-07, 09:57 AM
Actually, with the movie still pulling in nearly $2 million a day during the week and having just had a $20 million dollar weekend in its second weekend, 20th Century Fox is probably willing to wait until it actually has stopped making significant money before declaring it a success or failure. It's still far from "doing so badly now".

I disagree, the competition is far far worse for them this weekend, and then when Transformers opens in a few days, FF2 will essentially be gone from the theatres. If you don't believe me, look at your local theater listing on fandango, it will be down to a few showings per day by the 4th.

Comparison chart to other non spidey Marvel movies, at this point, it may barely beat Ghost Rider domestically.

http://www.boxofficemojo.com/showdowns/chart/?id=marvelmidrange.htm

Mr. Cinema
06-30-07, 10:18 AM
Actually, with the movie still pulling in nearly $2 million a day during the week and having just had a $20 million dollar weekend in its second weekend, 20th Century Fox is probably willing to wait until it actually has stopped making significant money before declaring it a success or failure. It's still far from "doing so badly now".
yes, those are pathetic numbers. It's only been out 2 weeks and it's already down to earning $2 million days, while playing at 1,000 more theaters than Knocked Up, which has also been out 2 weeks longer. FF2 opened at $58 million and had a gigantic 65% drop. It's toast.

Joe Molotov
06-30-07, 11:07 AM
Some of you guys are delusional, thinking Rats can beat Die Hard

What. :lol:

Jericho
06-30-07, 11:15 AM
(This space reserved to make a snarky comment to the OP when box office figures come out Sunday) ;)


I think he may be the only guy in the U.S. thinking Die Hard will be Rats. I don't even think Bruce Willis believes it :)

Mr. Cinema
06-30-07, 11:25 AM
FRIDAY'S NUMBERS:

1. RATATOUILLE BVI 3,940 16,395,000 4,161 n/a 16,395,000
2. LIVE FREE OR DIE HARD 20TH CENTURY FOX 3,175 10,495,000 3,306 n/a 25,507,000
3. EVAN ALMIGHTY UNIVERSAL 3,602 5,023,000 1,395 -55% 50,535,125
4. 1408 MGM 2,678 3,676,000 1,373 -52% 33,457,034
5. FANTASTIC FOUR: RISE OF THE SILVER SURFER 20TH CENTURY FOX 3,963 2,695,000 680 -55% 108,547,632
6. KNOCKED UP UNIVERSAL 2,972 2,246,000 756 -33% 117,231,335
7. OCEAN'S THIRTEEN WARNER BROS. 3,450 1,887,000 547 -46% 97,938,028
8. PIRATES OF THE CARIBBEAN: AT WORLD'S END BVI 2,802 1,452,000 518 -28% 292,248,588
9. SICKO LIONS GATE 441 1,368,000 3,102 5,600% 1,368,000
10. EVENING FOCUS FEATURES 977 1,212,000 1,241 n/a 1,212,000

I'm sure Ratatouille will get a significant bump today as most animated films do. Looks like Die Hard will pull in near $30 million, which isn't bad at all. Cars opened to $19.7 million on its first Friday at about the same number of theaters.

FF2 and Knocked Up are neck and neck, even with FF2 playing at 1,000 more theaters.

Lateralus
06-30-07, 11:50 AM
Looks like the Rat is going to have legs, lots of them... The reviews are just out of site for this movie.

TomOpus
06-30-07, 12:30 PM
Looks like the Rat is going to have legs, lots of them... The reviews are just out of site for this movie.RT has it at 6/114 for 95% fresh.

JumpCutz
06-30-07, 01:14 PM
Some of you guys are delusional, thinking Rats can beat Die Hard

rotfl

chris_sc77
06-30-07, 01:25 PM
I guess you shouldn't underestimate the loads of money americans will spend on shit films.

Drop
06-30-07, 01:38 PM
What are you referencing there chris_sc77?

fumanstan
06-30-07, 01:44 PM
I'm dissapointed that FF2 isn't doing better, since its a fun film.

I'll probably wait a week or so before catching Rats. I'm not particularly excited about it, but hey, its Pixar :shrug:

William Fuld
06-30-07, 02:26 PM
I guess you shouldn't underestimate the loads of money americans will spend on shit films.

Just stop, you're embarrassing yourself now.

RichC2
06-30-07, 02:29 PM
What are you referencing there chris_sc77?

Does it matter? He probably hasn't seen whatever he's talking about.

Hokeyboy
06-30-07, 02:36 PM
Rat will not make more than 35 million this weekend.
:lol: :lol: :lol:

Artman
06-30-07, 02:43 PM
I love how everyone's an expert in these threads. Speaking as if they're the only ones who could possibly know.

Oh, btw I casually threw out a 50/30 million wknd number for rats and DH....and what do ya know, looks like I'm right on. (again)

AllHallowsEve
06-30-07, 03:42 PM
I guess you shouldn't underestimate the loads of money americans will spend on shit films.

A critical hit with A-level word of mouth is a piece of shit?

I'd bet $10,000 you haven't even seen Ratatouille. It's one of the best films of the entire summer. Certainly beats the suffering some of us encountered while viewing Spiderman 3.

Terrell
06-30-07, 04:02 PM
1. RATATOUILLE BVI 3,940 16,395,000 4,161 n/a 16,395,000
2. LIVE FREE OR DIE HARD 20TH CENTURY FOX 3,175 10,495,000

:lol: That was just far too easy a prediction.

chris_sc77
06-30-07, 04:03 PM
NO havnt seen ratatouille, die hard, evan almighty or fantasric four. I dont have a desire to see them at all. They all look encredibly unappealing to be and cant really see what some people are enjoying about them but thats fine. Maybe ive become too snobby when it comes to this or I'm still bitter about the failure of Perfume, Grindhouse, and Zodiac.
It just seems like a normal movie cant make money unless it has animated talking animals, superheroes or dumbed down PG-13 action.
I'm just amazed at how these films make all this money. And the more they continue to make money it seems like the more these kind of movies will be made and less of the kind I want to see like Perfume, Grindhouse or Zodiac..
So theres my piece.

Terrell
06-30-07, 04:12 PM
And the more they continue to make money it seems like the more these kind of movies will be made and less of the kind I want to see like Perfume, Grindhouse or Zodiac..
So theres my piece.

Oh, so you're one of those hardcore type of moviegoers. Hate to tell you this, but the vast majority of folks just aren't into that kind of stuff. And what do you consider a normal film?

maingon
06-30-07, 04:18 PM
NO havnt seen ratatouille, die hard, evan almighty or fantasric four. I dont have a desire to see them at all. They all look encredibly unappealing to be and cant really see what some people are enjoying about them but thats fine. Maybe ive become too snobby when it comes to this or I'm still bitter about the failure of Perfume, Grindhouse, and Zodiac.
It just seems like a normal movie cant make money unless it has animated talking animals, superheroes or dumbed down PG-13 action.
I'm just amazed at how these films make all this money. And the more they continue to make money it seems like the more these kind of movies will be made and less of the kind I want to see like Perfume, Grindhouse or Zodiac..
So theres my piece.


What you dont like Pixar Flicks? ratatouille is one of the best movies of the year. Die Hard even though its PG13 doesnt feel dumbed down. It feels just as violent then the other flicks. You dont enjoy Superhero, "comic book movies" either? my gosh you boring odd person. Dont you like fun poporn flicks? Movies just to sit back and relax and have fun? Do you like Comdies like Knocked up or are they too dumb for you too?

chris_sc77
06-30-07, 04:25 PM
ok, first I have no prob. with the occasional superhero film , animated film what have you, but it seems like they are releasing way too many of these and making most half assed..
We didnt need Evan Alrmighty, FF2, or a PG-13 Die HArd did we?
I actually like sequels a lot but not when they are done like this.
It just seems like the same old 3 or 4 different kind of movies are the the only ones being made and released wide anymore.

maingon
06-30-07, 04:27 PM
ok, first I have no prob. with the occasional superhero film , animated film what have you, but it seems like they are releasing way too many of these and making most half assed..
We didnt need Evan Alrmighty, FF2, or a PG-13 Die HArd did we?
I actually like sequels a lot but not when they are done like this.
It just seems like the same old 3 or 4 different kind of movies are the the only ones being made and released wide anymore.

so your not gonna see Die Hard because its PG13? its really good flick and doesnt feel any different then the others when it comes to violence. Fantastic Four is a pretty fun popcorn flick too. Why cant we have these movies? I enjoyed all 3 movies you listed.

Drop
06-30-07, 04:29 PM
NO havnt seen ratatouille, die hard, evan almighty or fantasric four. I dont have a desire to see them at all. They all look encredibly unappealing to be and cant really see what some people are enjoying about them but thats fine. Maybe ive become too snobby when it comes to this or I'm still bitter about the failure of Perfume, Grindhouse, and Zodiac.
It just seems like a normal movie cant make money unless it has animated talking animals, superheroes or dumbed down PG-13 action.
I'm just amazed at how these films make all this money. And the more they continue to make money it seems like the more these kind of movies will be made and less of the kind I want to see like Perfume, Grindhouse or Zodiac..
So theres my piece.

It's probably not worth it to address this, but all that matters to me is a good story, good characters, or (ideally) both. It doesn't matter if they're rats or humans. I loved Grindhouse and I loved Ratatouille. I don't understand what superficialities, like the species of a character is, has to do with a film being good.

By the way a talking animal film called Surfs Up seems to have bombed. So it's not like that is a guarantee anymore.

maingon
06-30-07, 04:31 PM
It's probably not worth it to address this, but all that matters to me is a good story, good characters, or (ideally) both. It doesn't matter if they're rats or humans. I loved Grindhouse and I loved Ratatouille. I don't understand what superficialities, like the species of a character is, has to do with a film being good.

By the way a talking animal film called Surfs Up seems to have bombed. So it's not like that is a guarantee anymore.


I agree, btw Surfs up was a pretty funny flick, great voice acting, chris_sc77 I bet your gonna avoid something like The Transformers too, which looks amazing.

William Fuld
06-30-07, 04:44 PM
Surfs up was a pretty funny flick, great voice acting, chris_sc77 I bet your gonna avoid something like The Transformers too, which looks amazing.

Ironically, he's said he's going to see Transformers!

I can understand being disappointed and frustrated when quality films don't do well, but to talk shit about Pixar, when they've constantly delivered the kind of family films that all the studios should aspire to, is silly. And to say you're "amazed" that Ratatouille is making big money or that you "cant really see what some people are enjoying about them" is borderline retarded.

Daytripper
06-30-07, 04:48 PM
With "Ratatouille" on track to gross in the 52M range this weekend, is that lower than projected? It's such a great movie. I hope it earns as much as "Cars" if not more (in the long run). But I guess the market is just so oversaturated with animated films lately.

On a side note, there was a preview for "Bee Movie" before "Ratatouille" and boy does it look bad. The animation was not that great and the clips were just not funny (IMO).

Ronnie Dobbs
06-30-07, 05:16 PM
I'm still bitter about the failure of Perfume, Grindhouse, and Zodiac.


Wow. They're just movies. I do want to see Zodiac though I totally forgot about it.

PopcornTreeCt
06-30-07, 05:23 PM
Okay, I want to come to defense of chris_sc77. All he's saying is that good movies don't make money and lousy ones do. Which with the occasional anomalies (Ratatouille) is correct.

While I did see Pirates, enjoyed Spider-Man 3, and laughed through Shrek 3 I absolutely refuse to sit through Transformers and a PG-13 Die Hard. I think we can all hope for the day when intelligent movies make money but that day will never come.

I know Pixar is one of the holy grails no one can talk bad about on these forums but maybe family films aren't for everyone?

fumanstan
06-30-07, 05:34 PM
I love how everyone's an expert in these threads. Speaking as if they're the only ones who could possibly know.

Oh, btw I casually threw out a 50/30 million wknd number for rats and DH....and what do ya know, looks like I'm right on. (again)

Clearly, you're the only real expert here :p

chris_sc77
06-30-07, 05:39 PM
Well, i guess i also underestimated the wrath of fans of Pixar.

Ronnie Dobbs
06-30-07, 05:46 PM
Apple must be having the best week ever iPhone and Ratouille

Seantn
06-30-07, 05:54 PM
I'm still bitter about the failure of Perfume, Grindhouse, and Zodiac.

Perfume made 133 million overseas, I think it'll be ok.

AllHallowsEve
06-30-07, 05:54 PM
Okay, I want to come to defense of chris_sc77. All he's saying is that good movies don't make money and lousy ones do. Which with the occasional anomalies (Ratatouille) is correct.

While I did see Pirates, enjoyed Spider-Man 3, and laughed through Shrek 3 I absolutely refuse to sit through Transformers and a PG-13 Die Hard. I think we can all hope for the day when intelligent movies make money but that day will never come.

I know Pixar is one of the holy grails no one can talk bad about on these forums but maybe family films aren't for everyone?

No, you're right. Family films aren't for everyone.

However, it's also not fair to call a film a piece of shit when you have never seen it. He was attacking a competently made film while on a rant against poorly made films. That makes no sense.

That's being just as bad as those calling "Grindhouse" a piece of shit when they have never seen it. And I can bet you he would be coming to the defense of that film immediately.

Supermallet
06-30-07, 06:00 PM
On a side note, there was a preview for "Bee Movie" before "Ratatouille" and boy does it look bad. The animation was not that great and the clips were just not funny (IMO).

Actually, Bee Movie looks like Dreamworks' best CGI animated film since Antz.

MadonnasManOne
06-30-07, 06:03 PM
I can understand people being upset that well made films don't make big money at the Box Office. However, you can't lump Ratatouille in with bad films making big money, because Ratatouille, and Pixar films in general, are not bad films. They are worthy of making bank at the Box Office.

William Fuld
06-30-07, 06:24 PM
Okay, I want to come to defense of chris_sc77. All he's saying is that good movies don't make money and lousy ones do.

Stop the presses!

eatntae
06-30-07, 06:50 PM
On a side note, there was a preview for "Bee Movie" before "Ratatouille" and boy does it look bad. The animation was not that great and the clips were just not funny (IMO).
When I watched it last night, the preview for Wall-E was right before Bee Movie, and I thought it was weird that they both had the same uptempo song in both trailers (don't know if the song has a name).

Supermallet
06-30-07, 06:57 PM
The song from Brazil, you mean.

The Bus
06-30-07, 07:07 PM
Actually, Bee Movie looks like Dreamworks' best CGI animated film since Antz.

* cough * Overthehedge * Cough *

Mr. Cinema
06-30-07, 07:12 PM
With "Ratatouille" on track to gross in the 52M range this weekend, is that lower than projected? It's such a great movie. I hope it earns as much as "Cars" if not more (in the long run). But I guess the market is just so oversaturated with animated films lately.

On a side note, there was a preview for "Bee Movie" before "Ratatouille" and boy does it look bad. The animation was not that great and the clips were just not funny (IMO).
I think the $50 million range was expected. I think Ratatouille will have stronger legs and better word of mouth than Cars did, which had a 43.9% drop its second weekend. That's very un-Pixar like.

GreenVulture
06-30-07, 08:47 PM
I just wanted to say that this was probably the only thread where you could have used the title John McClane vs. Plague-Carriers, and you didn't. :(

Seantn
07-01-07, 07:08 AM
On FantasyMoguls, they said it appeared that From Friday to Saturday, Die Hard went UP by 26%

fumanstan
07-01-07, 12:03 PM
Actually, Bee Movie looks like Dreamworks' best CGI animated film since Antz.

It sure doesn't look that way from the trailers.

Mr. Cinema
07-01-07, 12:12 PM
Hmmm, Ratatouille didn't get a Saturday bump:

1. RATATOUILLE BVI 3,940 16,701,000 4,239 n/a 33,096,000
2. LIVE FREE OR DIE HARD 20TH CENTURY FOX 3,175 12,764,000 4,020 n/a 38,271,000
3. EVAN ALMIGHTY UNIVERSAL 3,602 5,640,000 1,566 -50% 56,175,125
4. 1408 MGM 2,678 4,029,000 1,504 -46% 37,486,034
5. FANTASTIC FOUR: RISE OF THE SILVER SURFER 20TH CENTURY FOX 3,963 3,525,000 889 -55% 112,072,632
6. KNOCKED UP UNIVERSAL 2,972 2,824,000 950 -34% 120,055,335
7. OCEAN'S THIRTEEN WARNER BROS. 3,450 2,451,000 710 -48% 100,389,028
8. PIRATES OF THE CARIBBEAN: AT WORLD'S END BVI 2,802 1,924,000 687 -34% 294,172,588
9. SICKO LIONS GATE 441 1,682,000 3,814 6,628% 3,050,000
10. EVENING FOCUS FEATURES 977 1,306,000 1,337 n/a 2,518,000

RichC2
07-01-07, 12:53 PM
Yeah doesn't bode well for the little guy, shame too:

Weekend Estimates -

1 - Ratatouille BV $47,227,000 - 3,940 - $11,986 $47,227,000 - 2
2 N Live Free or Die Hard Fox $33,150,000 - 3,408 - $9,727 $48,178,000 $110 1
3 1 Evan Almighty Uni. $15,089,000 -51.6% 3,636 +32 $4,149 $60,625,000 $175 2
4 2 1408 MGM/W $10,610,000 -48.5% 2,733 +55 $3,882 $40,389,000 $25 2
5 3 Fantastic Four: Rise of the Silver Surfer Fox $9,000,000 -55.0% 3,424 -539 $2,628 $114,800,000 $130 3
6 5 Knocked Up Uni. $7,418,000 -32.4% 2,678 -297 $2,769 $122,407,000 $30 5
7 4 Ocean's Thirteen WB $6,050,000 -47.0% 2,903 -547 $2,084 $102,085,000 - 4
8 6 Pirates of the Caribbean: At World's End BV $5,015,000 -30.4% 2,162 -640 $2,319 $295,758,000 $300 6
9 31 Sicko LGF $4,500,000 +6,424.7% 441 +440 $10,204 $4,615,000 $9 2
10 N Evening Focus $3,513,000 - 977 - $3,595 $3,513,000 - 1

rexinnih
07-01-07, 01:03 PM
Not bad for the Rat.

JPRaup
07-01-07, 01:07 PM
Die Hard's five day barely squeaked past Ratty, nice

fumanstan
07-01-07, 01:25 PM
Not bad for the Rat.

Not great either.

Mr. Cinema
07-01-07, 01:36 PM
I'm very surprised that it didn't get a big boost on Saturday. Animated movies usually get a nice bump, but not this time. It still may hold up better than Cars did, but Transformers won't help out.

Goldberg74
07-01-07, 01:52 PM
Pirates will pass the $300M mark in the next 10 days.

Good to see Ocean's 13 squeek past the $100M mark.

The Antipodean
07-01-07, 03:39 PM
If Ratatouille is considered a failure, I will blame it squarely on that *godawful* title. Children's movies shouldn't have a name the kids can't even pronounce -- titles like "Cars," "Finding Nemo," "Toy Story" give you a pretty good idea what the movie is about. Terrible choice of a title here, no matter how good the movie itself is.

PopcornTreeCt
07-01-07, 04:11 PM
Except for the fact that the title perfectly fits the movie.

I'm kinda surprised by low box office. I figured it would do at least $50 million. Though I suppose no matter how many critics tell the mainstream it's a great movie, it just doesn't look like one.

RyoHazuki
07-01-07, 04:29 PM
I think the low box office is just from crowding. Its kinda overwhelming all the crap thats coming out.

Word of mouth should carry Ratatouille to a nice sum. Die Hard however will probably drop like a stone once Transformers opens.

Ronnie Dobbs
07-01-07, 04:46 PM
McClane isn't really living up to the hype maybe he should've stayed retired.

Daytripper
07-01-07, 04:53 PM
I think the low box office is just from crowding. Its kinda overwhelming all the crap thats coming out.

Word of mouth should carry Ratatouille to a nice sum. Die Hard however will probably drop like a stone once Transformers opens.

I agree on all counts. The market is so crowded this summer. "Pirates" probably could have made another 50-75 million if there weren't so many movies on it's heals. Thought it sucked though, so I'm personally happy ;)

And I've said this from the beginning, no matter how great "Die Hard 4" is (and I haven't seen it yet), I would seriously doubt if it would make more than 100 million.

Seantn
07-01-07, 05:33 PM
It's the biggest Die Hard opening ever. The highest grossing "Die Hard" only made about 120 million, so it's not like this is some franchise where Spider Man money is being expected by the studio.

Mad Dawg
07-01-07, 05:45 PM
It's the biggest Die Hard opening ever. The highest grossing "Die Hard" only made about 120 million, so it's not like this is some franchise where Spider Man money is being expected by the studio.

Yeah, given the immediate crowding and not just summer as a whole, I'm sure Fox's expectations are pretty reasonable. I'm not sure how one would classify opening a solid 2nd, with those numbers, to a highly anticipated Disney/Pixar flick on essentially a holiday weekend "not living up to the hype," either.

The Bus
07-01-07, 05:47 PM
It's the biggest Die Hard opening ever. The highest grossing "Die Hard" only made about 120 million, so it's not like this is some franchise where Spider Man money is being expected by the studio.

The $50MM cume is pretty impressive and while it's going to drop once Transformers is out I think it will have enough word-of-mouth going into the holiday that it will still do well. And believe it or not, a lot of people may not want to see Transformers. (I do not count myself among them).

Seantn
07-01-07, 06:03 PM
I was thinking that exact thing. I think Die Hard is good counter-programming to Transformers. I know a lot of people who don't want to see Tranformers, but like Die Hard.

Supermallet
07-01-07, 06:26 PM
It's the biggest Die Hard opening ever. The highest grossing "Die Hard" only made about 120 million, so it's not like this is some franchise where Spider Man money is being expected by the studio.

Biggest opening in raw numbers, but what about adjusted for inflation? Also, did the other Die Hards open on a Wednesday or a Friday?

OldBoy
07-01-07, 06:54 PM
Die Hard's five day barely squeaked past Ratty, nice
just curious, but why is that "nice"?

FantasticVSDoom
07-01-07, 06:56 PM
Again, I think more and more movies (especially family ones) are going to have a hard time due to the price of movies now a days. Its just getting too expensive now for a family to go.

OldBoy
07-01-07, 06:58 PM
why is LFoDH's production budget $110 mil (BW's bloated salary for another)? I would think with all the non-CGI stunts the budget should have been much much lower. now, this will be very hard pressed to make profit, which is a shame.

Terrell
07-01-07, 09:19 PM
Die Hard's five day barely squeaked past Ratty, nice

Die Hard is not going to make it's money back from the looks of it, especially when considering the competition it'll face soon. I look for it to fall off the map.

Joe Molotov
07-01-07, 09:29 PM
why is LFoDH's production budget $110 mil (BW's bloated salary for another)? I would think with all the non-CGI stunts the budget should have been much much lower. now, this will be very hard pressed to make profit, which is a shame.

Die Hard is not going to make it's money back from the looks of it, especially when considering the competition it'll face soon. I look for it to fall off the map.

You might want to wait for the international tally before you start writing it off.

chris_sc77
07-01-07, 09:30 PM
I was hoping Die Hard would bomb (Ratatouille as well) but it looks to be doing quite well from the looks of it. I don't really know what some people were expecting Die Hard to do but $48 million in its first 5 days is pretty damn decent and much more than what i thought it would do.

Seantn
07-01-07, 09:38 PM
I read something interesting over at BoxOfficeGuru.com , it said:

Live Free earned strong reviews from critics and overseas, where its title is Die Hard 4.0, grosses are expected to be significantly stronger as evidenced by 1995's Die Hard With A Vengeance which collected a whopping 72% of its $361M worldwide total from outside of North America.

So i'd say that this movie is a hit no matter what. Even if it was pulled from theaters after next weekend (which it obviously won't be, i'm just saying).

chris_sc77
07-01-07, 09:56 PM
Also the title Die hard 4.0 is a lot less embarrassing than Live Free or Die Hard.
I have heard more people call it Live free or Die Tryin' than call it by its correct U.S. title.
But that is really interesting because i had no idea Die Hard with a Vengeance made that much overseas.

dadaluholla
07-01-07, 10:13 PM
I don't think it actually said "Live Free or Die Hard" anywhere at the theater I went to this weekend. It just said DIE HARD 4.

Seantn
07-01-07, 10:19 PM
I don't blame them for wanting a title without a "4" in it. When it gets that high, you don't want to instantly remind the audience that they've paid for this type of film 3 times before.

B5Erik
07-01-07, 10:25 PM
Live Free or DIE HARD - best movie of the summer!

(And the theater I saw it at today had it listed with the proper title...)

Sondheim
07-01-07, 10:47 PM
I was hoping Die Hard would bomb (Ratatouille as well) -confused-

"Ratatouille" is one of the most acclaimed films of the year, and even if it doesn't interest you, it's still an example of good filmmaking and much, much more sophisticated than almost any other mainstream film released this year. Pixar is one of the few studios that consistently releases high-quality mainstream films that don't talk down to the audience.

Hoping for it to fail is no better than someone hoping (prior to their release) that "Grindhouse" or "Zodiac" or "Perfume" would fail. I loved two of those films (I haven't seen "Grindhouse",) but I also loved "Ratatouille", and I'm as snobbish in my film tastes as almost anyone around.

I can understand your frustration, but I don't think "Ratatouille" is the right target for your frustrations. As others have pointed out, it's no secret that good movies often fail at the box office while mediocre/bad movies rake in the cash (and that's not a new trend), but there are exceptions.

I don't think the success of "Die Hard 4" or "Ratatouille" or the low box office of the three aforementioned "failures" is going to prevent more artistic and/or experimental films from being made.

chris_sc77
07-01-07, 10:59 PM
okokokok.
I was hoping for the failure of Evan almighty, FF2, and Ratatouille because i thought that they looked terrible (Die Hard cause it was PG-13).
This doesn't mean that it is a fact that they are terrible it is just my opinion that from what i saw in the trailers and brief ads and what i know about these films that they looked bad or at least unappealing to me.
Disney/Pixar made about $47 million these past 3 days so i dont think they give a rat's ass about my hopes that a movie of theirs bombs.

misterchimpy
07-01-07, 11:01 PM
Overall, the Rat box office numbers are the most disappointing, almost a disaster in fact, it was down over 20% from the $60 mm opening weekend for Cars, despite just about the same number of screens. I would agree that based on the reviews, it should hold up reasonably well, but the double dose of Transformers and Harry Potter are gonna make it very very difficult for it to sustain much momentum or to beat Cars domestically.

Per screen average btw,almost the worst of any Pixar film's first weekend, even a Bug's Life was over 12k the first weekend, and that was almost 10 years ago! Toy Story had about the same per screen avg, but that was 12 years ago, when admission prices were presumably a lot lower, and there was no such thing as a cgi movie.

I haven't seen it, I have been a big fan of Pixar's stuff in the past, esp Finding Nemo and Toy Story 2, but I did think Cars(a.k.a. Doc Hollywood 2) was pretty weak. The funny thing is that I think people might start questioning why Disney paid $7 billion for Pixar, if they are going to get one movie/year that might make $50-100 mm when all is said and done. Yeah I know Lasseter is going to 'fix' Disney's animation business, but it might be that the bloom is off of the CGI rose, so to speak.

I love this comment from Disney's head of distribution: "What we have always played for is the long run," said Chuck Viane, Buena Vista's president of distribution. Uh sure, Chuck, whatever you say.

Another interesting disappointment was Sicko, which only did 10k per screen, this opposed to an amazing 27,600 per screen for Fahrenheit 9/11. I guess liberal porn isn't as appealing when it is about health care! I'm sure it will also play ok for a while, but 10k/screen isn't a strong number for something only 400+ screens, and that was after a lot of media hype this last week.

chris_sc77
07-01-07, 11:10 PM
Another interesting disappointment was Sicko, which only did 10k per screen, this opposed to an amazing 27,600 per screen for Fahrenheit 9/11. I guess liberal porn isn't as appealing when it is about health care! I'm sure it will also play ok for a while, but 10k/screen isn't a strong number, and that was after a lot of media hype this last week.


I was thinking the same thing when i first saw the numbers for Sicko but Sicko still has the 2nd highest Documentary opening ever and Weinstien Co. is putting the film in 200 additional screens on Tues and more to come over the next few weeks.
F.9/11 had bigger opening but also generated more controversey.
So, Sicko still did quite well and the film caost less than $20 million overall to produce and market this will definitely do well.
It sure as hell does better than the DTV "anti-Michael Moore" shit they release.

PopcornTreeCt
07-01-07, 11:11 PM
I don't think Ratatouille has to worry about Transformers or Harry Potter very much. Both are different markets. I'm sure kids will flock to see Harry Potter but the age demographic is still slightly different.

TomOpus
07-01-07, 11:13 PM
Overall, the Rat box office numbers are the most disappointing, almost a disaster in fact, it was down over 20% from the $60 mm opening weekend for Cars, despite just about the same number of screens. Cars didn't have near as much competition, especially from tentpole releases since it opened early June.

dhmac
07-01-07, 11:14 PM
A funny thing about this "latest Die Hard vs. latest Pixar" discussion is that the last time a Die Hard movie came out, almost no one had even heard of Pixar. (The last Die Hard film came out in the Summer of 1995, about 6 months before Pixar's first feature Toy Story was even released.)

misterchimpy
07-01-07, 11:19 PM
I was thinking the same thing when i first saw the numbers for Sicko but Sicko still has the 2nd highest Documentary opening ever and Weinstien Co. is putting the film in 200 additional screens on Tues and more to come over the next few weeks.
F.9/11 had bigger opening but also generated more controversey.
So, Sicko still did quite well and the film caost less than $20 million overall to produce and market this will definitely do well.
It sure as hell does better than the DTV "anti-Michael Moore" shit they release.

I agree that it's very good for a documentary, but the expectations were that it would do in the $7 mm+ range. 10k per screen was actually worse than the average for pretty much every other major release this weekend, so not sure why theater chains are going to step up in a big way. It will be solidly profitable, I'm sure, but it's nowhere near the cultural phenomenon that Fahrenheit 9/11 was.

Patman
07-01-07, 11:25 PM
I think seeing the posters of Michael Moore putting on a latex glove were just too disturbing for would-be audiences from middle America.

Ranger
07-01-07, 11:31 PM
Glad that Fantastic Four 2 is still alive. Should finish at or very close to $130M on the domestic front.

misterchimpy
07-01-07, 11:34 PM
Cars didn't have near as much competition, especially from tentpole releases since it opened early June.,

I think that could explain poor performance in the next few weeks, but I actually don't think they had that much competition this weekend. They got the same number of screens as Cars, Evan Almighty(the only family movie in very wide release) had bombed, and Spidey and Shrek were pretty much gone from the multiplexes. Yeah Surf's Up was still around, but that bombed as well.

As to your point about Cars being out in early June, it sounds like Chuck thinks that Rat should have been helped by the later release..

"Viane noted moviegoer pollster CinemaScore's "A" rating and how 99 percent of kids are out of school now, compared to 60 percent when Cars opened last year."

In any case, the reviews were much better than Cars...so maybe that will give it some legs. But this is going to be one of Pixar's worst performing films ever. Maybe it's the rat theme, maybe there's too much competition, who knows. But clearly, it wasn't even close to being the 'event' that many prior Pixar releases had been...

B5Erik
07-01-07, 11:58 PM
I wonder if the mildly disappointing box office for Ratatouille will push The Incredibles 2 into reality.

Talk about a franchise that could bring in $250+ million each time (if they keep the quality up). I mean, it's based on other franchises (Bond, FF), so it would make sense to do at least 2 sequels. I know that hasn't been the Pixar way, but The Incredibles was just so damned good - and so much fun - that they really should do more.

Cars did OK, RAT is going to make a profit, but neither of them is a Finding Nemo or Incredibles.

MadonnasManOne
07-02-07, 12:07 AM
I haven't seen it, I have been a big fan of Pixar's stuff in the past, esp Finding Nemo and Toy Story 2, but I did think Cars(a.k.a. Doc Hollywood 2) was pretty weak. The funny thing is that I think people might start questioning why Disney paid $7 billion for Pixar, if they are going to get one movie/year that might make $50-100 mm when all is said and done. Yeah I know Lasseter is going to 'fix' Disney's animation business, but it might be that the bloom is off of the CGI rose, so to speak.


Are you kidding? Might make $50-100 million before all is said and done? Um, Ratatouille is already near $50 million, in only the first three days. Granted, that's lower than the last few films, still, I believe Ratatouille will go on to make much more than $100 million. That's not to mention the international totals. I think everyone tends to forget those. For example, looking at Pirates of the Caribbean: At World's End. That film may look like it has bombed, because, domestically, the film hasn't even topped the $300 million it cost to make, although it is very close. However, add in the international total, and that film is over $900 million, and climbing!

I believe Disney is in no danger of losing any money over Pixar, taking into consideration worldwide totals, merchandise, licensing deals, and video sales.

The Antipodean
07-02-07, 12:17 AM
The funny thing is that I think people might start questioning why Disney paid $7 billion for Pixar, if they are going to get one movie/year that might make $50-100 mm when all is said and done.

Please, Pixar movies are cash cows on DVD and toss in the ancilliary toys, video games, etc. and Pixar movies are like printing money. While this may not be a huge box office hit it'll make a ton of money in the long run. Still a lame title though. ;)

Seantn
07-02-07, 12:39 AM
I agree that it's very good for a documentary, but the expectations were that it would do in the $7 mm+

What does "mm" stand for? I've seen a few people say it now.

misterchimpy
07-02-07, 12:53 AM
Are you kidding? Might make $50-100 million before all is said and done? Um, Ratatouille is already near $50 million, in only the first three days. Granted, that's lower than the last few films, still, I believe Ratatouille will go on to make much more than $100 million. That's not to mention the international totals. I think everyone tends to forget those. For example, looking at Pirates of the Caribbean: At World's End. That film may look like it has bombed, because, domestically, the film hasn't even topped the $300 million it cost to make, although it is very close. However, add in the international total, and that film is over $900 million, and climbing!

I believe Disney is in no danger of losing any money over Pixar, taking into consideration worldwide totals, merchandise, licensing deals, and video sales.

When I said make $50-100 mm, I meant profit, not gross. And yeah, they do get a lot of merchandising, video games, etc, although maybe not so much from this one, given the rat theme. But that profit estimate probably includes that, as well as international. Merchandise outside of video games isn't what it used to be, probably the principal reason they closed the Disney stores. And remember marketing costs, studio overhead, etc, as well as the fact that the theaters take a cut of the gross box office as well.

So Disney isn't going to lose money on the rat movie, but I didn't say that. But was it worth $7 billion in Disney stock? Yes there will be other benefits and more movies, and maybe having Lasseter run the animation business will pay dividends. But the fact remains that this was the first release under Disney ownership and is likely to have the worst financial performance of any Pixar film, definitely when adjusted for inflation.

misterchimpy
07-02-07, 12:57 AM
What does "mm" stand for? I've seen a few people say it now.

millions......an easy way to remember(and for all i know, maybe the source of the abbreviation) is that the roman numeral for 1000=m, so you can think of mm as a thousand thousands, so to speak. That's not how'd you write it in roman numerals, ha, but it may well be how the abbreviation came about.

wm lopez
07-02-07, 07:02 AM
Ocean's Thirteen looks like it won't make $150 miillion is it a bomb?
Did it have a big budget?

Mr. Cinema
07-02-07, 09:18 AM
Ocean's Thirteen looks like it won't make $150 miillion is it a bomb?
Did it have a big budget?
The budget isn't listed, but Ocean's Twelve's budget was $110 million. The previous Ocean films opened in December. I think 13 is doing well considering the crowed Summer competition.

eedoon
07-02-07, 09:28 AM
Man, I guess I'm too pessimistic that the rat will take champ on this week's box office. But I'm glad it came out this way. Too bad there's a lot of competition for this movie it didn't rake more cash.

Here in Asia the audiences' anticipation is much more into that Die Hard movie. Most of the countries slated the rat for later release - between late July to August. Probably it is better this way considering there are less big release during those date.

The Bus
07-02-07, 09:28 AM
What does "mm" stand for? I've seen a few people say it now.

It means millimeter. The correct abbreviation for million is MM, not mm. If you're going to be a stickler.

I thought Brandon Gray from Box Office Mojo made a very valid point:

Trying a smaller recipe after several epic-sized efforts, Buena Vista and Pixar's eighth feature wasn't expected to reach the initial heights of its brethren. On the surface, Ratatouille had the brand's least universally-appealing subject yet—a rat chef in Paris—not to mention a recent glut of computer animation has rendered the form more and more pedestrian.
Still, it had by far the biggest debut for a rodent-themed picture, more than doubling previous high Flushed Away, and in the past year the only animated movie to open bigger was Shrek the Third.

I bet you that Disney probably spent a good $10MM less on advertising and promotion on this one. It just wasn't as common to see a Ratatouille ad as it was a Cars ad.

This movie will go over $100MM very easily. Look at Knocked Up: it started with $30MM and is now well over $120MM. And the timing for its release, as is Ratatouille's, is magnificent. There's no other adult-ish comedies out, and there's going to be only one other animated movie coming out: The Simpsons. There simply won't be any competition. I think we'll see very low drops and I wouldn't be surprised to see Ratatouille cross the $150MM mark.

Terrell
07-02-07, 10:55 AM
You might want to wait for the international tally before you start writing it off.

I see it doing worse in the international market. 110 million dollar budget, plus marketing costs is a bit to large a budget for this film in my opinion. That is if the studio wanted to make a profit. I was shocked when I saw the budget. I thought it was doing pretty good in terms of making money until I saw that. I was expecting a budget of around 70-80 million, tops.

maingon
07-02-07, 11:44 AM
Are you kidding? Might make $50-100 million before all is said and done? Um, Ratatouille is already near $50 million, in only the first three days. Granted, that's lower than the last few films, still, I believe Ratatouille will go on to make much more than $100 million. That's not to mention the international totals. I think everyone tends to forget those. For example, looking at Pirates of the Caribbean: At World's End. That film may look like it has bombed, because, domestically, the film hasn't even topped the $300 million it cost to make, although it is very close. However, add in the international total, and that film is over $900 million, and climbing!

I believe Disney is in no danger of losing any money over Pixar, taking into consideration worldwide totals, merchandise, licensing deals, and video sales.


you are right, Ratatouille will make way more the a 100 million. Pixar flicks make a lot of money

Cars worldwide: 461,981,126
Nemo: 864,625,978
toy story: 361,958,736
toy story 2: 485,015,179
Incredibles: 631,436,092
Monsters INc: 525,366,597

Over the years they will be profiting over the deal, plus the DVD sales etc are huge would put this movies much higher.


misterchimpy why would they be questing if buying pixar wasnt worth it? its not like there movies are gonna make 7 billion right away, over time they will. Pixar movies are always big hits and usually always win best animated picture too. Dont understand your thinking misterchimpy

slop101
07-02-07, 01:38 PM
Ratatouille will pick up on word of mouth alone (or at least not drop significantly).

Also, I feel a movie "drop" in expected BO is an answer to the previous movie - as in Ratatouille is an answer to Cars being a bit of a disappointment (for a Pixar movie that is), and Cars opening huge as an answer to Incredibles being so well received. And trust me Wall-E will be huge due to Ratatoille's greatness.

The Bus
07-02-07, 01:48 PM
I'm glad Cars did so horrible worldwide.

misterchimpy
07-02-07, 01:51 PM
you are right, Ratatouille will make way more the a 100 million. Pixar flicks make a lot of money

Cars worldwide: 461,981,126
Nemo: 864,625,978
toy story: 361,958,736
toy story 2: 485,015,179
Incredibles: 631,436,092
Monsters INc: 525,366,597

Over the years they will be profiting over the deal, plus the DVD sales etc are huge would put this movies much higher.


misterchimpy why would they be questing if buying pixar wasnt worth it? its not like there movies are gonna make 7 billion right away, over time they will. Pixar movies are always big hits and usually always win best animated picture too. Dont understand your thinking misterchimpy

There was a lot of speculation at the time of the deal that Disney panicked because their own animated films had been bombing. So some people thought they paid too much for a studio whose most profitable movies were behind them. Remember when Pixar first appeared they were virtually alone in the CGI business, they did great movies as well, but now there are 5-10 CGI kids movies/year, with many more to come. And kids grow up faster, play more video games, etc.

Another way to think about it, if Disney had borrowed the money to buy Pixar, the $7 billion would cost 6% or so a year in interest, or $420 million/year. Yes they make money off of the film library, merchandise etc, but that number was maybe $100 mm pretax at most(and Disney already owned 50% of the films done before the deal anyway), because they only had 6 or 7 titles in the library at the time. So the return is still pretty dependent on how current releases do.

Don't confuse the box office take, btw, with how much money a studio earns on a film. I agree that even $300 mm worldwide is a nice box office number. But again, you have to take out the theater's cut, production costs, prints, advertising, etc. And yes, there will be DVD sales, video games, but probably not too much merchandise(stuffed rats not too popular, lol--i didn't see McDonald's do a promotion!).

There is no doubt that this movie, while profitable, will be substantially less profitable than Finding Nemo or even the Incredibles. And that's the point, this is the first movie under Disney ownership and the return is going to be nowhere near the return that Pixar made historically.

Maybe there will be other movies down the road that do better, but maybe not. To your point, Pixar used to be a virtual lock to win Best Animated Feature oscar, yet in the last 2 years, someone else won(Wallace and Gromit + Happy Feet). They will probably win this year(who knows about Bee Season), but they are clearly no longer the only game in town.

So if you were a Disney shareholder, you might be pissed that they diluted their earnings by issuing $7 billion in stock for a studio whose highly reviewed yearly release might 'only' earn $100 mm in profit when all is said and done. At the end of the day, returns on investments drive the movie business just like any other business...

Giles
07-02-07, 01:55 PM
Ratatouille will pick up on word of mouth alone (or at least not drop significantly).

Also, I feel a movie "drop" in expected BO is an answer to the previous movie - as in Ratatouille is an answer to Cars being a bit of a disappointment (for a Pixar movie that is), and Cars opening huge as an answer to Incredibles being so well received. And trust me Wall-E will be huge due to Ratatoille's greatness.

'The Wall-E' trailer didn't impress me in the slightest.

I'm glad Cars did so horrible worldwide.

I agree. It was definately Pixar's weakest.

The Bus
07-02-07, 01:56 PM
Well, I remember when Cars came out it had a disappointing B.O. performance, bad enough it actually hurt Disney's stock.

I'm guessing Disney is probably more concerned about today's pipe bombings.

The Bus
07-02-07, 01:57 PM
'The Wall-E' trailer didn't impress me in the slightest.


There was a trailer? I remember seeing some chubby white guys talking about how great their older movies were, but that's about it.

Giles
07-02-07, 01:58 PM
There was a trailer? I remember seeing some chubby white guys talking about how great their older movies were, but that's about it.

yeah that's the problem right there...

oh pardon me, "teaser" not trailer.

misterchimpy
07-02-07, 02:03 PM
Ratatouille will pick up on word of mouth alone (or at least not drop significantly).

Also, I feel a movie "drop" in expected BO is an answer to the previous movie - as in Ratatouille is an answer to Cars being a bit of a disappointment (for a Pixar movie that is), and Cars opening huge as an answer to Incredibles being so well received. And trust me Wall-E will be huge due to Ratatoille's greatness.

I think it will hold up reasonably well, but I am in the minority here thinking that Transformers and Harry Potter are going to have a negative impact. I think Transformers especially could hurt it, the demographic goes head to head with Rat, and it too, is getting good reviews. So if it can survive the onslaught, then the schedule is clear for 2 weeks after Harry Potter, but I dunno, that's 3 weeks from now, which is almost forever these days at the multiplex...

RichC2
07-02-07, 02:10 PM
Its possible, but there will be benefits from sold out showings.

Plus word has it this is easily the least entertaining Harry Potter film.

MadonnasManOne
07-02-07, 03:57 PM
There was a trailer? I remember seeing some chubby white guys talking about how great their older movies were, but that's about it.

Why are you showing so much hate towards Pixar? If you aren't a fan, that's fine, but, there's no need to be rude.

The Bus
07-02-07, 04:11 PM
Why are you showing so much hate towards Pixar? If you aren't a fan, that's fine, but, there's no need to be rude.

What hate towards Pixar? I hate Cars and the shitty first half of the Wall-E teaser. Aside from Cars, I've seen every single one of their films.

fumanstan
07-02-07, 04:14 PM
I'm glad Cars did so horrible worldwide.

I'm not. I actually preferred Cars to Nemo :(

misterchimpy
07-02-07, 05:51 PM
Its possible, but there will be benefits from sold out showings.

Plus word has it this is easily the least entertaining Harry Potter film.

Yeah I just read the Hollywood Reporter review on RT, yeesh.
Although some of the other reviews weren't quite as negative, but they didn't exactly come off as ringing endorsements.

Puzznic
07-02-07, 06:30 PM
What hate towards Pixar? I hate Cars and the shitty first half of the Wall-E teaser. Aside from Cars, I've seen every single one of their films.

How can you hate a movie you've never seen?

hardercore
07-02-07, 06:42 PM
How can you hate a movie you've never seen?

I'm sure The Bus prejudices like all the rest of us, and it's quite simple, really -- all you need to do is not even give it a chance, henchforth basing an overtly negative opinion on it on either speculation or word of mouth alone, and then go nuts touting how much hatred you have for it all over the interweb.

I can't even wait till I get the chance to sit down and write my review of Silence (2008) (http://imdb.com/title/tt0490215/) because I've got so much shittiness about it to write I think I'm going to explode

Puzznic
07-02-07, 06:46 PM
I can even understand being unsure about Cars before seeing it. I don't have much interest in cars or Nascar and the trailer didn't blow me away so I too was skeptical about how good Cars was going to turn out.

But,given Pixar's track record, I gave them the benefit of the doubt and I ended up liking the movie alot.

RichC2
07-02-07, 06:46 PM
I can't even wait till I get the chance to sit down and write my review of Silence (2008) because I've got so much shittiness about it to write I think I'm going to explode

Marty and his damn remakes! Awful AWFUL AWFUL! That movie will be HORRIBLE! ;)

I can even understand being unsure about Cars before seeing it. I don't have much interest in cars or Nascar and the trailer didn't blow me away so I too was skeptical about how good Cars was going to turn out.

But,given Pixar's track record, I gave them the benefit of the doubt and I ended up liking the movie alot.

The Bus didn't slam Wall-E or any other Pixar movie that isn't Cars. He said he hated Cars (understandable) and didn't like the first half of the Wall-E trailer (which was a weak attempt at associating it with the Pixar classics)... I don't get how he's being prejudice against anything.