Why are collections built on horror and international movies?

[Daytona24]

I am just curious (and dont want to be blasted for this), but since I have been around the boards for a couple weeks now I noticed that alot of people really hype having alot of horror movies and international stuff in collections. Why is this? I am not saying anything wrong or bad about I am just wondering.

I myself dont much enjoy foreign films and most of my horror is mainstream stuff to go along with what I will admit is a mostly mainstream collection. Although I do enjoy collecting mostly films that I either really thought were cool or have significance in the film history.

So why all the horror and just what is attracting about international films?

And again please dont blast me, its just a question.

[PopcornTreeCt]

I don't get the horror. Horror movies are the lowest form of movies. But people like them. As for international movies, well a lot of them happen to be pretty good. I don't think there are too many collections built only on horror or foreign films or both. Its mostly a mix.

[Obey The D]

Originally posted by PopcornTreeCt
I don't get the horror. Horror movies are the lowest form of movies.

With an opinion like that, I'd be suprised if you didn't work for Paramount. ;) It's just like any other genre of film, some are crap, some are good.

[Austin54]

I collect almost everything - mainstream, sf, international, etc. It depends on what my mood is. As for horror, I tend to watch it when I am brain dead from the stress in my job (For example having to deal with an idiot who has a foot fetish who molested two teenagers in the library) When I get home these films are about all I can take
Austin
PS the police are still looking for him

[asianxcore]

It's all personal preference. You buy movies you like, you buy genres you like, simple as that.

[nemein]

I ran out of domestic things I was interested in so I started branching out to foreign (esp HK/Chinese) cinema...

[Holly E. Ordway]

They're both areas where a collection is likely to be somewhat distinctive, once you get beyond the well-known titles. And if you have a distinctive collection, in whatever genre, you're more likely to talk about it than if you have a more mainstream, or less focused, collection.

[Richard Malloy]

I guess I'm one of those DVD Talkers straddling the arthouse and the grindhouse. The only movies I truly despise are of the formulaic mainstream variety. Surprise me. Shock me. Show me something I haven't see before.

Familiarity breeds contempt. And boredom.

[SFranke]

Originally posted by Daytona24
So why all the horror and just what is attracting about international films?

I don't know what the deal with horror is. Most of the horror I've seen is trash.

As for what is attractive about international films, ask yourself what is attractive about American films. You might respond by saying there is nothing inherently attractive about American films, but there are some truly outstanding films that come from the USA. The same is true for films made outside the USA. An interest in foreign films is an indication that one has a true appreciation of cinema, because these films typically need to be sought out and discovered.

[Dazed]

The same could be said of why people have lots of comedy or sci fi. Its just people tastes. I personally have lots of sci fi and not many horror

[Groucho]

99% of everything is crap. Therefore 99% of [your favorite genre here] is crap.

[flyboy]

An interest in foreign films is an indication that one has a true appreciation of cinema, because these films typically need to be sought out and discovered.

Well said...........


Fifteen years ago you would not catch me watching a movie with subtitles....I sure found out what I was missing.

My advice, go to Roger Eberts Top 100 films and look them over...its a starting point to many wonderful foreign and domestic films...who knows you may just find something that you love! :)

http://www.suntimes.com/ebert/greatmovies/

[Yakuza Bengoshi]

Originally posted by Daytona24
I myself dont much enjoy foreign films

Could you elaborate on what you don't enjoy about "foreign films." Do you not like reading subtitles, or is it that you don't feel that you can relate to any stories set outside the United States, or something else?

[sracer]

Originally posted by Daytona24
I am just curious (and dont want to be blasted for this), but since I have been around the boards for a couple weeks now I noticed that alot of people really hype having alot of horror movies and international stuff in collections. Why is this? I am not saying anything wrong or bad about I am just wondering.

I myself dont much enjoy foreign films and most of my horror is mainstream stuff to go along with what I will admit is a mostly mainstream collection. Although I do enjoy collecting mostly films that I either really thought were cool or have significance in the film history.

There'ya go! A big reason for having a DVD collection in the first place is to have those niche films at your disposal. Most horror and foreign films are NOT mainstream. Films like "Burial Ground" and "Inferno" not going to easily be found to rent.

Also, horror and foreign films often times have a lot of atmosphere. They (the good ones anyways) pay special attention to set the tone and mood. Each one (again, the good ones) have a "personality" that is unique.

In contrast, you can take any Adam Sandler/Ben Stiller movie and they are pretty much interchangeable.

What I have difficulty understanding is why people collect mainstream titles that are readily available for rent at every Hollywood Video and Blockbuster.

[cultshock]

I guess I'm one of those DVD Talkers straddling the arthouse and the grindhouse. The only movies I truly despise are of the formulaic mainstream variety.

:up: A large portion of my collection would be at home in arthouse or grindhouse theatres.

In my younger days, I used to be just an average mainstream film watcher. Just something to do to kill a couple hours, like the majority of the population. When I started to get interested in horror, foreign, cult, etc. films, I started to become a film lover, films started to interest me on a different level instead of just being a casual diversion. I suddenly became interested in the actual people involved in front of and behind the camera. I started noticing certain film styles, homages, construction, etc., in other words, I started actually watching films. I became interested in the art form itself. Anyway, its the non mainstream stuff that caused this interest, and these are the films I want to own and watch (and perhaps analyse) over and over again. Mainstream films? Nah, usually once is enough (sometimes more than enough), and I don't feel the need to own them.

[Mike Lowrey]

Originally posted by Yakuza Bengoshi
Could you elaborate on what you don't enjoy about "foreign films." Do you not like reading subtitles, or is it that you don't feel that you can relate to any stories set outside the United States, or something else?

For me, it's a little of both. The only real foreign films that I am interested in are generally WWII films. For example, Das Boot and Stalingrad. I can tolerate subtitles if they're from a German/Russian source. But I despise French. (Which is why I always watch the English-dubbed version of Brotherhood of the Wolf.)

And as for relating to stories outside the US, that is a big part of it too. Quite frankly, I don't get the European lifestyle. If anything, I understand the oriental lifestyle more and will watch a Far East film before I watch a European one. Maybe it's that the European urban state is so different than anything in the States. By that I mean, the tight and narrow streets, and the clumped together buildings. But I also know, through personal contact, that Europeans really don't know much about American life either. One strange but obvious thing is the difference in our driving habits. In America, we drive everywhere and often. In Europe, they seem to rely more on mass transit and therefore they criticize American use of fossil fuels. (My personal contact was a far left-wing Parisian.)

I'm not a real big fan of general drama of which I find of alot of, shall we say, non-mainstream, film.

Also, I don't own a single comedy DVD. I used to somewhat like comedy when I was younger, but in my middle-age years, comedy does nothing for me. In fact, I find most comedy just silly.

Horror? Now that's a genre I too don't have much interest in either. The only horror films I own are basically the Alien and Predator films.


My favorite genres are sci-fi/fantasy, action blockbusters (including comic book hero stuff), historical epics (including war movies), and Westerns. My animation interest is generally with the new stuff, mainly CGI shows, ie. Beast Wars/Machines, Roughnecks, Shadow Raiders: War Planets. I don't hardly care at all for anime.

[chente]

I have very little horror in my collection. I plan on adding more but it isn't a genre that really interests me much. I like old campy stuff, ghost stories and other psychological movies but don't usually enjoy slasher films.

I don't consider "foreign" to be a genre. My dvds of foreign films are comprised of many different genres. I love Chinese action, french dramas, some Italian horror, Japanese samurai, and gritty Mexican films. I also love hollywood classics, american crime films and super hero movies. I'm also starting to explore silent film. It is a mistake to get hung up about where a movie is made. There are well made, interesting films made all over the world. Why be content with the formulaic american movie scene where it is rare to green light a movie that isn't part of a franchise, a remake or a sequel? The world is your oyster.

Some are turned off by subtitles, but they don't bother me. I've gotten so used to them that I actually sometimes turn them on during english movie, which is a language that I completely understand.

[ThatGuamGuy]

Originally posted by evitagen
I don't know what the deal with horror is. Most of the horror I've seen is trash.
...
An interest in foreign films is an indication that one has a true appreciation of cinema, because these films typically need to be sought out and discovered.

Anybody else see a bit of a contradiction in those two statements? I'd say -- and, judging by most of the pro-horror responses here, I'm not alone -- that great horror films typically need to be sought out and discovered more than great foreign films; I could make a blanket statement like "people who like foreign films tend to list largely the same directors (Bergman, Tarkovsky, Kurosawa, Ozu, Antonioni, de Sica, etc. [I left Fellini off because he's almost mainstream, comparitively])", but, fact is, it'd be evidence more of my own limitations than those of the fans of the genre in question.

And, hey, let's not forget ... some foreign films *are* horror films! But I guess you have to seek those out and discover ... that they're trash. Right?

99% of everything is crap. Therefore 99% of [your favorite genre here] is crap.

God bless you, Groucho. Except that my favorite genre is crappy films.

[texasgator]

My horror collection began one Halloween when I tried to rent some horror flicks at the local Hollywood video -- there was nothing left of any value. After that, I started collecting horror movies and each Halloween (or week of Halloween), I tend to watch plenty of horror movies to make Halloween all the more special -- and now I always have plenty to choose from.

[Richard Malloy]

And as for relating to stories outside the US, that is a big part of it too. Quite frankly, I don't get the European lifestyle. If anything, I understand the oriental lifestyle more and will watch a Far East film before I watch a European one. Maybe it's that the European urban state is so different than anything in the States. By that I mean, the tight and narrow streets, and the clumped together buildings. But I also know, through personal contact, that Europeans really don't know much about American life either. One strange but obvious thing is the difference in our driving habits. In America, we drive everywhere and often. In Europe, they seem to rely more on mass transit and therefore they criticize American use of fossil fuels.
WTF? So, just plain ol' zenophobia and provincialism?

I live in Boston, and your description of Europe sounds a lot like home to me. Also sounds like NY, SF, Philly, to name a few. You ought to get off the plantation sometime. Expand your mind. Broaden your horizons. Or not.

[MahatmaPetey]

Originally posted by sracer


What I have difficulty understanding is why people collect mainstream titles that are readily available for rent at every Hollywood Video and Blockbuster.

Because some people like to watch movies more than once. Even if they are mainstream.

[gutwrencher]

I knew it was about time, once again, to defend the library and my taste in film. since thats getting old and very boring...I'll pass this time. judging someone on the taste they have...and the collection they have....is a waste of time. as far as horror....take a look at my library contents. but be warned...you will choke yerself on all the horror. but at the same time...my library is also very well-rounded and pound for pound....a great selection based on MY tastes....not the dude next door. I see many collections with nothing but mindless comedy, but why ask why? go for whatever you want and I promise I'll care less. UNLESS....you share a similar taste to mine.:D



What I have difficulty understanding is why people collect mainstream titles that are readily available for rent at every Hollywood Video and Blockbuster.

I cant believe this is being asked again. I guess people just are not into building personal libraries any longer. what a freakin' shame.

[Der Zorn Gottes]

There's no good reason not to have an international DVD collection, unless you don't take movies seriously. Most of the great Hollywood and otherwise American classics of the past thirty years, even, were either directed by foreign directors, or heavily influenced by a mixture of foreign and American movies.

[shill66]

Some people would say I have a LOT of horror movies.
Others would say I DON'T have too many horror movies.

Why? Because a majority of my horror titles are pre-1970s, and a lot of people don't consider that horror movies existed before 1973.

[onebyone]

Originally posted by Obey The D
With an opinion like that, I'd be suprised if you didn't work for Paramount. ;) It's just like any other genre of film, some are crap, some are good.

Good one. :)

Now if you will excuse me, I got horror movies to watch.

[wendersfan]

I'm not much of a horror guy. I liked Se7en, if that counts.

I buy a lot of foreign films, one, because I like 'em. I love Wenders (obviously), Renoir, Godard, Wong Kar-Wai, etc., more than any American directors save Hawks and Ford. I also buy them because they are less likely to be stocked in rental places, so it makes more sense to buy them, rather than sometjing I can more readily rent.

[Josh-da-man]

Horror movies are "cult" movies, so you'll find a lot of people who happen to collect them. The same thing could apply to international titles as well, or Criterions, or old movies.

It stands to reason that people who are into cult movies would tend to have big collections that they're proud of, so they tend to show them off more.

Also, when you get out of the mainstream, these movies can be hard to come by in rental places and the like, so that could also be reason you have people having large personal libraries of them. So if I ever get the urge to watch "Galaxy Quest" or something, chances are I can rent it at the video store.

[Walter Neff]

I think people who own tons and tons of one genre of movie (horror, for example) tend to be fetishists -- movie fetishists, which is not as bad as some other types of fetishists, to be sure, but fetishists none the less. Just as they fetishize one type of movie, they also fetishize their collections, meaning they are more likely than some others to put their collections into Web-based DVD databases and put links to their database in their DVD Talk signatures.

In my case, I have all kinds of DVDs, including many foreign films (although they're far outnumbered by U.S. movies) and some horror movies (leaning more toward classic horror/thriller/monster movies than more recent slasher films though). But I don't have my DVDs in a database, and therefore don't have a link to it here. I like my DVDs -- I wouldn't have them if I didn't -- but don't fetishize them. And I'm just thinking that I'm not alone. There are probably others on this board who have more wide-ranging collections, but don't put their DVDs into a database.

[TomOpus]

You have a fetish about not fetishizing :p :)

[FatTony]

It's so people can have collections full of films that most of their friends/family have never heard of and feel proud of that fact and feel like a bigger film geek than everyone they know. It's an ego thing. ;)

[DickS]

More so each year, I find foreign language films refreshing. The majority of imports from Iran, Russia, (well.. just about every outside country) are even today demonstrating a relatively small reliance on flashy, staccato cutting (often the result of bad directing and editing and an effort to appeal to the short attention spans of the lowest common denominator), over-reliance on "adult" language (often the signature of a witless and unimaginative screenwriter), and CGI augmentation; instead they tend to be more character-driven and thoughtful. There are of course exceptions, but most of the contemporary foreign films I have seen in theaters, or rented or bought on dvd during the past few years have been able to reflect 21st century values and with 21st century plotlines with wit and intelligence without seeming like they were intended strictly for morons. I am truly and passionately a movie aficionado but have little use for 95% of what Hollywood churns out these days. Thank God for the films of other countries. Yes, I am sure many crappy films are made in every other country and just not necessarily made available to us in the U.S., but that suits me fine, too.

[DVD Smurf]

[list=1]
I love good scare...
Many blockbusters usually lack depth...
Directors creativity shines throw and not the company's or producers intention to make money on a formula...
Great directors...
Less predictable...
DVDTalkers are avid film viewers...
Like to tell others how inclined we are in cinema... :)
Too many remakes from Hollywood...
We can buy DVDs from different regions...
Expand our horizons...
Fellini
Kurosawa
Bergman
Herzog
Egoyan
Kiarostami
Majidi
von Trier
Almodóvar
Haneke
Tarkovsky
Kieslowski
Moodysson
Kitano
Takahata
Kar-wai
Visconti
Bresson
Renoir
De Sica
Lang
Tornatore
Clouzot
Miyazaki
Lee
Zhang
Tran
and many other small reasons...
[/list=1]

[Zodiac_Speaking]

My collection is largely based on cult films (from all genres), horror, scifi, and exploitation films (from all genres), with little mainstream titles to boot (like superhero films or Mystic River).
My reason is that I love those genres. I usually see 3-5 movies at the theare of month, so I see a lot of everything, but ultimately, for example this year, there's hardly much I'm going to purchase. Why? Nothing really excites me that warrants a purchase. Majority of these neweer (or mainstream) movies will soon be shown a million times on HBO, TBS, TNT, ect. so why bother buying them.
Nobody has the balls to show The Crazies uncut or on TV, let alone stuff like Uzumaki, I Drink Your Blood, Nosferatu (well, sometimes on TCM), or whatever.
You can't really sneer at what someone likes or doesn't like. My friend has a ton of comedy movies on DVD, I don't, but I'm not going to fault him for it. I buy the films I know I will rewatch enough to warrant a purchase, whether its I Spit on Your Grave: ME or Spiderman 2. Mostly, mainstream films (except of small few) don't have the balls to show or comment on issues that horror, cult, or exploitation does.

[renaldow]

:lol: at a lot of the pretentious crap that's been flung around in this thread.

My library is mainly horror and foreign films. Oddly enough, foreign isn't really a genre, foreigners happen to make all kinds of movies, and many of these foreigners actually speak English and make their movies in English. Strange and hard to believe, I know.

I don't think anyone needs to defend their tastes or spending habits, which it seems some people are doing. It comes down to basic supply and demand. Most horror and foreign films are not readily available to rent as many have stated. More people are willing to make a blind buy on horror and foriegn movies as it might be their only chance to see them. Many times these are films that are widely written about and reviewed, so they build up a lot of interest. When one is finally released on DVD, it's a big deal.

What gets posted about is really only the 'big' foreign and horror releases, most others go unnoticed. Just like the majority of the posts about upcoming US movies are mainly about the most anticipated releases. I can see how it might seem overwhelming when people are talking about movies you've never heard of, and confusing when they're something you have no interest in. I've been there. Only with me it was major postings on movies like Gladiator.

I think you already know the answer to your original question, which is: Because people like horror and international movies. I think your real question is: Why do people like horror and international movies? The only answer that works is 'because we all have different tastes.' Not satisfying, I know.

The thing is, someone will go to explore these films, get all the wrong ones and end up thinking 'what a load of crap!' and they'd be right. Not everything horror or international is good. What Groucho said is basically true. Unfortunately you sometimes have to sit through a few lame ducks to find something you connect with, and when you do it's like a whole new world of film has opened up to you.

[DRG]

Originally posted by renaldow
:lol: at a lot of the pretentious crap that's been flung around in this thread.

I think you already know the answer to your original question, which is: Because people like horror and international movies. I think your real question is: Why do people like horror and international movies? The only answer that works is 'because we all have different tastes.' Not satisfying, I know.

:up:

[eXcentris]

Originally posted by renaldow
I think you already know the answer to your original question, which is: Because people like horror and international movies. I think your real question is: Why do people like horror and international movies? The only answer that works is 'because we all have different tastes.' Not satisfying, I know.



Not satisfying at all. :) So, I would change that answer to:

You can only develop taste if you keep an open mind and that means venturing into unchartered territory which often involves having to suffer thru a lot of duds before you can find the real gems. Taste takes effort, taste is a conquest.

[renaldow]

Originally posted by eXcentris
Not satisfying at all. :) So, I would change that answer to:

You can only develop taste if you keep an open mind and that means venturing into unchartered territory which often involves having to suffer thru a lot of duds before you can find the real gems. Taste takes effort, taste is a conquest.

That's a good way to put it.

You can also think of it this way: Junk food is made to appeal to almost everyone. It's hard not to like Doritos and Ho-Ho's. But if you want to expand your palate and start trying German food, you're going to eat a lot of strange things that taste bad until you find something you like, or get accustomed to the taste of German food. Movies, books, anything else that hinges on likes/dislikes is the same way.

[Rubix]

i think horror movies are the best when you are a kid. that's when they can actually scare you and you won't notice or care about some of the really crappy acting or poorly written dialogue or plot holes.

ironically kids are ones who are prevented from seeing them and most adults don't enjoy them that much.

i watched tons of horror movies as a kid and i really loved them. i have a box of all the oldest fangoria issues somewhere from the early 90's.

[shill66]

Oldest Fangoria issues from the early 90s? You should mean the late 70s.

[steelpotato]

"i think horror movies are the best when you are a kid. that's when they can actually scare you and you won't notice or care about some of the really crappy acting or poorly written dialogue or plot holes"
You want to be 'scared'? 2 movies: Audition, Haute Tension

[DVD-ho78(DTS)]

Originally posted by jonpeters
Majority of these neweer (or mainstream) movies will soon be shown a million times on HBO, TBS, TNT, ect. so why bother buying them.

This has been answered already for you in this thread:

http://www.dvdtalk.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=374276&perpage=25&highlight=million&pagenumber=3

majorjoe23: "Because they're edited, full of commercials and not in widescreen."

Originally posted by steelpotato
You want to be 'scared'? 2 movies: Audition, Haute Tension

I wasn't aware of Haute Tension getting a Region 1 release. Audition isn't anamorphic which means a great deal to some of us with widescreen TVs. Have a couple other recommendations for some good, scary, foreign horror films that are anamorphic? Please nothing like The Eye because that was awful.

[steelpotato]

No not really if you're just talking about region 1 ;)

[Rubix]

shill66: i just phrased it poorly. i didn't know they had fangoria back then though. did they start over with the numbering sometime after though?

[flyboy]

Originally posted by Rubix
i think horror movies are the best when you are a kid. that's when they can actually scare you and you won't notice or care about some of the really crappy acting or poorly written dialogue or plot holes.

ironically kids are ones who are prevented from seeing them and most adults don't enjoy them that much.

i watched tons of horror movies as a kid and i really loved them. i have a box of all the oldest fangoria issues somewhere from the early 90's.

Fangoria was big in the 70's...and not just the late 70's but the early and Mid 70's as well.....I know...I use to buy em :)

I agree with one poster...gore does not equal scary.....I have not seen a scary movie since the Shining....not one.

[steelpotato]

Yes, I agree - the TV version of the Shining was the most terrifying film of the last 10 years ;)

[Jeff McKay]

Originally posted by flyboy
Fangoria was big in the 70's...and not just the late 70's but the early and Mid 70's as well.....I know...I use to buy em :)



The first issue of Fangoria came out in 1979.

[steelpotato]

lol pwned

[demonio]

I like horror movies......thats why I buy them!

[logboy]

people do really underestimate horror as a genre. if you watch hollywood horror movies (for the most part) you probably will think horror is trash : as far as i am concerned i cant think of any other genre that has such variety and depth to it ... and horror is alot more intelligent that alot of people will credit it for... and i agree with the comment that alot of hollywood is inspired by or made by foregin directors... that comment really caught me out - its a fine observation... when you start to broaden what you watch to foregin films you realise how much is being pilfered / stolen from foreign films without you reaslising it. a good example : "halloween" - often regarded as one of the classic american horror films, the "ground-breaking" style : its copied straight from italian horror and carpenter admits as much (i think he saw "suspiria" the year before)... but most americans would not have a clue things like this have and do happen...

[QuiGonJosh]

I love Horror movies and own quite a few...most of the foreign "art" films are pure pretentious crappola...sans Kurosawa...

[QuiGonJosh]

Originally posted by logboy
people do really underestimate horror as a genre. if you watch hollywood horror movies (for the most part) you probably will think horror is trash : as far as i am concerned i cant think of any other genre that has such variety and depth to it ... and horror is alot more intelligent that alot of people will credit it for... and i agree with the comment that alot of hollywood is inspired by or made by foregin directors... that comment really caught me out - its a fine observation... when you start to broaden what you watch to foregin films you realise how much is being pilfered / stolen from foreign films without you reaslising it. a good example : "halloween" - often regarded as one of the classic american horror films, the "ground-breaking" style : its copied straight from italian horror and carpenter admits as much (i think he saw "suspiria" the year before)... but most americans would not have a clue things like this have and do happen...

*Applause*

[sracer]

Originally posted by Yakuza Bengoshi
Then I presume you must either (1) not consider anime a "genre" or (2) not be familar with the variety and depth of anime.
I consider it a genre, and I've seen the supposed "depth"... sorry but IMO, it's just not "there".

[Yakuza Bengoshi]

Originally posted by sracer
I consider it a genre, and I've seen the supposed "depth"...

I highly doubt you have, speedracer.

[cactusoly]

I've been a horror fan since even before High School. As with any genre there is both great horror and crap. I think a lot the horror genre walks that line very tight (there is a fine line between genius and stupidity) Also, even a bad horror film can be enjoyable. About half my collection is horror.

[Adrenaline]

After going through endless hordes of Horror movies last year, the only Horror that I consider must have is The Thing (Carpenter version) and the Evil Dead Trilogy.

[slop101]

There's good and bad in every genre. If it's a genre we like more than others we'll excuse a lot more.

For example, my favorite genre would be of the pulp/crime/noir variety. Now, there's a lot of good to great films that cover these genres. But since I like the milieu of these genres so much, I can still enjoy the bad examples of these types of films - I'll see it as a glass partly full, instead of mostly empty. But only for these genres. I won't be able to excuse as much when watching other types of films - for example, I only really like the really good horror films, and can't excuse as much. But a true horror fan can sit through the worst horror film and still come away with something they like.

I also want to address this "foreign films as a genre" thing: Foreign films are as much a "genre" as films in color are.

[logboy]

Originally posted by Yakuza Bengoshi
Then I presume you must either (1) not consider anime a "genre" or (2) not be familar with the variety and depth of anime.

i'm very familiar with anime as a "genre" : been watching it for more than 20 years. i still stand by what i said : horror has more variety and depth. alot of anime is incredibly derivative... there are very few (i could count them on one hand) that are substantial and as visionary in their style as much of european horror is...

i dont think anime can be called a "genre" as such. it has lots of genres (including horror to some extent)... romance, sport, samurai, sci-fi, etc etc... theyre all genres, and theyre all in anime (and much more) but i have never seen as many anime series that approach the depth of lots of japanese live-action films. there are some : rourouni kenshin, fist of the north star, the satoshi kon movies... akira, and so many other well know anime films / series... watch a kiyoshi kurosawa film and tell me a anime series or film that compares to that kind of mind-blowing sophistication...

remember : anime is simply a term for japanese animation - and animation is nothing but a method of production.

[Damage]

Whether it's kung fu movies from 1970s Hong Kong or European zombie movies, "spaghetti" westerns or Hammer horrors, genre films are my alternative to mainstream cinema.

Lately, Hollywood has been creatively bankrupt. Once in a while, something slips through that's really different and exciting but most of the time it's something that appeals to the vast majority that's beyond capturing my interest. I hope that doesn't make me come across as an snob... I'm not. It's just that over the past few years I've become so bored with the Hollywood formula that regular movies just don't cut it for me most of the time. You can't deny the widespread popularity of the Scream movies, for example, but they hold no interest at all for me personally. Why watch Meet the Parents when I could pop in Tetsuo: The Iron Man? It's my choice, that's all. Mainstream flicks aren't necessarily bad movies, they're just usually not for me.

Recently at work, we were discussing movies we watched over the weekend. I was laughed at when I mentioned watching The Curse of Frankenstein. "Why would you watch something like that?!" Well, because they don't make movies like that anymore. The sets, the costumes, the music, the atmosphere... It's all so very different. And it's all good. (To me.)

And my disinterest in mainstream films is not a slam on US cimema. There have been some excellent independent titles coming out of North America as well as Europe and Asia. In movies, as in music, the "indies" will save us all! (Watch FUBAR (http://www.amazon.ca/exec/obidos/ASIN/B00006RJ9T/qid=1093202301/sr=1-1/ref=sr_1_2_1/702-1417050-0908062) and just give'r!)

[SFranke]

Originally posted by ThatGuamGuy
Anybody else see a bit of a contradiction in those two statements?

No. I said most of the horror films that I've seen are trash. I never said all horror films are trash, or that horror is trash by definition. Most of the horror films I've viewed have not been rewarding, so I do not seek out horror films to view.

[logboy]

some people have an odd understanding of the concept of enjoying "trash" ... theres a difference between "crap film" and "trashy film" ... i like trash too... doesnt mean i dont understand quality ... perhaps exactly the opposite infact.

[Yakuza Bengoshi]

Originally posted by logboy
i'm very familiar with anime as a "genre" : been watching it for more than 20 years. i still stand by what i said : horror has more variety and depth. alot of anime is incredibly derivative... there are very few (i could count them on one hand) that are substantial and as visionary in their style as much of european horror is...

Most everything is derivative. Horror, anime, what have you.

i dont think anime can be called a "genre" as such. it has lots of genres (including horror to some extent)... romance, sport, samurai, sci-fi, etc etc... theyre all genres, and theyre all in anime (and much more)

I agree with you, more or less.


but i have never seen as many anime series that approach the depth of lots of japanese live-action films. there are some : rourouni kenshin, fist of the north star, the satoshi kon movies... akira, and so many other well know anime films / series... watch a kiyoshi kurosawa film and tell me a anime series or film that compares to that kind of mind-blowing sophistication...

I think Serial Experiments Lain and Perfect Blue both measure well against the work of Kiyoshi Kurosawa. Have you seen them?

remember : anime is simply a term for japanese animation - and animation is nothing but a method of production.

Okay, I'll try to remember that.

[logboy]

I think Serial Experiments Lain and Perfect Blue both measure well against the work of Kiyoshi Kurosawa. Have you seen them?


i have seen all of satoshi kons films so far... "perfect blue" is a nice film, yes its similar to kurosawas stuff - ambiguous, deceptive, intricate; but i dont think its as substantial. and like many, there are very few reasons why "perfect blue" should be animated : cost, maybe... and i am glad that people who largely watch anime and not live-action stuff see things like this... "lain" is ok : though i found it contrived to a large extent.

i am glad you seem to have seen kiyoshi kurosawas work too... cool.

[sracer]

Originally posted by Yakuza Bengoshi
I highly doubt you have, speedracer.
rotfl

[jdpatri]

Originally posted by Richard Malloy
WTF? So, just plain ol' zenophobia and provincialism?

I live in Boston, and your description of Europe sounds a lot like home to me. Also sounds like NY, SF, Philly, to name a few. You ought to get off the plantation sometime. Expand your mind. Broaden your horizons. Or not.

I was just going to add a similar sentiment. I live in Boston (Cambridge actually). Trust me - those narrow streets... they're right here. Coffee-house, pseudo-intellectual, cigarette sniffin, pub attending, half-day working stereotypes.... we got those too.

Also, does a film like the Bourne Identity, Ronin, etc... those set in Europe also turn you off? Or is it more the pacing? To me the distinct pacing of European films - particularly Italian and French - has grown more appealing as mainstream Hollywood tries harder to disassociate itself from the notion of significant narratives.

[Sunday Morning]

Originally posted by PopcornTreeCt
I don't get the horror. Horror movies are the lowest form of movies. But people like them.

Get down off that lifeguard chair. Someone needs to burn the wood!


People have all kids of tastes. Embrace your own. Films are a great way to do that since there are so many different kinds. That is except for the ones they make nowadays in hollywood :)

[Shroud]

I guess I am one of the very few who actually enjoy horror movies. They make up a good percentage of the dvds that I buy. My main reason for liking horror movies is that if they are done right, they have the best surround sound.
I have a nice Mid-Fi setup with B&W DM600 series speakers with dual SVS subs and a good horror movie will give my subs and speakers a workout. From footsteps in the corner sneaking up on you (The Others) from bass shaking the whole house (The Haunting DTS) I really enjoy scary movies that are done right.
Foreign horror movies are even better, as most of them don't have to rely on huge special effects to make a story interesting, they go back to the basics and use sound to make things scarey (Darkness, Thesis, Los Sin Nombre).
And with foreign films sometimes the orginal movie is superior to the American remake such as Abre Los Ojos to Vanilla Sky. The story was so much better in Abre Los Ojos however I would have to give Vanilla Sky credit for better acting and special effects.
It all depends on what you like but some foreign movies have topics that are uneasy to the American Public such as Incest and Self Multilation that is found in the movie "Oldboy" to children killing each other as a game in "Battle Royale".

[logboy]

Originally posted by Shroud

And with foreign films sometimes the orginal movie is superior to the American remake such as Abre Los Ojos to Vanilla Sky. The story was so much better in Abre Los Ojos however I would have to give Vanilla Sky credit for better acting and special effects.

...thats one of the most appealing and yet destructive parts of american cinema over the last 25 years or so : you end up watching great production values... theyre very tempting to watch and i do like em : so i go to the cinema to watch those kinds of film when one comes along i like the look of... but buying films : well, theyre expensive, and so i like to buy stories more than production values on the whole.

[logboy]

Originally posted by Shroud

And with foreign films sometimes the orginal movie is superior to the American remake such as Abre Los Ojos to Vanilla Sky. The story was so much better in Abre Los Ojos however I would have to give Vanilla Sky credit for better acting and special effects.

...thats one of the most appealing and yet destructive parts of american cinema over the last 25 years or so : you end up watching great production values... theyre very tempting to watch and i do like em : so i go to the cinema to watch those kinds of film when one comes along i like the look of... but buying films : well, theyre expensive, and so i like to buy stories more than production values on the whole.

[gutwrencher]

Originally posted by Shroud
I guess I am one of the very few who actually enjoy horror movies.

maybe here at this forum-wink-. go to one of the many horror-based boards and you, like me, will drown on horror information.:D

even I'm a little shocked that I'm buying over 12 horror related titles tomorrow....usually it's just around 5 a week.:p

[renaldow]

Originally posted by PopcornTreeCt
I don't get the horror. Horror movies are the lowest form of movies. But people like them.

I'm still :rotfl: on that statement. Either you had a highly pretentious film school teacher or you have a misinformed view of filmmaking and film history. In reality, for years Comedies were thought to be the lowest form of movies; they didn't add anything to filmmaking and were usually made quickly and cheaply. Still are, for the most part.

Horror on the other hand, has contributed greatly to filmmaking in general; whether you're talking about sound, cinematography or of course special effects (and everything in between.) Go take a film 101 class and one of the first movies you are going to see is Nosferatu. Take a class on modern film and chances are you are going to watch Psycho and Alien. Go to film school and you'll be watching more horror than comedies.

[logboy]

good point renaldow ... i imagine alot of film school teachers are informing students of the obvious great american (and potentially japanese) filmmakers... not necessarily informing or inspiring them enough that they find out the sources of those people inspiration... obvious or otherwise...