Fool me once...
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Fool me once...
http://money.cnn.com/2005/05/26/comm...ming/index.htm
Smoke, mirrors and the next generation
History tells us: Don't believe all you're hearing about Xbox 360 and PlayStation 3.
May 26, 2005: 10:08 AM EDT
Game Over is a weekly column by Chris Morris
NEW YORK (CNN/Money) – There was a lot of hype last week about the next generation of game machines. Microsoft said the Xbox 360 will ultimately reach 1 billion consumers worldwide, while Sony gave a laundry list of features for the PlayStation 3, showing some jaw dropping footage along the way.
(Nintendo promised a Revolution, but didn't go much further than that.)
I hate to be a wet blanket, but it's time to come back to reality.
It's not hard to forgive the hardware publishers for a little bit of hyperbole at E3, the annual trade show of the video game industry. It is, after all, their moment in the sun. But now that the crowds have gone home and the booth babes have changed back into street clothes, it's time to recognize that a fair number of the promises made last week will quietly fade away.
Need proof? Look no further than the introductory days of the PlayStation 2 or Xbox.
The Xbox was supposed to have resolution that went beyond HDTV and have a graphics chip three times beyond that of the PC. Ultimately, only a handful of games have offered 1080i resolution (the current standard for high-def). Most titles offering advanced graphics stick with 480p resolution, which is lower than high definition. And PCs had nVidia's (Research) GeForce 3 (which featured a graphics chip comparable to that found in the Xbox) months before the console launched.
Bill Gates, meanwhile, spoke of "incredible, persistent, online worlds" that would be created because of what the Xbox hard drive could do. Only one – "True Fantasy Live Online" - was started, and it never materialized.
The PlayStation 2 was going to offer AOL Instant Messaging and have characters whose facial expressions were incredibly lifelike as they progressed through the game. AIM and PS2 were never again spoken in the same sentence – and the lauded "emotion engine" didn't come close to living up to its promise.
Phil Harrison, an executive vice president at Sony, talked highly of software that would incorporate visual imaging, saying it would enable users to import photographs from a digital camera, then "animate these in 3D, add sounds, and email them to their family or friends, just like a greeting card."
Never happened.
So what about the pretty pictures we all saw? Guess what... the graphics demos at those 1999 and 2000 press conferences were just as impressive (at the time) as what Sony showed off with its footage of "Killzone" or "Fight Night: Round 3" last Monday. Sony showed a lifelike female character from "Ridge Racer" strutting a catwalk and winking flirtatiously at viewers when it unveiled the PS2. Early Xbox footage showed a buff woman named Raven and her hulking robot friend showing off their martial arts form.
Both were amazing pieces of video, but no real-time gameplay on either machine ever lived up to that early footage.
That's not really the fault of developers. It's not hard to make early tech demos especially impressive, since you don't have to worry about including artificial intelligence or physics or any of the other resource chomping features that have to go into games to make them fun. Publishers, though, create them to have something to show potential buyers and say "Look! Look!! Now you've got to buy our new machine!" before laughing maniacally and rushing off to roll around in their piles of cash.
Let's not forget online, either. Sony (Research), back before the PS2's launch, said gamers would be able to download titles from existing PlayStation and PS2 libraries via broadband. Harrison (sounding a lot like Microsoft's (Research) J. Allard did earlier this year) encouraged developers to think of episodic games, which could be downloaded chapter by chapter.
Gates, meanwhile, told gamers they would be able to download trial versions of games to their Xbox's hard drive to help them decide whether to buy a retail copy. The same promise is being made with Xbox 360.
The fact of the matter is we will see a leap in quality with next generation games. I've had the chance to have hands-on time with several Xbox 360 games, including the very promising "Gears of War" and "Need for Speed: Most Wanted," and they show tons of potential. I'm sure when the time comes to try out PS3 games I'll be equally impressed.
But as Sony talks of users using the PS3's optional high-def camera to launch their own broadcasts and Microsoft discusses non-gamers hopping onto Xbox Live to sell shirts or skateboards they've created for the latest "Tony Hawk" game, take it with a grain of salt.
Better yet, grab a big shaker and begin pouring liberally.
History tells us: Don't believe all you're hearing about Xbox 360 and PlayStation 3.
May 26, 2005: 10:08 AM EDT
Game Over is a weekly column by Chris Morris
NEW YORK (CNN/Money) – There was a lot of hype last week about the next generation of game machines. Microsoft said the Xbox 360 will ultimately reach 1 billion consumers worldwide, while Sony gave a laundry list of features for the PlayStation 3, showing some jaw dropping footage along the way.
(Nintendo promised a Revolution, but didn't go much further than that.)
I hate to be a wet blanket, but it's time to come back to reality.
It's not hard to forgive the hardware publishers for a little bit of hyperbole at E3, the annual trade show of the video game industry. It is, after all, their moment in the sun. But now that the crowds have gone home and the booth babes have changed back into street clothes, it's time to recognize that a fair number of the promises made last week will quietly fade away.
Need proof? Look no further than the introductory days of the PlayStation 2 or Xbox.
The Xbox was supposed to have resolution that went beyond HDTV and have a graphics chip three times beyond that of the PC. Ultimately, only a handful of games have offered 1080i resolution (the current standard for high-def). Most titles offering advanced graphics stick with 480p resolution, which is lower than high definition. And PCs had nVidia's (Research) GeForce 3 (which featured a graphics chip comparable to that found in the Xbox) months before the console launched.
Bill Gates, meanwhile, spoke of "incredible, persistent, online worlds" that would be created because of what the Xbox hard drive could do. Only one – "True Fantasy Live Online" - was started, and it never materialized.
The PlayStation 2 was going to offer AOL Instant Messaging and have characters whose facial expressions were incredibly lifelike as they progressed through the game. AIM and PS2 were never again spoken in the same sentence – and the lauded "emotion engine" didn't come close to living up to its promise.
Phil Harrison, an executive vice president at Sony, talked highly of software that would incorporate visual imaging, saying it would enable users to import photographs from a digital camera, then "animate these in 3D, add sounds, and email them to their family or friends, just like a greeting card."
Never happened.
So what about the pretty pictures we all saw? Guess what... the graphics demos at those 1999 and 2000 press conferences were just as impressive (at the time) as what Sony showed off with its footage of "Killzone" or "Fight Night: Round 3" last Monday. Sony showed a lifelike female character from "Ridge Racer" strutting a catwalk and winking flirtatiously at viewers when it unveiled the PS2. Early Xbox footage showed a buff woman named Raven and her hulking robot friend showing off their martial arts form.
Both were amazing pieces of video, but no real-time gameplay on either machine ever lived up to that early footage.
That's not really the fault of developers. It's not hard to make early tech demos especially impressive, since you don't have to worry about including artificial intelligence or physics or any of the other resource chomping features that have to go into games to make them fun. Publishers, though, create them to have something to show potential buyers and say "Look! Look!! Now you've got to buy our new machine!" before laughing maniacally and rushing off to roll around in their piles of cash.
Let's not forget online, either. Sony (Research), back before the PS2's launch, said gamers would be able to download titles from existing PlayStation and PS2 libraries via broadband. Harrison (sounding a lot like Microsoft's (Research) J. Allard did earlier this year) encouraged developers to think of episodic games, which could be downloaded chapter by chapter.
Gates, meanwhile, told gamers they would be able to download trial versions of games to their Xbox's hard drive to help them decide whether to buy a retail copy. The same promise is being made with Xbox 360.
The fact of the matter is we will see a leap in quality with next generation games. I've had the chance to have hands-on time with several Xbox 360 games, including the very promising "Gears of War" and "Need for Speed: Most Wanted," and they show tons of potential. I'm sure when the time comes to try out PS3 games I'll be equally impressed.
But as Sony talks of users using the PS3's optional high-def camera to launch their own broadcasts and Microsoft discusses non-gamers hopping onto Xbox Live to sell shirts or skateboards they've created for the latest "Tony Hawk" game, take it with a grain of salt.
Better yet, grab a big shaker and begin pouring liberally.
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ouch! yeah I saw this article when I was at work today, it was pretty good. I agree with a lot of his points. I'm not sure if in the past companies actually followed through on what they said were going to do at E3, but lately with some of the track records I hardly ever believe it until I see it in my living room. There was definitely a lot of smoke and mirrors at this E3, no playable X-box 360's, no actual game footage of PS3 games (?). but it's all a big show and it's easy to promise something to create buzz, and in this industry you can do it very easily, and the gaming sites/fans eat it up. No one is going to remember that your console is 50 times as powerful and can launch remote guided missles to jupiter when it comes out. And you don't even have to hold good to your word anymore 'cause the ones getting screwed will be the gamers, or if you're lucky they won't even notice the difference. The industry really hasn't matured as fast as it's grown.
Last edited by Outlaw; 05-27-05 at 12:23 AM.
#3
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Not to mention that Nvidia just said that they haven't finished designing the graphics chip for the PS3 yet, so all that footage could not have been running on the actual PS3 hardware.
http://www.computerandvideogames.com...(que)id=119444
http://www.computerandvideogames.com...(que)id=119444
#4
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Solid article. Good reason why Nintendo seems to speak without all these promises. "2-3 times more powerful than GCN." Plus it makes it real hard to disappoint people about promises when you don't show anything.
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The math these companies use for their 15 or 35 times more powerful stuff is nonsense anyway. Show me games running on the actual hardware and save the numbers.
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Yeah, remember
that game that was supposed to come out for the Xbox, it had this person with a robot that appeared to mimic everything the character did.
Such bs, I'd be suprised it we get that good even with These new systems.
Such bs, I'd be suprised it we get that good even with These new systems.
#9
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Hmm...So is this news, that 'you can't believe just the ads/marketing folks'? Must have been a slow news day.
Only a, well, dumbass would buy something *solely* based on marketing hype. Even things like hybrid cars were having trouble with that [claimed MPG much higher than actual, etc]. I'm not sure why this seems to have spurred a big anti-Sony/MS vibe in many places.
I didn't go to E3, although I would have liked to. I definitely like watching trailers and movies and demos etc. But ultimately, all the hype in the world is meaningless compared to these four words:
"Show me the games!"
And to quote someone else from the gaming industry, Vic Ireland:
"Don't believe the hype."
Outlaw: I like your line: "The industry really hasn't matured as fast as it's grown." Very true. Nowadays we have tons more processing and graphic power than even five years ago; we have college educated geniuses creating games; the sheer mass of talent accessible by the gaming industry is immense. But for every 'mature' game that tells a deep, engaging story, there are twenty GTA clones or Manhunt or DOAXXX games, where 'mature' means "t & a & cursing & blood". I'm not inherently averse to any of that, but it has created a steal dad's Playboy/sneak into the R rated movie type of titillation, that ironically primarily appeals to the less [emotionally or physically] mature gamer.
Only a, well, dumbass would buy something *solely* based on marketing hype. Even things like hybrid cars were having trouble with that [claimed MPG much higher than actual, etc]. I'm not sure why this seems to have spurred a big anti-Sony/MS vibe in many places.
I didn't go to E3, although I would have liked to. I definitely like watching trailers and movies and demos etc. But ultimately, all the hype in the world is meaningless compared to these four words:
"Show me the games!"
And to quote someone else from the gaming industry, Vic Ireland:
"Don't believe the hype."
Outlaw: I like your line: "The industry really hasn't matured as fast as it's grown." Very true. Nowadays we have tons more processing and graphic power than even five years ago; we have college educated geniuses creating games; the sheer mass of talent accessible by the gaming industry is immense. But for every 'mature' game that tells a deep, engaging story, there are twenty GTA clones or Manhunt or DOAXXX games, where 'mature' means "t & a & cursing & blood". I'm not inherently averse to any of that, but it has created a steal dad's Playboy/sneak into the R rated movie type of titillation, that ironically primarily appeals to the less [emotionally or physically] mature gamer.
Last edited by tonyc3742; 05-27-05 at 02:58 PM.
#10
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Originally Posted by dtcarson
Hmm...So is this news, that 'you can't believe just the ads/marketing folks'? Must have been a slow news day.
You joke, but check the "official" threads for Sony & Xbox360. There are plenty of people just on this forum buying into the hype. Leads me to believe there are plenty more out there like it.
Revolution, like I said, isn't that bad since there is no hype about it.
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People buy the hype all the time. If people wern't buying the hype I would have a lot less people to "respond" to on these boards. And without that my life would have no meaning... So I guess in a way I need the hype to feel as I have a purpose in life...
:deletes entire thread:
:deletes entire thread:
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Originally Posted by Barney1234
that game that was supposed to come out for the Xbox, it had this person with a robot that appeared to mimic everything the character did.
Such bs, I'd be suprised it we get that good even with These new systems.
Such bs, I'd be suprised it we get that good even with These new systems.
The one problem I have with that article is Sony actually came through on their claims with regards to PS2 tech demos. Every single one of them has been surpassed. The Ridge Racer girl, the Gran Turismo demo, the Tekken demo, the Final Fantasy 8 ball room dance demo, etc, have all been surpassed in graphic quality.
In fact, here:
PS2 Tech Demos
PS2 Today
So really, is there much of a doubt that Sony has not achieved the quality of their tech demos? I think it's pretty clear that they've exceeded them unlike what the CNN article is stating. MS on the otherhand flat out lied with their Raven demo.
#13
MS on the otherhand flat out lied with their Raven demo.
I think the PS3 & 360 will both be great, BTW.
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Heh well not sony but some hard working programmers busting their balls maybe... although I never saw the original PS2 demos in motion so I can't comment. But the hair in FFX (and presumably FFX-2) is very stiff and lifeless. In some ways it's hardly better than Shenmue. Silent Hill 3 is pretty amazing though.
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Silent Hill 3 is in game, there are no prerenders in that game anyway . The FFX look like in game, from memory the CGI for that game looks much better. You can tell by how bad the hair looks .
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I think the tech demos presented by Sony for the PS2 are finally starting to get realized on a greater scale. Games like GT4, Silent Hill 3, and God of War truely show off what the system is capable of. Unfortunately, it has taken us many years to get to this point, which is something that hopefully won't take as long this time (with easier programming, this is a possibility). I don't think the full hardware potential of the PS2 will ever be realized, as those who can push the hardware are now moving on to the PS3.
We are never going to have a Tekken 3 quality game for PS2
We are never going to have a Tekken 3 quality game for PS2
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Originally Posted by Gallant Pig
So did Sony with their KZ 2 demo, glass house = don't throw stones. Also your photos above don't prove anything, the 2nd set is also cutscenes. I owned a PS2 and no game I played came close to any of those photos, at least in any pragmatic realtime sense.
I think the PS3 & 360 will both be great, BTW.
I think the PS3 & 360 will both be great, BTW.
The above photos certainly prove everything as each of them are all real time. It doesn't matter if its a cut scene as long as they are real time on the system. I think the photo evidence clearly shows that all of the tech demos have been surpassed to Sony's claims.
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Originally Posted by Bluebomber
I had forgotten how good Zone of Enders 2 looked, amazing considering those shots are in game .
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Originally Posted by joshd2012
I don't think the full hardware potential of the PS2 will ever be realized, as those who can push the hardware are now moving on to the PS3.
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Originally Posted by Chris_D
Actually I think the ps2 is pretty maxed out, the difference between the newer top tier games and the 1st gen (hell, 2nd gen) is pretty amazing. Still I hope the tools are better for the ps3, cos frankly I'd rather not have to wait through 2-3 years of crap to get something that looks good no matter how much supposed untapped power there is.
http://www.technology.scee.net/scees...rHaveWeGot.pdf
I do think development will be greatly eased this time around, especially since the Unreal 3 engine is a licensed tool for the PS3. That thing looks bad-ass right now, and game developers can start using it now.
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I agree that the PS2 is finally delivering close to what the tech demos demonstrated 5 years ago. My main complaint is with the features the xbox and PS2 were supposed to deliver that never showed up, and surprise, are now these features are being touted for the 360 and PS3.
Last edited by jeffdsmith; 05-28-05 at 11:41 AM.
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I think one could argue that the xbox did live up to the "Raven" tech demo. Look at Ninja Gaiden, Chronicles of Riddick, Doom 3 (although not as good as the PC, pretty damn good for a console) Splinter Cell: Chaos Theory, Forza... All of these games look absolutly incredible.
Sure there is bound to be some unfufilled hype from a console launch but I don't regard it as bold faced lies, just things that didn't pan out.
Sure there is bound to be some unfufilled hype from a console launch but I don't regard it as bold faced lies, just things that didn't pan out.
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You're missing the point. the point of an E3 press conference "system unveiling" is to promise what you have planned for your system, unveil its key features, what makes it stand out from the rest. Obviously this is also their chance to sell their system and generate hype. However they pretty much go into these conferences knowing they can promise turning rocks into gold and show a CG video of what it "might look like" using different hardware but can dump that feature. not panning out isn't that great of an excuse if they use for one of their system selling features. And everyone is guilty of doing this, its just really annoying. I'd own an x-box if true fantasy online ever came out, thank god I waited.