I plan on getting the pannasonic AE700 projector soon, and would like to wire it up with a ceiling mount and have the wires run up into the ceiling , through the attic, and then down the wall to my components/computer on the other side of the room.
I am really hesitant to try this myself. Should i contract someone to do this? How much can i expect to pay for that? Should i just try to do it myself and learn what to do?
Has anyone done this themselves, and how did it go.?
Sonicflood
02-16-05, 12:19 AM
See this thread (http://www.dvdtalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=382017&highlight=projector)
cseyer
02-16-05, 08:37 AM
Its not the easiest thing to do, is the wall you are running down an interior wall or exterior? If its exterior it is more difficult due to the insulation. However if you have good access above in the attic then its a matter of drilling holes in the right places and skillfully using a fish tape to fish the wires down the wall the. And yes I have fished wires in walls before and I have all kinds of fun doing it but always eventually been succesful. I have used a flexible 3 ft. drill bit to get things down the wall to my basement and fish tape to get things up the wall into the attic. If you are willing you can do this it just takes time and patience.
I have no idea what you would pay an electrician/AV installer maybe a couple hundred or more?
skiblet
02-16-05, 12:45 PM
see thats what im thinking, im gonna get reamed pretty hard if i hire a professional electrician to come out and do this, when , i have some cautious optimism that i can learn to do it myself.
Unfortunately the wall has horizontal cross bracing, which is what worries me. The only way around this problem is to remove a section of the drywall and then remove a section of that cross brace. :eek:
Thats the part im worried about. Id like to hear from people that have done this -
Sonicflood
02-16-05, 05:48 PM
see thats what im thinking, im gonna get reamed pretty hard if i hire a professional electrician to come out and do this, when , i have some cautious optimism that i can learn to do it myself.
Unfortunately the wall has horizontal cross bracing, which is what worries me. The only way around this problem is to remove a section of the drywall and then remove a section of that cross brace. :eek:
Thats the part im worried about. Id like to hear from people that have done this -
Go to Home Depot and/or Lowes and buy a Greenlee flexible drill bit (3'-4' in length) Use this to drill through the horizontal cross bracing. That's what a professional will use and they'll charge you WAY more than the cost of the bit. You should expect to pay $25-$35 for the bit and about $20 for the placement tool. The end of the bit has a small hole in it to allow you to attach the wires or a wire puller such as a fish tape or fish sticks (fiberglass bendable/extendable wire puller) and bring it back through the hole just drilled. You would then connect your wire(s) to the wire puller/fish tape/fish stick and pull them through the hole. You can probably use a piece of nylon string as a a low-cost wire puller.
This way, you won't have to remove a section of the drywall, thus making the job easier and less expensive than you will run into either DIY removing/patching drywall or hiring a pro to run the wire(s) for you.
You may need a placement tool to help bend the bit as it goes in the wall. Here's what one looks like:
If you lived near me, I'd do it for you no charge. It would take me maybe 20-30 minutes from start to finish in running the wire(s).
What type & how many wire(s) are you trying to get from point A to point B?
If you have any other questions, post them & I'll try to reply quickly.
Sonic
skiblet
02-17-05, 02:01 AM
Sonic,
Thanks for your advise and encouragement. I hope i can send some additional questions to you when i start this crazy project.
Also, what do you do if the thickness of your wires is thicker than the hole in the cross brace? Like component cables for instance, they are huge-
Sonicflood
02-17-05, 08:49 AM
Sonic,
Thanks for your advise and encouragement. I hope i can send some additional questions to you when i start this crazy project.
Also, what do you do if the thickness of your wires is thicker than the hole in the cross brace? Like component cables for instance, they are huge-
You can get a larger drill bit or drill multiple holes. I've done both. If you need to contact me directly, feel free to e-mail me (criteriondvd@hotmail.com). I'm home for a couple of days due to illness and am checking my e-mail and DVD Talk via my projector ;)
Sonic
Sdallnct
02-20-05, 11:47 AM
Great post Sonicflood,
what type of face plates do you use and when? In other words at the speaker to you just have a hole? At the receiver end I will have six wires (I only have 5.1 now, but want to go ahead and wire for 6.1) coming out of the wall. What type of face plates do you use? I have looked at little at parts express, but really haven't found anything that will take 6 wires.
cseyer
02-20-05, 07:29 PM
Leviton Quickports will take 6 per face plate, however remember that you need two ports per speaker ( a + and a -) so you will want to do a double gang box and put 6 ports in each side for a total of 12. I have bought them at home depot or online at www.broadbandutopia.com.
Sonicflood
02-20-05, 08:01 PM
Great post Sonicflood,
what type of face plates do you use and when? In other words at the speaker to you just have a hole? At the receiver end I will have six wires (I only have 5.1 now, but want to go ahead and wire for 6.1) coming out of the wall. What type of face plates do you use? I have looked at little at parts express, but really haven't found anything that will take 6 wires.
cseyer is correct.
The Leviton QuickPort system is the way to go! It's what I use and it makes all the connections look neater.
Just buy 6 pair of the Binding Post Module pkgs. Here's a picture:
This would allow you to terminate 6 pairs of speaker wires behind your entertainment center, etc..
I use a lable maker to make ID lables for each connection.
Any other questions?
Sonic
EDIT: the Leviton Quickport stuff is available at Home Depot.
Sdallnct
02-26-05, 02:09 PM
Ahhh! SWEET! Somehow I missed those custom plates. I was only seeing (or not realizing what I really needed) those pre-made plates that at the most had two or three speakers.
OK, got it. Double box and two of the face plates will take car of the speakers.
I plan on running the power cord into the ceiling and plug in, in the attic.
Will run some sort of component cable and can do another box/face plate for it.
That should take care of it....
Any suggestions on the whole retro fit thing? Do these come with some sort of a template? I'm going to have to cut through a built in cabinet, so I want to get it right the 1st time.
Sonicflood
02-26-05, 02:42 PM
Ahhh! SWEET! Somehow I missed those custom plates. I was only seeing (or not realizing what I really needed) those pre-made plates that at the most had two or three speakers.
OK, got it. Double box and two of the face plates will take car of the speakers.
I plan on running the power cord into the ceiling and plug in, in the attic.
Will run some sort of component cable and can do another box/face plate for it.
That should take care of it....
Any suggestions on the whole retro fit thing? Do these come with some sort of a template? I'm going to have to cut through a built in cabinet, so I want to get it right the 1st time.
When you buy the outlet boxes (called old work boxes) they should come with a cardboard cutting template. If you don't see one attached, either look nearby for a stack of them or ask an associate to get one for you. You'll most likely see the old work boxes made by a company called Carlon. They will be blue in color and are located in the electrical section of Home Depot/Lowes.
Here's a pic:
http://cache.smarthome.com/images/25411_main.jpg
You want the old work boxes, not new work boxes! Old work boxes are for post construction (retro) work.
You can also use what's called a old work mud ring (it has no back) if you don't want/need to have a full box or have a shallow wall depth. Here's what one looks like:
http://cache.smarthome.com/images/2552_sm.jpg
There are available in the same place as the old work boxes.
Feel free to e-mail me or post here any other questions & best of luck!
Sonic
Sdallnct
03-04-05, 11:13 AM
When you buy the outlet boxes (called old work boxes) they should come with a cardboard cutting template. If you don't see one attached, either look nearby for a stack of them or ask an associate to get one for you. You'll most likely see the old work boxes made by a company called Carlon. They will be blue in color and are located in the electrical section of Home Depot/Lowes.
Here's a pic:
http://cache.smarthome.com/images/25411_main.jpg
You want the old work boxes, not new work boxes! Old work boxes are for post construction (retro) work.
You can also use what's called a old work mud ring (it has no back) if you don't want/need to have a full box or have a shallow wall depth. Here's what one looks like:
http://cache.smarthome.com/images/2552_sm.jpg
There are available in the same place as the old work boxes.
Feel free to e-mail me or post here any other questions & best of luck!
Sonic
I bought all the needed parts yesterday at HD. Hopefully get started this afternoon or this weekend. I ran into a little snag. I thought I had plenty of attic space to move around as the ceilings are only 8' in that room. However, our furnace is blocking my path. I can see where I need to go and where the wires will come up but, I physically can't get there. So I'm going to try one of two things,
1) Go check out the raceway molding they got at HD. I have 1X2 molding all the way around the room, so if there is something small from raceway, I might go that route (but that won't solve my problem of getting power and component cables to my projector). Also, I think those are pretty expensive and I'm trying to stick to a budget.
2) Go up through the ceiling as I had planned and use a fish wire guide to push a string into the attic and then HOPEFULLY push it through far enough to my furnace where I can reach it. I can then tape speaker wire to the string and pull it through. The room is about 12' across, so I'm hoping this will work. And since five of six speakers should be at ceiling height, the speakers should cover any holes.
Also, the furnance is right above the wall I was going to drop everything to go to the receiver. However, luckily, the wall is common with the garage. So I can just drop everything through the ceiling in the garage, then just go through the wall at the right spot.
So to give you an idea, the media room and garage are side by side and have 8' ceilings and attic access is in the garage. All other rooms have vaulted ceiling. However they stuck the furnance right between the garage and media room. And with duck work, wires, gas lines, etc, I cannot get around it.
Sdallnct
03-05-05, 11:19 AM
I decided to put boxes on at all spots where speaker wire will come out at the ceiling. I figured this would look good and if I had to do any fishing, the boxes would protect the drywall from getting to chewed up. I mounted all boxes yesterday (except for the projector itself, I still haven't decided where to put its wires thru the ceiling).
BTW, I used the mud rings. Since I will be fishing the wire around up in the attic I think it will be easiest to go with no backs. At HD these came in a "contractors" kit with 6 in a bag and 6 templates for like $6.00.
REL77
03-08-05, 01:53 PM
I too am in this problem where I am going to need to pass my Video wires through walls and ceilings, and have no clue how to do it
Sdallnct
03-08-05, 08:06 PM
I too am in this problem where I am going to need to pass my Video wires through walls and ceilings, and have no clue how to do it
The above mentioned Leviton system is AWESOME! I just finished installing it for my speakers. It is easy and looks very professional. My wife about $hit when she saw 6 14g speaker wires sticking out from the wall. But less then 20 minutes later, I had the Leviton face plate all hooked up. Very quality connections as well. Next to this box, I will be installing a single box for my component cables from the projector. But this system looks so good, I think I'm going to use it right at the projector as well. In other words, I was just going to run the three wire thru the ceiling, but instead I think I use a Leviton box as well and just hook the projector into it, then run a long cable to where I need to go to another Leviton box. I'm also going to replace the existing cable plate with Leviton so it will match.
BTW I used two different systems for running the speaker wire. First I used a fish tape and pushed that thru the ceiling until I could grab is with a long pole with a hook on the end up in the attic. This worke ok. But what worked even better is that I fed the speaker wire thru a 1/2" plumber PVC pipe, putting a loop at end. I then stood the pipe up and thru the hole in the ceiling. Then in the attic, I used my pole with hook to grab it. Worked like a charm.
As mentioned before, I was planning on running the wires in the walls, but due to a number of reasons, I ended up going thru the ceiling. Not quite as clean of look as I had hoped, but nice and the wife is happy (good WAF), all is good!
I'll try to post some photos in the next day or two as I appreciate everyone that helped me, so maybe it will help someone else.
Sonicflood
03-09-05, 12:35 AM
The above mentioned Leviton system is AWESOME! I just finished installing it for my speakers. It is easy and looks very professional. My wife about $hit when she saw 6 14g speaker wires sticking out from the wall. But less then 20 minutes later, I had the Leviton face plate all hooked up. Very quality connections as well. Next to this box, I will be installing a single box for my component cables from the projector. But this system looks so good, I think I'm going to use it right at the projector as well. In other words, I was just going to run the three wire thru the ceiling, but instead I think I use a Leviton box as well and just hook the projector into it, then run a long cable to where I need to go to another Leviton box. I'm also going to replace the existing cable plate with Leviton so it will match.
BTW I used two different systems for running the speaker wire. First I used a fish tape and pushed that thru the ceiling until I could grab is with a long pole with a hook on the end up in the attic. This worke ok. But what worked even better is that I fed the speaker wire thru a 1/2" plumber PVC pipe, putting a loop at end. I then stood the pipe up and thru the hole in the ceiling. Then in the attic, I used my pole with hook to grab it. Worked like a charm.
As mentioned before, I was planning on running the wires in the walls, but due to a number of reasons, I ended up going thru the ceiling. Not quite as clean of look as I had hoped, but nice and the wife is happy (good WAF), all is good!
I'll try to post some photos in the next day or two as I appreciate everyone that helped me, so maybe it will help someone else.
Congrats! :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup:
I knew you could do it!!! I hope my info was helpful. :)
Post those pics. They'll help others.
Sonic
skiblet
03-09-05, 11:41 AM
i would definately like to see more pics of your setup , sdallnct
cseyer
03-09-05, 12:18 PM
Glad the Leviton quickports worked out for you!! I used them throughout my house for phone/network/speaker/cable outlets. Very easy to work with and they look great. Another cool product they make is called the Powerjack you can power a cordless phone with this in wall plate that also takes the phone jack. Makes for a clean install with no visible cords. http://www.leviton.com/sections/prodinfo/newprod/powerjack/powerjack.htm
Sdallnct
03-09-05, 12:31 PM
Glad the Leviton quickports worked out for you!! I used them throughout my house for phone/network/speaker/cable outlets. Very easy to work with and they look great. Another cool product they make is called the Powerjack you can power a cordless phone with this in wall plate that also takes the phone jack. Makes for a clean install with no visible cords. http://www.leviton.com/sections/prodinfo/newprod/powerjack/powerjack.htm
Thanks to you and Sonicflood, everything is going smoothy. I really appreciate it.
Nice idea on the cordless phone. I'm having issues with cordless phones right now. I used 900hz so they would not interfer with my wireless network in my old house. But they were useless in our current house so up graded to 5.8 and they buzz as well. I'm thinking it could by my dishnetwork, but that is another thread I suppose.
I'll post some picks by the weekend, I promise.
Sdallnct
03-13-05, 10:48 AM
OK couple of requests for photos so I'll post some. I'm not sure what everyone was interested in so I'll just post some random and if you got questions let me know.
First however, let me thank all those that gave me input. I have never done home theater install before and really not that much even simple construction. Input here really shortened my learning curve and pointed me in the right direction.
My main goal was to have a decent system but come in under my $2,000 budget (for everything except furniture). I will meet this even when I order a new receiver. I moved into the house in June, but have been working out of town from Aug to Feb, so most of this work is recent. It is not complete as I took a couple of days off and I imagine it will never been done. I want to get up and running and then make changes, tweeks as needed.
Finally this is a free web hosting site that limited me in number of photos and size. Hopefully I compressed the photos enough....
Room before construction starts. Don't you just love the 70's fan and brown track lighting!
Pulled back carpet and built riser framing (note this is one mistake I made, I went with 2X6's and should have gone with at least 2X8's). Note cut outs for electrical so I can use them if needed.
Front speakers mounted (I'm not sure I like the CC speaker like that, but going with it for now). I also may raise of lower the mains depending on the sound and how big my screen is.
And speaker wire all in place. Note I wired for 6.1 even tho right now I only have 5.1. Figure any new receiver I get will have 6.1 and I don't want to have ro run wire again. I will eventually replace the AC and plate with white so they all match. The mud ring on the left of the speaker connections is for video which I will run today (sunday) or tomorrow.
For actually wiring I ran the wires in the attic and then down a hole in the ceiling of my garage. I wanted to run down the actual wall but my Furnace was just above the wall and I could not do that. Since taking this photo I have wrapped the wires in a plastic conduit I picked up, I will then tack up on the ceiling and down the wall so it will look ok, at least for a garage.
As I mentioned, today or tomorrow will be running video for the projector and will hopefully build the screen mid week. Once I get the screen built I'll add a photo of it. Lastly after spring break will need to paint the room.
Hope this helps those that are about to starting. I got everything (except poject/receiver/DVD player) at HD or Lowes.
Sonicflood
03-13-05, 06:54 PM
BRAVO!!! Excellent work. :thumbsup:
I always love to see a DIY project come together. There is a sense of pride in knowing that you did it yourself.
This thread should serve as an excellent "how to" guide for others.
Sonic
Sdallnct
03-13-05, 10:45 PM
BRAVO!!! Excellent work. :thumbsup:
I always love to see a DIY project come together. There is a sense of pride in knowing that you did it yourself.
This thread should serve as an excellent "how to" guide for others.
Sonic
Thanks so much, and again really appreciate your help. I worked on it this afternoon and ran four video cables (3 for component and 1 for regular video) and started cleaning up. I got to say right now I'm SO excited. I hooked up my Dishnetwork receiver and surround receiver to the projector and to speakers to make sure everything all worked ok before I started "finish work". It is AMAZING! I have not decided on the exact size of image yet, but just blasting on the wall at anywhere from 82" to 92" is impressive! The quality is far more then I expected for this size of screen and this is only SD!
They have LOR on Showtime (yet again) and I brought my wife in and she could not believe it. She really felt it was a better image then our standard 32" JVC TV! And this is with no screen! And I have yet to throw on a DVD.
And you are so correct. It feels even better to be doing it myself. Sure there are a couple of things a pro would have done quicker and better then me. But I'm learning as I go, nothing is "unchangable" so not only am I saving a ton of money, but really enjoying it as well.
skiblet
03-14-05, 12:08 PM
sdallnct, thanks for the pictures. looks like you are doing a great job on it! very nice and clean looking install. very professional-
id love to see any more pics, and especially the finished photos
Sdallnct
03-16-05, 01:34 AM
sdallnct, thanks for the pictures. looks like you are doing a great job on it! very nice and clean looking install. very professional-
id love to see any more pics, and especially the finished photos
Thanks, I'll post some more as I get farther along. I have run the wires for the projector and that came out fine. I have wraped the visible speaker wire in the media room with some plastic conduit stuff.
I had hoped to build my screen tomorrow or thursday. However, I'm having trouble with set up of my Toshiba SD-H400, and I don't want to build the screen till I have check image size on the player I will be using. If I can't get the issue resolved before thursday it will have to wait as we take our Spring Break vacation starting Friday. If I don't build the screen tomorrow, I might put up the new track lighting.
Lastly I need to paint. I plan to paint the ceiling pretty quickly and then do that walls later on. I know what general color I want, just got to get specific and do it.
Sdallnct
03-16-05, 01:27 PM
This thread should serve as an excellent "how to" guide for others.
Sonic
I agree and perhaps we need to add what tools are needed. I know my life would have been a lot tougher without the nice cordless drill my wife got me for Christmas. I was surprised that other then wire fish tape thing, everything I used was pretty standard. Drywall hand saw, couple of screwdrivers, flashlight, wire stripper, electrical tape, etc.
Numanoid
03-16-05, 09:16 PM
A couple of questions:
1) What's the riser for?
2) Why do you have your rear surrounds pointing sideways rather than forward?
Sdallnct
03-17-05, 01:41 AM
A couple of questions:
1) What's the riser for?
2) Why do you have your rear surrounds pointing sideways rather than forward?
1) so the rear row of seats is higher then the front (I plan to have two rows of seating), here is a simple example
http://www.4seating.com/images/access171.jpg
2) that is about the angle they should be (but I can change them once I get seating in there and see how things sound). This is from Dolby.com
1) so the rear row of seats is higher then the front...[/IMG]
I was going to ask the same question. For whatever reason, when I saw the picture I thought you had the riser in the *front* of the room. Now it makes perfect sense!
Sdallnct
03-17-05, 01:45 PM
I wasn't going to post any more photos till I got the screen up (which will have to wait till after spring break now) and I did some more finish work (caulk, paint, etc), however the photo above showing the mount, mud ring, electrical, etc for the projector looked so bad, thought I'd post a photo showing how it looks now. This is standing directly under the projector,
Since I only have eight foot ceilings, the projector hides the mounting I used (plumbers parts) and electrical cord pretty well. And I put the box for video close enough that I did not have to use any cables, just plugged directly in. Note that I ran components and a video line. I only need the components with my Toshiba Tivo/DVD player, but I figure I might need video to hook up a video camera, VCR, or whatever. I have the same thing mounted where my receive sits.
The yellow line in the ceiling is from where I removed the old tracking lighting and I believe I left just enough room to put new track lighting in the same place.
I just got the Yellow Mug Boxes like you have in some of your pics (the open backed ones), but I want to know what kind of faceplates/covers I can get. I didnt see any at Home Depot that fit the screw holes in the middle top and bottom of the the thing. All were to wide? Is there something I am missing, I am looking for something like you have in your pic above.. Please help... I just dont want to see the hole Plastic box... Did you have a template of the shape you needed to cut into your wall?
cseyer
03-30-05, 04:49 PM
The faceplates look like leviton quickports (Decora 4 port style) with RCA quickport connectors installed, the outer cover is a standard decora style switchplate. Both are available at Home Depot.
This is what I have now (same thing)... I just need some type of face plate, just not sure what fits since the standard light switch style covers do not fit correctly unless I am missing something
I also need to find out if there is a template anywhere for me to cut that too, i dont really want to guess and check
Sdallnct
03-30-05, 09:00 PM
I just got the Yellow Mug Boxes like you have in some of your pics (the open backed ones), but I want to know what kind of faceplates/covers I can get. I didnt see any at Home Depot that fit the screw holes in the middle top and bottom of the the thing. All were to wide? Is there something I am missing, I am looking for something like you have in your pic above.. Please help... I just dont want to see the hole Plastic box... Did you have a template of the shape you needed to cut into your wall?
The face plate in that photo is a actually a face plate I found with the phone accessories at home depot. It had a center section that I just cut out with a drywall saw. The photo you show is actually in my garage ceiling. As mentioned, I could run run the wires in the wall as my furnence sits right on the wall, so I dropped all the wire down in the garage and went thru the wall to the media room.
You are correct, most standard face plates will not work as they are designed to screw into an outlet (plug or switch) that was mounted in a mud box. The face plates I used at the speakers were just standard .49 plates that had a small hole for like coax cable. My 14g speaker wire was a little thick so I just took a drill to the face plate and make the holes a little bigger.
Sdallnct
05-18-05, 01:46 AM
OK, time for some updated photos! I was going to paint, but my wife won't let me till I finish the kitchen :(
And the required Nemo pic. Note the photo looks like the screen is off, but it is not, it is my camera (couldn't find my tripod). Also note, I really posted this to show that I took this at 12:00 noon on a bright sunny day in North Texas. I of course had they drapes closed, but while heavy they are not black out drapes or anything special. Just picked them up at Bed Bath and Beyond (well my wife did)
(looks like I compressed the Nemo pic a little to much. I looks much better "live", but you get the idea)
svadas
05-25-05, 02:34 PM
I have a basement drop ceiling. How would you suggest I handle power to a projector? I was thinking about puting a electrical outlet on the ceiling joist lumber but do not know if that would be code or not.
Dead
05-26-05, 04:10 PM
I have a basement drop ceiling. How would you suggest I handle power to a projector? I was thinking about puting a electrical outlet on the ceiling joist lumber but do not know if that would be code or not.
I don't know for certain if it's to code or not, but that's how the outlets were in the unfinished portion of our basement when we bought our house.
Spiky
05-26-05, 04:33 PM
I just ran an extension cord to my rack so it could be plugged in to the same power strip and outlet.
kvrdave
05-26-05, 06:18 PM
nice seats. Where did you get them and what did they cost?
Dead
05-26-05, 10:38 PM
nice seats. Where did you get them and what did they cost?
I don't know for certain if it's to code or not, but that's how the outlets were in the unfinished portion of our basement when we bought our house.
I think as long as there is a cover on the box and it is wired properly it will meet with code.
Sdallnct
05-28-05, 12:27 PM
I have a basement drop ceiling. How would you suggest I handle power to a projector? I was thinking about puting a electrical outlet on the ceiling joist lumber but do not know if that would be code or not.
Well I'm sure what I did was not technically code and I do planning on changing in the future but don't think there is a big problem. After running the power cord in the ceiling in the attic I simply plugged a 12' or 15" heavy duty extension cord and run it threw the ceiling in my garage and plugged it into a surge protector there.
My furnace is right there in the attic and lot of power everywhere, but no plug. When I get energetic I'll go in the attic and put in a power plug and plug in up there. But it has been nice having the power cord reachable. Here in N. Tx we have a lot of storms so I have a couple of time gone out and physically unplugged the unit.
As for your basement, I don't see why it wouldn't be code. I mean it really is no different then putting them on a wall. Just use an approved box/wiring and plug (all available at HD) and I would think it would be fine. You could just ask the dudes at HD they usually are pretty knowledgable.
Sdallnct
05-28-05, 06:13 PM
nice seats. Where did you get them and what did they cost?
eBay. $85 per seat and $30 per seat for shipping.
Got them from andypando on eBay and cannot recommend him enough. Excellent customer service. I must of e-mail 4 or 5 times before ordering and he answered promply every time. These do lean back quite a bit so I mounted the "feet" about 19" from the rear wall.
I just did a search and it doesn't look like he has any chairs up right now, but that is not unusual. Let me know if you are really interested and I'll send you his e-mail address and you can check with him on when he will have some more ready.
Sdallnct
07-15-05, 11:03 PM
Over the weekend painted the wall with my screen on it. Looks a lot better with the darker color (tho took 3 coats of paint).
Over the weekend painted the wall with my screen on it. Looks a lot better with the darker color (tho took 3 coats of paint).
...
:up:
I like that look much better... and, it help a bit with the perception of contrast for projected images. :)
Sdallnct
07-16-05, 12:41 PM
:up:
I like that look much better... and, it help a bit with the perception of contrast for projected images. :)
Yea, my wife picked the color. I about $hit when it was $40 for a gallon (I'm a cheapy)! But it did turn out well. Sherman Williams has these little "sample" bottles of paint for about $2.50 each. So we bought 2 or 3 of them and tried them all on the wall and went with this "Ruby" color, which is sort of a Ruby/wine color.
And you don't have to be nice. I know the yellow doors, trim/base suck. But all the trim work is rough ceder, like what you would see in a cabin or something. It is stained yellow (I can tell it was originally a light brown/tan). I don't want to try to paint that crap unless I have to, so I'm trying to work it in the color sceme. Since the drapes have some gold in it, I'm hoping the yellow trim will work. So far I still don't like it, but not enough to try to paint the crap.
BTW my wife did give me the ok to order the front row of seating. I took her to sit in the Berkline 088's. These are slightly narrower in the seat and a lot thinner in the arm rest, so I could get four of them in front row (probably do a love seat in the middle with seats on either side). I could only get 3 of the typical berks (099 or 090's). But, I'm just not sure if that is what I want. I like the idea of getting 4 nice seats there, but a reclining couch would be nice too (but only seat 3).
Spiky
07-16-05, 02:56 PM
You're nicer than me. The kids get the floor (front row). Which they appear to be much happier about now that the TV is 90" instead of 27.
Sdallnct
07-16-05, 09:41 PM
You're nicer than me. The kids get the floor (front row). Which they appear to be much happier about now that the TV is 90" instead of 27.
Actually the front row will likely be our main seating. My wife thinks the theater seats which will be our rear row we have now are only "OK" comfortable. She is glad we got them, but wants something more comfortable.
I'm actually a little concerned I made the screen to big. It is great on our rear row, but not sure how it will look aprox 2.5 feet closer. Will see how it looks. This was a DIY screen, I can always build another if needed.
Spiky
07-16-05, 11:56 PM
What's the width and distance? Right around 1.8x distance is just about right for me. I start moving my head/eyes to see the whole screen if I'm closer, which I don't really like. I thought I wanted mine bigger because I have a bit of room, but I'm not sure that's a good idea. If it's bigger I may not like it as much, there's a reason I always sit in the middle of movie theaters. It's the "right" spot.
Sdallnct
07-17-05, 12:47 AM
What's the width and distance? Right around 1.8x distance is just about right for me. I start moving my head/eyes to see the whole screen if I'm closer, which I don't really like. I thought I wanted mine bigger because I have a bit of room, but I'm not sure that's a good idea. If it's bigger I may not like it as much, there's a reason I always sit in the middle of movie theaters. It's the "right" spot.
The width of my screen is 82" which makes it a 94" 16:9 screen.
My front row will be just a touch over 11 feet from the screen, with the rear row will be about 14 feet from the screen.
You know, I went and looked at the calculator at projector central and they added a "recommended seating area". And guess what? For my size screen it says the recommended seating area for film/video is 10 to 15 feet. Looks like I will fall in that for both rows! As you can see from my photos, I was mainly going by screen size for what would fit between the two doors.
They also added a max light recommendation and it shows 3 fc (I assume foot candles). Will have to dig out my light meter and see what I got.
broadwayblue
07-17-05, 11:01 AM
i'm pretty sure you won't complain about the screen size being too big. my 4 month old setup has me watching a 112" diagonal screen (well actually picture as it looks so good on the wall i haven't gotten around to buying a screen) from a viewing distance of just about 12'. HD material looks amazing. SD and DVD not so much, but SD doesn't look too good at even half the size screen, and my DVD player is a 5 year old non-upconverting model. i'm planning on building a new HTPC to do double duty as DVD player and gaming rig. funny thing is i pretty much only watch HD now anyway...i don't even find myself scrolling through any other part of the channel guide. if only i could cancel everything else but the HD channels!
Sdallnct
07-17-05, 12:16 PM
i'm pretty sure you won't complain about the screen size being too big. my 4 month old setup has me watching a 112" diagonal screen (well actually picture as it looks so good on the wall i haven't gotten around to buying a screen) from a viewing distance of just about 12'. HD material looks amazing. SD and DVD not so much, but SD doesn't look too good at even half the size screen, and my DVD player is a 5 year old non-upconverting model. i'm planning on building a new HTPC to do double duty as DVD player and gaming rig. funny thing is i pretty much only watch HD now anyway...i don't even find myself scrolling through any other part of the channel guide. if only i could cancel everything else but the HD channels!
I think you are exactly right. I put our dining room chairs where my front row would go. On DVD it was very good, SD just ok.
Which PJ do you have? I'm still debating about add HD in my media room. In fact I was going to ask,
I have a couple of Dave Matthews DVD's that appear to be HD. Also I have a clip of an Eric Clapton concert that is absolutly the best image I have ever seen on my system. Is this what I can expect on getting from HD or would it be even better? I realize that HD is better then any DVD, however keep in mind my X-1 is not a HD PJ. So are these high quality DVD's about as good as it gets on the X-1 or is it even better with a true HD Source (it would be OTA)?
Dead
07-17-05, 10:57 PM
...
And you don't have to be nice. I know the yellow doors, trim/base suck. But all the trim work is rough ceder, like what you would see in a cabin or something. It is stained yellow (I can tell it was originally a light brown/tan). I don't want to try to paint that crap unless I have to, so I'm trying to work it in the color sceme. ...
In the pictures, the trim looks pretty much like a natural wood tone, which I think looks fine. :)
...I'm still debating about add HD in my media room. In fact I was going to ask, I have a couple of Dave Matthews DVD's that appear to be HD. Also I have a clip of an Eric Clapton concert that is absolutly the best image I have ever seen on my system. Is this what I can expect on getting from HD or would it be even better?
It just so happens that I brought home one of the US Digital HD boxes yesterday. After playing with it some, I think it's going back... not because it wasn't good mind you, but because it's got me wanting even more. OTA I could get about eight channels and the difference between them and the same channels on cable was amazing. Now I'm thinking I may either go with the cable company's HD package or pick up an LG box that does both OTA and QAM. Either way I expect to get more channels than the US Digital box could provide.
Football season is going to be sweet! :D
Sdallnct
07-17-05, 11:14 PM
It just so happens that I brought home one of the US Digital HD boxes yesterday. After playing with it some, I think it's going back... not because it wasn't good mind you, but because it's got me wanting even more. OTA I could get about eight channels and the difference between them and the same channels on cable was amazing. Now I'm thinking I may either go with the cable company's HD package or pick up an LG box that does both OTA and QAM. Either way I expect to get more channels than the US Digital box could provide.
Football season is going to be sweet! :D
So how did the HD image look compared to your DVD player? No doubt in my system that my DVD player is a ton better then SD TV (Dishnetwork), but I was wondering how HD would look on the X-1 compared to DVD.
Dead
07-18-05, 08:51 AM
So how did the HD image look compared to your DVD player? No doubt in my system that my DVD player is a ton better then SD TV (Dishnetwork), but I was wondering how HD would look on the X-1 compared to DVD.
To me it looked *almost* as good as DVD, but not quite. I didn't put any time into trying to optimize the image once I got it on either. So, there's the possibility that it could have actually looked the same or better than DVD after some adjustments.
Sdallnct
07-18-05, 11:43 AM
To me it looked *almost* as good as DVD, but not quite. I didn't put any time into trying to optimize the image once I got it on either. So, there's the possibility that it could have actually looked the same or better than DVD after some adjustments.
OK, thanks. Think I will see what I can get. I really don't want to pay $300 for one of those receivers, but I believe I can do better going through Dishnetwork's retention department, maybe. I suppose I could just get a 3rd party receiver since I really only want OTA. hummmm.....
Spiky
07-18-05, 11:52 AM
Check for Voom receivers on Ebay. Supposedly they can receive OTA still and people were selling them for not much. Don't know if there are still any out there, though.
I'd wait a bit if you are on the fence and are using a sat provider. They are both in a major transition period and the boxes, sats, and channels will all be fiddled with quite a bit in the coming year.
Deftones
07-18-05, 01:28 PM
So, what would be the dead cheapest I could do something like this w/ just a decent projector (that displays HDTV) and a screen?
In my new house, I have this media wall area that's a bit recessed from the main wall. I was thinking of doing a screen above my HDTV now, so I could watch movies on a bit bigger screen and occasionally watch TV. Most of my TV watching would still be on the tube, though.
Sdallnct
07-18-05, 04:05 PM
Check for Voom receivers on Ebay. Supposedly they can receive OTA still and people were selling them for not much. Don't know if there are still any out there, though.
I'd wait a bit if you are on the fence and are using a sat provider. They are both in a major transition period and the boxes, sats, and channels will all be fiddled with quite a bit in the coming year.
That is why I don't want to spend a lot and why I hope I can get a deal. You know me, I know enough to be dangerous, but it is my understanding the dish providers are switching to MPEG4 or something? So that you can get local HD channels thru the dish? But dang, I'd really like to get OTA HD at least for football this fall.
Sdallnct
07-18-05, 04:19 PM
So, what would be the dead cheapest I could do something like this w/ just a decent projector (that displays HDTV) and a screen?
In my new house, I have this media wall area that's a bit recessed from the main wall. I was thinking of doing a screen above my HDTV now, so I could watch movies on a bit bigger screen and occasionally watch TV. Most of my TV watching would still be on the tube, though.
My budget for my media room for everything EXCEPT furniture was $2,000. And I fell right into that. I have still not ordered a new HT receiver, and that will likely push me over budget. But still pretty good. I think I listed mine aprox costs somewhere, but if it helps you,
Very pleased with my PJ and Speakers. They no longer make the X-1, but you can pick it up refurbished for about $550 or so. Or you can step up to the 4805 for not much more then what I paid for my X1 (around $850-$900).
Still using my POS older Sony receiver, but it works. I do need to upgrade, but got to find a deal!!!!
Sdallnct
07-18-05, 04:30 PM
Check for Voom receivers on Ebay. Supposedly they can receive OTA still and people were selling them for not much. Don't know if there are still any out there, though.
I'd wait a bit if you are on the fence and are using a sat provider. They are both in a major transition period and the boxes, sats, and channels will all be fiddled with quite a bit in the coming year.
Hey, your right, those are pretty cheap. What do I need to know, or do you have a web site about them? For example, several listings are "new in box never activated". Will these work? Or am I just better off getting one that is used? Some are listed with "no card". Do you need a card for OTA? Thanks Spiky!
Edit: Ok, one answer down, you do need a card. It will not work without a card.
Edit 2: Ok, another question down, yes it must be and "activated card".
Deftones
07-18-05, 05:03 PM
See, I have everything else. A decent Yamaha DD/DTS receiver, HD DirecTV receiver, speakers, surround wiring in my new house, etc. I'll I'd really need is the projector, the screen, the celiing mount and the wiring.
This may be something I do down the line a bit. I'm still debating it, if I really need it. :lol:
Sdallnct
07-18-05, 05:06 PM
See, I have everything else. A decent Yamaha DD/DTS receiver, HD DirecTV receiver, speakers, surround wiring in my new house, etc. I'll I'd really need is the projector, the screen, the celiing mount and the wiring.
This may be something I do down the line a bit. I'm still debating it, if I really need it. :lol:
YES you REALLY need it. And once you go big, you won't go back!
Deftones
07-18-05, 05:18 PM
YES you REALLY need it. And once you go big, you won't go back!
Well, I have been spoiled by my dad's rig. Of course, his cost as much as I make in a year.
Marantz VP12S4 Projector
Marantz SR8400 Receiver
Marantz DV7600 DVD Player
Firehawk screen
I don't remember the brand of speakers, or the other goodies, but it's :drool: worthy. Having fully reclining leather theater seats doesn't hurt, either. ;)
Spiky
07-18-05, 06:01 PM
Sdallnct,
You already know more than me about the Voom stuff. :) I just remember reading about them as an option somewhere. AVS or HTS, most likely. DBSForums might be a spot they would discuss that, but AVS will assuredly have a discussion.
D* is moving to MPEG4. They have launched one of the 4 sats that will carry 1500 local and 150 other HD channels using MPEG4. The 2nd sat was supposed to be up already, but there were outside issues that delayed its launch. 12 cities will get some of this running before the end of 2005. This will require different hardware, although I think the latest D* receiver (non-DVR, H10 or something) is MPEG4 capable and will only require firmware upgrades to turn it on.
I'm not sure about Dish, they haven't announced anything, as usual.
So far, all sat HD receivers have been able to get local HD channels from an antenna. Assuming you have local HD channels and can receive them at your house. That's what I am doing. I picked up the HDTivo and am getting my locals in HD OTA.
Spiky
07-18-05, 06:08 PM
Deftones,
YES you REALLY need it! Note there are PJs that are HD resolution, and there are PJs that are HD-compatible. The X1 is only compatible since it is an 800x600 PJ. I'm not knocking them, esp for the price, but there is a difference.
If you have a Costco near you, check out the IF 4805+screen for $1100 or whatever it is today. This is not HD res, but is compatible. It has gotten VERY good reviews from all sorts of people and the Costco price will get you in the door pretty easily. If you want to get into real HD res, you might look for a deal on a used Sanyo Z2 or Panasonic AE500. Otherwise you are looking at over $1500, most likely.
Sdallnct
07-18-05, 10:01 PM
Sdallnct,
You already know more than me about the Voom stuff. :) I just remember reading about them as an option somewhere. AVS or HTS, most likely. DBSForums might be a spot they would discuss that, but AVS will assuredly have a discussion.
D* is moving to MPEG4. They have launched one of the 4 sats that will carry 1500 local and 150 other HD channels using MPEG4. The 2nd sat was supposed to be up already, but there were outside issues that delayed its launch. 12 cities will get some of this running before the end of 2005. This will require different hardware, although I think the latest D* receiver (non-DVR, H10 or something) is MPEG4 capable and will only require firmware upgrades to turn it on.
I'm not sure about Dish, they haven't announced anything, as usual.
So far, all sat HD receivers have been able to get local HD channels from an antenna. Assuming you have local HD channels and can receive them at your house. That's what I am doing. I picked up the HDTivo and am getting my locals in HD OTA.
I found this forum and they even have a FAQ or "sticky" on using the Voom receiver for OTA only
http://www.highdefforum.com/index.php
I GOT to call disnetwork tomorrow and see what they will do. If I add a seperate HD receiver then I will have to upgrade my HT receiver right now so I can use it as a switch box. I really don't want to run any more wires to my x1. Plus if I can get a deal on the dish HD receiver then it will make the overall system a lot easier for the family to use. Well, think I will put a couple of low bids on some of those on ebays and see if I get lucky and get a really inexpensive one.
Wow, had not heard/seen that. I did put in some low bids on some closing austions, but I was out bid quickly. Most of the Vooms are going for $50 to $60. While cheap, I also saw a true Dishnetwork HD receiver on "buy it now" for less then a $100. While I'm cheap, I also like easy. It would be easier to have a single receiver for both sat and OTA HD. If I can pick one up for only $40-$50 difference, then will probably just go Dish.
Sloth911
07-23-05, 07:11 AM
Looks very clean and nice.
I see the plumber parts attached to the ceiling, but what did you use to attach those parts to your projectors 3 mounting holes?
svadas - i just ran an extension cord for my PJ through the drop ceiling. (http://www.dvdtalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=430173)
Sdallnct
07-23-05, 08:40 AM
Looks very clean and nice.
I see the plumber parts attached to the ceiling, but what did you use to attach those parts to your projectors 3 mounting holes?
svadas - i just ran an extension cord for my PJ through the drop ceiling. (http://www.dvdtalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=430173)
I drilled holes in a piece of plexiglass and mounted that to the PJ with machine screws and bolts (the bolts allow me to level the PJ). Then I attached the plumbing parts to the plexiglass. Hummm, I think I got a photo somewhere...will get back to you....
Sloth911
07-23-05, 10:13 AM
I drilled holes in a piece of plexiglass and mounted that to the PJ with machine screws and bolts (the bolts allow me to level the PJ). Then I attached the plumbing parts to the plexiglass. Hummm, I think I got a photo somewhere...will get back to you....ok - i know what you mean - i saw the same DIY setup at AVS forum. is that where you got the idea?
Sdallnct
07-23-05, 06:42 PM
ok - i know what you mean - i saw the same DIY setup at AVS forum. is that where you got the idea?
Well I actually got it from a guy on FW, when I read a thread about an X-1 deal, but yea, I'd bet it originated on AVS. It works really well since I have low ceilings, but if I had higher ceilings (and thus need longer pipe), I might not have liked it as much (see the photo showing my CC speaker).
Sdallnct
07-23-05, 06:51 PM
Wow, had not heard/seen that. I did put in some low bids on some closing austions, but I was out bid quickly. Most of the Vooms are going for $50 to $60. While cheap, I also saw a true Dishnetwork HD receiver on "buy it now" for less then a $100. While I'm cheap, I also like easy. It would be easier to have a single receiver for both sat and OTA HD. If I can pick one up for only $40-$50 difference, then will probably just go Dish.
OK after reading folks having problems with Vooms over at AVS, think I will go the Dishnetwork way. I just got off the phone with them and here is their current deal:
$5.00 monthly rental for HD receiver
$10.00 monthly programing charge
$99 for a tech to come out and install.
I figured if I could get the receiver for $100 I'd pull the trigger. I hate paying for rental of equipment, but since the dish stuff is in such flux right now, might be smart. I ask for self install and he said not available. However, the $10.00 programing fee sucks! I ask if I could just drop that and he said no it was a package deal. I whinned a little about how I just added SBC HSI (true), and already have cell phones, local/long distance land line phone service all with them (true) and I have been getting deal offers from cable (not true and would not go back to cable anyway). He said there was a cross promotion with cell phones and them and I should call them back on monday and might get 6 months free programming thru them. So will call on Monday.
I may be making to big of a deal of it. Tho they SAY I have to have programing, but I could wait a month or two and cancel and just use OTA, but maybe not.
Sdallnct
07-24-05, 09:27 PM
It just so happens that I brought home one of the US Digital HD boxes yesterday. After playing with it some, I think it's going back... not because it wasn't good mind you, but because it's got me wanting even more. OTA I could get about eight channels and the difference between them and the same channels on cable was amazing. Now I'm thinking I may either go with the cable company's HD package or pick up an LG box that does both OTA and QAM. Either way I expect to get more channels than the US Digital box could provide.
Football season is going to be sweet! :D
OK Dead, more questions,
I see you say OTA, can you give me the specific's?
-How far away from the broadcast antenna's are you?
-Which antenna did you use?
-Did you use any sort of amplifier on it?
Next week will likely order my Dishnetwork HD Receiver. And IF I got to pay a tech to install it, I might as well have an OTA antenna set up.
I'm typical and want to mount it in the attic. I'm right at 30 miles from the broadcast antennas and they all are on the same hill. Sooo I think I SHOULD be able to make an attic antenna work. The question becomes do I get one of those typical "yogi" style antenna's and fight with the size, or try something smaller? While I usually order everything on-line, think I will buy this local so if I don't like it I can exhange in an hour instead of a week.
Yea, I've been reading a lot over at AVS and some of the other sites. I know that "bigger is better", "higher is better" and "outside is better", but only being 30 miles away and very directional, I think I can make it work. Plus if I can put it in the attic above my HT room, then it will litererally be just a 10-15 foot run to my receiver.
Spiky
07-25-05, 03:14 PM
antennaweb.org
Put in your info there to see what kind of antenna is recommended for your spot. Look at the direction of the transmission antennas and decide if the terrain will cause any problems for you, if so try bumping up to a slightly bigger or higher antenna than recommended.
At 30 miles you ought to be able to get one of the smaller antennas that can easily attach to your dish's pole. Maybe even without an amp if the terrain/buildings are not in the way.
Sdallnct
07-25-05, 04:22 PM
antennaweb.org
Put in your info there to see what kind of antenna is recommended for your spot. Look at the direction of the transmission antennas and decide if the terrain will cause any problems for you, if so try bumping up to a slightly bigger or higher antenna than recommended.
At 30 miles you ought to be able to get one of the smaller antennas that can easily attach to your dish's pole. Maybe even without an amp if the terrain/buildings are not in the way.
Yea, I have done that. I'm trying to go attic for now as the only think I got that will even show HD is my X-1, so I want it close to that room. I'm just wondering if I need to go with one of those "typical" antennas or if a square shooter or one of those would work. According to the antenna web thing, it looks like I'm at the upper end of short range and lower end of mid range. And since all antennas are on the same hill directional would be fine/best.
Course if I did add an OTA antenna to my dish, and it worked, then I would be "future proofed" for when I get a HD TV in my living room or bedroom.
Sdallnct
07-25-05, 04:35 PM
Hey Spiky,
Something I just thought of, assuming I get a Dish Network HD receiver, how would that work hooked up through my stand alone Tivo? I understand I would not be able to record in HD, but even just watching "live tv" would no longer be in HD, would it?
My kids use the Tivo a lot. I would hate to yank it out, but I could. If I got a seperate non Dish HD STB for OTA HD and hooked that in my HT Receiver with component switching, then I could still run the Dish Network SD receiver through the TV and through a HT receiver's component switching. Then could just switch between the two on the receiver???? Does that sound right? Loose to much quality? Hummm had not thought about hook up.....
Spiky
07-26-05, 10:44 AM
You wouldn't be able to run HD through the Tivo, anyway. Wrong inputs. So run the component or digital video (for HD) to the TV and the Svideo to the Tivo for recording. I don't know about Dish receivers, you'll have to check to see if they have simultaneous SD/HD output.
EX: My HDTivo receiver has simultaneous output only if you set it into 480i output. I use this occasionally to record to DVD-R.
I'm not sure why you would need another HD box, the Dish box should do OTA. If you want to record Dish channels on the Tivo, another SD box would be the best bet. Don't you already have that? But it will cost another $5/month.
Sdallnct
07-26-05, 03:25 PM
You wouldn't be able to run HD through the Tivo, anyway. Wrong inputs. So run the component or digital video (for HD) to the TV and the Svideo to the Tivo for recording. I don't know about Dish receivers, you'll have to check to see if they have simultaneous SD/HD output.
EX: My HDTivo receiver has simultaneous output only if you set it into 480i output. I use this occasionally to record to DVD-R.
I'm not sure why you would need another HD box, the Dish box should do OTA. If you want to record Dish channels on the Tivo, another SD box would be the best bet. Don't you already have that? But it will cost another $5/month.
Honestly, I don't know WHAT I want! Well not true, I really want to watch my beloved Cowboys in HD this fall, and have a huge SB party in January and watch the game in HD. While not big into TV, most every one of the few shows I like to watch is broadcast in HD (CSI, for example).
I do not care about recording in HD.
I currently have a Toshiba Tivo/Progressive Scan DVD player. I don't have to keep it in the mix, but would like to. Again not caring if I can record in HD or not.
Yes, I already have a Dish Network SD receiver. I was going to move that into another room, but wouldn't have to.
The only thing I have runing to my X-1 is component cables and a single video cable. I would prefer NOT to run any more, though I suppose I could.
Right now I have a pretty simple set up. The Dish Network SD receiver goes into my Tivo via S-video (highest quality connection on the DN receiver). Then I have the Tivo/DVD player hooked to my X-1 via components.
I need a new receiver so thought I pick one up that did component switching and then I could use that to switch between everything (well I think I would only have two sources, HD and SD w/Tivo/DVD player.).
Again, I just now started to think about hook up. So if I get a Dish Network HD box, then I need to hope it does output with component and S-video at the same time. If I get get a seperate HD receiver, then it really doesn't matter.
EDIT: After looking it does appear that the Dish Network 811 HD receiver DOES output to both component and s-video at the same time. If that is the case then I should have two sources correct:
1) Component HD
2) SD thru s-video to tivo/dvd player
However, unless I want to run more wires I need a switching box of some sort or a HT Receiver that has component switching. What do you think? And I see some of the lower end H/K have "only" 30-35 Mhz component switching, while starting with the mid range ones they have 50 Mhz component switching. Seem even the lower end Onkyo (502/503) have 50 Mhz component switching. Does it make that much of a difference?
Spiky
07-26-05, 04:40 PM
That's probably the best bet for now, with what you want. Just add the HD receiver to what you have now. With some sort of switching.
If you ever keep stuff on DVD, downrezzed HD copied to DVD-R tends to look a bit better than straight SD recorded on DVD-R. So you might prefer to record from the HD receiver at some point, even though it won't be in HD res.
Sdallnct
07-26-05, 04:43 PM
EDIT: After looking it does appear that the Dish Network 811 HD receiver DOES output to both component and s-video at the same time. If that is the case then I should have two sources correct?:
1) Component HD
2) SD thru s-video to tivo/dvd player
However, unless I want to run more wires I need a switching box of some sort or a HT Receiver that has component switching. What do you think? And I see some of the lower end H/K have "only" 30-35 Mhz component switching, while starting with the mid range ones they have 50 Mhz component switching. Seems even the lower end Onkyo (502/503) have 50 Mhz component switching. Does it make that much of a difference?
Spiky
07-26-05, 05:07 PM
I don't know. Some people say yes, others say no. I've never compared my Onkyo to anything else. In fact, I just started using it a month or 2 ago. It always claimed to be able to handle HD bandwidth, but I'm not sure of the speed rating anymore.
This was a huge discussion topic a few years ago. Some claim 35MHz is enough for HD bandwidth, others say 50, still others claim over 100 is necessary.
Sdallnct
07-26-05, 06:00 PM
I don't know. Some people say yes, others say no. I've never compared my Onkyo to anything else. In fact, I just started using it a month or 2 ago. It always claimed to be able to handle HD bandwidth, but I'm not sure of the speed rating anymore.
This was a huge discussion topic a few years ago. Some claim 35MHz is enough for HD bandwidth, others say 50, still others claim over 100 is necessary.
Which Onkyo did you get and how do you like it? You can really get those at a discount, especially the refurbished. I saw a refurb'd 502 @ ecost for like $165. But, I really love my H/K in my living room (I can't switch it is a couple of years old and does not have component switching. Plus I want 6.1)...humm I know, I know, either is a huge step above the POS Sony I got.
Spiky
07-27-05, 12:33 PM
I have the 898 from a couple years ago, current model is the 902, I think. Got a great deal since Circuit City is generally stupid. But mine, for component switching, is probably about comparable to the low end models today. Electronics is a bizarre marketplace. The only thing now where there is a distinction between Onkyo's mid-range and low-range is usually number of inputs, amp capabilities, DAC capabilities, and then a couple less-used features. Oh, and build quality....maybe.
I love it. The DACs are better than most products, although I like two of my sources better. It is 7.1, and I am finally running all 8 speakers. Here is my equipment thread (http://www.hometheaterspot.com/htsthreads/showflat.php/Cat/12/Number/711437/an/0/page/0#711437), both the HT and the thread are a work in progress. The amp rating is like most in the under-$4000 group, a pack of lies. But at least it is detailed lies, so I know how to translate. And my Klipsch speakers make the most of any amp, so it is plenty powerful at the moment. The usability is great, menus could be a bit better but no serious complaints. I'd like a few more features, but they are really only available on high end stuff: better crossover choices and tuning, stuff like that.
In the coming years I will replace this with a preamp and amp, but I'm happy enough with the 898 to start with either side and go slow. Probably used market for amps, and some spiffy new preamp with the latest technology sometime in the future. Definitely will need HDMI switching sometime soon. With this method I can buy better stuff than I can afford all at once.
Sdallnct
07-27-05, 04:43 PM
Nice looking set up. When I was in high school/early college I worked at the highest end audio store in all of Dallas/Ft Worth. I use to deliver the Klipsch Cornwalls and Cornerhorns all the time!
Sdallnct
07-30-05, 10:11 AM
Well I last night I won an auction for a Voom, got it for right at $100 shipped and it even comes with one of those small Windgard antenna's. The guy didn't have a lot of feedback which makes me a little nervous, but figured it was worth a shot. He did clearly state that it would pick up signal's "in your area" so I'm assuming it has the most current FW and will "search for channels".
http://i7.ebayimg.com/01/i/04/92/c7/8b_2.JPG
Course the bad part is I also got an e-mail yesterday and I have to go work in Florida. Should only be for a couple of weeks, but now won't be able to test it out when it comes in. Bummer...
Dead
07-30-05, 10:23 AM
OK Dead, more questions,
I see you say OTA, can you give me the specific's?
-How far away from the broadcast antenna's are you?
-Which antenna did you use?
-Did you use any sort of amplifier on it?
... I'm right at 30 miles from the broadcast antennas and they all are on the same hill. Sooo I think I SHOULD be able to make an attic antenna work. The question becomes do I get one of those typical "yogi" style antenna's and fight with the size, or try something smaller? ...
I think that Spiky already covered the most important questions, but since I finally notice this post I'll go ahead and reply.
According to AntennaWeb, I'm 15-30 miles from the stations I wanted to pick up. Since I was trying to go cheap, I went with the $25 Philips Mant410 antenna. According to the specs on the Wal-Mart website, it "Features 45db amplified tuning". The reality is that the amplification didn't seem to make much difference in my situation.
When I tried the antenna in my walk-out basement on the underground side, I could pick up from one of the transmitters. By moving the antenna to the other side of the room, I could pick up two transmitters and about five channels. By moving it into the sunroom (as far as it could go without being outside), I got three or four transmitters and about eight channels. These came in pretty well, even though the antenna was aimed directly into the dozens of trees that occupy our back yard. IIRC, this got me CBS, NBC, ABC, UPN, WB and a couple of low interest "others".
What it didn't get me was FOX, which made a big difference to me. The problem is that the FOX transmitter is on the exact opposite side of the house. I suspect that if I were willing to go to the trouble of doing an attic or outdoor install that OTA would have satisfied my every need. My personal requirements for adding HD were that it be cheap and easy though. For me, the hassle factor of spending a day in the attic or on the roof couldn't compete with the ease of contacting the cable company. So, I'll start playing with a new Comcast box next week, which I hope will do a good job of meeting all of my needs.
Sdallnct
07-30-05, 10:39 AM
Cool, thanks for the info. And that is why I'm kind of excited that the Voom box I got is coming with a small antenna. So I should be able do exactly what you did, walk around and see where I get the best signal. I hope to be able to mount in the attic just about my HT room. This will make the install quick, easy and neat.
Unlike you, for me all major stations are on the exact same hill right at 30 miles from me. Nothing really close to me to block anything, so who knows the antenna that is coming might just work. It is rated up to 50 miles.
Of course now got to find a deal on a receiver so I can use it for switching....
Spiky
07-31-05, 04:35 PM
I have that precise antenna, Sdallnct, seems to work great although I'm pretty close so I can't guarantee much with my experience. I'm at 10-12 miles so I didn't even bother with the amp.
Dead, if you get an antenna like the one he pictured it would work for you. Even though it is directional, it turns out it is actually essentially bi-directional. It can receive from both directions, 180 deg apart, because of the design. There are several like that. There are also multidirectional, but they tend to be a little pricier, IIRC.
Spiky
08-01-05, 01:11 PM
This seems a place to put it....
This weekend I got my ND 2x filter and installed it. Wonderful! My PJ has been plenty bright, but I can't just look at it and say, "that's bright enough" or "that's too bright", since I don't have the experience or eye for it. But apparently mine was too bright, because it is still bright as it can be, but the blacks are MUCH improved. Neo's coat is no longer grey. And with less wash-out there is more detail. RBE is down a bit too. I'm wondering if I can go with an 4x filter, I might try getting a 2nd 2x to add to it.
Also, somebody found the way into the service menu last week. So we discovered that our 5x color wheel is factory set by Toshiba to 4x! How's that for a kick in the head? The BenQ version is set to 5x. Mine is now set to 5x. It's actually got a 6x setting, but that doesn't seem to do anything useful as the sync gets off.
Sdallnct
08-03-05, 08:58 PM
Interesting. Does your lens accept a screw in filter or did you have to mount something in front of the lens? I don't think my X-1 would benefit from a ND filter, tho I have turned down the brightness quite a bit.
Since I have got a HD OTA receiver on the way, I have stepped up my search for a new HT Receiver so I can use it as a switch box. So far I got on my short list,
H/K AVR 135
Onkyo 503
I love the sound quality of the H/K I bought for my living room. And for whatever reason this lowest end H/K has 50 Mhz component switchting (there next few models up do not). The Onkyo has 3 component inputs which is nice, but not really sure I need three, so I'm leaning towards the H/K.
Spiky
08-04-05, 01:18 PM
It doesn't seem to be a standard threading on the lens like a photo lens would have, but I am able to screw the filter to it. I've been playing with the service menu and the filter, trying to figure out what looks best. I just sat there watching with one eye for awhile, checking each scene with and without the filter like an optometrist. Definitely like the blacks with the filter, and it doesn't harm the other colors.
The X1 isn't the brightest, but not the dimmest either. If you have turned bright down quite a bit, you may easily be able to do such a filter.
Another thing that I will most likely try is a color correcting filter. The red is weak in the Toshiba and always has far higher gain settings, so adding a red filter has eased calibration and improved contrast for those that have tested it. A german company called Cine4home.de does some amazing reviews of many PJs, including recommending color filters for each model. They did the 4805, but I don't see one for the X1.
HK makes great amps, that is the best reason to look at their receivers. Onkyos are back to being halfway decent at the low end, like they were 20 years ago. I'll bet the HK sounds better, but the Onkyo is easier to use and better looking, although that is VERY subjective. Audio quality would be most important in my book.
Sdallnct
08-04-05, 06:19 PM
Audio quality would be most important in my book.
:thumbsup: Exactly. I know this lowest end H/K lacks some features and has limited inputs (and some would say limited power, it won't be a problem in my smallish media room). But I'm so impressed with the sound quality of the H/K I got for the living room (a very low end discountinued model), I'm really leaning towards the H/K. And I have the exact same speakers in both my media room and living room, so there is no reason to think it wouldn't work well with those speakers.
Sdallnct
08-06-05, 02:17 PM
Well settled on the H/K and got it on the way (well probably be shipped early next week).
I'm happy it has the 50 MHz component switching and is 6.1 (I already have the 6th speaker up). Sure even tho I know it is a "powerful" real world 40 watts, do wish it had a little more power. But, the H/K I have in the living room is "only" 40 watts and gets plenty loud in a huge room (roughly 40' X 25 X 10) and much more power then a POS Sony I had rated at 100 watts. So I don't think I will have any issues in my smallish media room (15 X 12 X 8). I could have moved up to the mid-level H/K but would have been about $400 to $500 more and didn't want to totally blow my budget. So this will, hopefully be good.
Spiky
08-06-05, 11:35 PM
Yeah, the HK is probably correctly measured at 40 wpc. If the Sony were comparably measured it would probably come in at 15 wpc or something. Very similar to how they rate horsepower in cars, the method changes the result.
Sdallnct
08-15-05, 05:30 PM
Back home...and playing a little,
I did a quick test of the Voom HD receiver and just plugging in the antenna and setting it on the floor near my sliding glass door got me two of the four channels I'm mainly interested in! So went to Lowes and got some hardware to mount the antenna in the attic. Even tho the antenna came with a mounting pole I picked up a very short one (well plumbing pipe that should work just as well) as I plan to mount the antenna upside down from the ridge beam. This way will be out of my way and as high as I can get it in the attic. I hope to mount it just above my furnace as this way it won't be bumping my head into it.
That was a pretty darn good picture! I was able to watch the rest of the golf tourny on with the HD signal. Very nice and if all the channels are that clear, I will be very happy with the $100 I spent to get it!
More later as I get farther along.
Sdallnct
08-20-05, 10:15 PM
OK, some updates,
My Voom box for HD is working pretty darn good. I'm still tweaking the antenna direction but mounting it in the attic got me about 12 or so HD channel including 3 of the 4 majors. I'm not getting my Fox affiliate. I can get a strong signal, but it won't lock on. I'm working on it. However, very pleased with the picture, sometime I think it is very close to my DVD player and some channels on some shows maybe a touch better! Course that may say more about my DVD player then the HD Receiver! Even tho right now I cannot do a direct comparison, I can easily tell the HD is a ton better then Dishnetwork SD.
I have partially hooked up my H/K receiver. I ordered some more component cables and optical cables so I could do it right, so right now it is just running audio. The sound is very good. Much, much better then the POS Sony I had. Much fuller sound, more depth and no tinny sound. Power wise, it is fine. I don't think my speakers could handle any more and it really is great for movies. I love it and glad I got the H/K.
Soon as the component cables come in I will check out the component switching and see how that goes. Then I just need to figure out how to get Fox and I will be set!
Sdallnct
09-03-05, 01:10 PM
I ordered a 2nd Voom box off ebay based on research that the FW version might make a difference. I bought a cheap one as it had no remote, cords but had the last FW. It works AWESOME. Now pick up all major channels.
I also finished hooking up the H/K using the component switching. I'm sure there is some signal difference (loss), but I sure can't see it. The H/K really is an awesome sounding unit. Very impressed.
Of course I just got off a conference call and will have to leave town for shortly which means I will miss the first week of NFL football :(. Got everything up and running and now will have to leave :(. Ah well.
Spiky
09-04-05, 10:59 PM
That sucks. Football's the whole reason for all this, right?
Sdallnct
11-15-05, 12:10 AM
Update,
Was home last weekend and our new couches for the living room were coming, so I moved our old one into the media room.
I took the 3" feet off the couch to get it through the doors and decided to leave the feet off. This with the 2X6 riser joists, 3/4" plywood, 2" board holding my rear theater chairs gives me an about an effective 10" riser. It is not hard to get up or down on the couch. The screen does seem a touch high, but I didn't have much chance really enjoy and try it.
The space between the theater chairs and couch is about perfect. No waisted space but plenty of room to walk and plenty of room for your feet when you sit in the theater chairs.
I'm going to remove to rope lighting an add a small step light or something since the couch covers most of the lights anyway and it looks a little silly.
With the couch I'm exactly 11' from my screen while the rear row is right at 15'. At 11 feet I thought I was a little close for SD TV (Dish), but it is awesome for HD or DVD.
My wife gave the go ahead for four Berkline recliners for the front row, but I just can't decide exactly what I want for the front row (the love seat you see the side is not staying). Not so much the money as it is to decide what will work best for the room. So I might live with the couch for a while. Maybe through the Superbowl and see how it works out.
Spiky
11-15-05, 10:45 AM
Nice. Berklines would be nice too. That's my problem, haven't finished the room, yet. Are you sure you can fit 4 across? They get pretty wide.
Sdallnct
11-15-05, 06:32 PM
Nice. Berklines would be nice too. That's my problem, haven't finished the room, yet. Are you sure you can fit 4 across? They get pretty wide.
Yup, I can pretty easily do the 088's with a love seat in the middle and single chairs on either side. The 088's are slightly narrower then the more popular 090's and also have a lot thinner arm rest.
Well if you haven't finished the room, you might want to pick chairs before you finish. That was my problem, I finished just about everything including the riser, then tried to find the seating to fit. I wish I had bought the seating 1st and that would have helped with riser height, how to build the riser, how deep, how big of a screen, where to mount the PJ on the ceiling, where to put my components, etc, etc. Seems in the end, almost everything centers around where and how you will be sitting.
Spiky
11-16-05, 11:35 AM
I've got a dual-chair/loveseat thingy like 2 Berkliners would be. That part is ok, I just need to clean up and finish wiring and whatnot. I've got most of it done, but haven't worked on it in awhile.
Buy: