<i>MOD EDIT: I changed the title to add the extra info/report just in case someone else came across the news and was going to start a new thread. I don't mean to imply the two events are linked in anyway, I was just using the AQ leader being killed as an example of something...
the Lt Cmd of one of the ships
http://ubbt.moby.com/userfiles/2936940-charlie_brown.jpg
General Zod
08-19-05, 10:06 AM
I've traveled the banks of the river of Jordan
To find where it flows to the sea
I looked in the eyes of the cold and the hungry
And I saw that I was looking at meeeeeee.
And I wanted to know if life had a purpose
And what it all means in the end
In the silence I listened to voices inside me
And they told me again and again...
There is only one river
There is only one sea
And it flows through you
And it flows through me
There is only one people
We are one in the same
We are all one spirit
One naaaaaaaaaaaammmme.
We are the father
We are one.
We are one.
We are one.
tommy28
08-19-05, 10:18 AM
boy don`t we have some sort of tracking system that can detect when and where these things are fired so we could blast that spot with-in minutes...
nemein
08-19-05, 10:48 AM
If there is such a thing to that capability, and assuming this ship has it in the first place, I'd be very surprised if they allowed it to be activated while docked at port. Seems like the potential for mishaps would be too great.
OldDude
08-19-05, 11:14 AM
boy don`t we have some sort of tracking system that can detect when and where these things are fired so we could blast that spot with-in minutes...
I think you are thinking of Phalanx,
http://www.chinfo.navy.mil/navpalib/factfile/weapons/wep-phal.html
3000 round per minute, 20 mm autonomous cannon, a last line of defense against missiles, et al.
When engaged, I believe you wouldn't want to piss it off.
nemein
08-19-05, 11:27 AM
I think you are thinking of Phalanx
That's the first thing I was thinking of too, but that's a defensive weapon not a counter-strike one. I didn't know if there was something else out there he might be thinking about. Obviously if people are on watch they should be able to detect/track where the missile was fired from and take some sort of counter action. What level of readiness is maintained in port like this I don't know and I'm pretty sure those systems are not automated.
mikehunt
08-19-05, 11:27 AM
there's also this
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Counter-battery_radar
but assuming this is a built up area the buildings would likely block it
and the radio news is saying they're looking for 2 iraqis and a syrian who rented a store front in the area
OldDude
08-19-05, 11:35 AM
That's the first thing I was thinking of too, but that's a defensive weapon not a counter-strike one. I didn't know if there was something else out there he might be thinking about. Obviously if people are on watch they should be able to detect/track where the missile was fired from and take some sort of counter action. What level of readiness is maintained in port like this I don't know and I'm pretty sure those systems are not automated.
Mortar shells are usually "lobbed" in an arc. For any short range, direct-aimed projectile, the fact the most of the 3000 rounds miss the projectile would put the perps "in harm's way." But I am sure they are turned off in port to avoid PR incidents.
nemein
08-19-05, 11:44 AM
For any short range, direct-aimed projectile, the fact the most of the 3000 rounds miss the projectile would put the perps "in harm's way."
That may be an incidental side effect of the weapon but I don't think that's what the original concept/design was about. The range of rounds is most likely not going to be great enough for it to strike whatever launched the missile. To put it another way if they do there's been a lot of mistakes made to get to that point. The security perimeter of the ship in question has been completely compromised and/or the vehicle that launched the missile in the first place is lingering too long ;)
OldDude
08-19-05, 11:51 AM
Depends. Suicidal terrorists in rubber boat, with bomb or shoulder-fired missiles, problem solved. It will also attack floating mines. Range is "classified."
I trust there is some kind of IFF function.
nemein
08-19-05, 11:53 AM
I trust there is some kind of IFF function.
One can only hope ;) I agree though... it's most likely something you're not going to leave active while in port :johnwoo2:
Mammal
08-19-05, 12:17 PM
Did the attackers train in Iraq?
Mopower
08-19-05, 01:10 PM
Did the attackers train in Iraq?
Oh snap!! Take that Bush!
Nazgul
08-19-05, 01:36 PM
Did the attackers train in Iraq?
It never would have happened if we stayed out of Iraq.
al_bundy
08-19-05, 01:42 PM
boy don`t we have some sort of tracking system that can detect when and where these things are fired so we could blast that spot with-in minutes...
since the ship was in port, it was probably turned off
nemein
08-19-05, 01:45 PM
It never would have happened if we stayed out of Iraq.
:lol: Yep there's absolutely no precedent for this sort of attack...
Myster X
08-19-05, 01:54 PM
beauty... too bad the navy won't get to use it yet :(
It never would have happened if we stayed out of Iraq.
:up: The world was completely peaceful until George Bush came in and decided he wanted to take all the world's oil in order to make his buddies rich, stop abortion, and kill Cindy Sheehan's son.
beecee24
08-19-05, 02:12 PM
No, his dad did a great job getting everything in place for Jr.
:up: The world was completely peaceful until George Bush came in and decided he wanted to take all the world's oil in order to make his buddies rich, stop abortion, and kill Cindy Sheehan's son.
Mordred
08-19-05, 02:25 PM
Obviously Iraq is a hotbed of terrorism since two Iraqi terrorists attacked us. I'm glad that we attack the countries where terrorists come from... oh wait that would mean we would be in Saudi Arabia right now wouldn't it? Nevermind.
nemein
08-19-05, 02:32 PM
Why attack countries when you can work w/ them though.
http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/ap/20050819/ap_on_re_mi_ea/saudi_militants_10
al-Qaida Leader in Saudi Arabia Killed
RIYADH, Saudi Arabia - Police raids touched off fierce gunbattles Thursday that killed six Islamic extremists, and authorities said the dead included al-Qaida's leader in Saudi Arabia, whose hideout was found to hold the head of a murdered American last summer. A police officer was also killed.
Saleh Mohammed al-Aoofi, the kingdom's top fugitive, had led local al-Qaida operations since his predecessor was killed by police a year ago during a crackdown on religious militants in the homeland of
Osama bin Laden and most of the Sept. 11 suicide hijackers.
Al-Aoofi was believed involved in the June 2004 kidnapping and beheading of engineer Paul M. Johnson Jr., whose body was shown in photos on the Internet. A few weeks after the slaying, police found Johnson's head in a freezer at an apartment that had been used by al-Aoofi.
<b>
The former Saudi prison guard was one of only two people still at large from a list of 26 most-wanted militants that was issued in December 2003. The remaining militant is another Saudi, Talib Saud Abdullah al-Talib. The others have either been captured or killed.
Saudi authorities issued a second list of 36 suspects in June, several of whom have already been arrested or killed.</b> It was not immediately known if any of the 15 other suspects slain or captured in Thursday's raids in Riyadh and the holy city of Medina were on that list.
The Interior Ministry said security officers staged a series of near simultaneous raids at six suspected militant hideouts in Medina, several of them near the Nabawi mosque, where Islam's Prophet Muhammad was buried.
At a seventh site, police battled with three militants holed up in a building, leaving two extremists dead, including al-Aoofi, the ministry said. The third suspect was wounded and captured, and one policeman and a resident of the building also were wounded, it said. The official Saudi Press Agency said later that the policeman had died.
At the same time, police fought with militants at an apartment in the al-Massef neighborhood of Riyadh. Four extremists were killed there, said a security official, who spoke on condition of anonymity because he was not authorized to speak to journalists.
The Interior Ministry statement said human remains found at the Riyadh site indicated at least one militant was blown apart in an explosion. It said one extremist was arrested and a cache of weapons, explosives and money was found.
The raids came hours before King Abdullah arrived in Medina to meet with tribal leaders and pray at the Nabawi mosque. The crackdown on al-Qaida began while Abdullah was de facto ruler, and he vowed to push ahead when he was elevated to king this month after the death of his half brother Fahd.
It was unclear if the raids had anything to do with last week's decision by the U.S. Embassy in Riyadh to close for two days or the warning from the British and Australian governments for their citizens in the kingdom to be cautious amid reports that militants planned attacks.
The Interior Ministry said at the time it had no information that a terror attack was imminent. Britain's government said preparations for an extremist assault were in the final stages.
The last major attack by militants came in December, when gunmen invaded the heavily guarded U.S. Consulate in Jiddah and killed nine people.
Al-Aoofi was a veteran Islamic militant. He reportedly fought alongside Muslim separatists in Russia's
Chechnya region, then traveled to
Afghanistan shortly before the Sept. 11 terror attacks on Washington and New York. It was in Afghanistan that he met men who would later become his comrades in the Saudi terror network, Saudi newspapers have reported.
He was a top deputy in al-Qaida's cell in Saudi Arabia when it launched a violent campaign with car bombings that killed 35 people at foreigners' housing compounds May 12, 2003.
At the time, the al-Qaida cell was led by militant Abdulaziz al-Moqrin, a Saudi who was thought to have masterminded the June 12, 2004, kidnapping of Johnson, an engineer with Lockheed Martin.
Johnson's kidnappers announced his slaying six days later, posting pictures of his beheading on the Internet. Hours later, Moqrin was killed in a gunbattle with Saudi police, and al-Aoofi took up the leadership
Sure there's still a lot of problems in SA and w/ our relationship w/ SA but repeat after me.... COOKIE CUTTER APPROACHES DON'T WORK. We have to engage w/ every country on a different level. Sometimes there will be similar approaches but even "warmonger" Bush realizes you can't attack everyone. So you have to work w/ what you have and do what you can based on the situation.
Mordred
08-19-05, 02:36 PM
Didn't realize that they had finally bothered to start helping us. That's good to hear.
nemein
08-19-05, 02:42 PM
AFAIK they have been helping us wrt the WoT from the beginning, although things may have kicked into a higher gear after the bombing attack they suffered. The only thing they didn't do was allow us to use them as a staging area for the attack on Iraq.
Mordred
08-19-05, 02:45 PM
AFAIK they have been helping us wrt the WoT from the beginning, although things may have kicked into a higher gear after the bombing attack they suffered. The only thing they didn't do was allow us to use them as a staging area for the attack on Iraq.I'm pretty sure they were very uncooperative initially in our investigation of 9/11, refusing to turn over some kind of documentation while other countries in the region were willing to do so.
Mordred
08-19-05, 02:52 PM
Here you go:
Saudi Aid to War on Terror Is Criticized (http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/nation/la-101301saudi,0,6282423.story)
WASHINGTON -- Saudi Arabia--although long considered a crucial ally of the United States--has provided little if any assistance to investigators hunting the friends and finances of Osama bin Laden and his Al Qaeda terror network, according to intelligence and law enforcement specialists.and more:
Bush administration officials go to Saudi Arabia in a second attempt to obtain Saudi government cooperation in the 9/11 investigation. The Saudis have balked at freezing assets of organizations linked to bin Laden. Shortly thereafter, the Boston Herald runs a series of articles on the Saudis, citing an expert who says, “If there weren't all these other arrangements—arms deals and oil deals and consultancies—I don't think the US would stand for this lack of cooperation.” Another expert states that “it's good old fashioned ‘I'll scratch your back, you scratch mine.’ You have former US officials, former presidents, aides to the current president, a long line of people who are tight with the Saudis. ... We are willing to basically ignore inconvenient truths that might otherwise cause our blood to boil.” These deals are worth an incredible amount of money; one Washington Post reporter claims that prior to 1993, US companies spent $200 billion on Saudi Arabia's defenses alone.And this is what changed:
May 12, 2003: Saudi Arabia Bombing Changes Saudi Stance Toward al-Qaeda
Saudi Arabia is attacked by three suicide bombings in the capital of Riyadh. At least 34 people are killed. The Saudi royal family had taken very little action against al-Qaeda prior to this. However, it appears to more aggressively combat al-Qaeda afterward.Sorry no links to these last two, the Boston one was dead and the 2nd LATimes had a bad link.
nemein
08-19-05, 03:00 PM
Surprised you don't remember hearing about this. Maybe soon thereafter they started fully cooperating, but I thought it was a lot of lip service at first.
I may have at the time, but certainly don't remember after 3 1/2 years. I guess it just goes to show how people's POV is reflected in what/how they remember things.
Mordred
08-19-05, 03:11 PM
I may have at the time, but certainly don't remember after 3 1/2 years. I guess it just goes to show how people's POV is reflected in what/how they remember things.Not sure if that was a comment directed at me or an introspective comment :) Either way I agree... and find that people usually only remember things that support their preconceived POV... and quickly forget those things that might cast doubt on their cut and dried beliefs of how things "really work". Interstingly enough, that is also the main reason I hate almost everyone. :)
nemein
08-19-05, 03:21 PM
Not sure if that was a comment directed at me or an introspective comment
Both... you don't get off the hook that easily -ptth-
mikehunt
08-19-05, 03:24 PM
Did the attackers train in Iraq?
supposedly 2 of the guys suspected of it are from iraq
Ranger
08-19-05, 03:48 PM
I believe Jordan was ranked as one of the top three most pro-Al Qaeda countries.
So if you ask me, it's pretty foolish to dock at Jordan.
Oh sure, the Jordanian government "try" help out with this terrorism problem, but with the population siding with al Qaeda, there's really little that government can do.
E70f
08-19-05, 07:42 PM
a. That's some long range rockets if they were fired in Jordan yet landed in SA.
b. Too funny that the stray rockets killed an AQ dude, though :lol: Own goal, morons!
Ranger
08-19-05, 07:51 PM
a. That's some long range rockets if they were fired in Jordan yet landed in SA.
b. Too funny that the stray rockets killed an AQ dude, though :lol: Own goal, morons!
Not sure what you are saying.
I think one rocket landed in Israel, not Saudi Arabia.
The only one killed from the rockets attack was a Jordanian soldier, and some reports said he was just simply assigned to guard the area.
E70f
08-19-05, 08:02 PM
It was humor based on the crappy, misleading thread title:
"Rockets Fired at US Ships in Jordan ... AQ leader in SA killed"
They shot at a US warship in Jordan and missed so badly they killed one of their own morons who was in Saudi, see.
Ah nevermind... :(
Ranger
08-19-05, 08:14 PM
Oh sorry, forgot about that.
nemein
08-19-05, 08:58 PM
It was humor based on the crappy, misleading thread title:
Looks like someone didn't bother reading the edited first post ;)
DarkestPhoenix
08-19-05, 09:00 PM
Uhh...as far as the Iraqi dude-age link is concerned, I don't know where the confusion came from. They said it flat-out at the beginning of the article.
I knew they were from Iraq right away, though.
They can't hit shit.
Thor Simpson
08-20-05, 01:03 PM
http://www.cnn.com/2005/WORLD/meast/08/20/jordan.blasts/index.html
<B>Jordan finds launcher for attacks</B>
Saturday, August 20, 2005; Posted: 8:38 a.m. EDT (12:38 GMT)
AQABA, Jordan -- <B>Authorities in Jordan say they have found the launcher that fired three Katyusha rockets that targeted but missed two U.S. military ships in the Red Sea port of Aqaba.</B>
Jordan's Interior Minister Awni Yirfas announced the development Saturday, the day after three Katyusha rockets hit a warehouse and a hospital in Aqaba, killing a Jordanian soldier, and striking the nearby Israeli port city of Eilat.
A second Jordanian soldier was severely wounded. No U.S. military personnel were injured.
"We have found the rocket launcher in the warehouse from where they fired," Yirfas told The Associated Press.
"The investigation is still underway and issues related to it will remain secret so it would not harm the process," Yirfas said. "I cannot give you the names or say if we are looking for the perpetrators in the desert or any other place."
AP reported that Jordanian security forces were searching for six people, including one Syrian and several Egyptians and Iraqis.
Buy: