I can't say I agree with every choice and needless to say there are many shocking omissions. But there are some I'm glad to see:
Stanley Kubrick's Barry Lyndon
Kurosawa's Ikiru
Almodovar's Talk to Her
Scott's Bladerunner
Bergman's Persona
Considering the list some of my favorites that were omitted:
Gone With the Wind
Wizard of Oz
Sunset Blvd
Grapes of Wrath
It Happened One Night
LA Confidential
Jean Cocteau's Beauty and the Beast
Fellini's Nights of Cabiria or La Strada or 8 1/2?
Brian De Palma's The Untouchables
Amadeus
Ang Lee's Eat Drink Man Woman
Pixar's The Incredibles
Annie Hall
Night of the Hunter
Fanny and Alexander
Wong Kar Wai's In The Mood For Love
Silence of the Lambs
JFK
Hithcock's Vertigo and North by Northwest
Kurosawa's Ran and Seven Samurai
Marcel Pagnol's Manon of the Spring
American Beauty
David Lynch's Mulholland Drive and Blue Velvet
Excalibur
Cinema Paradiso
Moulin Rouge
Fargo
2001: A Space Odyssey
wm lopez
05-22-05, 04:54 PM
The best way it study these best of lists is to view box-office by decade.
That way it's the paying public that has a say so and not some goof from some magazine or the liberal goofs at A.F.I.
NitroJMS
05-22-05, 04:57 PM
Seems like Time was going for the anti-AFI list by going the less popular and/or foreign route with alot of their selections.
I do have to nitpick how they can pick Finding Nemo over the vastly superior Toy Story, Monsters, Inc. and The Incredibles. Or Charade over North by Northwest?
Matthew Chmiel
05-22-05, 05:40 PM
The list gets props by listing both Children of Paradise and Brazil. Hell, even a little bit more loving by listing The Apu Trilogy. :thumbsup:
However...
1. Why Finding Nemo? PIXAR and other animation studios have put out films that are far and away better than Finding Nemo. Maybe I only think this as I believe Finding Nemo was one of PIXAR's "lesser" efforts (right next to Monsters, Inc. and A Bug's Life).
2. Star Wars is listed, but not The Empire Strikes Back? If The Godfather, Parts 1 & 2 and the entire Lord of the Rings trilogy can get a mention, why not Empire Strikes Back? Come on, it was the last great Star Wars film...
3. These people do know that Kurosawa made better films that Yojimbo... right?
RyoHazuki
05-22-05, 06:02 PM
Pretty good list. Obviously people aren't going to agree with everything on there. Finding Nemo is really odd on that list though.
Gerry P.
05-22-05, 07:50 PM
The best way it study these best of lists is to view box-office by decade.
That way it's the paying public that has a say so and not some goof from some magazine or the liberal goofs at A.F.I.Right on!... because the best movies always make the most money.
astrochimp
05-22-05, 08:10 PM
Biggest omission in my opinion:
The Shawshank Redemption
QuikSilver
05-22-05, 08:37 PM
Definately not a very good list with way too many omissions to list. Do these guys live under a rock?
DRG
05-22-05, 08:53 PM
Other notable omissions:
Raiders of the Lost Ark
Bridge on the River Kwai
Bugg
05-22-05, 08:58 PM
The best way it study these best of lists is to view box-office by decade.
That way it's the paying public that has a say so and not some goof from some magazine or the liberal goofs at A.F.I.
Props to you, with the weekend almost at a close you hit it hard and made in just before the midnight deadline to claim sole ownership of DVDTALK's "dumbest post of the week" :up:
PopcornTreeCt
05-22-05, 10:06 PM
I like how it includes a lot of foreign films. But I can't help but think if it wasn't for Criterion many of these movies wouldn't be on the list. Sure, they still existed but Criterion has resurrected them and brought them back into the spotlight.
Nice choice with City of God and Miller's Crossing. But Finding Nemo has make scratching my head.
NatrlBornThrllr
05-22-05, 10:19 PM
Yojimbo over Seven Samurai?
Finding Nemo over...everything else?
Drunken Master II got a nod?
Over Shawshank?
...and One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest?
Smiles of a Summer Night is the best Bergman? Since when?
No Hitchcock outside of Psycho? What about Rear Window? Vertigo? North by Northwest?
I could go on. The list is seriously flawed (in my opinion, that is), but much respect to TIME Magazine for including City of God.
-JP
wendersfan
05-22-05, 10:25 PM
Kind of odd that the only Renoir was <b>The Crime of Monsieur Lange</b>...
DVD King
05-22-05, 10:32 PM
It's hard for me to take a list seriously when they leave out Apocalypse Now or Vertigo in favor of Finding Nemo :thmbsdwn:
the big train
05-22-05, 10:50 PM
No Hitchcock outside of Psycho? What about Rear Window? Vertigo? North by Northwest?
Notorious was there.
NatrlBornThrllr
05-22-05, 10:56 PM
Notorious was there.
Good eye.
Also, I didn't even notice that Rules of the Game wasn't on the list. If a list leaves off Rules of the Game and Seven Samurai, and favors Bergman's Smiles of a Summer Night over Wild Strawberries or Seventh Seal...then something's a bit off.
-JP
dhmac
05-22-05, 11:30 PM
A lot of good/great movies on the list, but not a great list overall due to too many omissions.
Coral
05-23-05, 12:46 AM
Nice that they didn't shortchange foreign films, but there are some very questionable titles there.
Finding Nemo, Brazil and LOTR Trilogy (for example) don't deserve to be on there.
Odd that Smiles of a Summer Night is listed instead of Bergmans better films Wild Strawberries and Fanny and Alexander (to name a few).
Purple Rose of Cairo is there but no Manhattan or Annie Hall?
Where's the Three Colors Trilogy?
Great to see Leolo on the list. Very unexpected, but a nice surprise.
Dean Kousoulas
05-23-05, 01:20 AM
I really liked seeing City of God on that list. Finding Nemo??? I really hope that was #100.
Myster X
05-23-05, 02:05 AM
No Seven Samurai? :brickwl2: Obviously a flawed. How the heck did "Once Upon a Time in the West" made the list but not "The Good the Bad and the Ugly"? Where's "Platoon"???? :hairpull:
duff beer
05-23-05, 02:07 AM
No Seven Samurai? Disgard that list.
glassdragon
05-23-05, 02:14 AM
no office space? They obviously have asses for heads... Havn't met one person who didn't think that was one of the best movies they had ever seen.
RevKarl
05-23-05, 02:26 AM
Seems like Time was going for the anti-AFI list by going the less popular and/or foreign route with alot of their selections...Actually, Time movie critic Richard Schickel is one of the individuals who selects the nominees for AFI's "100 Years, 100 whatever" lists...I was surprised The Prime of Miss Jean Brodie wasn't on this list, as he considers it one of the funniest films ever made (having threatened to resign if it wasn't placed on the "100 Laughs" ballot...and no, I'm not joking about this.)
Wazootyman
05-23-05, 02:49 AM
Ah Schickel... can you ever print things correctly?
Dr. Mantle
05-23-05, 03:32 AM
The best way it study these best of lists is to view box-office by decade.
That way it's the paying public that has a say so and not some goof from some magazine or the liberal goofs at A.F.I.
You're so totally right! Independence Day was one of the best movies of the 90s!
jetflair
05-23-05, 05:24 AM
You're so totally right! Independence Day was one of the best movies of the 90s!
Actually, in my opinion. it was. And that's all these lists are; opinions.
Rubix
05-23-05, 06:58 AM
they forgot goonies.
please correct, kthxbai.
wendersfan
05-23-05, 08:25 AM
no office space? They obviously have asses for heads... Havn't met one person who didn't think that was one of the best movies they had ever seen.:wave:
It's an enjoyable movie, but it's nothing special.
Jaymole
05-23-05, 08:58 AM
no office space? They obviously have asses for heads... Havn't met one person who didn't think that was one of the best movies they had ever seen.
It's comments like these which makes me hope that there will never be another top 100 movie list posted here on this forum.
Obviously this list is more of "our favorite 100 movies" list, but i take it with a grain of salt. It's interesting but that's about it.
cleaver
05-23-05, 09:20 AM
On one hand, I am enraged by no Raiders of the Lost Ark. On the other hand, Drunken Master 2! :thumbsup:
astrochimp
05-23-05, 10:08 AM
No Seven Samurai? :brickwl2: Obviously a flawed. How the heck did "Once Upon a Time in the West" made the list but not "The Good the Bad and the Ugly"? Where's "Platoon"???? :hairpull:
The Good the Bad and the Ugly is there ;)
Coral
05-23-05, 12:41 PM
no office space? They obviously have asses for heads... Havn't met one person who didn't think that was one of the best movies they had ever seen.
Not sure if that is a joke or not - but in case it isn't...
while I enjoy Office Space - I really dont see the film being in the Top 100 or even the Top 500 films of all time.
I guess "Best" and "Favorite" makes a big difference with these lists.
Mondo Kane
05-23-05, 01:02 PM
WTF? Drunken Master 2?? rotfl I gots to know how they came up with this one!
Nickofdoom
05-23-05, 02:35 PM
Hey! Where the hell is Good Burger?!!
Myster X
05-23-05, 03:37 PM
The Good the Bad and the Ugly is there ;)
ah... I was looking for it under T.
glassdragon
05-23-05, 03:56 PM
fine, no it wasn't a joke. I happen to love that movie and think it deserves to be there. Most of these movies i've never even heard of, so imo it deserves a place there. Not saying that the ones listed are bad, but i have nothing to base it as one of the top movies of all time when i havn't seen it. Was just an opinion guys
raven56706
05-23-05, 04:00 PM
Thats it this is ridiculous.... no Battlefield Earth.... no sell
glassdragon
05-23-05, 04:03 PM
Thats it this is ridiculous.... no Battlefield Earth.... no sell
yeah dammit, where the hell is Mortal Kombat Annihilation :scratch2:
wendersfan
05-23-05, 04:06 PM
fine, no it wasn't a joke. I happen to love that movie and think it deserves to be there. Most of these movies i've never even heard of, so imo it deserves a place there. So basically what you're saying is you don't know what you're talking about, therefore your opinion is more valid than two men whose job it's been for several decades to review movies and write books about them. Nice.
Of course there's room for disagreement since this is basically a matter of opinion, but <i>informed</i> opinions are a lot more useful. What <i>is</i> useless is a post (and there have been several, some serious, some not) that says the entire list is crap because some fanboy personal favorite is omitted.
<i>My</i> favorite movie isn't on the list. My <i>second</i> favorite movie isn't on the list. I still think it's a worthwhile endeavor, but to each his own.
tdirgins
05-23-05, 04:30 PM
These lists are getting ridiculous. :rolleyes:
glassdragon
05-23-05, 04:38 PM
So basically what you're saying is you don't know what you're talking about, therefore your opinion is more valid than two men whose job it's been for several decades to review movies and write books about them. Nice.
Of course there's room for disagreement since this is basically a matter of opinion, but <i>informed</i> opinions are a lot more useful. What <i>is</i> useless is a post (and there have been several, some serious, some not) that says the entire list is crap because some fanboy personal favorite is omitted.
<i>My</i> favorite movie isn't on the list. My <i>second</i> favorite movie isn't on the list. I still think it's a worthwhile endeavor, but to each his own.
wow calm down. I never said the list sucked.. what i said was that they had asses for heads for not putting 1 thing in the list. Where did i ever say that the list sucked? I never claimed to be making an informed opinion about the movies i had never seen, in fact i said my last post that I cannot make one because i hadn't seen all of those movies. As for your comment about people who review movies their whole life, well HA. I could care less how long they've been doing it. Someone could do a job for many many years and still not be very good at it. I tend to distrust crtitics as my movie taste is usually the opposite of every critic out there. If they hated it then i know i'll love it and the opposite. So please entitle me to an opinion without saying i said stuff that i didn't. My reply was in no way meant to infer that any of the movies that WERE on the list were bad. It was just to infer that i thought it should have been on the list. Oh, and if you couldn't tell the asses for heads comment was completely in jest and was meant as a joke. They can like what they want, that's fine by me lol
brainee
05-23-05, 05:03 PM
Has anybody getting worked up about this actually read the article by the guys at Time? They admit that lists are silly and don't really mean anything. They're just ways to have fun and stimulate discussion. I doubt that even the authors would agree with some conclusions from this list: like "Drunken Master 2" is a better action movie than things like "Jaws" or "Raiders"; or that "The Fly (1986)" is really the best horror movie in the last 45 years.
glassdragon
05-23-05, 05:08 PM
Has anybody getting worked up about this actually read the article by the guys at Time? They admit that lists are silly and don't really mean anything. They're just ways to have fun and stimulate discussion. I doubt that even the authors would agree with some conclusions from this list: like "Drunken Master 2" is a better action movie than things like "Jaws" or "Raiders"; or that "The Fly (1986)" is really the best horror movie in the last 45 years.
I agree, it's all subjective. I'm not going to say anyone sucks because they like a certain movie. I may however give my own opinion, which people should respect just as i would respect their opinion. Mortal kombat annihilation to me was the worst movie ever made, but i'm sure there are a few people out there that absolutely love that movie. I won't say that they suck for that, and i will respect the fact that someone liked the movie, but i would expect the same from them if they disagreed with a movie i liked
on another note DAMN it's slow at work tonite
cfloyd3
05-23-05, 05:29 PM
I personally liked seeing Invasion of the Body Snatchers (1956) on the list, fantastic film.
NatrlBornThrllr
05-23-05, 05:45 PM
I never claimed to be making an informed opinion about the movies i had never seen, in fact i said my last post that I cannot make one because i hadn't seen all of those movies.
You did, though. You said that Office Space is a better movie than these dozens of films that you haven't heard of (which is implied by stating that it deserves to be on a top 100 list over, one would assume, at least a handful of these titles that you've never heard of). You did pass judgement on these films you've never heard of, by saying that Office Space is better. What's worse, you used the fact that you've never heard of them as justification for claiming that Office Space is better ("most of these I've never even heard of, so imo it deserves a place there").
On a related note, while I wouldn't include it on the list, "Office Space" is the funniest movie I've ever seen, and was one of the first DVD's I ever bought.
On a side note, what in the fuck is "Talk to Her" doing on the list? It's a good movie that I'm proud to own, but certainly not one of the 100 best of all-time.
-JP
glassdragon
05-23-05, 06:07 PM
no, once again I never said it was better than those movies. I said that it should be on the list. I didn't single out any one movie and say it was better. In fact I never used the word better in any of my posts. I can understand where you would get this idea since one would have to be ommited to add the one i wanted. However as i said i never said any specific one. I'm sure there's at least 1 on that list that everyone could find that they would want ommited. I'm sure i could find one if i looked at the list again. I never said any particular one though.
anyway this is getting old. I'm defending myself for people inferring things that i said and not what i actually said. Forget i said anything and continue with the posts. Just remember everyone that if you have an opinion on what you think should have been on there then maybe you should keep it to yourself or you may find yourself in the same position :P
NatrlBornThrllr
05-23-05, 06:25 PM
Oh I see, so in saying, "I've never even heard of most of these films, so imo Office Space deserves to be on the list," you weren't implying that it should, in turn, be ranked ahead of those films that you'd never heard of? I mean, if your criteria for getting it on the list is that you've never heard of most of the films, should one not assume that you'd rank it above those films?
The fact is, you said that a film that's not particularly solid in any respect aside from it's humor should be placed on a top-100 list because you've, "never heard of most of the movies on the list." That's an outlandish statement, and you got called out on it. No need to make it look like you're being attacked for stating your opinion. You're being questioned based on the justification you gave along with your opinion (or the lack thereof).
Just remember everyone that if you have an opinion on what you think should have been on there then maybe you should keep it to yourself or you may find yourself in the same position :P
Please. Unless it's an informed opinion, in which case, feel free to post it.
-JP
IanH
05-23-05, 06:34 PM
With these Best 100 lists of all time its unlikely I'll agree with most of them. Lawrence of Arabia is included in almost every list but its a movie I respect but don't particularly like all that much. At the very least the movie has to have a certain standard and hold something of value.
Whether I "liked" a movie of not is almost irrelevant. These lists are often put together like a consensus and like all consensus I'm expecting to see stuff I don't particularly like. But every movie has to rise to a certain level or has to have a certain unique value. Whether its......
Technical in Nature
Storytelling ability
Its ability to capture the "zeitgeist" or spirit of the time
Career defining performance by an performer or director
etc etc.
In addition to one these unique abilities the movie just has to work on a basic level of communicating what the filmakers intended to do.
But when there is a movie that does the similar thing but better IMO (like The Incredibles over Finding Nemo) or there is a movie thats better and is his signature piece (Annie Hall over Purple Rose of Cairo) this is when I have a real problem with any list. Its always subjective though.......
glassdragon
05-23-05, 07:04 PM
Oh I see, so in saying, "I've never even heard of most of these films, so imo Office Space deserves to be on the list," you weren't implying that it should, in turn, be ranked ahead of those films that you'd never heard of? I mean, if your criteria for getting it on the list is that you've never heard of most of the films, should one not assume that you'd rank it above those films?
The fact is, you said that a film that's not particularly solid in any respect aside from it's humor should be placed on a top-100 list because you've, "never heard of most of the movies on the list." That's an outlandish statement, and you got called out on it. No need to make it look like you're being attacked for stating your opinion. You're being questioned based on the justification you gave along with your opinion (or the lack thereof).
Please. Unless it's an informed opinion, in which case, feel free to post it.
-JP
ok, i believe i misspoke there, I did not in any way mean to bash anything on there. It's amazing how one word like "so" would cause such a contraversy. I apologise for anyone who took that the wrong way. I am not saying any of those films are bad. Honestly though, there are more important things to worry about than someone's opinion on a top 100 list when as we all know they are subjective and mean nothing anyways. Once again sorry for the slip up in what i said, was an accident.
hardtack
05-24-05, 09:52 PM
No Seven Samurai? Disgard that list.
Exactly!! And further reasons to disregard the list are:
a) They included The Singing Detective starring Michael Gambon - this was not even a movie, it was serialised for television! Boof! there goes their credibility.
b) Finding Nemo - if animation is going to be nominated then surely Animal Farm or Grave of the Fireflies would rate way ahead of that.
c) As enjoyable as A Hard Days Night was, it is not really top 100 material. If you are going to nominate musicals, then nominate West Side Story; if you are going to nominate pop culture musicals, then nominate The Girl Can't Help It.
ivelostr2
05-24-05, 11:53 PM
I checked out the list, Ive seen a lot of them, but not all. A couple things, all are IMHO:
1. I am glad they are doing foriegn films as well as America, that one of the problems with AFi, but duh AMERICAN FI.
2. I am suprised blade runner made it, I like that movies, but it has more of a cult status that a critical acclaim.
3. I am elated Ikiru made the list, hands down my favorite of Kuro's films, and I am always suprised how few were familiar with this movie before the CC discs, even people "in the know."
4. I know someone has already mentioned it, but how can Annie Hall not make the list if Purple Rose of Cairo did. I mean c'mom, if neither of them made the list, i would be likeok, they're not into Woody, but how does that one make it and not the other.
5. Empire and Indy, have already been mentioned.
...my 2 pennies...
Nick
(edited to add) No gone with the wind, how is that possible?
ivelostr2
05-25-05, 12:01 AM
Exactly!! And further reasons to disregard the list are:
a) They included The Singing Detective starring Michael Gambon - this was not even a movie, it was serialised for television! Boof! there goes their credibility.
b) Finding Nemo - if animation is going to be nominated then surely Animal Farm or Grave of the Fireflies would rate way ahead of that.
c) As enjoyable as A Hard Days Night was, it is not really top 100 material. If you are going to nominate musicals, then nominate West Side Story; if you are going to nominate pop culture musicals, then nominate The Girl Can't Help It.
b).
I also think finding nemo is neither as good as Shrek, Toy Story or Lion King or as important as those films. Toy Story was completely new, it changed peoples expectation, Shrek changed Disney's perception as being un challengable, and Lion King, (maybe its my skewed perspective being a teen then) made disney not just for girls, as it had been for the few years before that film.
c).
I was pleased that Meet me in St. Louis was there, I love this movie, and I can never articulate why, but I just love it...
wendersfan
05-25-05, 08:53 AM
Exactly!! And further reasons to disregard the list are:
a) They included The Singing Detective starring Michael Gambon - this was not even a movie, it was serialised for television! Boof! there goes their credibility.
So were <b>Berlin Alexanderplatz</b> and <b>The Decalogue</b>. It's become accepted practice among film critics and scholars to consider those works "films"*, since that is how they are most often seen these days, as theatrical releases. For example, recently I was at theatrical viewing of Maurice Pialat's miniseries from the 70's called <b>The House in the Country</b>. It's unlikely I would ever see it on TV, but in a theater, quite likely.
As for disregarding the list because of the omission of <b>Seven Samurai</b>, see what I wrote above about "personal fanboy favorites". Several films which I consider to be superior to that film were also omitted, but I don't consider that cause to dismiss the list out of hand. Instead, I consider it a challenge to further explore films I'm either not familiar with or that I might have unfairly discounted in the past.
*For purposes of making lists like the one we're discussing now.
Buy: