WASHINGTON - Black, Hispanic and white motorists are equally likely to be pulled over by police, but blacks and Hispanics are much more likely to be searched, handcuffed, arrested and subjected to force or the threat of it, a Justice Department study has found.
The study, by the department's Bureau of Justice Statistics, was completed last April and posted on the agency's Web site after Bush administration officials disagreed over whether a press release should mention the racial disparities.
Traffic stops have become a politically volatile issue as minority groups have complained that many stops and searches are based on race rather than on legitimate suspicions.
The bureau's director, Lawrence A. Greenfeld, appointed by President Bush in 2001, wanted to publicize the racial disparities, but his superiors disagreed, a BJS employee said Wednesday. No release was issued.
Greenfeld has told his staff that he is being moved to a new job following the dispute, according to this employee, who spoke on condition of anonymity because he is not authorized to talk to reporters.
Greenfeld was not immediately available for comment. Justice Department spokesman Brian Roehrkasse would not comment on Greenfeld's status.
"When someone in law enforcement who is willing to speak the truth about racial profiling gets demoted for it, that's absolutely chilling," said Hilary Shelton, director of the NAACP's Washington bureau. "To manage any problem, we must first measure it."
Roehrkasse said, "There was no effort to suppress any information because the report was released in its entirety on the Web site." He added that 37 of 55 BJS reports issued in 2004 and so far this year were not accompanied by a news release.
Based on interviews of almost 77,000 Americans age 16 or over in 2002, the study drew no conclusions about the reasons for the racial disparities in post-stop treatment.
Casey Perry, chairman of the National Troopers Coalition, which represents state highway patrolmen, said he wasn't surprised about the percentage of motorists who are pulled over. "It's very interesting there was no racial disparity," he said, arguing that some regional studies which found profiling had been skewed by local demographics. More information would be needed to evaluate the post-stop data, he said.
Shelton said the BJS study found less racial disparity in traffic stops than a nationwide NAACP study between 1991-93, but said the figures for racial disparity in arrests and use of force were consistent with his group's findings.
The data showed that black, Hispanic and white motorists were equally likely to be pulled over by police; about 9 percent of each are stopped. Traffic stops were the most frequent form of police contact with the public; an estimated 16.8 million drivers were stopped in 2002.
The racial disparities showed up after that point:
_Blacks (5.8 percent) and Hispanics (5.2 percent) were much more likely to be arrested than whites (2 percent).
_Hispanics (71.5 percent) were much more likely to be ticketed than blacks (58.4 percent) or whites (56.5 percent).
_Blacks (2.7 percent) and Hispanics (2.4 percent) were far more likely than whites (0.8 percent) to report that police used force or the threat of it. Force was defined as when an officer pushed, grabbed, kicked or hit a driver with a hand or object. Also included were police dog bites, chemical or pepper spray or a firearm pointed at the driver, or the threat of any of these.
_Handcuffs were used on greater percentages of black motorists (6.4 percent) and Hispanics (5.6 percent) than whites (2 percent).
_Black and Hispanic drivers and their vehicles were much more likely to be searched than whites and their vehicles. Black motorists were searched 8.1 percent of the time; Hispanics, 8.3 percent; whites, 2.5 percent. Vehicles driven by blacks were searched 7.1 percent of the time; by Hispanics, 10.1 percent; by whites, 2.9 percent.
The study, first reported by The New York Times, said the interviews did not ask enough questions about circumstances — such as whether drugs were in plain view — or about driver conduct to "answer the question of whether the driver's race, rather than the driver's conduct or other specific circumstances," led to the search.
The study, first reported by The New York Times, said the interviews did not ask enough questions about circumstances — such as whether drugs were in plain view — or about driver conduct to "answer the question of whether the driver's race, rather than the driver's conduct or other specific circumstances," led to the search.
That is the important part.
natevines
08-25-05, 04:26 PM
Oh my god! Minorities whining about unfair treatment?!
They'll never accept the fact that they commit more crimes.
kvrdave
08-25-05, 05:02 PM
Oh my god! Minorities whining about unfair treatment?!
They'll never accept the fact that they commit more crimes.
That's not fair. You have to look at the data to draw a conclusion like that, and you know it. :grunt:
General Zod
08-25-05, 05:19 PM
I'm so surprised!
No, really, I'm completely surprised!
OK, not really.
- David Stein
:lol: :up: Couldn't have said it better myself.
Tracer Bullet
08-25-05, 06:37 PM
Oh my god! Minorities whining about unfair treatment?!
They'll never accept the fact that they commit more crimes.
How exactly do you know that? As far I know, crime statistics measure reported crimes and arrests. So, nonreported crimes and crimes that never result in arrest aren't represented.
DVD Polizei
08-25-05, 06:43 PM
1) Could it be because White People just STFU and let the officer do his job?
2) Could it be because minorities have such a grudge on their shoulders due to the "White Man Keepin' Yizzall Down" Theory passed on by naive generation to naive generation, they have to fight every single authority figure who wants them to do something--regardless if the authority figure has Probable Cause to do so.
grundle
08-25-05, 10:56 PM
Police dog accused of racial profiling
http://bsbrigade.com/forums/showthread.php?t=8570
Police dog accused of racial profiling
McKEES ROCKS, Pa. — A Pennsylvania councilwoman has accused her borough's lone police dog of racial profiling, leading to calls that the canine be killed.
Dolpho, a 5-year-old German shepherd, can sniff out the difference between marijuana, heroin and cocaine. The dog came from Europe two years ago and is trained in drug detection and patrol.
But councilwoman Wanda Jones Dixon said Dolpho can also tell the difference between blacks and whites, and should be put to sleep.
On Friday, while K-9 officer Schawn Barger wrestled with a drug suspect, he said a quick-release button on his belt was activated, accidentally opening a door to the K-9 wagon.
The dog lunged from the vehicle and bit a 9-year-old boy on the leg instead of the suspect, dragging him for about 20 feet, family members said. The boy is black.
Councilwoman Dixon told the city council she has received six complaints about Dolpho in the past year. Three of the people who complained were involved with drugs. Three others were blacks who believe the dog jumped at or attacked them because of their race.
"I had received complaints from African-Americans saying they believe the dog only attacks African-Americans," councilwoman Dixon said Monday. "I think the dog makes the distinction."
Officer Barger, who has worked with Dolpho for more than two years and takes the dog home with him at night, said the dog has never gone after the wrong person before. He said Dolpho became confused during a tense situation.
"The dog saw movement. There was a lot of noise — a lot of screaming," Barger said. "It was basically just complete chaos and the dog, he just could not tell who the bad guy was and who the good people were."
The boy was treated for a dog bite and released Friday. He limped into the council meeting Monday with his mother, Lorraine Livingston.
"This is something that will take him a while to get over," Livingston said. "The officer had no control over that animal. That dog should be put to sleep."
Experts differ on whether dogs can discern race.
The owner of the Tom Brenneman School for Canines near Lawrence, Kan., has trained more than 600 dogs for police departments nationwide. He said dogs determine targets by scent alone and see only gray and white.
Tom Brenneman said the dogs can be trained to recognize the scent of drugs, explosives and also that dogs can smell fear.
"As far as it being black or white or Hispanic, that doesn't have anything to do with it," he said.
A national expert on animal behavior at Tuft's University School of Veterinary Medicine said dogs not only can determine race, but can develop prejudices similar to humans. Dr. Nick Dodman said that prejudice can be based on a lack of exposure to different people or because of a bad experience.
Dolpho has since been taken off active duty, but the department is standing behind him.
Chief Robert Martineau said the dog is good around children and even visits area schools and day care centers.
"To say the dog is racial ... that's ludicrous. That doesn't make sense," Martineau said.
No decision was made on Dolpho's future Monday.
The Associated Press contributed to this report.
Rockmjd23
08-25-05, 11:00 PM
Right, there's racist dogs :rolleyes:
wmansir
08-25-05, 11:37 PM
It looks like I'm among the 0.3% of whites searched by the police. Back around 2001-2002 I was stopped because my license plate light was out and I let the cop search my car, probably looking for drugs. I knew there was nothing to find so I agreed rather than fight it and increase my chances of getting a ticket. All he did was sit in the driver's seat look around the console seat area. He didn't really search me personally, though he half-heartedly had me empty my pockets. I didn't even really empty them, just pulled out my gloves because they were bulky and said that's about it. No pat down or anything. Then he let me go with a verbal warning about the light. It was might white of him.
Thor Simpson
08-25-05, 11:49 PM
Right, there's racist dogs :rolleyes:
They're just biased against people that refer to one another as dogs. It'd piss me off too if a bunch of giraffes went around saying "Yo, person" to other giraffes.
Breakfast with Girls
08-25-05, 11:55 PM
Race disparity seen during traffic stops?! I bet it's because of RACISM!!
Thor Simpson
08-25-05, 11:58 PM
Race disparity seen during traffic stops?! I bet it's because of RACISM!!
(either that or global warming)
kvrdave
08-26-05, 12:03 AM
How exactly do you know that? As far I know, crime statistics measure reported crimes and arrests. So, nonreported crimes and crimes that never result in arrest aren't represented.
I understand nonrecorded votes are also not counted in an election.
Giantrobo
08-26-05, 12:59 AM
Bah. Here's my take on the study:
Blacks and Hispanics get arrested more because although whites are also huge lawbreakers, they're more likely to "catch a break" from Cops.
Cops get more shit from minorites because let's face it, it's not like they(minorities) haven't had good reason to fear for their lives where Cops are concerned.
Myster X
08-26-05, 01:03 AM
Bah. Here's my take on the study:
Blacks and Hispanics get arrested more because although whites are also huge lawbreakers, they're more likely to "catch a break" from Cops.
Cops get more shit from minorites because let's face it, it's not like they(minorities) haven't had good reason to fear for their lives where Cops are concerned.
I hope that's sarcasm.
DVD Polizei
08-26-05, 01:31 AM
Not a bad point G, but how about this.
How about a minority gets a break from a white cop, and instead of mentioning it to his bros about how he got a lucky break from an honest white officer, he says something very different.
Don't you get a lot more sympathy from your community and more pats on the back when you say you've been a victim of racial inequality? Yep. I think you do. I don't think minority communities want hear something like, "Hey guys, this cop gave me a break. He was very nice. I just let him search my car because I have nothing to hide."
Here in Portland, we had the Hispanic community complain because they were "BEING TARGETED BY POLICE". Well, if you do a check, the area they were being pulled over more frequently and searched, was a high crime area, who, guess what almighty, had a majority population of Mexicans, and who were involved with Meth, fraud, illegal ID rings, etc.
In fact, we have such a high illegal immigrant rate here in Portland, the police have almost stopped arresting illegals because it costs to much to process them when they know the very same people they deported, will be back in a week or less. It's slowly becoming another LA.
And just where were these stats taken from? Suppose you have a high crime area like LA. Oh my goodness, who do you think is going to make the largest blip on the Police Radar Crime Screen.
You gotta love this survey. You see, because it was becoming quite difficult to prove to the public that officers pulled over minorities MUCH MUCH MORE than those white people. The stats just didn't come out. So, we have something that went further. Now we have minorities admitting that police pull over everyone equally, but now, the cops are searching and cuffing the minorities more. The last time I checked, LA wasn't full of white people.
And this is another ironic situation. Do you think an area with mostly whites was taken into consideration? Or do you think areas who have mostly minorities were used for the test. The very reason why there are more minorities searched and cuffed were because it was in an area that has more minoritiest! Duh.
What we have are minority communities failing to acknowledge that in some demographic areas, THEY ARE COMMITTING MOST OF THE CRIMES.
Denial is also a bad behavior which has been handed down from generation to generation, and the law enforcement community being used as a scapegoat for their high demographic criminal behavior is getting so old and tired.
Don't commit the crime. Don't have anything to hide? Chances are, you won't have a hard time. Start mouthing off that cops are racist and you want the officer's badge number and you don't have to listen to anything a cop says, and Whoopi Goldy Bergs, you're gonna have a problem.
General Zod
08-26-05, 02:52 AM
:up: Well said. I think it's easier to blame someone else because of the high crime in your area than yourselves. Most police stations are hiring more and more minorities and so it's going to get harder and harder to say the police are racist - but they will still want to place the blame somewhere.
Just really expanding on this...
Denial is also a bad behavior which has been handed down from generation to generation, and the law enforcement community being used as a scapegoat for their high demographic criminal behavior is getting so old and tired.
natevines
08-26-05, 03:31 AM
That's not fair. You have to look at the data to draw a conclusion like that, and you know it. :grunt:
Uhhh..I know we're not supposed to bash a source, but come on now.
Giantrobo
08-26-05, 07:09 AM
I hope that's sarcasm.
Hope in one hand shit in the other...
Giantrobo
08-26-05, 07:31 AM
Not a bad point G, but how about this.
How about a minority gets a break from a white cop, and instead of mentioning it to his bros about how he got a lucky break from an honest white officer, he says something very different.
Don't you get a lot more sympathy from your community and more pats on the back when you say you've been a victim of racial inequality? Yep. I think you do. I don't think minority communities want hear something like, "Hey guys, this cop gave me a break. He was very nice. I just let him search my car because I have nothing to hide."
Here in Portland, we had the Hispanic community complain because they were "BEING TARGETED BY POLICE". Well, if you do a check, the area they were being pulled over more frequently and searched, was a high crime area, who, guess what almighty, had a majority population of Mexicans, and who were involved with Meth, fraud, illegal ID rings, etc.
In fact, we have such a high illegal immigrant rate here in Portland, the police have almost stopped arresting illegals because it costs to much to process them when they know the very same people they deported, will be back in a week or less. It's slowly becoming another LA.
And just where were these stats taken from? Suppose you have a high crime area like LA. Oh my goodness, who do you think is going to make the largest blip on the Police Radar Crime Screen.
You gotta love this survey. You see, because it was becoming quite difficult to prove to the public that officers pulled over minorities MUCH MUCH MORE than those white people. The stats just didn't come out. So, we have something that went further. Now we have minorities admitting that police pull over everyone equally, but now, the cops are searching and cuffing the minorities more. The last time I checked, LA wasn't full of white people.
And this is another ironic situation. Do you think an area with mostly whites was taken into consideration? Or do you think areas who have mostly minorities were used for the test. The very reason why there are more minorities searched and cuffed were because it was in an area that has more minoritiest! Duh.
What we have are minority communities failing to acknowledge that in some demographic areas, THEY ARE COMMITTING MOST OF THE CRIMES.
Denial is also a bad behavior which has been handed down from generation to generation, and the law enforcement community being used as a scapegoat for their high demographic criminal behavior is getting so old and tired.
Don't commit the crime. Don't have anything to hide? Chances are, you won't have a hard time. Start mouthing off that cops are racist and you want the officer's badge number and you don't have to listen to anything a cop says, and Whoopi Goldy Bergs, you're gonna have a problem.
Bla blah blah.
Have you ever read my pasts posts? I don't for one second deny that blacks and hispanics have/cause more crime when you compare their number to whites in America. Especialy when you talk about concentrated areas like big city ghettos. I also know that being an ass to a cop when pulled over can get you arrested, beat up, and in some rare cases killed. I think you'd be a fool to believe that no cop has ever fucked someone up just for asking questions. Hell, I got yelled at once by a cop for denying a taffic violation after he pulled me over. I guess he put me in my place right? Anyway, cops are human and they fuck up, get overly excited, and overreact just like anyone else. I believe in holiding cops to a "higher standard" because after all, they're given great responsibilty right? Some cop fucks up and someone can die right? Hey, if the cop can't handle that "higher standard" then perhaps he should go do something else.
How about this... Black person who gets pulled over and acts reasonable and doesnt' give the cop shit. Does the cop go back and tell all his co-workers that there's some blacks who respect them? I doubt it.
Mind you I've got a cousin in LAPD so please don't think I'm just shitting on cops because I'm black or I hate the cops because that is simply not the case. Also, while I'm -not- one who believes all cops are racist and out to get blacks, I'm also not one who just gives cops "Free passes" -when they're wrong or before all the evidence has come in- like many of you white folks here tend to do because you've had less "trouble" with them so you can't relate to being treated like shit by them.
Denial is also a bad behavior which has been handed down from generation to generation, and the law enforcement community being used as a scapegoat for their high demographic criminal behavior is getting so old and tired.
I agree. But it goes both ways. To deny that there aren't -some- fucked up abusive cops with power trips is foolish. Hell, my LAPD cousin even admitted to that. I think one of the major problems is distrust ON BOTH SIDES of the equation. Hey black man, not every cop is bad....Hey cop, not every black male is out to kill you.
BigDaddy
08-26-05, 08:32 AM
Bah. Here's my take on the study:
Blacks and Hispanics get arrested more because although whites are also huge lawbreakers, they're more likely to "catch a break" from Cops.
Cops get more shit from minorites because let's face it, it's not like they(minorities) haven't had good reason to fear for their lives where Cops are concerned.
While I have never been arrested I have been pulled over and had my person and my car searched quite a few times. I was in a so called "black" area at the time with a friend of mine that happens to be black. With me being white they assumed I was buying or selling. So I can relate to people of any color being harrased by the cops. When this happend I was younger and got pissed off about it.
I understand nonrecorded votes are also not counted in an election.
If that was an attempt at a joke, it was a poor one.
General Zod
08-26-05, 10:12 AM
How about this... Black person who gets pulled over and acts reasonable and doesnt' give the cop shit. Does the cop go back and tell all his co-workers that there's some blacks who respect them? I doubt it.
But I bet more often than not that person gets a break, just like a white person who would respect the cops.
I think when a white person gets busted they say "Damn, I got busted" but when I black person gets busted they say "Racist cops". Don't forget there's the Jesse Jackson's and Al Sharpton's of the world telling them that nothing is their fault and it's all the fault of the police and the white man every day. Like I said before, it's much easier to blame someone else than yourself.
Red Dog
08-26-05, 10:16 AM
I would expect more minorities consent to searches because (being generally poorer and less educated) they don't know their 4th amendment rights.
Giantrobo
08-26-05, 10:23 AM
I would expect more minorities consent to searches because (being generally poorer and less educated) they don't know their 4th amendment rights.
AND they're scared shitless of getting their asses kicked. But we only hear about the crazed troublemaker that gets tazered while yelling "racism" after the tazer button is released and the shock stops long enough for them to talk again. It's ALWAYS the few who fuck it up for the many....just like the few bad cops
But even if they did know about the 4th, can you imagine a black man trying to tell a cops his rights? :lol: The cops would just laugh as he's beating the shit out of him.
Giantrobo
08-26-05, 10:27 AM
But I bet more often than not that person gets a break, just like a white person who would respect the cops.
I think when a white person gets busted they say "Damn, I got busted" but when I black person gets busted they say "Racist cops". Don't forget there's the Jesse Jackson's and Al Sharpton's of the world telling them that nothing is their fault and it's all the fault of the police and the white man every day. Like I said before, it's much easier to blame someone else than yourself.
Give me fuckin' break. Yeah right, all busted whites just take their punishment like men right? They don't call cops pigs and accuse them of violating their rights? :lol: Women who get busted don't accuse cops of being sexist? They sure did when Martha Stewart got nailed.
Hey, if whites thought that yelling racism would work they'd be yelling it too. :lol:
General Zod
08-26-05, 12:31 PM
Give me fuckin' break. Yeah right, all busted whites just take their punishment like men right? They don't call cops pigs and accuse them of violating their rights? :lol: Women who get busted don't accuse cops of being sexist? They sure did when Martha Stewart got nailed.
Hey, if whites thought that yelling racism would work they'd be yelling it too. :lol:
I didn't say all, i'm generalizing just like you are. I don't remember people shouting sexism when Martha Stewart got nailed (pun), but I don't agree with that either.
I think you are correct that whites would be yelling racism if it would work, but that doesn't mean they should which is what we are talking about here.
Giantrobo
08-26-05, 03:41 PM
I didn't say all, i'm generalizing just like you are. I don't remember people shouting sexism when Martha Stewart got nailed (pun), but I don't agree with that either.
I think you are correct that whites would be yelling racism if it would work, but that doesn't mean they should which is what we are talking about here.
Just to be clear I never said anyone should yell racism where there's none.
kvrdave
08-26-05, 04:17 PM
If that was an attempt at a joke, it was a poor one.
Not a joke, but making a point of how ridiculous it is to claim that the real story lies in the things that are unknowable.
uberjoe
08-26-05, 04:35 PM
Not a joke, but making a point of how ridiculous it is to claim that the real story lies in the things that are unknowable.
Which is why I support evolution over Creationism! Snap!
Just kidding. Please don't shoot my cat.
Tracer Bullet
08-26-05, 04:35 PM
Not a joke, but making a point of how ridiculous it is to claim that the real story lies in the things that are unknowable.
I don't think it's anything of the kind. I think it's a caveat against not saying blanket statements that can't be verified. If he had said, "minorities commit more reported crimes", or something, then at least that could be checked.
kvrdave
08-26-05, 05:08 PM
I think that is PC nitpicking to expect people to clarify that the data they are reporting on, is reported data.
DVD Polizei
08-26-05, 07:31 PM
Give me a buckin' freak. :D
alarican
08-26-05, 08:28 PM
Hope in one hand shit in the other...
I might just have to use this one...
Canadian Bacon
08-26-05, 11:38 PM
I have no problem with this, do you know how much damage a watermelon can do if it hits you in the head
-wink-
Giantrobo
08-27-05, 07:15 AM
I have no problem with this, do you know how much damage a watermelon can do if it hits you in the head
Buy: