Chew

Episode Title: "In God We Trust"


I had to start this thread as this is the first "live" episode I've watched since the series began. It took a few months, a couple DVD boxsets, a few Bravo repeats, a few "creative" searches, and many saved TiVo episodes: but I finally caught up!


Very happy to see Bruno again. If Vinnick uses him, and actually takes the advice, he should win easily (in the fictional universe, that is). As for the VP: any chance to see Speaker/President Walken (Goodman) again? That might be a good choice. And if Alda doesn't want to do TV full-time again, just find a way to elevate Goodman to the job after the election.

Knowing they wouldn't pick Bingo Bob and knowing Alda doesn't want to do TV full-time, is there really any doubt at this point Santos will win the general?

Red Dog

Liked this episode. Glad they finally gave Vinick some play. If only Republicans could actually nominate someone like him. It can't happen in today's day and age since the religious right wields far too much power in the party.

wendersfan

No kidding. A guy who wants to cut taxes and spending, and isn't in the pocket of the religious right? Where do I sign up?

MrX

That speech he gave at the end outside the White House would pretty much seal his fate

Red Dog

It was totally unrealistic though. The church question would certainly come up during the primary; not after he sailed through a primary. I mean are we to assume Vinick won the GOP nomination by moving to the center.

Shannon Nutt

Both Alda and Smits are signed THROUGHOUT next season...so Alan will be doing TV full-time...for at least a year.

BTW, Alda was fantastic in last night's show...will all due respect to Smits (who is also a good actor, but not quite yet in Alda's league), I'm pulling for the Republican in this election...something I would NEVER do in real life.

Chew

I should clarify: I mean full-time like Martin Sheen full-time. He may be signed throughout next season like he is this one, but he's hardly been much more than an recurring guest-star.

wendersfan

Originally Sheen was never supposed to be the star anyway; Rob Lowe was going to be primus inter pares in an ensemble cast about White House staffers, and Sheen would appear briefly in most episodes. Perhaps the idea is to return to that concept with a new administration?

Chew

That would be fine. But, I seriously doubt the exact same thing won't happen with Alda as President. They'll start out the planned way and it'll be by the roadside in 3 episodes because the audience is calling for more Alda screentime.

Besides, Vinnick winning has to mean the entire current cast of the show will either have to leave or be pushed to the background, right?

wendersfan

Oh, I agree, and I think that's the main reason why it wouldn't happen.

JasonF

Realistically, Smits winning would have the same effect -- he wouldn't bring over Bartlett's staff; he'd have his own. But if we were being realistic, at least two out of three of Toby, Josh, and C.J. would have long ago left the White House for other opportunities. It's pretty rare for high level staffers to stay for two entire administrations. They get burned out; they leave; they go work in private industry for a while; they come back in a new position. Witness Karen Hughes or Ari Fleischer, for example.

wendersfan

I could easily see Josh, Donna, and even Toby or C.J. working in a Santos White House. Josh would be a lock, and the other two/three would be within the show's bounds of realism, if not "real" realism.

JasonF

Josh? Sure. Donna? Possibly, depending on how the Santos/Russell storyline plays out. Toby? Why would he want to? C.J.? Almost certainly not, unless Santos offered her a cabinet position, which would be thoroughly unrealistic.

And there's no realistic way to keep Will or Leo around. Not that realism stops them on this show -- I mean, what the hell is Leo still doing there? He has a heart attack and resigns as Chief of Staff, so he ... decides to just hang around the White House with his old friends? What the hell is that? I mean, do you think John Ashcroft is wandering around the West Wing asking Andrew Card and Karl Rove if there's anything he can do to pitch in?

Red Dog

No way Toby nor CJ would work for Santos. CJ is the Chief of Staff. She surely would not be for Santos, so why take a downward step? Toby? I can't believe the man's head already hasn't exploded.

wendersfan

Will and Leo are out. I can see them contrive a reason to keep Toby, assuming Schiff would want to stay on. As far as CJ, I keep forgetting she's now Chief of Staff. I missed most of the early part of the season, and since they spend so little time in the White House, it's hard to remember who does what around there anymore. So you're right - there's no realistic reason to keep CJ, unless she'd be some sort of "domestic advisor".

One would assume that, if Santos gets elected, Josh becomes Chief of Staff and Donna Deputy Chief of Staff. What would Toby do, stay as Director of Communications? It's hard to fathom, but IMO they'd need at least three of the original cast to stay to keep any continuity.

wendersfan

In essence I agree. See my above post. But when looking at this seriously, who stays and who goes has more to do with the direction the producers want to take with the show, and what kinds of deals the actors want/are offered. Realism is irrelevant. If they paid Martin Sheen enough money, they could make Bartlett the new Secretary of the Treasury if they wanted to...

Legolas

Martin Sheen was only supposed to appear once a month or so in the beginning, with Rob Lowe as the star. You do the same with Alda, you could bring in a Republican actor like Tom Selleck or Kelsey Grammer to headline the show, maybe bring back Matthew Perry's character.

Of course, since Alda is playing a Republican, his fate has already been sealed on this show. Unless they do the unrealistic thing: When they were talking about potential VP candidates and Vinnick asked, "A Democrat?", could he have been referring to... Santos?

Red Dog

I don't think that is necessarily true now that John Wells runs the show; not Sorkin.

Jcheckel

Here's how I see it possibly happening with regard to Santos and some of the current regulars. Josh will obviously be part if they go with Santos. And they've set up Donna joining him a few eps ago when she met him in the episode where Santos set up the vote. I think the president will have Toby go do speech work for the campaign next year for the good of the party, much like the meeting between the two candidates in the oval office. Also I think they set up Toby joining a few episodes ago when he had the fight with Josh, to me it seems like he wasn't mad at Josh's choice of the candidate, he seemed more upset that they weren't doing it together. CJ is a little tougher, I have no idea what they'd do with her. Leo I see a few possible ways they could go with, they could make him head of the DNC or possibly something they mentioned a few years back during the last election, how about Leo as VP, he may not seem like the safe choice to win with his history, but he's got more experience in the higher levels of government than Russell (Leo may actually be over qualified for VP) and Josh and Santos have run their campaign based on the way they felt it should be run, not necessarily the best way to win, plus its not like he's got a real job at the White House now anyhow. As for Will, I was barely able to stand the character when he replaced Sam, now he's become annoying as hell and he still doesn't know why he's with the VP, he's even said he's only there hoping to see in him what the President and the others saw in him to make him VP.

About last night's ep, I thought it was one of the best since Sorkin left based on one scene. Jed and Vinick with the ice cream. I thought that scene was very Sorkinesque, it seemed like the last few years they woulda just had the scene in the Oval Office continue and made it still seem almost like a negotiation, where last night you got the feeling they actually respected each other and were just talking without one trying to convert the other.

MrX

I believe he was talking about Bruno, Ron Silver's character, being brought in.

Legolas

Okay, that makes sense now. Especially since that governor was shown next to Vinick on TV for next week's preview.

JasonF

A former Cabinet Secretary and White House Chief of Staff with a bum ticker as Vice President!?! That's thoroughly unbelievable!

Legolas

A Republican presidency wouldn't necessarily be a clean sweep. The cast in the opening credits would be ditched, but you could keep Mark Feuerstein and Kristin Chenoweth, bring back Matthew Perry, bribe back Emily Procter. And Vinick is clearly someone who would butt heads with the GOP Speaker.

sjrab16

I am a big fan of Smits and Whitford, and I was really hoping they would be the people to carry on the show. But after watching last night, I really liked Alan Alda as Vinnick. I have always been a fan of his since MASH, so hopefully they will continue Alda. And then if they could get Ainsley back, as well as some of the other Republicans they have shown in the past it would be cool.

Chew

I think Procter is still a tad busy on a much more popular (Nielson-wise) show.