chess

I hear all the time how people sold their Gamecubes, and I just can't reconcile it with my experience this generation.

I'm genuinely confused about this. I own a PS2 and a Gamecube (Halo wasn't enough to get me to buy an Xbox), and I must have played my Cube more than my PS2 by a 5:1 margin.

The Cube was the smallest and most reliable console this generation. It was the cheapest console this generation. It also had the best controller IMO (purely subjective)...not to mention the only first party wireless controller. The graphics were typically as good or better than the PS2 or Xbox (perhaps a bit more cartoony and colorful).

Most importantly, I believe the Cube had the most "A list" titles.

Mario Sunshine was beautiful and loads of fun
Zelda: Wind Waker was stylish with perfect controls and a great quest (perhaps a bit short)
Mario Kart: Nothing innovative, but still the most fun racing game this generation (especially multiplayer)
Metroid Prime & 2: Bar none, my favorite game this generation...not even sure what would be second (maybe GTA3 or Vice City)
Animal Crossing and Pikmen: Absolutely unique (a rare thing in video games)
Resident Evil 4: Played through 5 TIMES before I put it down. A first for me.
Super Smash Brothers: I absolutely DEFY you to have more multiplayer fun
Mario Golf/Tennis/Baseball/Strikers: More fun than any of the licensed sports franchises...and it's not close
F-Zero GX: Absurdly hard and unforgiving, but drop dead gorgeous
Eternal Darkness: Where to start...
Pac-man Vs.: Best. Party. Game. Ever.
Paper Mario: Just as good, maybe better, than any Final Fantasy

In contrast, the X-box had maybe 2-3 A-list titles, and the PS2 had 5-6 (unless you count sequels multiple times)...GTA, Ratchet & Clank, GT, FF, MGS, Ace Combat (maybe just me)...and that's about all I can think of. There were plenty of top notch multi-platform games like Madden and Soul Calibur, but I usually went with the Cube version for the controller.

So what the hell happened?

Was the PS brand just too entrenched by the time the Cube was launched. Were too many people feeling burned by the N64? Was Nintendo just not cool (whatever that means) anymore? Did the market outgrow the cartoonish games? Was it the funky little proprietary disks? Was it the funky indigo color? Are people averse to playing umpteen Mario titles? Was it ignoring online play?

Liver&Onions

Pre-emptive mod post. Since this has potential to be a console bashing topic. Please refrain from it, or you will be spanked.

I have my reasons why I think it "failed"... a brief version.

3rd party support was minimal. But when they were good, there were good..when they were bad they were horrid.

I think that the largest reason is peoples perception and maybe even Nintendo's marketing for the system. It sadly did seem targeted for the younger set. I'm guessing there were more games (percentage based) aimed at the Teen and under crowd than other systems. And once a perception is in place, it's tough to break the mold.

I bought mine launch day, and still have it. It doens't get played as much, but why...I think because it's not always hooked up to the TV. I still have RE4 to finish, Killer 7 to finish, and Paper Mario to start. but it's that extra 3 minutes of work to plug it all in that prevents me from it.

gimmepilotwings

I agree with Liver.

Early 3rd party support, and virtually no EA support, eventhough they did come out year 1, virtually doomed this console from the start. If RE4 was a launch title, It would have changed the tide. I think that RE4 was the best game of last generation.

PixyJunket

I don't think "lost" or "failure" are the right words to use. Would you consider an independent movie studio who doesn't care to jump into the "me too" world of making the next big Spider-Men or X-Man movie a failure? They make the product they want, satisfy a niche and make a profit while doing it. Technically they're "behind" the big studios but have not "lost" anything nor have they "failed" at anything.

If Nintendo was trying to compete with the mainstream market and achieve the "lowest common denominator" numbers Sony and Microsoft were looking at, yes, I'd say they lost.. but that was never their intent. Whether they sold as many Gamecubes as they wanted may be up for argument, it's hard to say they failed when it appears they have done exactly what they were aiming for this generation.

chess

I'll buy your argument for the next generation, but I really believe that Nintendo had every intention of "competing" in this current generation.

The Cube is a pretty straightforward console and didn't do anything terribly unique until midway through with GBA connectivity on games like Animal Crossing, Wind Waker, and Pac Man Vs.

chess

Was that a carryover from the N64, or was there some licensing/porting issue?

Can't argue with either of these statements, though I'm still partial to Metroid Prime. Edit to add: Both Cube games though!

The Bus

I'll put it this way: I wanted to own a Gamecube. I really did. Everytime I would go into Best Buy to get one, I would sit and look at the racks of games to get something that would make me get this console.

For the first couple of years, there was nothing. No Zelda game, no real Mario game... All the games that looked interesting were only "OK" --- I don't buy a system for "OK" games. I event went with a friend and told him "If you see a game that looks worth it, I'll get it."

After Halo 2 came out, I really didn't play anything else for a while. It was a fun game and I felt like I needed to play it to make the $50 I spent on Xbox Live worth it. Even the PS2 I had sat in the dust, and I didn't pick it up again until Katamari came out. Katamari was actually only the second game I ever got for the PS2. The first? Twisted Metal Black.

darkside

The Cube was my favorite of the three, but I think the reason for its failure was the fact that it has weaker third party support and that keeps it from competing head to head. That is why Nintendo has gone away from direct competition with the Wii and DS.

Another problem is Nintendo gamers. They tend to be so supportive of Nintendo's first party games that they ignore a lot of quality software from third parties. That in turn cause third parties to shy away from Nintendo. There were a number of Cube titles that should have been hits, but instead sold poorly. Also the fact they went with those tiny memory cards at launch killed sports gaming on the Cube. That was perhaps the dumbest mistake of all. Nintendo really has failed badly over the years in understanding American gamers.

DJ_Longfellow

Well, you have to look at us SIMPLE gamers out there. I like SPORTS and FPS, thus the XBOX is my console of choice. I still look at the GameCube as a kiddy console....I know I'm wrong and I'm sure I would enjoy it, but I really had no interest in another console.

Canis Firebrand

Not haveing any online gaming capabilities also hurt it, in my opinion.

Could you imagine Mario Kart against other people, it would have been a blast.

I too see it as more of a kids console. I own one, and do enjoy the few games I have for it. But for a while, it seemed that the majority of titles coming out for it were younger oriented. The x number of pokemon games and such led to that generalization.

Gallant Pig

Super Smash Brother's Online

xmiyux

I also loved my Cube when i had it for Animal Crossing and the like. But the day came when i was at the mall wanting something new to play and couldn't find a thing that interested me. I looked at the list of upcoming titles and it was the same thing... the only thing i thought looked good at the time was a Harvest Moon game and it was forever away. Meanwhile the Xbox with KOTOR and DOA3 was taunting me from the shelf - so i traded all my Cube stuff and went Xbox.

That is why i'm so excited for the downloadable retro games on the Wii - i should never get bored.

chess

Is there a Pokemon game on the cube? I sincerely don't know, but I don't recall one.

At any rate, I'm inclined to think that the online part didn't really hurt it until it had already "failed".

I also agree about the perception. Mario games do look awfully kiddie, but the play mechanics are rock solid...making them loads of fun.

Groucho

There was a few Pokemon games I think. None were online, which was a mistake. A reasonably-priced Pokemon MMORPG could potentially rival WoW in popularity.

Canis Firebrand

The majority came out on the Gameboy and those systems before the DS. But the GameCube did have 2 or 3 pokemon titles.

xmiyux

Heck, even just Pokemon Arena online would have been awesome.

Mario Kart online gives me chills - man i love those games.

Canis Firebrand

Heck, even Mario Party online would be a blast.
Though I think 95% of the fun of the game is seeing the reactions of people in the room with you. But, for those times you want to play and don't have anyone over, playing online would be a good alternative.

tpc

I've said many times that I love my cube, but I don't think it's an overstatement to say that they lost this generation in the mainstreams eyes... who doesn't really care about things like profit margins.

I think lack of online hurt... and I also think the weak launch lineup that was missing Mario, Metroid, and Zelda. That initial lineup says a lot to gamers.

I also think the choice of launch color hurt... wasn't the purple cube the only one available at launch? Most guys just don't want a little purple box. I know I personally didn't buy one until the black was available... but that had more to do with the $99 price tag than the color.

I also kind of think the choice to use the mini-dvd format hurt them a lot... with less memory available, it felt to me that developers often had to trim things to fit the medium... most notably audio.

Groucho

The console launched with both purple and black colors.

tpc

Then I stand corrected.

AllHallowsEve

It's design hurt the console. Think back to when it came out. That instilled it with "kiddie" right from the start. People moaned at the time over the design. Like it or not, people will automatically judge on design.

Lack of 3rd Party support.

Droughts of quality games. You would have one come out, but then it would be many months before another. Virtually all the best games were 1st party and there were not enough of them. Mario Sunshine and Luigi's Mansion just didn't cut it and were weak compared to Mario titles that came before it. Neither brought anything new to the table.

Mario Brothers, Mario Brothers 3 (not this one, but it added to NES and had some of the best graphics on the system), Mario World, and Mario 64 were all system launches and all uniquely added to the franchise back in the day. Mario World was basically just a graphically enhanced version of Mario 3 with new suits, but it was still loved.

Paper Mario 2, Animal Crossing, Resident Evil 4, etc., were quality. Both Pikmin and Animal Crossing were very unique. But not enough of them.

Delay after delay after delay. Coughs at Zelda.

Not enough variety and lack of M rated games. Like it or not, people want M rated titles.

Hard to "pirate"

chess

I bought purple.

...actually I think it was a pack in with Mario Sunshine. I wanted black, but the purple was a better deal.

Liver&Onions

I got the purple, because I though (and still think) it was cooler than the plain ol' black

fujishig

As everyone else said, lack of 3rd party support was huge... there are just people out there that will never be into Nintendo 1st party games, and will gravitate towards Madden and GTA and the like. Of course, the lack of third party support was caused by a few factors:

1) PS1 dominance, which meant that a lot of developers jumped ship the last generation.
2) The unique aspects of the Gamecube made ports from other systems problematic. The controller, first of all, while great for games that were designed specifically for it, was a terrible substitute for games designed for the dual shock. On top of that, if you played any sports games on the cube, a season would pretty much fill up your memory card. The only "port" I bought for the Cube was Soul Calibur 2, and even then it was only because of Link and the fact that I had an X-arcade stick.
3) Things just rolled downhill as the PS2 became dominant this generation. Look at Capcom, who developed several "exclusives" for the Gamecube but almost had to port them to PS2 because the audience just wasn't there: Killer 7 and Viewtiful Joe, for example (I think RE4 would've made it to the PS2 regardless).

So the PS2 had weaker graphics, but a better memory card system and a huge fanbase, which meant that games would be designed for it and maybe ported to other systems. The Xbox had better graphics and a Hard drive, as well as better online play, and games that appealed to the US fanbase (FPS).

There's also the fact that Nintendo is probably the worst at putting older games out as a Greatest hits price... even their early GH titles were 10 bucks more than the other systems.

But they made money, they pleased their fans, and they're still around, so it wasn't all doom and gloom.

maxfisher

Even more, the fact that it couldn't play DVDs! How has nobody mentioned this yet? I know quite a few people that weren't necessarily gamers but wanted a primary or secondary DVD player and figured they might as well spend the nominal extra cash to be able to play games if they wanted to. I don't think including DVD playback would've propelled them to number one or anything, but I do think this generation saw a large segment of casual or non-gamers pick up the Xbox or PS2 just because they could get one for anywhere from $50 to $100 more than a standalone DVD player. Nintendo was not an option for this segment of the market and I think it hurt their overall sales.