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View Full Version : Police raid Michigan comic convention, shut down DVD bootlegs


MovieExchange
05-19-06, 07:10 PM
Just got a call from a friend attending the Motor City Comic Con in Novi, Michigan today. Over the last several years, the convention has lessened the emphasis on comics and increased promotion of media personalities, and along with that came a slew of VHS and later DVD dealers, all packed with bootlegs of both current theatrical releases and TV shows / movies that aren't available on DVD legally.

My friend called me a few hours ago, and told me that the police raided the show, and all the dealers selling bootlegs were cuffed and lined up to be taken away.

Personally, I'm amazed this didn't happen sooner. There have been a large number of bootleg dealers at that convention for at least 10 years now.

rw2516
05-19-06, 07:29 PM
I'm also suprised it hasn't happened sooner. Don't know about now but it used to be illegal to sell movie posters. Posters were the property of Screen Service Corporation and were to be returned to them or destroyed by the theater after a movie closed. If not they were considered stolen property. I was at a comic show about 25 years ago and the FBI came in and confiscated all the posters from the dealers. Don't remember anyone getting arrested though.

milo bloom
05-19-06, 07:31 PM
Attention all murderers, rapists and drug dealers in Novi, MI: here's your chance!



:rolleyes:

Breakfast with Girls
05-19-06, 07:37 PM
Good.

Joe Molotov
05-19-06, 08:20 PM
About time they got those dangerous Star Was Holiday Special dealers off the street.

PixyJunket
05-19-06, 08:43 PM
Fucking awesome!

TomOpus
05-19-06, 08:49 PM
Last year at Comic-Con during Preview Night, I saw a large table loaded with boots. Next day the same table had another vendor selling authorized merchandise. I was all giggly that those asshats were shutdown fairly quickly.

Peep
05-19-06, 09:09 PM
I heard that bootleggers who sell out of print or unreleased titles often reduce the chances of offical releases by softening the market.

Maybe that a misperception, but who is going to buy the rights to a title if they think it's readily available as a bootleg?

MovieExchange
05-19-06, 09:21 PM
I heard that bootleggers who sell out of print or unreleased titles often reduce the chances of offical releases by softening the market.

Maybe that a misperception, but who is going to buy the rights to a title if they think it's readily available as a bootleg?


Yeah, but the return argument is that many of the times these items are bootlegged when it seems that there is no hope of them ever being out legally. For example, the Adam West Batman series. DC Comics has pretty much said that there is no way in hell this is coming out. So to be honest, I have to problem buying a bootleg of it. Of course, I'm also in the minority of people that would buy a legal release when it came out even though I had a boot.

Misery
05-19-06, 10:05 PM
What a shame.All the bootleggers will have to go back to Ebay to sell thier junk.

digitalfreaknyc
05-19-06, 10:08 PM
Attention all murderers, rapists and drug dealers in Novi, MI: here's your chance!



:rolleyes:

:up:

zombiezilla
05-19-06, 10:26 PM
MovieExchange, I agree with you. If USA distributors/studios will not release certain films I want in R1 (see my user name for a hint at what film series I'm mainly referring to), I'll buy a pirated copy easily, especially if I cannot get the alternate region release, or if there isn't one. Of course, as you said, I would also buy the legit version should it ever become available.
EXAMPLE: I want a movie I'll refer to as "G1985" on legit DVD, but it's not out in America, only Europe and Asia. I found a guy (on eBay, natch) who had a FOUR DISC SET for sale. It came with the widescreen original language version with (removeable) English subs; the Widescreen English international version (although in English, unseen in the USA); and the USA version, in English and fullscreen (shudder). The 4th disc was all the extras from the damn LASERDISC! It was such a good and perfect collection, the likes of which I would make for myself, if I had the equipment/access to the discs. But I do not, so I bought it directly from him at a lesser price than what the auction commanded. I cut out the man (eBay) and got it for less $$$, to boot!
Were ANY of the versions in my current set released in the USA, I'd buy them. Even if they were no better than this pirate copy.

And, NOOOO I am not selling, trading, or swapping DVDs here. Just making a statement.

And, some of you may remember that I used to live in Michigan....I always attended this show, both the late spring/early summer and the autumn shows. And I always walked away with a bag of DVDs....several of which eventually got replaced with the legit release, if they came out....but most did not.

............

The Video Dead
05-19-06, 11:25 PM
If i got a chance to pickup some old tv shows that will never get a release date.....


ala Salute your shorts, Doug, My Brother and Me, Martin, Wonder Years, You Can't Do That On Television, Ahhh Real Monsters etc.


I think these places need to really get on the ball with releasing old tv shows that alot of fans want.

MasterCXtreme
05-19-06, 11:32 PM
Michigan cops are dicks. And that's no threadcrap people, that's a fact.

zombiezilla
05-19-06, 11:42 PM
MasterCXtreme, you got that right, for sure!

Lastdaysofrain
05-20-06, 09:06 AM
What a collosall waste of man power and tax dollars. I honestly see nothing wrong with selling bootlegs of things that aren't commercially available. I think it's lame to sell bootlegs of films in theatres, but stuff that's rare or hard to find? Who cares.

This is a worse waste of manpower, tax dollars, and police than the war on drugs. Fight some legit crime people.

John Sinnott
05-20-06, 09:20 AM
Michigan cops are dicks. And that's no threadcrap people, that's a fact.

"There are three types of people in the world: dicks, pussies and assholes."


Kudos to the cops too! I'm glad they are enforcing the laws instead of sitting at a donut shop.

Egon's Ghost
05-20-06, 09:28 AM
Even if something isn't on DVD, I just have a problem paying more than $.10 for a bootleg. How in the hell can a website like DVDavenue.tv exist? Everything there is a bootleg. Full series sets of The Addams Family. Um, yeah. $100 for something that was ripped from TV Land?! To quote James Caan, "f*ck you in your a$$hole!" Why aren't they raided?

What a collossal waste of man power and tax dollars.
So we shouldn't have intellectual property laws?

GIjon213
05-20-06, 09:51 AM
I, for one, am glad this happened. There are so many people I know who say that they collect DVD's. I then ask them what one's they have, do they have any limited editions, etc... And they then proudly tell me that all 300 DVD's they have are burned! And they think that they collect DVD's?! No, they don't collect DVD's, they steal them. It is like someone hoarding those gold chocolate coins and saying that they are a coin collector. I have only ever bought one bootleg DVD, and that was off Ebay by accident. But you know what? I learned so much about who and where to buy from, checking feedback, asking questions, etc... that that one bootleg purchase was worth the lessons learned. To all those who think that the cops are wasting their time, I think that they are doing their job.

TomOpus
05-20-06, 10:02 AM
What a collosall waste of man power and tax dollars. I honestly see nothing wrong with selling bootlegs of things that aren't commercially available. You don't think it's wrong only because you don't own the rights to property that could be copied and sold.

MovieExchange
05-20-06, 10:17 AM
You don't think it's wrong only because you don't own the rights to property that could be copied and sold.

What about situations where the person that owns the rights apparently, for whatever reason, just doesn't want to make money off the property?

As I've mentioned before, the Batman TV series.

Or better yet, Tick: the Animated Series. Here we thought we were going to get a season set, and now we find out that the official release is going to be a "best of" collection instead. Or Song of the South, which keeps getting blocked by the politically correct police.

Don't get me wrong, I despise boots of things that we know will be coming out on DVD legally. As someone that sells DVD's for a living, nothing gets me more pissed than when a customer comes in and tells me they don't need to pay $10 for a previously viewed copy of King Kong because their friend burned it for them. But when it's something that will not see an official release for whatever reason? If I want to see it, I'll buy it.

wewantflair
05-20-06, 10:44 AM
It's still their firm right to withold their property from the public, even if the public wants it. We may not like it, but profiting from someone else's property, even if they choose not to, is wrong.

Dr. Henry Jones, Jr.
05-20-06, 10:48 AM
What about situations where the person that owns the rights apparently, for whatever reason, just doesn't want to make money off the property?




They are more than welcome to release it to everyone for free if they don't want to make money from it.

Reservoir
05-20-06, 11:26 AM
Send them to Guantanamo Bay.

Russell S
05-20-06, 11:45 AM
Cops raiding a comic book convention? Come on. I'm all for cracking down on current releases, copies of legit releases, etc, but stuff that may never get a release or cases where companies drag their feet, you'd better believe I'll pick up a bootleg. I've cherished my From Beyond and Dellamorte Dellamore boots for years. I may never have even seen these had I waited patiently on the official releases.

Shagrath
05-20-06, 11:59 AM
I've cherished my From Beyond and Dellamorte Dellamore boots for years. I may never have even seen these had I waited patiently on the official releases.

...And I've cherished my official Italian Dellamorte Dellamore for years. Just because it's not out here doesn't mean it's not available. You can always go region-free and find almost anything released somewhere in the world. From Beyond has been officially released in Hong Kong, Germany, and possibly others.

naitram
05-20-06, 12:24 PM
Stupid. Go catch some terrorists.

xage
05-20-06, 12:33 PM
What a shame.All the bootleggers will have to go back to Ebay to sell thier junk.


And you are one of those who would fall for and buy it?

filmfreak
05-20-06, 12:53 PM
It's still their firm right to withold their property from the public, even if the public wants it. We may not like it, but profiting from someone else's property, even if they choose not to, is wrong.

They should release these DVDs and the problem would be resolved. Look. Iím not condoning bootleg DVDs, but what are the studios waiting for? You want to kill piracy...release the damn movies.

grundle
05-20-06, 01:33 PM
bootlegs of both current theatrical releases and TV shows


I'm glad the cops raided them for that.

However, for stuff that is decades old and has never been released on DVD, where the owner of the copyright has no intention of ever releasing a DVD, I think copyright law should allow people to make copies for their friends. When the owner of the copyright isn't trying to make money off of it, I don't see any reason to enforce copyright laws.

Sometimes bootlegs are the only way to prevent classic work from disappearing forever.

rexinnih
05-20-06, 01:36 PM
It's against the law. 'Nuff said.
You wouldn't steal a car, would you? Except if you were in Michigan right now, where you can get away with it because the cops are raiding comic conventions..........

Russell S
05-20-06, 01:37 PM
Shagrath -

I AM region-free, just wasn't at the time. But just because these may be available in other regions doesn't make my argument null and void. Monster Squad, anyone?

And don't think for a second they wouldn't love to keep you from buying an import.

MovieExchange
05-20-06, 01:57 PM
It's still their firm right to withold their property from the public, even if the public wants it. We may not like it, but profiting from someone else's property, even if they choose not to, is wrong.

You're right, it's still wrong. But we all have different levels of what we do and do not find acceptable, even if it's wrong.

xage
05-20-06, 02:52 PM
...And I've cherished my official Italian Dellamorte Dellamore for years. Just because it's not out here doesn't mean it's not available. You can always go region-free and find almost anything released somewhere in the world. From Beyond has been officially released in Hong Kong, Germany, and possibly others.

what about the big difference between NTSC and PAL???

xage
05-20-06, 02:55 PM
They should release these DVDs and the problem would be resolved. Look. Iím not condoning bootleg DVDs, but what are the studios waiting for? You want to kill piracy...release the damn movies.

You just dont understand why "Region Codes" were set at the first place when DVDs came out.

littlefuzzy
05-20-06, 06:10 PM
I *ahem* KNOW SOMEONE who may be willing to purchase a couple of bootlegs of items that will probably NEVER be released...
Porgy & Bess with the musical sequences intact
Song of the South...

Heck, this person's mother even wants the person to track down some bootlegs of those two items... :D

ThatGuamGuy
05-20-06, 07:52 PM
Michigan cops are dicks. And that's no threadcrap people, that's a fact.

If these are bootleggers, wouldn't it be the FBI who arrested them?

I think it's funny that people (not you, MasterCX) are ignoring the part about how at least some of the bootlegs were of movies currently in releases; folks, we *want* bootleggers like that arrested. Used stores buy bootlegs from people like this quite often, in my experience (inadvertantly, I'm sure).

Anybody selling other bootlegs at the con, I feel bad they got busted, but they ought to be selling on-line anyway (which, I would imagine, is where the comic sellers who no longer attend the con are).

And I don't buy the argument of "well, then the studios should release them!" If the bootleggers are doing it out of the goodness of their heart and not making a profit, I have no problem with it (examples: a lot of 'MST3k' fans, or some of the people who have made 'Star Wars' boots), but if you're charging premium prices for something you burned 100 copies of to DVD from an old VHS taped off of TV, I have no sympathy.

shaggy
05-20-06, 09:05 PM
If a film or TV show is available on "real" DVD then there is no exuse to be buying or selling it. If something is out of print or was never available then I don't have a problem. In the early 90s I bought live music CDs all the time. I also bought live music, rare movies and cartoons on VHS at record and comic shows. Now there is no need to support bootleggers because the fan communites are make amazing stuff available and its all free. I have over 1500 retail DVDs, and I also have 300-400 burned DVDs of old TV shows , TV specials, cartoons, and movies. Some of them are incredible but I would buy the real thing the minute it came out.

Kris81
05-20-06, 10:16 PM
Local plaza in my area (suburbs of toronto, those of you will know it as the asian plaza) have about 6-7 stores in the mall that sells any movie you want for about 5$ cdn (copied)

every few months, they're busted, shut down.. and re open up



personally i don't care.. i'd rather see cops spending more time busting drug dealers, rapists, murderers, etc, then worrying about dvd pirates

Shagrath
05-20-06, 10:21 PM
what about the big difference between NTSC and PAL???

My player can do the conversion from PAL to NTSC with no problem, so that's not an issue. A lot of people complain about the 4% speedup on PAL stuff, but I've never noticed it on any of my PAL releases, so that's not an issue either.

Jericho
05-20-06, 10:32 PM
Reading this thread I get the feeling that most posters feel "entitled" to movies, and when whoever doesn't release a DVD of the stuff they want, its acceptable to get a bootleg. Maybe its just me, but I find that thinking disturbing. People aren't owed anything, and there is no right in owning a movie. Now this isn't to say people can't get bootlegs, but don't try to justify it. Hell, knowingly buying a bootleg can make one contributorily liable for infringement (though who would bring suit on that?).

As for the arrests, I say good for the police. Because the crimes are in all likelihood federal crimes, I suspect these were federal officials (i.e. FBI) as mentioned above, not local cops. Although it's not like arresting a few bootlegers will really take any manpower away from local police forces.

Tarantino
05-20-06, 11:07 PM
Although it's not like arresting a few bootlegers will really take any manpower away from local police forces.

Seriously. I fucking laugh when people make remarks like 'go catch some terrorists, or some drug dealers'.

Yeah...

Might as well not give out traffic tickets either, since they should be out catching murderers and terrorists instead.

= J

BigDan
05-21-06, 12:56 AM
I don't have a problem with companies asserting their intellectual property rights, but I have a problem with the way criminal prosecution of copyright infrigement seems to only happen when corporations are the ones whose property is being infringed.

I mean, nobody even threated Jeff Katzenberg and Eddie Murphy with jail when they stole Art Buchwald's intellectual property.

MovieExchange
05-21-06, 02:58 AM
Reading this thread I get the feeling that most posters feel "entitled" to movies, and when whoever doesn't release a DVD of the stuff they want, its acceptable to get a bootleg. Maybe its just me, but I find that thinking disturbing.

"Entitled"? Not at all. I do, however, feel that there is justification in buying a bootleg at times. To give yet another example, movies by Jodorowsky. They aren't available in America. Why? Because of a stupid feud that lead to Allan Klein buying the rights to his films and refusing to release them on DVD in America out of spite. I simply refuse to let stupid things like that interfere with my enjoyment of a movie or TV series.

Any of you that think less of me for breaking the law, I expect you to deliver yourself to your local police department and demand a ticket every time you exceed the speed limit, as you're breaking the law also.

calhoun07
05-21-06, 03:12 AM
I heard that bootleggers who sell out of print or unreleased titles often reduce the chances of offical releases by softening the market.

Maybe that a misperception, but who is going to buy the rights to a title if they think it's readily available as a bootleg?

There is one instance where the availbility of bootlegs encouraged a studio to release a DVD. My So Called Life is such an example. Once it was shown to the people in charge how well bootleg sets were selling on Ebay, the green light came to get the sets out, and they sold quite well, much higher than anticipated by the studio.

If it's a popular bootleg, it will be a popular release as well. Die hard fans who would settle for a bootleg will give up the money for a proper release with better quality once it rolls along.

calhoun07
05-21-06, 03:23 AM
Even if something isn't on DVD, I just have a problem paying more than $.10 for a bootleg. How in the hell can a website like DVDavenue.tv exist? Everything there is a bootleg. Full series sets of The Addams Family. Um, yeah. $100 for something that was ripped from TV Land?! To quote James Caan, "f*ck you in your a$$hole!" Why aren't they raided?


And that's pretty much how I feel about it. For these bootleggers, their over all costs to put out the product is next to nothing. The more slick of them may have DVD duplicators that are capable of doing several DVDs at once, which is costly to buy the machine, but to charge $15-$20.00 for something that pretty much cost a buck or two to make? I don't feel the need to give an asshole my hard earned money because he either ripped the product from TV or because he managed to find a site where to download the stuff for free. And I will admit I did buy some bootlegs at a convention once, but it was such a stupid mistake. Most of the stuff wound up coming out in legit DVD anyway later on, and for the rest of it, the DVD-Rs they used turned out to be crap, as the DVD-Rs started to break up and pixelate after a while.

I am not sure I am for using tax payer money to bust them, but I wish people wouldn't give them the time of day and then they would just go away. For things like Batman TV series and such....if the fans of these shows really were that passionate about these programs, they would be available for free online. When I think of some bands that I like to collect live shows from, most of the time, I cannot find any body to sell me live shows. It's either by trade only or there are those kind enough to put up files for free online. I am for bootlegs as long as people aren't trying to get rich off of it. It's one thing to share things that will never be released commercially without greed, but it's another thing entirely if you expect me to help you pay your mortgage because you choose to sell things like that.

calhoun07
05-21-06, 03:31 AM
Reading this thread I get the feeling that most posters feel "entitled" to movies, and when whoever doesn't release a DVD of the stuff they want, its acceptable to get a bootleg. Maybe its just me, but I find that thinking disturbing. People aren't owed anything, and there is no right in owning a movie.

I've already posted my feelings on buying vs. using fan communities to get this kind of stuff for free, but I wanted to say that in many instances, I don't feel that it's some kind of sense of "entitlement." People just want this stuff on a format that isn't going to wear out. If they can't transfer their own VHS copies to DVD, then they will find somebody who can do it for them. I don't see that as a sense of entitlement. Some people can't do for themselves (such as record each and every episode of Batman off of TV) so they will turn to others who can do it for them. How is that entitlement?

Reservoir
05-21-06, 08:35 AM
For years George Lucas has lied again and again. OK, now he's releasing Stars Wars as it was (and should be) and every fan well rebuy again. How many times is that?

I can't see anything wrong with someone owning or swapping a bootleg of the original film if the owner deliberately annoys a fan. We're dealing with people's memories here and not shares in Twentieth Century Fox or giving FBI agents something to do when they're not looking for Osama bin Laden in Idaho.

If you are found with 1,000 copies then that's different. Obviously.

flashburn
05-21-06, 09:07 AM
Local plaza in my area (suburbs of toronto, those of you will know it as the asian plaza) have about 6-7 stores in the mall that sells any movie you want for about 5$ cdn (copied)

every few months, they're busted, shut down.. and re open up



personally i don't care.. i'd rather see cops spending more time busting drug dealers, rapists, murderers, etc, then worrying about dvd pirates

I remember going there while I was on a business trip. When I first saw the plaza, I was excited, hoping to find some imports. Of course, every single shop there was selling just bootlegs, it was amazing. Some of the bootlegs were rather professional looking, and others were very obvious.

boe
05-21-06, 10:39 AM
Although I'll admit I am against people making a profit on bootleg discs, I see the argument about some things that are not coming out on DVD. I don't think bootlegs soften the market that much. I could download/buy a bootleg of stuff that is in the theatre right now but that won't stop them from coming out on DVD in 6 months - and the official releases will have much better transfer and more features.

There are several movies I'd download if I could since they've had more than enough time to release them on DVD. Not all of them are great but if they can release - dead alive, night to dismember, my giant, lord of illusions, On Deadly Ground...

I think they should be able to release -

IF looks could kill
Colossus: The Forbin Project - WIDESCREEN
The Soldier - released in Europe almost a year ago - Soldat
Run
Looker - pure cheese but I liked it for some reason - was able to download - bad transfer - VHS.
Blade Runner - not the F$#@# director's cut.

digitalfreaknyc
05-21-06, 12:16 PM
For years George Lucas has lied again and again. OK, now he's releasing Stars Wars as it was (and should be) and every fan well rebuy again. How many times is that?

Uhh...not "every."

Have you been to the Star Wars thread? I think a lot (most) of us won't.

Snowmaker
05-21-06, 12:25 PM
Wow!

I should have went.

JerryKILL
05-21-06, 01:32 PM
Supply and demand, folks. If the studios supplied the product I want I would buy it from them, otherwise...

I'm thinking of rare/obscure films that do not get released because of a perceived lack of profitability, not held up by some petty copyright dispute. I could literally list hundreds.

Case01
05-21-06, 02:22 PM
Good old opinions and laws, stirring debate since 1858.

dvd-4-life
05-21-06, 02:32 PM
Why don't the movie companies have a made-to-order business where if you want something in there library thats not available on dvd and free of copyright problems?They could charge 100 dollars for one yr of a tv series or 30 dollars for a movie making it profitable for them and keeping the diehard collectors happy.

Reservoir
05-21-06, 04:17 PM
Uhh...not "every."
Have you been to the Star Wars thread? I think a lot (most) of us won't.
Then they are not fanatical about the films.

MovieExchange
05-21-06, 05:55 PM
I went to the convention today and talked to some people about what happened. Apparently the raid was very specific, all the dealers busted were offering bootlegs of The DaVinci Code.

The anime dealers were left alone, probably because most law enforcement folk only know the major names, not anime.

calhoun07
05-21-06, 06:33 PM
For years George Lucas has lied again and again. OK, now he's releasing Stars Wars as it was (and should be) and every fan well rebuy again. How many times is that?

The first time the original original trilogy will be on a home video format in quite a few years, actually, since Lucas told the public they would be released one last time then never again, back before the release of the 97 editions. And I doubt every fan will buy the new DVDs. Some will (gasp) actually be comfortable with the changes he made to the 2004 editions and continue living their lives.

sracer
05-21-06, 06:37 PM
If these are bootleggers, wouldn't it be the FBI who arrested them?

I think it's funny that people (not you, MasterCX) are ignoring the part about how at least some of the bootlegs were of movies currently in releases; folks, we *want* bootleggers like that arrested. Used stores buy bootlegs from people like this quite often, in my experience (inadvertantly, I'm sure).
It's unfortunate that the video community doesn't distinguish between "pirating" and "bootlegging". And worse than that, associates the lesser term "bootleg" with the more serious act of "piracy".

BOOTLEG = selling a homegrown product that isn't officially released.
PIRATE = selling a homegrown copy of an official product.

Anybody selling other bootlegs at the con, I feel bad they got busted, but they ought to be selling on-line anyway (which, I would imagine, is where the comic sellers who no longer attend the con are).

And I don't buy the argument of "well, then the studios should release them!" If the bootleggers are doing it out of the goodness of their heart and not making a profit, I have no problem with it (examples: a lot of 'MST3k' fans, or some of the people who have made 'Star Wars' boots), but if you're charging premium prices for something you burned 100 copies of to DVD from an old VHS taped off of TV, I have no sympathy.
At the conventions and expos that I attend, vendors know the rules and don't offer PIRATED material, or are immediately shut down should they try to pedal PIRATED material. Thankfully, BOOTLEG stuff is left alone.

MovieExchange
05-21-06, 06:54 PM
It's unfortunate that the video community doesn't distinguish between "pirating" and "bootlegging". And worse than that, associates the lesser term "bootleg" with the more serious act of "piracy".

BOOTLEG = selling a homegrown product that isn't officially released.
PIRATE = selling a homegrown copy of an official product.


At the conventions and expos that I attend, vendors know the rules and don't offer PIRATED material, or are immediately shut down should they try to pedal PIRATED material. Thankfully, BOOTLEG stuff is left alone.


To bootleg means to produce, distribute or sell without permission or illegally (Dictionary.com)

Or we can go to Merriam-Webster, where the term "bootleg" is defined as "to produce, reproduce, or distribute illicitly or without authorization."

The terms "bootlegging" and "piracy" are pretty much interchangable.

rw2516
05-21-06, 07:07 PM
To bootleg means to produce, distribute or sell without permission or illegally (Dictionary.com)

Or we can go to Merriam-Webster, where the term "bootleg" is defined as "to produce, reproduce, or distribute illicitly or without authorization."

The terms "bootlegging" and "piracy" are pretty much interchangable.

Is a distinction made between items that are intended to be passed off as original as opposed to those that you can tell the difference. Some bootlegs are actually real pressed dvds rather than burned dvd-rs. "Counterfeit" maybe.

nodeerforamonth
05-21-06, 07:15 PM
It's against the law. 'Nuff said.
You wouldn't steal a car, would you? Except if you were in Michigan right now, where you can get away with it because the cops are raiding comic conventions..........

Well here in CA, laws aren't enforced (i.e. speeding, driving while distracted, coming over the border w/o permission, murder if you're a celebrity, etc...). There's no danger of this happening at the Comic-Con in July.

shtfilter
05-21-06, 08:20 PM
The covers.

I am a member of two different cover sites and design custom covers sometimes and when I see the low quality covers the bootleggers use I want to punch them in the face.

"You expect me to buy a $20 copy of 'Begotten' with that to represent it?"

And I would like them to have a 16X9 TV there to show me the quality.

I don't care if studios lose money. If they wanted the money or product out there they would release it.

*Case in point, Shout Factory paying the money to get Freaks and Geeks out there with music intact. Of which, I paid the extra money for the yearbook edition.

P.S. I do not own any bootlegs, not even ones that I really want like Begotten or Salo. Eventually one day I will save up the money for both.

wewantflair
05-21-06, 09:03 PM
Some of the people in this thread talk out of both sides of their mouths with such impunity that it's actually grotesque. On one hand, those people say that bootlegging is tolerable because art is being shared with the public. On the other hand, they are deliberately ignoring the wishes of artists (or owners of the art, such as publishers) due to their own senses of entitlement.

You are not entitled to a work of art simply because you want it. Publishers have as much right to art as the artists, since they in effect commission the art or purchase it after the fact. You do not have the right to take from these people simply because they are rich.

MovieExchange
05-21-06, 09:29 PM
Some of the people in this thread talk out of both sides of their mouths with such impunity that it's actually grotesque. On one hand, those people say that bootlegging is tolerable because art is being shared with the public. On the other hand, they are deliberately ignoring the wishes of artists (or owners of the art, such as publishers) due to their own senses of entitlement.

You are not entitled to a work of art simply because you want it. Publishers have as much right to art as the artists, since they in effect commission the art or purchase it after the fact. You do not have the right to take from these people simply because they are rich.

Wow, such sweeping generalizations. Tell me, did you actually bother to read what has been said in this thread?

toddly6666
05-21-06, 10:02 PM
wow, everyone should be proud of our brave policemen stopping those money-stealing criminals for bootlegging SILVERHAWKS, SILVER SPOONS, TURKISH STAR WARS, RAMBO cartoon, and TRANSFORMERS HEADMASTERS cartoon DVDs...good job police! Hollywood will now gain back the money they have been losing thanks to the good work! Instead of putting these guys in prison, they should take away their comics, action figures, and kick them out of momma's house. That's more of a punishment for them than fines or jailtime....it's good to see our hard-earned tax money preventing the enjoyment of American pop culture events...

wewantflair
05-21-06, 10:05 PM
Wow, such sweeping generalizations. Tell me, did you actually bother to read what has been said in this thread?

Yes. And I saw lots of people advocating bootlegging unreleased or OOP material.

nodeerforamonth
05-22-06, 12:21 AM
Yes. And I saw lots of people advocating bootlegging unreleased or OOP material.

I saw the opposite.

My opinion:

if it's something like da DaVinci code, there is no excuse. Book 'em.

If it's something obscure that is never going to come out officially anyways, then I don't see a problem with it.

TomOpus
05-22-06, 12:38 AM
Well here in CA, laws aren't enforced (i.e. speeding, driving while distracted, coming over the border w/o permission, murder if you're a celebrity, etc...). There's no danger of this happening at the Comic-Con in July.Please elaborate about how laws aren't enforced, because I'd like to disagree.

Also explain what happened to the bootleg table that was removed at last year's Comic-Con. Oh, they must've sold out in 3 hours and left, right?

renaldow
05-22-06, 02:40 AM
The sellers knew what they were doing was illegal. They took the chance when they decided it was a good idea to sell the bootlegs. They got caught this time. End of story. Don't do the crime if you can't do the time.

boe
05-22-06, 03:00 AM
Please elaborate about how laws aren't enforced, because I'd like to disagree.



I live in CA and would like to disagree as well. They enforce all the laws that generate revenue - e.g. parking, speeding, jay walking etc - OK none of the other ones - killing, beating (particularly if they are the ones doing it-I think it is in the job perks) theft, crossing borders... I've gotten two parking tickets and one speeding in CA but when I called to notify them that my car had been broken into and nearly $800 in stuff was stolen - they couldn't be bothered to show (Culver City Police - just want to say thanks again!). Somehow they managed to show within 5 minutes after I parked my car and he meter ran out. Amazingly they call every year to ask for money for the policeman's ball. Can't tell you how many times I've donated - I really can't :)


Just so you know I'm not against all cops- I worked with a great team back east. They only gave out tickets for gross violations - their budget was not in any way dependent on revenue generating activities such as parking, speeding, etc. Their only concern was crime such as theft and killing. The place is right on the border of a bad city so the cops have to deal with gangs etc. but they do a good job of keeping serious crime down by focusing their efforts on real criminal activities.

MovieExchange
05-22-06, 09:13 AM
Yes. And I saw lots of people advocating bootlegging unreleased or OOP material.

Aaaand where did you see people saying they were "entitled" to it?

Or are you just putting words in their mouths? I'm guessing you are.

Iron_Giant
05-22-06, 11:22 AM
The first time the original original trilogy will be on a home video format in quite a few years, actually, since Lucas told the public they would be released one last time then never again, back before the release of the 97 editions. And I doubt every fan will buy the new DVDs. Some will (gasp) actually be comfortable with the changes he made to the 2004 editions and continue living their lives.
Already have the orignal on VHS and the "Updated" version on DVD, so I will not be spending anymore money on the "Old" DVD.

wewantflair
05-22-06, 11:36 AM
Aaaand where did you see people saying they were "entitled" to it?

Or are you just putting words in their mouths? I'm guessing you are.

Would you care to offer an alternative idea for doing buying bootlegs? "Because I want to" or "because the companies won't release it/them in R1" are both examples of feelings of entitlement.

Linn1
05-22-06, 12:08 PM
With bootleg outfits like Video Asia, and dozens more in actual stores and video stores. I mean with places like HK Flix selling hundreds of boots online, what did they do? They shut down a couple of vendors. That's it. This does NOTHING to stop bootlegging. To stop that, you need to crack down on ALL bootleggers, starting with the large outfits. Fans will still get the stuff they want by trading, but then the movies will go back to being something companies can actually sell. Right now, companies look at niche market titles and then look if they've been booted. If they've been booted, it's a near instant pass.

Billyspunk
05-22-06, 12:09 PM
Does anyone know if dvdavenue.tv is a LEGIT company, meaning do they really have permission to sell unreleased tv shows? They seem to be fairly large and I was told they have been in business for 3 years, does the copyright owners know about them?

sracer
05-22-06, 01:34 PM
Would you care to offer an alternative idea for doing buying bootlegs? "Because I want to" or "because the companies won't release it/them in R1" are both examples of feelings of entitlement.
Because it is permissible? (At least a good case can be made for homegrown tapes/discs of TV shows that haven't been formally released by studios.)

wewantflair
05-22-06, 03:56 PM
Permissibility is an opportunity, not a motive. We don't do things because they are permissible, because that would imply that we would do everything that was permissible, which is simply ludicrous on face value.

Peep
05-22-06, 05:29 PM
I live in CA and would like to disagree as well. They enforce all the laws that generate revenue - e.g. parking, speeding, jay walking etc - OK none of the other ones - killing, beating (particularly if they are the ones doing it-I think it is in the job perks) theft, crossing borders... I've gotten two parking tickets and one speeding in CA but when I called to notify them that my car had been broken into and nearly $800 in stuff was stolen - they couldn't be bothered to show (Culver City Police - just want to say thanks again!). Somehow they managed to show within 5 minutes after I parked my car and he meter ran out.

I've lived in Los Angeles for about 10 years now and have never actually seen a police officer give out a parking ticket. True, they will ticket you for speeding and jay-walking.

TomOpus
05-22-06, 07:37 PM
I've lived in Los Angeles for about 10 years now and have never actually seen a police officer give out a parking ticket. I've never seen someone murder another person... but I hear it happens from time to time. :D

sracer
05-22-06, 08:08 PM
Permissibility is an opportunity, not a motive. We don't do things because they are permissible, because that would imply that we would do everything that was permissible, which is simply ludicrous on face value.
well then your whole "I want to = sense of entitlement" position is nothing more than flamebait. Because the motive for buying officially released DVDs is because we want to. :rolleyes:

boe
05-22-06, 08:51 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Peep
I've lived in Los Angeles for about 10 years now and have never actually seen a police officer give out a parking ticket.

I don't know if the people giving out tickets are actually elves but I guarantee if you park your car downtown, in santa monica, marina del rey, culver city, westwood... for 10 minutes any place that has metered parking or no parking between certain hours you'll magically have a ticket.

I've never seen someone murder another person... but I hear it happens from time to time. :D

Yeah but in LA there is no profit in that type of crime so while they catch thousands of people who park their car illegally every day they rarely catch any killers. Why would they want to - if they did, the money to lock them up comes from the budget which pays their raises every year.

calhoun07
05-22-06, 08:52 PM
well then your whole "I want to = sense of entitlement" position is nothing more than flamebait. Because the motive for buying officially released DVDs is because we want to. :rolleyes:

Isn't the main motive behind a lot of things we buy them because we want them? Did you buy your car due to a sense of entitlement? Or get it "tricked out" with extra stuff the dealer didn't include because you felt entitled to have a nicer car? Or do you make a special trip to a certain store to get something you can't get at your usual store because you feel entitled to have that specific item, whether it be a favorite food, a article of clothing, a favorite drink, what have you? I guess I don't understand where these people come up with sense of entitlement BS. Perhaps it's from their sense of entitlement that they feel they need to put down people they think are lesser than them.

nodeerforamonth
05-23-06, 01:25 AM
Please elaborate about how laws aren't enforced, because I'd like to disagree.

Also explain what happened to the bootleg table that was removed at last year's Comic-Con. Oh, they must've sold out in 3 hours and left, right?

I've driven past cops at 80mph. Never stopped me. I see people do it all the time too.

I see people driving with cell phones weaving all over the road. In front of cops. Never pulled over. I even saw a guy brushing his teeth while driving once. Constantly see women putting on makeup while driving 65mph down the freeway. Never see them pulled over.

Regarding getting away with murder if you're a celebrity? I refer to exhibit A: OJ Simpson. exhibit B: Robert Blake.

Had my car broken into half a dozen times. Even if the cops show up (IF), you're lucky if they even fill out a report.

Regarding the border? You've obviously haven't read the news lately. Nor are you from CA. The border is not enforced. People who hire illegals are not fined. Illegal aliens are allowed to roam free.

It's anarchy in CA.

What bootleg table at the Comic-Con were you talking about? I didn't hear of anyone getting their tables removed. And I've gone every day for every year for the past 10+ years.

JM1
05-23-06, 07:59 AM
I dunno if it's still the same, but in 2003 I went to see the 2nd Matrix movie (or was it the third? It was November of that year anyway) in the Loews theatre on 42nd St in NY, and on coming out of the theatre after the movie the street traders right outside the cinema were selling boots of the movie as you came out of the theatre! Right outside the damn theatre, in the middle of NY!

Fok
05-23-06, 04:40 PM
In all the Asian malls around here they have stores that just sell bootlegs. Not quite sure why the police haven't shut them down.

Class316
05-23-06, 06:10 PM
What sad news :(

Cameron
08-09-06, 04:12 AM
anybody ever get the story on what became of all this

MovieExchange
08-09-06, 05:20 AM
anybody ever get the story on what became of all this

Just what I posted. The cops raided the place on Friday, arresting between 14 and 17 people. Most of the dealers were released that day and were back at the convention on Saturday, selling their legal (and bootleg Japanese) wares. The convention organizers released the expected statement of "oh, we didn't know that these were illegal." Which is total bullshit, of course, but can't be proven.

The prevailing theory amongst dealers at the convention was that the convention organizers reported the dealers, out of fear of being held responsible if they did nothing and a raid still occured.

toddly6666
08-09-06, 09:00 AM
well, we all learned what the moral of this story is:
Don't ever sell bootleg dvds of The Green Hornet, Bionic 6, M.A.S.K. and Witchblade TV series, because it's just pure evil and wrong.

JCWBobC
08-09-06, 10:08 AM
The same thing happened at the Chiller Convention back on 1994 or 1995. Someone bought a bootleg tape that was horrible quality and decided to complain to the police or FBI about it. We stood in line for about 2 hours because they showed up and confiscated all the bootleg tapes people were selling. We didn't see anyone get arrested but it sucked that we had nothing to buy as this was the only way we could get the impossible to find stuff. We didn't know about the internet and their was no Ebay back then. Of course the next year things were back to normal but vendors weren't as open about selling things that weren't official releases.

I probably spent about $500-$1,000 in the early 90's buying tapes at conventions that I would not have been able to find anywhere else or weren't released commercially in the US. I remember copies of the Street Fighter animated movie selling for $25 a tape with no subtitles, because it was the only way to get it, and the guy sold out all 3 days. Nobody cared that it was a bootleg/pirated copy or that it would come out officially in 6 months to a year. They wanted it now(then) and they would pay the high price to have it.

DavidH
08-09-06, 12:08 PM
Michigan cops are dicks. And that's no threadcrap people, that's a fact.

True. In addition, it's become very apparent to me many of them spend 40 hours a week passing out speeding tickets -- often times ILLEGALLY parking on private property (i.e., citizen driveways) to do so. I can't tell you how often I and other people I talk to see this happen. If this is how Police are going to be used, then let's CUT funding to send a message.

calhoun07
08-09-06, 07:44 PM
well, we all learned what the moral of this story is:
Don't ever sell bootleg dvds of The Green Hornet, Bionic 6, M.A.S.K. and Witchblade TV series, because it's just pure evil and wrong.

And God will kill a puppy if you do it.

Brent L
11-12-06, 07:14 PM
I went to the Anderson Jockey Lot this morning, and I found a table outside with tons of brand new DVDs for 3 for $25. At first I was just scanning the section, not really looking all that close. The I saw that they had Song of the South on DVD, but didn't think too much of it since I've seen tons of sellers who deal with legit DVDs offering that exact same DVD. Then, as I noticed they had sealed copies of Beauty and the Beast: PE and picked them up in a mad rush to possibly buy them, I instantly could tell that they were not only bootlegs, but every single DVD that they had for sale was a fake. They had hundreds and hundreds of DVDs, all bootlegs, all the way from random older flicks to new releases to almost ever Disney film ever.

When I saw who they were, I recognized them. Years ago I bought the Lisa Marie Presley CD from them, sealed, and it ended up being a bootleg also. Back then I went back to them and demanded my money back since it was an obvious fake once you opened it, and the excuse they gave me was that they had nooooooooooo idea it was a fake.

Uh huh, sure.

The couple seems to be in their 60's or so, and I'm told that they are there every Saturday and Sunday. How they continue to get away with this, I'll never know.

I was going to post this in a thread I started back in 2003:

http://forum.dvdtalk.com/showthread.php?t=304892

But I noticed that it has been moved to the Archive folder.

It just really pissed me off, just as it always does, seeing so many people buying bootlegs when most of them think they are getting a great deal on legit items. I know that some people don't care, but I know that many of the people are buying from them because they don't even expect them to be fake at all.

The Infidel
11-12-06, 07:34 PM
Did you call the cops?

Brent L
11-12-06, 07:36 PM
No, I've never seen any results from doing that in the past.

calhoun07
11-12-06, 11:09 PM
Did you pee in their butts?

The Valeyard
11-12-06, 11:58 PM
Did you pee in their butts?


rotfl

Brent L
11-13-06, 12:35 AM
Did you pee in their butts?

I tried but then they called the cops on me instead!

Call the cops on someone selling bootleg DVDs at a flea market and they wont do anything, but the bootleggers makes one complaint about attempted anal urination and they come running.

Deadpool
11-13-06, 10:20 AM
Did you pee in their butts?
:lol:

Must be a slow day at The Otter Farm today...

There's no new 'humans molesting animal' stories out :D

mxv
11-13-06, 10:39 AM
I used to go to a lot of Record shows and as time progressed, there were less and less dealers selling vinyl and more and more selling bootleg videos and CDs. One time I get to the show and the doors are locked and there is cop cars everywhere. The cops came and shut down the show and arrested a bunch of the dealers for selling bootlegs. I hoped that it meant there would be less of them in future shows but all it meant was the dealers stopped coming and the shows were sparse until a few months later when their bravery returned. Eventually I stopped going because it was a big waste of time to go looking for anything but bootlegs.

That long winded tale was a lead-in to say that I'm surprised it took this long to have something like this happen and while you can aruge the merits of bootlegs all day, it is the law and selling them is illegal. Personally I have no problem with people swapping such things with each other in an attempt to get things on a DVD they can't just go out and buy, but I am against the people who sell and profit off these things when they had nothing to do with creating the stuff and the people who do get nothing.

Mike Adams
11-13-06, 03:10 PM
Personally I have no problem with people swapping such things with each other in an attempt to get things on a DVD they can't just go out and buy, but I am against the people who sell and profit off these things when they had nothing to do with creating the stuff and the people who do get nothing.

Well said. It would really bother me if I went to a record show expecting to buy... you know... RECORDS, and every table was full of bootlegs instead. That said, I go to a 3-day comic show every year, and if it weren't for the bootleg DVDs, I'd go nuts because I'm not that much of a comic fan. Still, I can see that true comic fans would be really pissed if they came to buy comics and there were more bootleggers than comic book dealers.

I know a lot of people look at this as a black-and-white issue, but if I may, let me point out the things that REALLY annoy me:

1) Dealers who are selling bootleg DVD-Rs of movies currently in theaters that you know DAMN WELL will be on DVD inside of six months.
2) Dealers who keep selling DVD-R bootlegs of cartoons that have either already been released, or are going to be released the following week.
3) Dealers who keep selling "complete collections" of a six-season cartoon show where seasons 1-4 have already been released, the latest of which was a very recent release, so you know seasons 5 and 6 are coming (I'm not talking about anything specific, but that situation happens often).

With so much stuff that's yet to appear on DVD, it would be in everybody's best interest for bootleggers to stick to stuff you actually can't get any other way. Unfortunately, the "pirates" who are just after easy money know that Disney titles sell well and the people buying them are the least likely to know or care that they're getting a bootleg.

MovieExchange
11-13-06, 06:00 PM
No, I've never seen any results from doing that in the past.

I've often wondered what the result would be if a customer were to just start opening the items and destroying the discs. What are they going to do, sue you? Sure, take a person to court and tell a judge that you're suing them for destroying bootlegs that you were trying to sell.

zombiezilla
11-13-06, 07:46 PM
I don't sell them, but if I did, my reply to you would be: that would be a good way to get your ass kicked in the most heinous way I could possibly imagine. Your wrists would be broken by the time you got to the 3rd disc or so. Take me to court...from a wheelchair. If you don't like 'em, don't buy 'em.

But I'll buy them, and I like them (and I don't copy & re-sell them). Don't stop me from enjoying the stuff.

Christ, bunch fuckin' Nazis out there.

Xbox69
11-13-06, 07:56 PM
I've often wondered what the result would be if a customer were to just start opening the items and destroying the discs. What are they going to do, sue you? Sure, take a person to court and tell a judge that you're suing them for destroying bootlegs that you were trying to sell.

How about getting a custom made T-shirt (preferrably black with white lettering) emblazoned with the words, These Discs Are Bootlegs!!. Walk up and just browse not uttering a single word. ;) Hey, pair up with a buddy and take shifts. I wonder how many customers they'd get then.

Have the lettering on Front & Back for maximum effect.

JMG
11-13-06, 08:06 PM
How about getting a custom made T-shirt (preferrably black with white lettering) emblazoned with the words, These Discs Are Bootlegs!!. Walk up and just browse not uttering a single word. ;) Hey, pair up with a buddy and take shifts. I wonder how many customers they'd get then.

Have the lettering on Front & Back for maximum effect.



:lol:








don't forget to wear a richard nixon mask.

zombiezilla
11-13-06, 08:42 PM
Damn, don't you think that everyone who buys every Beatle bootleg that comes out already has the entire catalogue of legit stuff, and simply wants MORE? And even when/if the stuff were to come out eventually on a legit label, they'd buy those too? KISS just got me to shitcan a great deal of bootleg VHS stuff that I'd kept for years when they released KISSOLOGY, Vol. 1; I gave one of the tapes to a friend who's a casual fan, the rest were tossed. Who needs 'em? They're available from a legit source! THAT IS ALL THAT WE, THE FANS, WANT...AND DEMAND. If we can't get the 1960's Marvel Comics Cartoons we want from Wal-Mart (or Best Buy, or Circuit City, etc.), but they're available from a bootleg seller at the local comic-con, so be it. Leave people the hell alone to enjoy what they want.

I do not condone the pirating of items that are already out, or have a date announced, or even have someone from their camp who says that they're "coming out soon!" But, shit, I like early stuff by Cheap Trick. I own a DVD of at least one show from each of their first 10 tours. And compilations of TV appearances from each year. But I own all the legit stuff the group released from that time period as well. Who does this harm, considering that were CT to release "CheapTrick-ology, Vol.1" which included any of this stuff (not necessarily all of it), that all of their fans would buy this?!?!?

People need to get over themselves, for Christ's sake.

zombiezilla
11-13-06, 08:45 PM
How about getting a custom made T-shirt (preferrably black with white lettering) emblazoned with the words, These Discs Are Bootlegs!!. Walk up and just browse not uttering a single word. ;) Hey, pair up with a buddy and take shifts. I wonder how many customers they'd get then. Have the lettering on Front & Back for maximum effect.


You apparently don't get it; WE KNOW THEY'RE BOOTLEGS, that's why we buy 'em. You could give out FREE fucking shirts, and not one person would care, except maybe people you dragged out to the show with you.

Cameron
11-13-06, 08:47 PM
i doubt that most people who buy bootlegs don't know any better....most just don't care (including myself) i'm not going to pay good money for things readily available through the regular channels, but I have/will buy stuff that I can't get my hands on, and never will.

Star Wars Holiday Special
Song of the south
monster squad
night of the comet
the wonder years
batman (adam west)
zatoichi 14
halloween 6 producers cut
Corman's fantastic four
BraveStarr
Futureworld

all of which are not available in the public market. If they ever become available I would love to replace the sub par boots with a regular dvd, but until then I'll hold on to what i have. The only way to curb bootlegging is to make the titles available. Every convention i have ever been to had Star Wars bootleg dvds until the newest edition came out...since then, they have all but dissapeared.

I don't understand people who pay for videocamera copied boots of new movies still in theater, or readily available series...but honestly I don't see much of that, other than the guys selling off the old stock at a discounted price

zombiezilla
11-13-06, 08:47 PM
Another good example; I have owned/currently own every Godzilla movie currently released in R1 (and many from other regions). But I also own a large selection of Godzilla bootlegs as well (thank Gawd for eBay!).

Brent L
11-13-06, 08:53 PM
I'm ok with people buying that type of stuff and I understand it perfectly. Heck, I've downloaded all sorts of unreleased stuff over the years. The bootleggers that piss me off are those who have sealed DVDs of various popular titles and new releases and Disney stuff and come across as legit to the average consumer who just happens to walk by, like at a flea market or a jockey lot. To many, they wont even know that they aren't buying the real thing, and for many of those people they actually do care and feel cheated when they eventually find out, or they're told, that what they actually bought was a bootleg from a goof.

I've actually let people know that they are looking at bootlegs in situations like that, and they thanked me and didn't buy anything from them.

Brooklyn
11-13-06, 09:01 PM
Another good example; I have owned/currently own every Godzilla movie currently released in R1 (and many from other regions). But I also own a large selection of Godzilla bootlegs as well (thank Gawd for eBay!).

How is that a good example? Just because YOU would replace a bootleg with a
legit release doesn't mean everyone else would. There are far too many folks
that are happy to just stick with the boot.

zombiezilla
11-13-06, 09:34 PM
I doubt that highly. Every fan I know personally, of every genre that I know, would CHEERFULLY replace their old boots with legit releases, were they to become available. We are the norm, NOT the exception. Just ask around; you'll find out I'm right!

A possible exception would be that if the actual source material sucked so bad on the boot (and was from a near-original source), that no one gave a shit about getting a legit release. Example: Van Halen live in Argentina, 1982. I own the bootleg VHS; their performances are so bad, it's no wonder this'll never see the light of day legitimately, and I'd probably pass if it did.

Brooklyn
11-13-06, 09:52 PM
I doubt that highly. Every fan I know personally, of every genre that I know, would CHEERFULLY replace their old boots with legit releases, were they to become available. We are the norm, NOT the exception. Just ask around; you'll find out I'm right!

Doubt all you want, I can cite the exact opposite whereby those I know have
stated (and shown) that they wouldn't/won't replace their boots with legit
releases. Why pay for something they already have when that money could
go towards something they couldn't download is a common reason. I'm not
saying you yourself, nor your friends wouldn't, but to say that that's the norm?
No way.

MovieExchange
11-13-06, 10:19 PM
I don't sell them, but if I did, my reply to you would be: that would be a good way to get your ass kicked in the most heinous way I could possibly imagine. Your wrists would be broken by the time you got to the 3rd disc or so. Take me to court...from a wheelchair. If you don't like 'em, don't buy 'em.

But I'll buy them, and I like them (and I don't copy & re-sell them). Don't stop me from enjoying the stuff.

Christ, bunch fuckin' Nazis out there.


You, my friend, have a severe mental problem.

Lighten up, Francis.

turborobb
11-14-06, 04:19 AM
We have two big comic/sci fi/collectors shows here in Orlando every year, the FX Show in January and Megacon in Febuary. Last year there were tons of bootleg DVD people at both shows. Bootlegs of the new Doctor Who and Battlestar Galactica were big sellers last year. I picked up a lot of rare stuff myself... I love classic cheesy sci fi TV and got Voyagers!, Automan, Star Maidens, Otherworld, the Man from Atlantis, Jason of Star Command, Fantastic Journey, old WCW Monday Nitros and various sci fi movies that you can't buy on offical DVD. I don't mind fans trading rare material that will most likely never be released on DVD or even charging a small price for thier time to make it, but the thing I don't understand is how much they want for the stuff, I know a booth can cost a lot of money at these shows, but $20 of the Star Wars holiday special or $30, $40, $50, $60 for a bootleg season set that you copied on your computer last week? come on.

I've thought about running off my own copies of these TV shows, printing up some fancy covers, getting a booth at the next con and undercutting all the bootlegers 50% or more.

At the cons, I always look around on Saturday and find what I want and offer a silly low price, (I'll give you $20 for this DVD set you have priced $50) they always laugh and say no, but when I come back at the last minute sunday night they always take me up on the offer.

I also love how the bootleg covers are made to look like R2 or Imports, like they are fooling anyone.

zombiezilla
11-14-06, 06:13 AM
You, my friend, have a severe mental problem.
Lighten up, Francis.


No, it's you with the problem. Come up to a sales booth at a show and commit a violent act in view of the seller and you'll get an immediate and violent response...as you should, were you to do something so stupid.

I've beaten a man's ass more than once for kicking a dog. If people that like to kick dogs knew that someone like me was gonna be right behind them, watching, waiting for them to kick that dog so that their face could be ground up, maybe there'd be less cruelty to animals.

Grow up, Francis.

Brooklyn
11-14-06, 07:16 AM
No, it's you with the problem. Come up to a sales booth at a show and commit a violent act in view of the seller and you'll get an immediate and violent response...as you should, were you to do something so stupid.

I've beaten a man's ass more than once for kicking a dog. If people that like to kick dogs knew that someone like me was gonna be right behind them, watching, waiting for them to kick that dog so that their face could be ground up, maybe there'd be less cruelty to animals.

Grow up, Francis.

I can understand the sympathy for a dog, but the way you stated your
feelings don't exactly help prove him wrong. As for the DVDs, they're an
inanimate object and taking a few bucks away from a bootlegger who
has no right selling the discs to begin with in no way compares to the
(defenseless) animal cruelty comparison.

scarredgod
11-14-06, 08:54 AM
first of all, i am a bootleg buyer, of rare or unreleased stuff...BUT it would be nice to to a convention and find legit DVDs from other regions. the Pittsburgh Comicon and Monster Bash are both filled with bootleg dealers, no one legit.

i would love to see a company like Xploited Cinema set up a booth at one of these cons, but why would they? they would be selling a legit R3 DVD for 35 bucks and a dealer across from him would have a burned copy of the same DVD for 20 bucks, 3 for 50.

MovieExchange
11-14-06, 11:36 AM
Grow up, Francis.


Sounds like you should take your own advice... you're the one playing the role of "I'm going to beat your ass, I'm the internet tough guy."

When you can stop fantasizing about how much of a tough guy you are and can act like an adult and have a mature conversation, check back in with me, ok?

nemein
11-14-06, 12:07 PM
<i>Mod note: I think it's about time to wrap up this "conversation" </i>