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I'm about ready to attempt legal action against Amazon... [Archive] - DVD Talk Forum
 
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View Full Version : I'm about ready to attempt legal action against Amazon...


rbf1138
03-30-05, 11:04 PM
I know some of you remember the deal on Joseph Campbell's Mythos, that was on sale for 8.99 from Amazon back in December. Now, while some people have recieved it, many have not. Over the past 4 months, I've called 3, maybe 4 times to inquire about it's ever-changing status, as it moved back a few weeks at a time. Over the 4 months, the availablity on the site changed, ranging from 2-3 months, to 7-11 days, to the current 4-5 days. Each time, I asked why it was listed as it was, and was told each time it was a mistake. Now, I would have bought that response the first, maybe second time, however the fact that myself and at least one other friend (not to mention others from this board alone) have asked about it, and it does not seem to have been taken off the website if it is in fact not available anymore is nonsense. Someone is clearly aware of the product's listing and its availablity. My order is still open, but I have very little confidence that I will ever recieve it for the price advertised when I ordered it. My friend's order was cancelled, and others on this board have had their orders cancelled. I realize I got in on a possible pricing error, but to this point they have left my order open and have not told me it was a mistake. In addition, I have been continually told by CSRs that it would be in "next week" or "8 days" and it has yet to show up. I've decided to order Mythos at the current price of almost $90. It will certainly be interesting to see if it shows up after I pay full price.
To be honest I do not know the legality of the matter at this time, but I have relatives who would know the law, and I plan on talking to them this weekend. There may be a different course of action depending on if I recieve it after paying full price or not. If they are giving priority to new, more expensive orders, I can't imagine that type of service is legal. And if they are not recieving more of the product, and they are merely pulling in customers by leaving it advertised as shipping soon, that too seems extremely unethical.

Wannabe
03-30-05, 11:49 PM
I have this on order as well. My guess is that since Amazon handles literally millions of items -- there's bound to be an occasional problem with their inventory system on a few products.

I don't know much about the law, but I do know that in order to receive damages in court, you have to prove how you were economically impacted by Amazon's failure to provide the product.

And if Amazon did make a pricing mistake, they can simply cancel your order before it ships. They're under no legal obligation to sell you a product that they lose money on (unless you have a signed contract with them). I doubt "bait and switch" laws apply to online sellers.

Amazon continues to claim that the product is out of stock. The best you could hope for is to receive one item at the $8.99 price. Perhaps a gift certificate for your trouble.

In my particular case, I had ordered many copies of Mythos in two different orders. Last week they canceled one of my orders. Why is the other one open? Who knows?

vhgong
03-31-05, 09:21 AM
Its a mistake, move on.

Groucho
03-31-05, 09:32 AM
This was a misprice on an item you probably had no interest in, and were only going to resell anyway. I'm sorry you weren't able to take advantage, but it's probably best you move on.

marty888
03-31-05, 09:37 AM
Great argument for tort reform ...

Ispep Aloc
03-31-05, 09:46 AM
Some of the time...talking to CSRs are gonna get you nowhere. Move up the chain. If you have a problem with a CSR ask to talk to their supervisor and so on. I've had a similar problem with a printer that I ordered in January and it shipped earlier this month. I called a few times because the site said 2-3 days and my estimation date was long overdue.

Items come and go in availability. Its a fact. There's nothing you or a lawyer can do to change that.

rbf1138
03-31-05, 09:50 AM
I guess I should add that for one, I do not plan on reselling this, and secondly I love Power of Myth, and I am very much interested in watching this one as well. While it's true I probably would never buy this at the full $90, its just bad business on Amazon's part to repeat the mistake multiple times of both the availability and the actuality of it ever being sent to me. Had they cancelled my order and all of the others within a month of the order, I'd be annoyed, but I'd forget it. However, the fact that some people have recieved it and not others, yet it continues to sell while they obviously have yet to fulfill outstanding orders is again, just bad business practice and discouraging to a customer. The best outcome I'd hope for is that they'd be forced to better monitor and enforce the information stated on their site. I've brought this to the attention of the CSRs on numerous occassions now, which should be more than enough for any website, let alone one as well known as Amazon to have fixed the error by now.

Falc04
03-31-05, 10:41 AM
Great argument for tort reform ...

:thumbsup:

ben12
03-31-05, 11:33 AM
Legal action? hahaha
If you really want to do something, file a complaint with the BBB. Otherwise, as others have said, move on with your life.

Count Dooku
03-31-05, 02:44 PM
I am outraged! This is scandalous, salacious, outrageous! http://www.berrysmediahut.com/seinfeld/images/jackiechiles.gif

rauent
03-31-05, 08:41 PM
You may want to read the "Conditions on Use" page on amazons site:

PRICING

Except where noted otherwise, the List Price displayed for products on our website represents the full retail price listed on the product itself, suggested by the manufacturer or supplier, or estimated in accordance with standard industry practice. The List Price is a comparative price estimate and may or may not represent the prevailing price in every area on any particular day. For certain items that are offered as a set, the List Price may represent "open-stock" prices, which means the aggregate of the manufacturer's estimated or suggested retail price for each of the items included in the set. Where an item is offered for sale by one of our merchants, the List Price may be provided by the merchant.

With respect to items sold by Amazon.com, we cannot confirm the price of an item until you order; however, we do NOT charge your credit card until after your order has entered the shipping process. Despite our best efforts, a small number of the items in our catalog may be mispriced. If we discover a mispricing, we will do one of the following:

If an item's correct price is lower than our stated price, we will charge the lower amount and ship you the item.
If an item's correct price is higher than our stated price, we will, at our discretion, either contact you for instructions before shipping or cancel your order and notify you of such cancellation.
Please note that this policy applies only to products sold and shipped by Amazon.com. Your purchases from third-party sellers using Amazon.com Payments are charged at the time you place your order, and third-party sellers may follow different policies in the event of a mispriced item.

And you may want to bone up on the State of Washingtons laws as another paragraph on this page states:

APPLICABLE LAW

By visiting Amazon.com, you agree that the laws of the state of Washington, without regard to principles of conflict of laws, will govern these Conditions of Use and any dispute of any sort that might arise between you and Amazon.com or its affiliates.

bluesparrow
04-01-05, 02:16 AM
How can you sue? Did they charge you? If not you're out nothing. Even if they did, suing over $9 is a bit, well, insane.

QuanTum
04-01-05, 11:20 AM
It's really too bad there are still jerks that order "many copies" on multiple orders. I ordered ONE way before MANY other people order theirs who have already received a copy.

Wannabe
04-01-05, 12:39 PM
It's really too bad there are still jerks that order "many copies" on multiple orders. I ordered ONE way before MANY other people order theirs who have already received a copy.

Is there a quota system on Amazon.com? Does their system limit customers to one item per customer? Is it illegal or immoral to buy mulitple copies?

Goldblum
04-01-05, 12:45 PM
Go get'em, Tiger!

QuanTum
04-02-05, 12:57 AM
Is it illegal or immoral? No, but I guess it depends on your definition of morality. It is certainly poor etiquette. We all belong to this great forum and share knowledge of wonderful deals. The jerks that take advantage of this knowledge for their own personal gain ruin the opportunity for many other members to get in on a great deal; deals which they would not have even known about if it were not for the community of members that share such information. I think such behavior is reprehensible. I also beleive such behavior could easily destroy most forums such as this and that really pisses me off.

Wannabe
04-02-05, 02:37 AM
The jerks that take advantage of this knowledge for their own personal gain ruin the opportunity for many other members to get in on a great deal.

Really? How's that? Do you know how many copies of Mythos were actually available for purchase? Was it ten copies or ten million?

Was Mythos only available to DVD Talkers? No, it was posted in Amazon.com's under $10 section and available to anyone with an Internet connection.

And no one (except maybe Amazon employees) knew how long Mythos would be offered at that price. The Rick Steves - Best of Travels in Europe DVD, priced at 66% off list price, has been on sale for two months at Amazon. How many copies of that title would YOU allow someone to purchase?

Does your philosophy apply to other items? When Target clears out their Easter candy, pricing $2.50 bags of M&M's at 25 cents, how many bags should one buy? Is there a moral obligation to make sure you don't buy too many? What's fair to you?

Brian Shannon
04-02-05, 02:19 PM
I realize I got in on a possible pricing error, but to this point they have left my order open and have not told me it was a mistake.

Sounds like you know it is a mistake. Is it worth callling a lawyer?

Troy Stiffler
04-02-05, 06:58 PM
Sounds like you know it is a mistake. Is it worth callling a lawyer?

Only if the lawyer doesn't pick up his phone...

rbf1138
04-06-05, 02:57 PM
Well, order's been cancelled. Just ordered another copy at $89.00, as it is shipping in 6-12 days...wonder what's going to happen.

Digweedrocks
04-06-05, 09:11 PM
Alot of stress over an $8.99 purchase, granted teh 90% discount, but still less than ten bucks. Any real judge would laugh that one out of court and as you could have disputed it with you credit card. sounds to me they never even charged your card in the first place? Or did I read this thread too quickly?

And after four monthes it would be pretty obvious it was not vital to your business, unlike say a real case of damages where an option for oranges say, is not honored and the price of oranges is 5x what your option price is AND you run an orange juice stand. That is assuming they were paid for the OPTION in teh first place. Placing an order is a request, not a legal obligation until satisfied with acceptance of payment, and even that is covered by AMAZON's term of service, in which they can refund any order they can not fill. I'm sure after teh first couple of hundred copies of MYTHOS(which probably wholesales for at least $40-50) flew through the door, they could not fulfill the order due to the sale priced lot selling out. Regardless of how you stand on price mistakes, you can't really expect most merchants to fill thousands of orders after selling out. Short of a Federal law stating otherwise, you are not forced to accept all orders or even fulfill them if you refund the money in a timely fashion. Otherwise no one would ever advertise as teh legal obligations concerning orders would be completely unreasonable.

rbf1138
04-06-05, 09:41 PM
My question is, if they fill this order at full price...would that be some type of discrimination whereby they are fulfilling orders placed later solely because the customer paid more for it? This would have to be grounds for some type of fraud issue, as they claimed my order was cancelled due to unavailablitity, not a pricing mistake.

Josh H
04-06-05, 10:28 PM
Does your philosophy apply to other items? When Target clears out their Easter candy, pricing $2.50 bags of M&M's at 25 cents, how many bags should one buy? Is there a moral obligation to make sure you don't buy too many? What's fair to you?


Stupid comparison. People aren't goint to buy up all the 25 cent M&Ms and sell them on ebay for $1.50 to make a profit.

The problem on the net is when there's a great deal that's not a permanent price reduction, there's a few people that buy as many as they can get and sell them for near regular price on ebay to make a profit.

It's not illegal, or even really immoral, but it is poor etiquette as the other poster said. It keeps a lot of people who just wanted 1 copy for themselves at a great price from getting in on the deal, just because one greedy bastard wants to make a quick buck.

jaelliot
04-07-05, 10:14 PM
My question is, if they fill this order at full price...would that be some type of discrimination whereby they are fulfilling orders placed later solely because the customer paid more for it? This would have to be grounds for some type of fraud issue, as they claimed my order was cancelled due to unavailablitity, not a pricing mistake.

I am sure your order was cancelled because of availability issues. What would be the point in lying to you, Amazon.com has their policy for mispriced items on their website.


If we discover a mispricing, we will do one of the following:

* If an item's correct price is lower than our stated price, we will charge the lower amount and ship you the item.
* If an item's correct price is higher than our stated price, we will, at our discretion, either contact you for instructions before shipping or cancel your order and notify you of such cancellation.



You should spend your time looking for unmarked wet areas at the mall if you have such a hard on to sue someone. Stop tearing yourself up because you didn't get to screw "The Man" this time.

rbf1138
04-07-05, 11:10 PM
When deepdiscount's sale started working days before it was supposed to go into effect, there was a great outcry on these boards for the prices to be honored, regardless of the "mistake" the site had made. Why am I greedy in this situation, but all those people who demanded their orders be honored in other pricing mistakes were somehow justified. The fact is, while they may have a pricing mistake policy, they sent this dvd to others on this board at the "mistaken" price. They've NEVER stated it was a pricing mistake, though their website continues to display it as being available. Don't you understand what my gripe is, at all? I have a problem with the continued advertisement of a product that is apparently not ever going to be available, even after they've been notified many many times. In addition, they DID fulfill some orders, so if they're selectively cancelling orders now to fill orders that paid full price, well, thats a serious business issue. At this point I have no problem recieiving or not recieving this dvd, but I'd like to know what the issues have been this whole time, why some got it and not others, and why they continue to allow orders for a product they have stated is no longer available at all.

marty888
04-08-05, 06:45 AM
Forget <i>Mythos</i> ..... this is sounding more and more like <i><b>PATHOS<b></i>.

QuanTum
04-13-05, 09:19 PM
I have been a loyal and happy customer of Amazon for many years. This has been the first negative experience i have had with the company. I ordered on Dec 9th. Many people who ordered after me received a copy. I received delay notification after delay notification until 4-1 when i received a cancellation because "we will not be able to obtain the item." That same day, I called their customer service. I explained that I had placed the order in December and it was cancelled, but I saw that it was still available on the website and said it would ship in 4-6 days. The CSR said that she did not understand why that would happen and apologized for the lengthy delay and offered to submit a new order. I asked if she would be able to adjust the price and she said that she would. I placed the order and she modified it after submission. She ended up charging me $9.98 total. I did not quible over the extra dollar. On 4-7, I received an email saying there was a delay with the order, but did not ask me to make any approval like the delays on the first order. On 4-12, I received a shipping notification and today I received Mythos. Obviously, the first order should not have been cancelled because they were unable to obtain the item. Any time I have ever had a problem with an order, a CSR has set things right. I am disappointed that they filled orders that were placed after mine while I waited and that they strung me along for 4 months and then cancelled for no good reason. But ultimately, Amazon came through for me.