"As for how Warner would justify charging U.S. consumers far more for DVDs, "I don't that's an issue," Caldwell said. "I think that historically, prices of entertainment around the world have always been different country to country.""
Nice... so the rest of the world can afford to pay more, it's not like Warner is losing any money over this? What a great business model! Poor, poor studios...
SFranke
02-25-05, 12:52 PM
Per capita income of a person living in China is $1000. $2.65 / $1000 = .265% of income
Per capita income of a person living in the US is $31,600. $20 / $31,600 = .063% of income.
.265 / .063 = 4 times as many DVDs in the can be bought by a US citizen versus a China citizen using the same percentage of income. If that weren't good enough, you don't have to live life as a slave!
Edit: I forgot a dollar sign.
Third Baseman
02-25-05, 12:54 PM
Nice!
Oh, damn.
PixyJunket
02-25-05, 12:55 PM
Plus consider them having to compete with rampart piracy. In China, piracy exists on the streets.. in the USA it exists by little children on the internet.
Playitagainsam
02-25-05, 12:57 PM
Don't give me this GDP comparison... a few years ago, I had this EXACT argument with the IFPI in Eastern Europe... you think that convinced them to institute lower prices for CDs in countries where the average monthly salary was $80? Think again. This is a clear case of "some animals are more equal than others"
ShagMan
02-25-05, 12:59 PM
I believe this comes down to competing with piracy...
You'd think they'd lower prices here, that'd help with piracy here...
oh, wait, there isn't much/any piracy here for R1 released DVD's.
There went that arguement.
SFranke
02-25-05, 01:06 PM
If you are so upset with the price difference, why not import the Chinese DVDs when they arrive? I'm sure they'll be worth every cent of that $2.65 [plus you'll get free censors and edits, courtesy of the Chinese government]. Or you could just download films off the internet, which must be okay because Warners is greedy and charges more than you are willing to spend [which cannot be a lot, considering Warners produces the highest quality discs and offers them at the lowest prices].
Playitagainsam
02-25-05, 01:09 PM
thank for the advice, evitagen.
Oh, wait, maybe you'll get banned now, since you're inviting someone to be a pirate, tssk, tssk...
Class316
02-25-05, 01:11 PM
"oh we're being unfair to some consumers" is the FIRST thing movie studios will be thinking :rolleyes:
Plus consider them having to compete with rampart piracy. In China, piracy exists on the streets.. in the USA it exists by little children on the internet.
It exists on the streets too. Just not as much.
island007
02-25-05, 01:22 PM
I don't really see the problem with this. Most corporations use discriminatory pricing since it is more profitable than uniform pricing.
ENDContra
02-25-05, 01:25 PM
So whats to stop people outside of China from importing these DVDs that are released shortly after theatrical release? (Assuming of course that the Chinese theatrical release is similar to the US release).
danyanez
02-25-05, 01:30 PM
In China, piracy exists on the streets.. in the USA it exists by little children on the internet.
Do you ever went to a chinatown near you? They also sell pirated dvds on the street.
Easy
02-25-05, 01:56 PM
So now we know that a dvd can be sold for $2.65 and the studio and (I assume) a retailer will both still make a profit. Where does that put production cost? Pennies per disc? I always knew they were making HUGE profits but that is preposterous. What I find really amusing is that some studios actually have the balls to raise the price of 2 disc sets by $10 to an all time high $40 MSRP, gouging the American consumer even more. Wasn't the monsterous profit they're already making enough? What the hell, they'll keep pushing up the price as long people keep buying them. Capitolism. Ya gotta love it.
darmok
02-25-05, 03:43 PM
dvds should be considered as luxury items, and in most countries where discretionary income is high, prices are fixed as such. don't feel too bad about the price difference; at least you don't have to deal with rampant bootlegging and the low-quality junk associated with that.
orangecrush18
02-25-05, 04:52 PM
So now we know that a dvd can be sold for $2.65 and the studio and (I assume) a retailer will both still make a profit. Where does that put production cost? Pennies per disc? I always knew they were making HUGE profits but that is preposterous.
If you were only buying little plastic disks then you would have a point, but you are buying a film stored on little plastic disks, so you don't. You also are not taking into account all of the other costs that go into the production and sale of a film.
ENDContra
02-25-05, 05:15 PM
^ I think his point was that if you assume that they are making a profit at $2.65/disc, then for the prices they are selling them at in the US they are making HUGE profits. All of the other costs one would assume were considered when Warner set the $2.65 price (although I believe the majority of the costs of the film are supposed to be recouped at the box office, not necessarily through DVD sales).
NatrlBornThrllr
02-25-05, 06:25 PM
I don't care that China is getting it for less than us. It's the fact that they're getting it for 1/10 what we pay. If Warner is capable of making a profit at $2.65, it's unjustifiable for them to charge $20 per title. I look at it the same way that I looked at Nike Shoes when their prices jumped to $150 a pair, even though they cost $10 max to manufacture, ship, stock, and so forth. It's partly my fault that I'm getting ass-raped by these companies, because I'll continue to buy their products. Conversely, you've got to admit that a 5000% mark-up is a touch ridiculous.
And don't give me the shit about them lowering prices to combat piracy. That's pretty much the equivalent of Warner rewarding these fucks for illegally copying their material. "Oh, you guys are stealing our copyrighted material? Well I know what to do about that...MEGA SALE!!!" Fuck that. If that's the way things work, everybody go out right now and buy yourself a DVD burner (Shhhh, don't get your feathers all ruffled...I was only kidding. Kinda).
-JP
Easy
02-25-05, 06:46 PM
^ I think his point was that if you assume that they are making a profit at $2.65/disc, then for the prices they are selling them at in the US they are making HUGE profits. All of the other costs one would assume were considered when Warner set the $2.65 price (although I believe the majority of the costs of the film are supposed to be recouped at the box office, not necessarily through DVD sales).
Exactly. Both the studio and retailer making a profit at $2.65 per disc while in the US a single disc has a MSRP of $30. I assume anyone not scandalized by that works for a studio.
namlook
02-25-05, 07:23 PM
This is a good thing for everyone because Chinese sellers will ebay these legit releases at great prices.
island007
02-25-05, 07:28 PM
Exactly. Both the studio and retailer making a profit at $2.65 per disc while in the US a single disc has a MSRP of $30. I assume anyone not scandalized by that works for a studio.
Then you would assume incorrectly. I've no connections with any studio.
A few things to consider the retailer in China is "the state-owned company China Audio Video" and it will START at $2.65 for a basic version.
It is doubtful that the state owned company (China Audio Video) will sell the DVDs for less the $2.65; however, most retailers in the US will sell the Warner DVDs for less than the $30 MSRP.
The studio is able to accomplish this because:
1) Product differentiation- It may be the same movie, but the product is different. This is similar to a manufacture that makes both generic and name brand cereal.
2) Difference in consumer valuation.
3) Transaction costs are reduced by using a state owned company
A corporation that uses discriminatory pricing is attempting to capture the consumer surplus that results from a uniform-price model.
NatrlBornThrllr
02-25-05, 08:14 PM
Then you would assume incorrectly. I've no connections with any studio.
A few things to consider the retailer in China is "the state-owned company China Audio Video" and it will START at $2.65 for a basic version.
It is doubtful that the state owned company (China Audio Video) will sell the DVDs for less the $2.65; however, most retailers in the US will sell the Warner DVDs for less than the $30 MSRP.
The studio is able to accomplish this because:
1) Product differentiation- It may be the same movie, but the product is different. This is similar to a manufacture that makes both generic and name brand cereal.
2) Difference in consumer valuation.
3) Transaction costs are reduced by using a state owned company
A corporation that uses discriminatory pricing is attempting to capture the consumer surplus that results from a uniform-price model.
Okay. So we all still agree that they're capable of turning a profit at $2.65 MSRP per disc. And we're all aware that they're charging us upwards of $20 a disc?
...and this doesn't send up what-the-fuck flags for every single person on this site? What in the hell kind of alternate DVD-collector's reality have I slipped into?
-JP
dtcarson
02-25-05, 08:39 PM
I have thought some dvd's have been too expensive.
I haven't bought them.
End of story.
Obviously enough people think they're worth 20, 30, 40+ bucks to keep them in business. Or they'd drop the price--wait, they do on most titles.
Companies charge what the market will bear, I got no problem with that. I think 120k is way too friggin' much for a car, but someone's keeping Hummer in business.
And, yes, while we have piracy here, it's nowhere near as much of a 'business' and a threat as it is in the East.
Squirrel God
02-25-05, 09:05 PM
So $2.65 for the barebones DVD and $3.38 for a Special Edition.
Great!
Time for us multi-region folk to start checking out some reliable retailers in mainland China to order from :thumbsup:
DVD Polizei
02-25-05, 09:19 PM
Per capita income of a person living in China is $1000. $2.65 / $1000 = .265% of income
Per capita income of a person living in the US is $31,600. $20 / $31,600 = .063% of income.
.265 / .063 = 4 times as many DVDs in the can be bought by a US citizen versus a China citizen using the same percentage of income. If that weren't good enough, you don't have to live life as a slave!
Edit: I forgot a dollar sign.
You sound like the Bush Administration claiming the economy is getting better and better by the day, and having stats to back it up. While the stats are probably correct, they are nonapplicable.
The only reason they are selling cheap DVDs over there is because China is a haven for bootlegs, and they want a piece of the profits--even if it means selling DVDs for cheap.
This should tell you something about our prices over here.
Eventually, we MIGHT see music labels and movie labels selling DVDs for $2 a piece if bootlegging in the US gets popular enough.
So you see everyone, bootlegging is a good thing. It drives down prices.
DavidH
02-25-05, 09:55 PM
You sound like the Bush Administration claiming the economy is getting better and better by the day, and having stats to back it up.
Yes, it's true the economy is getting better. More news today reinforces that. You need to put away your "Bush" hating emotions and look at facts -- hard to do for liberals though. :)
SFranke
02-25-05, 10:07 PM
You sound like the Bush Administration claiming the economy is getting better and better by the day, and having stats to back it up. While the stats are probably correct, they are nonapplicable.
Yes, because we should never have the facts and truth get in the way of a perfectly good negative emotion.
emhello
02-25-05, 10:25 PM
You sound like the Bush Administration claiming the economy is getting better and better by the day, and having stats to back it up. While the stats are probably correct, they are nonapplicable.
The only reason they are selling cheap DVDs over there is because China is a haven for bootlegs, and they want a piece of the profits--even if it means selling DVDs for cheap.
This should tell you something about our prices over here.
Eventually, we MIGHT see music labels and movie labels selling DVDs for $2 a piece if bootlegging in the US gets popular enough.
So you see everyone, bootlegging is a good thing. It drives down prices.
It's true that many US businesses have to sell things cheaper overseas for various reasons. Keep in mind that these same companies are also your employers and also part of your investment portfolio. The majority of their profits are made in the U.S., generally because this is a richer country with stricter laws. Let's think about what would happen to your way of life if all of these companies were to lower all of the U.S. prices as well. You'd be biting that hands that feed you. Many industries would collapse and unemployment would skyrocket. Those high budget movies would probably get less money to be made.
NatrlBornThrllr
02-25-05, 10:25 PM
Hahaha, yay for politics invading a thread about a greedy corporation. We all knew it'd happen sooner or later. I lost the local pool by about 3 and a half hours. You bastards couldn't have waited, could you?
-JP
Bill Needle
02-25-05, 11:15 PM
A company has every right to charge what the market will bear. In fact, it is an obligation to the stockholders (owners) to maximize profits.
The question is, would the market still bear the same pricing if it was common knowledge that the studios were selling and still making money on essentially the same DVDs by charging others 1/10th of what we pay? My guess: It wouldn't for many consumers.
Music CDs are produced for pennies on the DVD production dollar, and they still charge what, $10 - $15 for a music CD? Utterly absurd. That is why I completely stopped buying music CDs. My personal market would no longer bear it.
And the notion that we pay more because we should pay more is progressive manifesto at it's worst, and utter nonsense. We pay more because we choose to pay more. That is the free market, and is the only system history has proven to not just last, but thrive over time.
Squirrel God
02-25-05, 11:26 PM
But it's not about how much it costs to manufacture the CD or DVD and the packaging is it. You have to factor all costs into account. It costs virtually nothing to actually mass produce the disk, which is why Warner can do this. They would rather take some money from the Chinese market than no money at all, which is the current situation.
Unfortunately, what Warner seem to not be paying attention to is that this pricing will affect their other markets. In today's global economy, it's pretty hard to restrict sales to only one country, which is what is required for this to work. Multi-region DVD players and Internet retailers means that lots of folk will be importing their DVDs from China if they're up to the Warner quality for other regions in terms of picture and sound. Certainly this will be the case in Europe and Australia where multi-region players make up a massively higher proportion of DVD-player ownership than in the US. Warner could see their sales dropping in these countries as a result.
But maybe I'm being naive and they have an ace up their sleeves to counter this ...
NeonGlow
02-26-05, 01:05 AM
That's some great packaging for the price, especially Pearl Harbor.
Squirrel God
02-26-05, 01:06 AM
Those images are taking forever to load ...........
NatrlBornThrllr
02-26-05, 01:12 AM
No kidding, I had Vietnam-like flashbacks of dial-up.
-JP
Squirrel God
02-26-05, 01:16 AM
No kidding, I had Vietnam-like flashbacks of dial-up.
-JP
rotfl
ChrisHicks
02-26-05, 01:21 AM
damn, I had sex 8 times while waiting for those pics to load and man is my arm tired.
Brain Stew
02-26-05, 02:12 AM
rotfl
Only on the Internet do you get people calling a company "greedy" for not selling special edition dvds for $3.
I think you guys need to realize that in a lot of Asian countries, the piracy rate for compact discs and DVDs is somewhere around 99%. That means that the companies aren't seeing ANY revenue, let alone profit. In order to combat the inexpensive bootlegs, Warner Brothers will sell official copies at a ridiculously low price. They might lose money or make a very small profit on each copy sold, but this isn't about making money. It's about maintaining "intellectual property." Regardless of how you feel about the laws of "intellectual property" you have to agree that the official channels should be payed for their product.
Piracy may be a problem in America, but it's not really THAT big of a problem that the companies need to start wildly slashing prices to $3. I can never imagine piracy levels in America reaching 99%.
As for importing the DVDs from China, this is an awful idea. China is currently under a totalitarian regime (albeit a slowly crumbling one) and all media is censored (in the true definition of the word, by the government). Furthermore, the picture may be spotty, not up to region 1 standards, and somewhat lackluster. After all, they only need to be better than a bootleg. But, if you feel like stocking up on a bunch of movies purely because they cost $3 and not based on the quality, MORE POWER TO YOU.
Daniel L
02-26-05, 02:12 AM
So you see everyone, bootlegging is a good thing. It drives down prices.
I'm going to pretend I didn't hear that.
Brain Stew
02-26-05, 02:18 AM
I'm going to pretend I didn't hear that.
Yeah, that quote you gave makes me cringe.
Qui Gon Jim
02-26-05, 07:51 AM
No kidding, I had Vietnam-like flashbacks of dial-up.
-JP
LMFAO
I kinda see what both sides are saying. Clearly these low prices are a stab at piracy, and to be honest, it is the absolute best anti-piracy strategy there is. Value added product at low prices make no reason to buy a sub quality pirate roduct. The thing I find hypocritical is that they DON'T DO THE SAME HERE.
"Let's use a connector for our new HD DVD formats that will "block" piracy."
"But sir, that will cut out a good part of the market we're aiming for."
"Who cares, Stop little Johnny from trading XXX with his friends!"
If they just came in and sold DVDs cheaper then they would sell even more. THAT is basic economics, a concept the rich fucks running the universe just don't see.
Easy
02-26-05, 11:12 AM
This information certainly makes me view music rights issues in a new light. I love how studios butcher TV sets and replace music indiscriminately. God forbit they should pay for music rights. We know they can't afford to do that. Well, we wouldn't want them to put a small dent their grotesque profits would we?
"They can't afford the music rights for ..." Yeah, right. So much for that bullshit excuse.
Cameron
02-26-05, 07:52 PM
20 bucks isn't that bad...as opposed to 50+ for laserdisc and even more for a P&S vhs....
DVD Polizei
02-26-05, 08:08 PM
Yes, it's true the economy is getting better. More news today reinforces that. You need to put away your "Bush" hating emotions and look at facts -- hard to do for liberals though. :)
Actually, I am a Republican. And I voted Bush. And I've looked at the facts. I know, that's probably hard to understand, being a polarizer, but there are misconceptions, and some things are not all fluffy and giddy. :)
The reason this is happening with cheap DVDs: Learned helplessness of a company who can't compete with an overwhelming alternative and since the companies virtually have no market share in China, they figure they can still make a little profit.
Problem is, knowing China and their adaptive history, they will make DVDs even cheaper. :up:
If the quality is the same, I'm buying Chinese DVDs. :banana:
Buy: