DVD Talk
We Need To Bring Back Shame and Good Manners [Archive] - DVD Talk Forum
 
Best Sellers
1.
2.
3.
4.
5.
6.
7.
8.
The Longest Day
Buy: $54.99 $24.99
9.
10.
DVD Blowouts
1.
2.
3.
4.
5.
6.
7.
Alien [Blu-ray]
Buy: $19.99 $9.99
8.
9.
10.

PDA
DVD Reviews

View Full Version : We Need To Bring Back Shame and Good Manners


saoirse
09-27-05, 09:44 AM
I really think shame needs to be back in style. I have nothing against larger people, but when did it become cool to have your ass crack showing to everyone at one side and then your bakery (rolls) hanging 6 inches over the front of your pants? I don't care how big someone is, but leting it all hang out in public is as bad as spandex was. Also, no matter what your size, your 12 year old kid should not be dressed like a hooker.

As for manners, I just don't see many people who have them anymore.
Examples:
Holding a door open for the next person.
Giving a thank you wave if someone lets you in in traffic.
Writing a thank you note for a nice present given.
Just saying thank you.

Good Manners need to be taught in school, cause parents sure as hell ain't teaching them anymore. Or maybe the parents who drive their BMW's or Mercedes' over to the daycare to drop off little Jimmy could pay to have their kids taught manners for them. Just some thoughts.

Ok rant over, just wanted to bitch for a minute.

La Bella Rose
09-27-05, 09:48 AM
:fart: Excuse me.....:blush:

PrincessT
09-27-05, 09:49 AM
Yeah, the thank you wave for letting someone change lanes in traffic seemed to go out of style with tight-rolled jeans.

Brain Stew
09-27-05, 09:52 AM
Yes, grandpa.

Kittydreamer
09-27-05, 09:55 AM
I teach my children good manners. Even my 3 year old knows when to say thank you, you're welcome and no thank you. They both have great table manners as well. Now, if I could only teach some manners to my husband....

dick_grayson
09-27-05, 09:58 AM
I'm not sure shame is the right word, but I know what you mean. Most people are dicks these days.

Groucho
09-27-05, 09:59 AM
Most people are dicks these days.Especially YOU.

uberjoe
09-27-05, 10:00 AM
Good Manners need to be taught in school, cause parents sure as hell ain't teaching them anymore. Or maybe the parents who drive their BMW's or Mercedes' over to the daycare to drop off little Jimmy could pay to have their kids taught manners for them.

I'm in favor of shaming people for being judgmental over whatever someone else drives. That seems very shameful, basing your opinion of someone on their automobile, then setting them apart with the implication that they are not good parents.

Mopower
09-27-05, 10:00 AM
Ehhh!!! I'm an old man and I hate everything. Ehhh!!!

dick_grayson
09-27-05, 10:01 AM
Especially YOU.


I'm a huge dick! :D

Randy Miller III
09-27-05, 10:06 AM
This'll never happen. Good manners take too much effort, while shame actually hurts people's feelings. ;)

Brain Stew
09-27-05, 10:08 AM
Ehhh!!! I'm an old man and I hate everything. Ehhh!!!
Pretty much :lol:.

saoirse
09-27-05, 10:10 AM
I'm in favor of shaming people for being judgmental over whatever someone else drives. That seems very shameful, basing your opinion of someone on their automobile, then setting them apart with the implication that they are not good parents.


I thought that would be picked up on, but not this way. My between the lines point there was against the people who toss their kids in daycare when they don't need to. They'd rather each have a luxury car, than have one of them spend time raising the child. I have nothing against luxury cars, but I do against people who are so selfish that they choose a car over spending more time with the child they forced into the world. That was my point.

Breakfast with Girls
09-27-05, 10:12 AM
Cover your shame!

Brain Stew
09-27-05, 10:13 AM
I thought that would be picked up on, but not this way. My between the lines point there was against the people who toss their kids in daycare when they don't need to. They'd rather each have a luxury car, than have one of them spend time raising the child. I have nothing against luxury cars, but I do against people who are so selfish that they choose a car over spending more time with the child they forced into the world. That was my point.
Wow, you are a real grouch.

Some families both parents work....

Groucho
09-27-05, 10:15 AM
I thought that would be picked up on, but not this way. My between the lines point there was against the people who toss their kids in daycare when they don't need to. They'd rather each have a luxury car, than have one of them spend time raising the child. I have nothing against luxury cars, but I do against people who are so selfish that they choose a car over spending more time with the child they forced into the world. That was my point.After reading this post, I grabbed a crowbar and began beating the next luxury car I could find with it, while screaming "THIS IS WHAT YOU GET FOR BEING A BAD PARENT! THIS IS WHAT YOU GET FOR BEING A BAD PARENT!"

Finally, the noise was too much for my wife, who came out side and yelled "What the hell are you doing to our car?"

VinVega
09-27-05, 10:45 AM
After reading this post, I grabbed a crowbar and began beating the next luxury car I could find with it, while screaming "THIS IS WHAT YOU GET FOR BEING A BAD PARENT! THIS IS WHAT YOU GET FOR BEING A BAD PARENT!"

Finally, the noise was too much for my wife, who came out side and yelled "What the hell are you doing to our car?"
:lol::up:

Now THAT'S the "funny Groucho."

I can't make a total generalization on manners. I've run into plenty of polite people and plenty of ignorant morons. Take 'em one at a time. I don't agree that manners should be left to the schools. Manners should be left to the parents with the schools under the expectation that the kids will have been properly instructed by the parents. If not, the school tells the parent, who will "take care of business" if you know what I mean.

Bronkster
09-27-05, 11:10 AM
Being one of the "older" otters, I could yammer on for pages about this topic. But, out of courtesy to others, I won't. ;) All the examples of manners given by Saoirse are things I do. Yes, even the writing of 'thank you' notes.

When did we get to the point where we feel the need to thank the retailer for the honor of buying something as they ignore us to talk on their cellphone? :sad:

dtcarson
09-27-05, 11:16 AM
If manners are left to the schools, even apart from the fact that doing that yields one more bit of parental authority to the inefficient and partially ineffective public school systems, by the time the kid gets there, it's too late. Daycare and schools should reinforce parents teachings, not replace or counter them. My boy is about to turn three, and for at least a year or so he's been very good with Please, Thank you, Excuse me [after burping] and You're welcome. The other day he said Excuse me when walking in front of someone at the store, I was proud. He still forgets sometimes, he's three, but he does very well.

I don't think it's a question of 'knowledge' or 'ignorance' [perhaps wisdom], but I think a lot of these social issues are due to people being incredibly selfish and self-centered and solipsist, combined with the recent teachings that 'you're as important as anybody else.' To an extent that's true, but only to an extent. And it has been taken too far, now people think they're *more* important than anyone else. From the no-wave-when-passing, to the use-ExitOnlylane as a passing lane, to not holding doors for the person behind you, to cutting in line at McDs, they're all acts of a person who is the only person in his universe. I was at the store today to get some bagels, you mix and match your own from the bins into a bag. There were no tongs, they always got broken. Anyone who would think of other people in addition to himself would think, "Hey, no tongs, hmm, I guess I should either use these handy dandy wax paper pieces thoughtfully placed here by the store to select my bagels, or at least take the one I touch." Basic manners that in the old days [like, oh, fifteen years ago], every six-year-old knew. Not today! There was an older lady ahead of me, not senior-citizen old, but older. She was taking her time deciding, okay, fine. She was selecting each of her 9 bagels, one by one, out of different bins. Whatever, I'm like that at Dunkin Donuts. But she was reaching in, manhandling three or four bagels in each bin, before picking the right one, and of course not using the paper that was right in front of her stupid face. She eventually moved, I pointedly and loudly asked the clerk if there were tongs, he said No, just use the paper, which I did. She came back [she should have heard us] and said I need to get one more, then reached in the bin. I said "Could you use the paper please?!?" in a polite/rude tone, she was like "Oh? Okay" but of course she had already groped another two bagels. I said "Never mind, you've touched them all now, don't bother" and stood there glaring till she moved and I could get my bagels.

Anyway, this was an older person, I assume she learned manners and common sense as a child, maybe not. Regardless, living in a society where rude and selfish behaviour is the norm, I guess those of us who care have to work harder to have a bit of social decorum.

Also anyway, I drive a BMW. My wife and I both work. My son has manners. My son goes to daycare 3x a week, it's not just 'dumping him off'. He learns there, and has fun, and plays with other kids [that's another thing, kids don't play outside anymore, but that's another thread]. We both work to continue the lifestyle we had before he was born, and take care of him, and attempt to save for the future, both ours and his. I guess we could both quit and go on welfare and let you pay for us, since obviously you know what's best, that my having a BMW shows my 'unfitness'. What is allowed, a Honda? Kia? What if it's new, and my BMW was bought used for 1/2 the cost of a new Honda?

tasha99
09-27-05, 11:24 AM
My 7-year-old is uber polite, but my 13-year-old is a complete and total ass. Just thought I'd share.

joeblow69
09-27-05, 11:42 AM
Holding a door open for the next person.

Screw that. Not only do I hate holding doors open for strangers, if someone is walking behind me, and we're coming to a door, I will speed up so that I get a respectable distance between us so it won't seem rude for me not to hold the door open.

Unless you're an invalid, you can open it your damn self! :mad:

talemyn
09-27-05, 12:10 PM
I don't think it's a question of 'knowledge' or 'ignorance' [perhaps wisdom], but I think a lot of these social issues are due to people being incredibly selfish and self-centered and solipsist, combined with the recent teachings that 'you're as important as anybody else.' To an extent that's true, but only to an extent. And it has been taken too far, now people think they're *more* important than anyone else.I know what you mean . . . I think that, in America, at least, there was a big shift around the 60's and 70's from a societal attitude of "I am a member of this society and, in return for my contributing to it, I am afforded these benefits", to one of "I am a member of this society and, as such, I am owed these benefits, regardless of what I do".

Not sure what caused it, but it seems to have stuck and spread. :(

saoirse
09-27-05, 12:34 PM
If manners are left to the schools, even apart from the fact that doing that yields one more bit of parental authority to the inefficient and partially ineffective public school systems, by the time the kid gets there, it's too late. Daycare and schools should reinforce parents teachings, not replace or counter them. My boy is about to turn three, and for at least a year or so he's been very good with Please, Thank you, Excuse me [after burping] and You're welcome. The other day he said Excuse me when walking in front of someone at the store, I was proud. He still forgets sometimes, he's three, but he does very well.

Great to hear. Keep up the great work.

Also anyway, I drive a BMW. My wife and I both work. My son has manners. My son goes to daycare 3x a week, it's not just 'dumping him off'. He learns there, and has fun, and plays with other kids [that's another thing, kids don't play outside anymore, but that's another thread]. We both work to continue the lifestyle we had before he was born, and take care of him, and attempt to save for the future, both ours and his. I guess we could both quit and go on welfare and let you pay for us, since obviously you know what's best, that my having a BMW shows my 'unfitness'. What is allowed, a Honda? Kia? What if it's new, and my BMW was bought used for 1/2 the cost of a new Honda?

Point taken. I actually think it is good for some kids to get a 'mix (a few days in daycare and the others with their parents). It can help with socializing. Mostly my 'BMW' crap rant was just referring to those who do this everyday and don't really care about their kids (there are surprisingly a lot of them). I just picked BMW because it's what I see the most at a particular daycare in my neighborhood. Sorry if I offended.

Again, I do like your idea of 3x a week, as opposed to every day.

Save Ferris
09-27-05, 01:00 PM
All the men in this forum need to get back to basics:

http://www.lahacal.org/gentleman/ladies.html

dtcarson
09-27-05, 01:35 PM
Well, we're really lucky--we both work full time, but he stays with his grandmother, who lives five miles from us, 2 days a week. Obviously that helps financially, and lets us both have careers and stay in the working world [adults need socialization too], but it also lets them be together and lets him appreciate the 'extended family'.
But yes, there are lots of people whose career/job, and even worse, tangible and obvious representations of implied wealth comes first. I think work is important for various reasons, and its important for a child to see someone manage their time and money and work, but like they say, no one's gravestone says "I should have spent more time at the office."
SaveFerris: I'm not sure if you're being sarcastic, but on a quick glance of that site, I don't see anything wrong with any of it. I like this part
"Should one demand the surrender of a seat to a lady in a crowded theater?
"To this, we would answer that, if the gallantry of the gentlemen thus situated does not prompt them to proffer the seats in question, it is rudeness to request it. A lady is a lady, it is true; but if she could not come early enough to get a good seat, she cannot expect that spectators who did should inconvenience themselves for her sake""

Be a gentleman and offer it, but if you don't, hey ladies, you have to make some effort as well.

*laugh* that site has some funny bits in it. Check out Mark Twains "Etiquette at a Fire"
http://www.lahacal.org/gentleman/twain.html
especially the order in which people should be rescued.
I'll agree, there is such a thing as taking it too far.

Brain Stew
09-27-05, 02:10 PM
I think that this forum is becoming more and more a haven for crotchety old persons and drama queens.

1) If you want to go back to the days were people doffed their hats to strangers on the street, DON'T. It never existed so you are comparing yourself to an unfair standard.

2) If you are worried about the state of society, DON'T. Society by and large is still the same. Some people are nice, some people aren't. The more things change, the more they stay the same.

3) Also, don't worry about other people's kids. Worry about your own. Ettiquette is taught in school. You have to say please, thank you and excuse me. Really, anything beyond that is gravy. I always thought the idea of no elbows on the table was ridiculous.

das Monkey
09-27-05, 02:10 PM
saoirse

Good Manners need to be taught in school ...
No, no, no, no, NO! And stop encouraging the parents too. I was raised to have good manners (I don't use them here, of course), and it's been a HUGE advantage in life. I don't want that competitive advantage diminished for me and my family.

das

Giantrobo
09-27-05, 02:18 PM
Lately I have seen two extremes that show the lack of respect for others. The young Punk who's just rude and has little training in the areas of Manners. On the other side of that same coin I've been seeing a lot of "Well to Do" people who seem to think they're more important than anyone around them so they see no need to respect others.

Fok
09-27-05, 02:35 PM
I agree with the poster, manners are seriously lacking these days.

Rockmjd23
09-27-05, 02:49 PM
Do you know, thanks to you, that I discovered a form of shame that's gone unused for 700 years?

http://www.simpsoncrazy.com/gallery/misc/pixel_lovejoy.gif

Goldblum
09-27-05, 02:51 PM
:lol::up:

Now THAT'S the "funny Groucho."

Unfortunately for his wife, it was Serious Groucho. :(

Nesbit
09-27-05, 03:24 PM
The whole lot of ya could use a good shaming. I remember when we use to get in the buggy, 4 to a carriage on Saturday night, and go out for a good shaming. Ahh those were the days.

Timber
09-27-05, 03:51 PM
Screw that. Not only do I hate holding doors open for strangers, if someone is walking behind me, and we're coming to a door, I will speed up so that I get a respectable distance between us so it won't seem rude for me not to hold the door open.

Unless you're an invalid, you can open it your damn self! :mad:

Unfortunatly I have to say that I do the same thing. :shrug: If I had to use the effort to open I want the next guy to have to do the same.

scottall
09-27-05, 03:58 PM
I have nothing against larger people, but when did it become cool to have your ass crack showing to everyone at one side and then your bakery (rolls) hanging 6 inches over the front of your pants?
You must feel shame for your bad manners and ill will towards the metabolically challenged.

Sloth911
09-27-05, 04:19 PM
Viva La Bam teach kids all they need to know about manners.

BMW + MTV + Daycare = perfect parenting