Reported at Drudge, and it's Axl, so take it at face value.

FLASH: Guns n Roses will release the long awaited 'Chinese Democracy' album on Labor Day... Developing...

I'm not a GnR fan. Don't own any of their music. But, does anyone know if Tommy Stinson (from the Replacements) was involved with the recording or did he just perform live with them?

To me Guns N Roses was Axl, Slash, and Duff. Without those three it's just an Axl Rose solo record.

Originally posted by atlantamoi
I'm not a GnR fan. Don't own any of their music. But, does anyone know if Tommy Stinson (from the Replacements) was involved with the recording or did he just perform live with them?

Here is what I found (and Stinson is mentioned as being part
of the lineup). Although it really is not the 'real' GnR, I am a
fan of The Replacements and would love to see what he is
up to now.


Guns n Roses Chinese Democracy has a release date again

Guns 'n' Roses "Chinese Democracy" has been rescheduled for release September 2, almost three years after the original release date.

Axl Rose has recorded over 70 songs for this record with various producers. In February, he fired producer Roy Thomas Baker who had been brought in to replace Sean Beaven.

It is unsure who will have credits on this version of the record, if it actually comes out. Rose recently commented on the record saying "we're in the studio doing this album and I can promise you that we're gonna deliver and it's gonna be out of the ballpark. We've been working on this album and I can tell you we're doing our best and that's all I can promise".

The Guns 'n' Roses lineup for the record is Axl Rose (vocals), Robin Finck (guitar), Buckethead (guitar), Chris Pittman (keyboards), Tommy Stinson (bass), Dizzy Reed (keyboards) and Brain (drums).

The band performed in Las Vegas last December and debuted a number of songs expected to be on the album. They were Oh My God; Madagascar; Chinese Democracy; The Blues and Silk Worms.

To date, the only song that has been officially released is "Oh My God" which featured on the 1999 movie soundtrack to "End of Days."

Guns 'n' Roses have been confirmed for the Carling Festival in England in August. Unconfirmed reports also have them scheduled for China and Japan early August.

By Paul Cashmere

I'll believe it when I have it in my hands...for now though, I'll just stick with uh, what I already have "accquired" from this album...

Does anyone care anymore?

Rather than Axl screwing around with a bunch of disposable musicians, wouldn't it make more sense to get the old band back together? Axl, Slash, Izzy, Duff, and Steven (providing he's up to it)?

As good as "Appetite for Destruction" was, and the "Use Your Illusion" albums weren't bad despite Axl's increasing rock-star pretensions, it's really kid of sad to have watched this band -- that was on top of the world in the late 80s and early 90s -- fall to pieces.

Providing he's up to it?

Axl's pretty much the reason the other guys left the band in the first place.

Here's an interesting question:

How much original music has "Guns N' Roses" released since Izzy Stradlin left the band in late 1991?

Give you guys a few moments to think about that one. . .

Originally posted by Josh-da-man
Does anyone care anymore?

Not I. Guns was my favorite band at one time. GNR will never be GNR without Slash, Duff, Izzy & Axl.

Rather than Axl screwing around with a bunch of disposable musicians, wouldn't it make more sense to get the old band back together? Axl, Slash, Izzy, Duff, and Steven (providing he's up to it)?

Okay, I gotta pipe in here. When I first heard "Sweet Child O' Mine" back in '87 I thought it was a decent song. Ever since then I've thought this band mostly blew chunks. That "November Rain" song solidified my feelings this band wasn't my style at all. The only reason I happen to be in the least bit interested about this new recording is because of one of the "disposable" musicians.

...but Dizzy Reed is still there... there's a Use Your Illusion & Spaghetti Incident veteran!! ;)

Spaghetti Incedent :yack:

GNR was (and is) one of my favorite bands, but this won't be GNR.

I may 'buy' it anyway, but I expect to be dissapointed. (is that possible!?!)

Originally posted by Virex
Providing he's up to it?

Axl's pretty much the reason the other guys left the band in the first place.


Actually, the "he" I was referring to was Steven Adler. He's had some pretty serious medical problems since he was kicked out GnR.

I'll beleive it when I see it.

Originally posted by Josh-da-man


Actually, the "he" I was referring to was Steven Adler. He's had some pretty serious medical problems since he was kicked out GnR.

I always thought it was drug problems that got him kicked?, which I always thought was the most silly thing. Im sure the rest of the gang was nice and sober at that time :)

Wow...didn't realize Buckethead was playing guitar on the album. That cat is pretty wild. Praxis and Zillatron with Bootsy Collins and Buckethead was some crazy sh|t.

Originally posted by palebluedot
Bootsy Collins and Buckethead was some crazy sh|t. http://www.bucketheadland.com/bucketheadscoop/snoopandbootsyeddie.jpg

I d/l two tracks from the new GNR album, and they were truly awful - I deleted them because there is no chance of me ever wanting to hear them again.

I always thought it was drug problems that got him kicked?

It was the drug problems that got him kicked out of the band, but I remember seeing him on some tabloid-news show a few years back, talking about the medical problems he had throughout most of the nineties. Haven't seen or heard anything from him since--I don't even know if he's still in music anymore.

Former GUNS N' ROSES star MATT SORUM is laughing at former bandmate AXL ROSE's
efforts to release new album CHINESE DEMOCRACY - because he thinks the project
will be awful.
Rose has been promising the new album for years, but drummer Sorum urges rock
fans not to expect a classic if the project ever hits record stores.
Sorum, who has formed hot new group VELVET REVOLVER with his ex-bandmates
DUFF McKAGAN and SLASH, says, "We put this band together and started an album
two weeks later. It's not f***ing brain surgery.
"It's verse, chorus, guitar solo, verse, chorus, and you're done.
"I don't know what he's f***ing doing over there but I hope it's a 72-piece
classically composed masterpiece."
(KL/RV/TN)

rotfl

OwNd!!! :lol:

Actually, this proves that Matt Sorum is an idiot. Yes, its so easy to make a rock album. Which is why there is so much shit out there in stores and the majority of them sound alike. This doesn't give me much hope about the VR album coming out. If they slapped it together like that then the VR album will be forgotten in about a month. Also, that single on the Hulk soundtrack sucked.

Uh I believe he was taking the piss out of Axl. I'd lay odds on the VR being infinitely more listenable, enjoyable and in the spirit of the original G n R than the Industrial schlock Chinese Democracy someday becomes.

I think the reason we haven't seen "Chinese Democracy" released is because Axl Rose crawled up his own ass about ten years ago.

Originally posted by Josh-da-man
I think the reason we haven't seen "Chinese Democracy" released is because Axl Rose crawled up his own ass about ten years ago.

Is that what happened to his eyebrows?

Matt Sorum, one of the biggest whores talking crap :lol: This guy would take a job with Tito Jackson if it paid. Although I do agree that it is not brain surgery.

Originally posted by Lara Means
Actually, this proves that Matt Sorum is an idiot. Yes, its so easy to make a rock album. Which is why there is so much shit out there in stores and the majority of them sound alike. This doesn't give me much hope about the VR album coming out. If they slapped it together like that then the VR album will be forgotten in about a month. Also, that single on the Hulk soundtrack sucked.

:thumbsup::thumbsup:

OwNed!

Originally posted by Lara Means
Actually, this proves that Matt Sorum is an idiot.

Well he IS a drummer!

But he did have some very valid points.

The amount of time it's taking to put this out is ridiculous. I gave up 5 years ago.

Originally posted by Lara Means
Actually, this proves that Matt Sorum is an idiot. Yes, its so easy to make a rock album. Which is why there is so much shit out there in stores and the majority of them sound alike. This doesn't give me much hope about the VR album coming out. If they slapped it together like that then the VR album will be forgotten in about a month. Also, that single on the Hulk soundtrack sucked.

Yeah, but that doesn't mean he's wrong about Chinese Democracy.

:lol:

definitely
http://tim.movementarian.com/archives/own3d.gif


Still a shame that The Offspring weren't able to call their latest album "Chinese Democracy".

Originally posted by Lara Means
Actually, this proves that Matt Sorum is an idiot. Yes, its so easy to make a rock album. Which is why there is so much shit out there in stores and the majority of them sound alike. This doesn't give me much hope about the VR album coming out. If they slapped it together like that then the VR album will be forgotten in about a month. Also, that single on the Hulk soundtrack sucked.

Well said....

They spent a year or two making Use Your Illusion I & II. Metallica spent the better part of a year and a half on the Black Album, which I think almost every major artist can possibly say. So if Axl want to spend a decade or two to put out what may be his final masterpiece, who are we and Sorum to say he can't?

Awesome. Matt :up:

if i heard right, on the behind the music special of guns n roses, they mentioned that chinese democracy by axl rose is tentavly scheduled for a november 2004 release.

I'll believe it when I'm actually holding a copy in my hands. He's been tweaking it for a few years now. It'll never be as perfect as he apparently wants it. Some people will hate it no matter what, so just release the damn thing, Axl!! I'm speaking directly to him because I know he comes to these boards :lol:

hahaha does anyone actually care anymore?

at least the 2nd half of GNR are being productive, and making (mediocre) music.

Axl doesn't want to release mediocre music, and for that reason I still have respect for him. He could have released shitty albums of generic hard rock, basically what Slash wanted to do (listen to his solo stuff), just rehash the last album over and over, but instead he wanted to go in a different direction. It may not sound like Appetite-era GnR, but even the original lineup could probably never recapture that, so I'm still interested in the new music he's making. I'm 22 and still have hope it will come out before I croak :D

You're being very silly & gullible if you actually believe this.

How many times have they announced a release date for this over the past 10 years?

Chinese Democracy and The Last Dangerous Visions will both be released on the same day.

I was a huge Guns fan, but I'll admit the only thing that's got me interested in this is the fact this fool has been working on it for 10 years. Other than that, I don't really care, unless the original members get together again. Seperately they have been unable to create the chemistry that resulted in one of the greatest records ever made.

Ya right,10 years and counting and im still waiting to poo on it.

Tapeworm will be released before this POS is. I.E. NEVER!

If this does come out, do you guys think it will show up high on the charts?

I bet it would debut at #1 or 2 depending on what else`was new.

Because Appetite for Destruction was so good, I think anticipation would grow heavily in the month or so leading up to it, regardless of the fact that the Spaghetti Incident was crap.

Yeah it would be #1. Spaghetti Incident was a covers album. It would have a huge first week or two. Then who knows.

Since Buckethead is out of GnR now, does this mean Axl has to re-record the entire album with someone else's guitar riffs?

Originally posted by Lara Means
Since Buckethead is out of GnR now, does this mean Axl has to re-record the entire album with someone else's guitar riffs?

If Buckethead's guitar tracks aren't used, it will most likely be Axl himself playing guitar on the album. Apparently, he's been taking lessons so he can play guitar.

It might have something to do with the way he tends to drive guitarists (and pretty much everyone else who plays with him) away.

label this news under "who cares anymore"

Guns N Roses are dead, he should rename the band

I think The Axl Rose Band would suffice.

I loved them in their heyday, but he needs to put out some songs, that songwriting talent should be there.

If there ever was a reason to download something before purchasing it, the new GnR record would be it.

I too won't believe it until I am actually holding a copy in my hands.

I'll stick with Velvet Revolver, thank you. FWIW, I think VR have a great, solid rock album. For me, GNR isn't even a band anymore, it's simply become a revolving door for musicians that think they can stomach being in the same room with Axl for more that 10 minutes. Axl may have rights to the GNR name, but to me it doesn't mean very much.

I think this will be the musical equivalent of Star Wars: Episode I: The Phantom Menace. It will make money, no doubt. The hype will be tremendous when it is actually released. But it is guaranteed to disappoint.

I gave up thinking this might be released about 5 years ago. I use to do a lot of club promotion here in the Hollywood area about 5 years ago. I talked to alot of people who knew about the recording process. Supposively, one of the sound engineers I talked to told me the band would show up late at night with a bunch of girls and just drink and party in the studio. They had this really expensive studio locked down for a year and had about 10 minutes of music recorded. If they really had something done and was ready for mixing, it would of leaked by know after all these years. We'd all be downloading it on Kazaa or something if there was an album in the wings. The only things showing up on Kazaa claiming to be new stuff was demos for Appetite for Destruction because I've had those demos since '87. 10 years is just way too long to keep something so hush so the only reason there is nothing leeking out is because there really is nothing to begin with. I doubt they have more than a couple of songs recorded by now.

He should really rename the band as it's essentially going to be an Axl Rose solo album, don't tarnish the good name of GnR. Anyone thinking it's really going to be the next "GnR" record is just fooling themselves. GnR wasn't Axl alone, even though he became a control freak in the end.
It's like Mick Jagger making an album with a bunch of studio musicians and calling it a Rolling Stones album or Robert Plant/Led Zep or Steve Tyler/Aerosmith.

If the song they did for "End Of Days" is any indication of the quality of their new work, then I am not looking forward to this album. They would have to seriously impress me to have this wait be worthwhile.

:confused:

Wow, dead thread walking :lol:

Well I did say take it at face value.

Found this on another message board:

As reported earlier, Slash was interviewed on Philadelphia's WMMR radio station recently and he mentioned Chinese Democracy. Here's a transcript of the mention:
---

Slash: Axl's got got a record coming out, Guns I guess you call it, I think in March.

Which is sorta cool, you know it's gonna be interesting to hear it. After all this time and after all this talk what's going on with him.

DJ: So wait, Chinese Democracy is gonna come out?
Slash: Yeah, it's coming out in March...

DJ: OK..
Slash: That's what... I've been told a lot of things over the years, but it definitely sounds like it's coming out in March.

DJ: We've been waiting forever.
Slash: Which means Velvet Revolver probably in March, April, May. Will be coming out somewhere around that time. It'll be interesting.

DJ: Yeah, I was gonna say your record will probably come out first.
Slash: No, no... Yeah, well. All things considered, it could. That could happen, but... Judging by, I think Axl's record is finished.

---

You can download the Podcast at gmppodcast.com.

More information about the WMMR Podcasts at wmmr.com.

Sounds like Slash is back on smack.

That a complete lie. IF it was true, where are all the promo copies? It's only 2 months away! The record label should have a ton of promo copies sent out to the radio stations, magazines & newspapers. Especially magazines so that by the time the issues hits the stands, the record will be out.

I'm not sure that it is always necessary to send out promo copies months in advance. These days that is asking for leaks and, if this album is about to be released, the publicity arising from its history is probably worth more than the advance opinions of reviewers. There is a fair chance it won't be anything special, won't be worth all the money spent on it and any canny executive would think that the fewer people who are aware of this beforehand the better.... just my two pennies.

I must admit that I wouldn't buy anything issued by Rose as I think that he is a waster and utterly disrespectful of his fans as evidenced by his numerous no-shows over the years. Again, all IMNSHO.

That a complete lie. IF it was true, where are all the promo copies? It's only 2 months away! The record label should have a ton of promo copies sent out to the radio stations, magazines & newspapers. Especially magazines so that by the time the issues hits the stands, the record will be out.

Two months is a little early for promo copies. MAYBE the debut single, but not the album.

I must admit that I wouldn't buy anything issued by Rose as I think that he is a waster and utterly disrespectful of his fans as evidenced by his numerous no-shows over the years. Again, all IMNSHO.

Same here. As far as I am concerned, Axl does not Guns and Roses make. Velvet Revolver, with Slash and Duff, is more GNR than Axl will ever be.

I'll buy Axl's record, out of morbid curiousity alone, but VR is where it's at for old school GN'R fans. I'd love nothing more than for both albums to come out on the same day, and for VR's to stomp all over Axl's, sales-wise.

Virex - does VR have a sophmore effort ready to go? If so, can't wait. Axl has become a sideshow attraction, more interested in generating press about a record that (most likely) will never surface. Slash and the boys, meanwhile, are at least making music, which is what the whole thing is supposed to be about.

Don't know; I'm only going off the article I quoted in post #56. Just (briefly) checked VR's site, which hasn't been updated in a while, and didn't see anything on the new album there.

Still bet we'll see it before Chinese Democracy, though. ;)

Agreed. And it'll be better than anything that Axl puts his name on nowadays. Very strange situation. I can't imagine how many copies of it he'd have to sell to get out of debt to various recording contracts, etc. that he's buried himself in the past several years. Don't the current estimates put the cost of this at around $13 million dollars so far?

From the thread fascinating article about "Chinese Democracy" (http://forum.dvdtalk.com/showthread.php?t=412993):

March 6, 2005
The Most Expensive Album Never Made
By JEFF LEEDS

WEST HOLLYWOOD, Calif.

IN the faint red light of the Rainbow Bar and Grill, Tom Zutaut sips at his drink and spills a bit of regret. It's been 19 years since he signed the then-unknown rock band Guns N' Roses to a contract with Geffen Records, where they turned into multiplatinum superstars. Back in those days, the Rainbow was their hangout of choice.

Years after he left the label, he returned in 2001 to try to coax Axl Rose, the band's magnetic leader and by then its only original member, into completing one of the most highly anticipated albums in the industry: an opus tentatively titled "Chinese Democacy." The deadline for turning in the album had passed two years earlier.

"I really thought I could get him to deliver the record," said Mr. Zutaut, who spent nine months trying. "And we got close."

He is speaking in relative terms. Mr. Zutaut is but one of a long series of executives and producers brought in over the years to try to conjure up the maddeningly elusive album - to cajole the reclusive rock star into composing, singing, recording, even just showing up. Like everyone else who had tried, or has tried since, Mr. Zutaut came away empty-handed.

Mr. Rose began work on the album in 1994, recording in fits and starts with an ever-changing roster of musicians, marching through at least three recording studios, four producers and a decade of music business turmoil. The singer, whose management said he could not be reached for comment for this article, went through turmoil of his own during that period, battling lawsuits and personal demons, retreating from the limelight only to be followed by gossip about his rumored interest in plastic surgery and "past-life regression" therapy.

Along the way, he has racked up more than $13 million in production costs, according to Geffen documents, ranking his unfinished masterpiece as probably the most expensive recording never released. As the production has dragged on, it has revealed one of the music industry's basic weaknesses: the more record companies rely on proven stars like Mr. Rose, the less it can control them.

It's a story that applies to the creation of almost every major album. But in the case of "Chinese Democracy," it has a stark ending: the singer who cast himself as a master of predatory Hollywood in the hit song "Welcome to the Jungle" has come to be known instead as the keeper of the industry's most notorious white elephant.

AT THE STROKE of midnight on Sept. 17, 1991, Guns N' Roses was the biggest band in the world. Hundreds of record stores had stayed open late or re-opened in order to cash in on the first sales that night of "Use Your Illusion," Vols. 1 and 2, the band's new twin albums. On the strength of that promotion - and the coattails of the band's blockbuster 1987 debut - the band set a record: for the first time in rock history, two albums from one act opened at Nos. 1 and 2 on Billboards national album sales chart. But by 1994 their fortunes had changed. After years of drug addiction, lyric controversies, onstage tantrums and occasional fan riots, their members had started to drift away, their lead singer had become bogged down in personal lawsuits, and "The Spaghetti Incident?," their collection of cover versions of classic punk songs, had been released to mixed reviews and disappointing sales.

The members of the band - what was left of it - reconvened at the Complex, a Los Angeles studio, in a massive soundstage with a pool table and a Guns N' Roses-themed pinball machine, to prepare for their next album, which Geffen executives expected to release some time the following year. But they quickly began suffering from an ailment that has proved fatal to bands from time immemorial: boredom.

"They had enough money that they didn't have to do anything," said a longtime observer of the band, one of the 30 people involved with the album who spoke for this article. He spoke on the condition of anonymity, as did many others who had signed a confidentiality agreement while working with Mr. Rose. "You couldn't get everyone in the room at the same time."

Mr. Rose had appointed himself the leader of the project, but he didn't seem to know where to lead. As Slash, the band's longtime guitarist, said recently, in reference to the singer's songwriting style: "It seemed like a dictatorship. We didn't spend a lot of time collaborating. He'd sit back in the chair, watching. There'd be a riff here, a riff there. But I didn't know where it was going."

Geffen was riding toward an uncertain destiny as well: its founder, David Geffen, retired, and its corporate parent, MCA Inc., was sold to the liquor giant Seagram, led by Edgar Bronfman Jr. With all those changes swirling, and with old Guns N' Roses material still ringing up millions in new sales, executives decided to leave the band alone to write and record.

A cover of the Rolling Stones' "Sympathy for the Devil," however, which was released as part of a movie soundtrack, would be the last addition to the original band's catalog. Slash quit the band in 1996; the drummer Matt Sorum and the bassist Duff McKagan were the next to go. Of the founding members, that left just Mr. Rose. But instead of starting something new, he chose to keep the band's name and repopulate it with new musicians. Geffen wasn't in much of a position to deny him. The label was on a cold streak and wagered that fans would still flock to the singer, even if a band had to be rebuilt around him.

Geffen wasn't in much of a position to prod him forward, either. In 1997 Todd Sullivan, who was then a talent executive for the company, sent Mr. Rose a sampling of CD's produced by different people, and encouraged him to choose one to work on "Chinese Democracy." Mr. Sullivan says he received a call informing him that Mr. Rose had run over the albums with a car.

The singer had encouraged everyone in the band's camp to record their ideas for riffs and jams, hours and hours of song fragments that he hoped to process into full compositions. "Most of the stuff he had played me was just sketches," Mr. Sullivan recalled. "I said, 'Look, Axl, this is some really great, promising stuff here. Why don't you consider just bearing down and completing some of these songs?' He goes, 'Hmm, bear down and complete some of these songs?' Next day I get a call from Eddie" - Eddie Rosenblatt, the Geffen chairman - "saying I was off the project."

Around the start of 1998 Mr. Rose moved the band that he had assembled to Rumbo Recorders, a three-room studio deep in the San Fernando Valley where Guns N' Roses had recorded parts for its blockbuster debut, "Appetite for Destruction." The crew turned the studio into a rock star's playground: tapestries, green and yellow lights, state-of-the-art computer equipment and as many as 60 guitars at the ready, according to people involved in the production. But Mr. Rose wasn't there for fun and games. "What Axl wanted to do," one recording expert who was there recalls, "was to make the best record that had ever been made. It's an impossible task. You could go on infinitely, which is what they've done."

As time and dollars flew by, pressure mounted at Geffen. The label's dry spell lingered, making them more dependent than ever on new music from their heavy hitters. "The Hail Mary that's going to save the game," the recording expert who spoke on the condition of anonymity explained, "is a Guns N' Roses record. It keeps not coming and not coming." The label paid Mr. Rose $1 million to press on with the album, with the unusual promise of another $1 million if he delivered "Chinese Democracy" by March 1 of the following year. Geffen also offered one of the producers Mr. Rose had recently hired extra royalties if the recording came in before that.

He never collected. The producer, who goes by the name Youth (his real name is Martin Glover), started visiting the singer in the pool room of his secluded Malibu estate, to try to help him focus on composing. But that collaboration didn't go any better than his predecessors' had. "He kind of pulled out, said 'I'm not ready,' " Youth said. "He was quite isolated. There weren't very many people I think he could trust. It was very difficult to penetrate the walls he'd built up."

Youth's replacement was Sean Beavan - a producer who had previously worked with industrial-rock acts like Marilyn Manson and Nine Inch Nails - and under his care the riffs and song fragments that the band had recorded slowly began to take shape. But costs were spiraling out of control. The crew rented one piece of specialized equipment, for example, for more than two years - at a cost well into six figures - and used it for perhaps 30 days, according to one person involved with the production.

Mr. Rose appeared sporadically, some weeks just one or two days, some weeks not at all. "It was unorganized chaos," the same person said. "There was never a system to this. And in between, there were always parties to go to, different computers Axl was trying out or buying. There were times when we didn't record things for weeks."

So the studio technicians burned as many as five CD's per week with various mixes of different songs, which were driven to Malibu for Mr. Rose to study. The band's archive of recorded material swelled to include more than 1,000 digital audio tapes and other media, according to people who were there at the time, all elaborately labeled to chart the progress of songs. "It was like the Library of Congress in there," said one production expert who spent time on the album there.

By one count, the band kept roughly 20 songs it considered on the A list and another 40 or so in various stages of completion on the B list.

All that material, however, didn't do much to reassure the band's label. "In 1998 and 1999 you start getting a little bit nervous," Mr. Rosenblatt, the executive who led the outfit after David Geffen's departure, said delicately. "Edgar Bronfman picks up the phone more than once. He wanted to know what was going on. You unfortunately have got to give him the answer, you don't know. Because you don't." To take the pressure off, Mr. Rose's manager at the time presented the idea of releasing a live album from the original band, which. Mr. Rose's crew began to assemble.

In January 1999 Seagram orchestrated a massive restructuring of its music division, firing 110 Geffen employees, including Mr. Rosenblatt, and folding the unit into the corporation's bigger Interscope Records division. The unfinished album was placed in the hands of Interscope's chairman, Jimmy Iovine. Mr. Iovine declined to comment for this article.

Mr. Rose was said to be crushed by the departure of his Geffen contacts - just as "White Trash Wins Lotto," a musical satire that sent the singer up as a star-eyed hayseed forced to learn the harsh lessons of the music industry, was developing a cult following in Los Angeles. When he missed his March deadline, however, he set a pattern that would repeat itself for years to come: a flurry of energetic activity, followed by creative chaos and a withdrawal from the studio.

That June he allowed a version of the old Guns N' Roses hit "Sweet Child O' Mine" that begins with the original band playing but almost seamlessly shifts into the new band to appear on the soundtrack of the film "Big Daddy." Later that summer he agreed to release his first original song in eight years, the industrial-flavored "Oh My God," for another soundtrack and introduced it in a commercial on MTV. (Mr. Rose fussed over the song so much that he, Mr. Iovine and studio technicians stayed up until nearly dawn adjusting the final mix, according to people involved.) News of its release stoked speculation that an album might follow. But it was panned by many critics and quickly forgotten.

In late 1999 he invited Rolling Stone to preview about a dozen tracks. The magazine reported the album appeared "loosely scheduled" for release in the summer of 2000. In fact, Mr. Rose's visits to the studio had become so irregular, according to several executives and musicians involved with the band, that an engineer working with him, Billy Howerdel, and the band's drummer, Josh Freese, found time during that period to start their own project, the band A Perfect Circle, and to begin recording an album, "Mer de Noms," which went on to sell 1.7 million copies.

Label executives still clung to the idea that if they could just bring in the right producer, he could find a way to finish the album and finally bring a return on their ever-growing investment. They summoned Roy Thomas Baker, famed for his work with the art-rock band Queen. (Mr. Beavan, who was said to have tired of the project, soon bowed out.) But instead of wrapping things up, Mr. Baker decided that much of what the band had needed to be re-recorded - and painstakingly so, as he sometimes spent as long as eight hours on a few bars of music.

The process was drawn out even further after Mr. Rose hired two new musicians - the guitarist Buckethead, a virtuoso who wore a mannequin-like face mask and a KFC bucket on his head, and the drummer Brian "Brain" Mantia - whom the singer directed to re-record all the music that their predecessors had spent months performing.

Still, Mr. Rose seemed to be emerging from his sullen shell. In mid-2000, for what was thought to be the first time since the "Illusions" tour ended in 1993, he performed in public, with the Thursday night bar band at the Cat Club on the Sunset Strip. "He was psyched," recalled one person who worked with the band at Rumbo. "It seemed like it boosted him again, people still want to hear him."

At about 4 a.m on New Year's Day 2001, at the House of Blues in Las Vegas, he and the new lineup of the band finally unveiled some of their new material. "I have traversed a treacherous sea of horrors to be with you here tonight," Mr. Rose told the crowd, which received him with roars of approval. Warm reviews followed. Making the most of the moment, he took his band on the road, going to Brazil to play in the Rock in Rio festival.

With the band's return, Mr. Rose's machinery cranked up again. One internal cost analysis from the period pegs the operation's monthly tab at a staggering $244,000. It included more than $50,000 in studio time at the Village, a more modern studio where Mr. Baker had moved the band. It also included a combined payroll for seven band members that exceeded $62,000, with the star players earning roughly $11,000 each. Guitar technicians earned about $6,000 per month, while the album's main engineer was paid $14,000 per month and a recording software engineer was paid $25,000 a month, the document stated.

Label executives were losing patience. Interscope turned to Mr. Zutaut, the original band's talent scout. Could an old friend succeed where so many others had failed? He was offered a roughly 30 percent bonus, he said, if he could usher the project to completion within a year.

But Mr. Rose's renewed energies were not being directed toward the finish line. He had the crew send him CD's almost daily, sometimes with 16 or more takes of a musician performing his part of a single song. He accompanied Buckethead on a jaunt to Disneyland when the guitarist was drifting toward quitting, several people involved recalled; then Buckethead announced he would be more comfortable working inside a chicken coop, so one was built for him in the studio, from wood planks and chicken wire.

Mr. Rose was far less indulgent of his producers and label. Around Christmas, he ousted both Mr. Baker and Mr. Zutaut (who said there had been a miscommunication). It would be weeks before the singer would even allow an Interscope executive to visit him in the studio, according to people involved with the production. Interscope dispatched a senior talent executive, Mark Williams, to oversee the project. Mr. Williams declined to comment for this article.

If Mr. Rose appeared more remote, his vision of the project became more grandiose, people involved with the band said. He directed that music produced by Mr. Baker be redone again, those people said. He now spoke of releasing not merely one album but a trilogy. And he planned one very big surprise.

At MTV's annual awards show in 2002, publicists buzzed through the audience whispering about a big finale. And with just minutes to go in the broadcast, a screen lifted away to reveal the band and Mr. Rose, in cornrows and a sports jersey, looking strikingly young. The musicians burst into "Welcome to the Jungle," one of the original band's biggest hits, and the crowd went wild. But on television Mr. Rose quickly seemed out of breath and out of tune. He ended the performance, which included the new song "Madagascar" and the original band's hit "Paradise City" in a messianic stance, raising his arms and closing his eyes. He left the audience with a cryptic but tantalizing message: "Round one."

Round two never came. The band went on a successful tour, but in the hours after their triumphant Madison Square Garden appearance, Mr. Rose was reportedly refused entry to the Manhattan nightclub Spa because he was wearing fur, which the club does not allow. That killed the mood. He didn't show up for the band's next performance, and the promoter canceled the rest of the tour.

Months dragged on as the band waited for Mr. Rose to record more vocals. In August 2003 when label executives announced their intention to release a Guns N' Roses greatest-hits CD for the holidays, the band's representatives managed to hold them off with yet another promise to deliver "Chinese Democracy" by the end of the year. But the album, of course, did not materialize. And then the game was over.

"HAVING EXCEEDED ALL budgeted and approved recording costs by millions of dollars," the label wrote in a letter dated Feb. 2 , 2004, "it is Mr. Rose's obligation to fund and complete the album, not Geffen's." The tab at Village studio was closed out, and Mr. Rose tried a brief stint recording at the label's in-house studio before that too was ended. The band's computer gear, guitars and keyboards were packed away. Over a legal challenge by Mr. Rose, the label issued a greatest-hits compilation, in search of even a modest return on their eight-figure investment.

Released in March of 2004, it turned out to be a surprisingly strong seller, racking up sales of more than 1.8 million copies even without any new music or promotional efforts by the original band. The original band's debut, "Appetite for Destruction," which has sold 15 million copies, remains popular and racked up sales of another 192,000 copies last year, according to Nielsen SoundScan. It is a sign that Mr. Rose's audience still waits.

Mr. Rose is reportedly working on the album even now in a San Fernando Valley studio. "The 'Chinese Democracy' album is very close to being completed," Merck Mercuriadis, the chief executive officer of Sanctuary Group, which manages Mr. Rose, wrote in a recent statement. He added that other artists including Peter Gabriel and Stevie Wonder "have throughout their careers consistently taken similar periods of time without undeserved scrutiny as the world respects that this is what it can sometimes take to make great art." There's certainly more than enough material; as Mr. Zutaut says, even years ago "people felt like the record had been made four or five times already." But of course, rumors of the album's imminent release have circulated since almost the very beginning of the tale, more than a decade ago.

And at the center of that tale, now as then, is the confounding figure of Axl Rose himself. A magnetic talent, a moody unpredictable artist, a man of enormous ideas and confused follow-through, he has proven himself to be an uncontrollable variable in any business plan.

His involvement on "Chinese Democracy" has outlasted countless executives, producers and fellow musicians - even the corporate structure that first brought the band to worldwide celebrity. Even, in fact, the recognizable configuration of the recording industry as a whole, which since the band first went into the studio in 1994 has consolidated to four major corporations from six, and staggered amid an epidemic of piracy, leaving it more focused than ever on the bottom line, and on reliable musicians with a proven track record of consistent performance. The sort of rock stars that the original members of Guns N' Roses, who recently submitted a claim seeking $6 million in what were called unpaid royalties from its catalog, used to be. But which Mr. Rose, with his mood swings, erratic work habits and long dark stretches, no longer is.

He hasn't disappeared entirely. His voice can be heard on the latest edition in the "Grand Theft Auto" video game series, in the character of a grizzled 70's-style rock D.J. "Remember," he advises the radio station's audience, "we're not outdated and neither is our music."

Interscope has taken "Chinese Democracy" off its schedule. Mr. Rose hasn't been seen there since last year, when he was spotted leaving the parking area beneath Interscope's offices, where witnesses reported that a small traffic jam had congealed when attendants halted other cars to clear a path for his silver Ferrari. Mr. Rose punched the gas and cruised into the day.

That a complete lie. IF it was true, where are all the promo copies? It's only 2 months away! The record label should have a ton of promo copies sent out to the radio stations, magazines & newspapers. Especially magazines so that by the time the issues hits the stands, the record will be out.As someone who actually receives promo copies from record labels, I gotta say that you don't have a clue what you're talking about.

Review copies are NEVER sent out more than a month in advance (except to maybe the Rolling Stones/Spins/etc.). Typically they don't get delivered to the Promotion/Publicity offices until 3-4 weeks before release, at which point they send them on. Only print magazines can be expected to get a release with any serious lead times. If I'm lucky, mine tend to arrive 2 weeks before release for small releases. Big releases are another story entirely.

A high profile release, which Chinese Democracy would probably be considered, may not ship to anyone other than radio and professional reviewers until the Monday before release. The labels are deathly afraid of piracy and will jump through hoops to make it so that the album doesn't get out anywhere... which means delaying release to radio as well. I've been told several times that a company is not doing standard promo on big releases for that very reason. A few years ago promo copies of a Radiohead release were sent out in their own CD players which were fused shut and came with undetachable headphones, plus the addition of a nifty bar attached to the top which would literally rip the CD in half if the player were somehow pried open. The majors have taken to holding listening parties, or album auditions for reviewers at thier offices instead of sending out discs.

Just about the only thing companies are willing to do these days is release an advance single and those typically only get sent to radio about a month prior to release.

I will probobly be disapointed but as a huge old school GNR fan I will be there the morning that it goes on sale.

I loved GNR back in the day. Appetite for Destruction was one of the few albums that my mom actually didn't want me listening to (she saw the album cover with the seemingly-raped waitress). By the time Use Your Illusion I & II were at the end of their single-producing days, they were almost a joke then. I admit I liked "Oh God" from the End of Days soundtrack but I can't help but think that the new album would be a joke. Axl Rose takes himself too damn seriously as a "rock god".

As someone who actually receives promo copies from record labels, I gotta say that you don't have a clue what you're talking about.

Review copies are NEVER sent out more than a month in advance (except to maybe the Rolling Stones/Spins/etc.).

I actually used to get promo copies of albums all the time (writing for a magazine and had a girlfriend working for a major label) months in advance. This was 10 years ago though. With the internet, times may have changed and getting a promo months in advance may not be the case these days. EXCUUUUUUUUUUUSE ME!

I WAS talking about Rolling Stone/Spin/etc... They need to have the advances now in order to get the review in the issue that will be hitting the stands in March.

I still don't believe it's coming out in March. You're a sucker if you do. Fool me once, shame on you! Fool me twice, we won't get fooled again!

I don't believe for a second that it will come out in March either, just saying that because we haven't heard anything yet doesn't mean anything. I also don't think the lead times for print magazines is near as long as it used to be, but I could be mistaken.

I've seen a March date and a May date bandied about, but both are complete guesses as far as I'm concerned. May makes a bit more sense because I would guess we would have heard SOMETHING by now if it were coming out in March (publicity with a full website, etc., would have started by now). Frankly I'll believe it when I see it. 2006 seems awful soon for Axl to put the polishing touches on it ;)

So am I living in a fantasy world or would the first week album sales be huge for this?

So am I living in a fantasy world or would the first week album sales be huge for this?

I doubt it would sell more than 200,000 copies in the first week. In fact, I doubt it would ever even go platinum.

I doubt it would sell more than 200,000 copies in the first week. In fact, I doubt it would ever even go platinum.I would guess it sells around 100-150k first week and then drop like a stone.

To be honest I don't keep track of album sales at all. Is 100-200k copies the first week good? What is the average for the number 1 selling album of the week?

So am I living in a fantasy world or would the first week album sales be huge for this?

You are living in a fantasy world. I can see it selling less than 20,000 in the first week. People simply don't care.

As someone who actually receives promo copies from record labels, I gotta say that you don't have a clue what you're talking about.

Maybe his info is outdated. I remember listening to Beck's Odelay several months before it came out. An RS writer even mentioned driving around in his car with it in the player the whole summer.

Of course, that was pre-Napster.

You are living in a fantasy world. I can see it selling less than 20,000 in the first week. People simply don't care.

While it would not get the kind of numbers a "Guns" album would of generated 15 years ago. I feel the hype will easily push it past 20,000 copies for it's first week. Personally I think there will be a short term buzz and then a month later it will be forgotten. It just seems that in today's music market, that even if this album is on par with Appetite for Destruction, the demand for hard-rock is almost nill among average music buyers.

Of cousre it probably wont even be released anyhow.

It just seems that in today's music market, that even if this album is on par with Appetite for Destruction, the demand for hard-rock is almost nill among average music buyers.



That shit makes me want to throw up.

Guns 'n' Roses album 'out next month'

Slash reveals all about 'Chinese Democracy'

Guns 'n' Roses' long awaited album 'Chinese Democracy' is finally set to be released in March, according to former guitarist Slash.

The news comes just weeks after reclusive singer Axl Rose revealed that the band's first material in 10 years was nearing completion.

Speaking about the release on Christian O'Connell's Virgin breakfast show, Slash confirmed that the record is done and he said a "very official source" had already heard it.

He added: "Yeah its going to happen, I've been made aware it's been heard.

"I'm really excited, it's been a long time waiting to see what the next step around the corner was going to be for him (Axl), we know where everybody else is, but we were wondering what he was going to be doing. It's coming out in March and apparently it sounds great."

Tracks slated to appear on the 13 track album include 'Better', 'There Was A Time' and 'The Blues'.

Although Axl and Slash have not spoken in the last 10 years, the velvet revolver guitarist said he was pleased that the record is finally going to see the light of day.

He added: "I've always been supportive over that thing, even though it's been turned in to a big controversial blah blah blah thing.

"When I left I was pretty pissed off for having to leave in the first place. After a while all the boo-haha that was stirred and all the negative press, sort of went in his direction, so I'm just waiting for the record to come out, so I'm glad where it's got to the point that that's happening.:later:

:later:

I have my doubts about this. Here we are in February and not even a promo single?

But I agree with Slash - let's see what the hype is about.

Hopefully they get a nice painting for the cover art to keep with all of their other full albums.

Hey, if it actually comes out, bully for Axl.

Although I'm not holding my breath or anything.

To be honest I don't keep track of album sales at all. Is 100-200k copies the first week good? What is the average for the number 1 selling album of the week?Missed this when originally posted.

I don't really pay attention to the numbers but I would guess most #1s debut with around 300-350k copies sold nowadays. Occasionally you'll have your massive debuts in the 600K to 1million range, but those are rare. Anything over 150k will probably be top 10 unless there are a lot of high profile debuts. I read today that Scott Stapp's solo album debuted with 94k copies which put it 19th the week it was released.

Glad this is finally seeing the light of day, but I'll be shocked if I ever buy it.

wonder what the DELUXE EDITION will be like

I don't really pay attention to the numbers but I would guess most #1s debut with around 300-350k copies sold nowadaysThere are an awful lot of variables. Barry Manilow's new album just debuted at #1 with 156K copies sold. The bottom end of the top 10 was Train's new album with 66K copies sold in its first week.

The week before, Il Divo's album also debuted at #1 with 156K copies sold, with #10 being the soundtrack to Disney's "High School Musical" at 53K copies.

Look back in December, though, and in the space of one week, Mary J. Blige sold 730K copies of her album in one week and Jamie Foxx sold 598K copies of his.

Put me in the "I'll believe it when I see it" camp. This record is a complete myth :)

But if it does come out, I hope it's good. We need some good kick ass rock n roll again.

Well according to blabbermouth.net, Axl & friends were in NYC this weekend celebrating his birthday, and they showed up at a club at 4am and asked them to let them in. As incentive, he brought a copy of "Chinese Democracy" and turned it into a listening party!

From melodicrock.com on 2/10/06... take with a grain of salt

COULD THE ILLUSION ERA GUNS N ROSES LINE-UP REALLY RETURN?:
Is the impossible actually being considered? Rumors of a Guns N Roses re-union appear to be gathering strength. It all started at British photographer/journalist Ross Halfin's website when he stated that the original Guns N' Roses lineup would get back together in June to play at the Download Festival in England, with Metallica also lined up to play.

That comment was soon withdrawn. Posted was: "I have to write some copy this weekend on Guns 'N Roses for a feature to go with my photos. My mind is blank at the moment. The thing is if you tell the truth it sets off too many wars, or egos way out of control. The original line-up is supposed to play Download in June with their metal chums, Metallica, if Lars can be bothered to turn up."

Now this - on the official Cult message board, frontman Ian Astbury has responded to a post asking after the possible 2006 touring line-up for The Cult. His response: "I love Matt he is a sweetheart..........Velvet Revolver Guns and Roses rumoured return W/SLASH and AXL .......Hey the Cult can barly contain Billy and Myself......But we will have a SHITHOT band for you so patience please."

So Use Your Illusion drummer Matt Sorum appears too busy for Cult duties it seems! Whether this will happen, if it will be a one-off performance or where this will leave the Chinese Democracy release and new Velvet Revolver releases are all questions to be answered in the coming weeks.

I want to believe it, but I don't.

But Steven Adler had very nice things to say about all the other members in the 20 Questions he did with Metal Sludge a couple weeks ago.

A song from Chinese Democracy has leaked onto the internet as well as an 80 second sample of another. It actually sounds pretty good to me. I'm sure any Guns N' Roses forum could point you in the right direction. Seems like the album really is coming.

A song from Chinese Democracy has leaked onto the internet as well as an 80 second sample of another. It actually sounds pretty good to me. I'm sure any Guns N' Roses forum could point you in the right direction. Seems like the album really is coming.

Well the forum I went to (heretodaygonetohell) had any references to it deleted and said they would ban anyone who posts a link to it.

Sounds like Axl's lawyers are hard at work.

Curse you Lars for killing Napster!

Anyone heard is Madagascar will still be on the album?

Howard Stern is playing IRS right now!

Wow I can't believe it is actually happening. Huge GNR fan way back when. I will be there the morning it releases.

I've been expecting to not like this for so many years now...I kinda like it. I'm not saying it's the equal of Appetite here, but at first listen - it's not bad at all.

I.R.S. is almost interesting.
Yeah, I agree.

It sounds like it could be decent, but those lyrics are really bad.

Yeah, I agree.

It sounds like it could be decent, but those lyrics are really bad.

You can understand the lyrics? Impressive :D

I've always like the music of IRS. Good song.

IRS reminds me more of Led Zeppelin than GNR. I don’t listen to Led much though so I may be way off. Anyone else hear that?

Weird GNR-related personal story:

My parents just moved into an assisted-living complex near Bourbonnais, IL. Middle of nowhere. During one of our preliminary visits to scope the place out, we were show a craft room where the residents painted birdhouses.

One of the birdhouses was adorned with GNR decals and logos, and we were informed that Axl Rose's grandmother lives there, and that he sends her stuff to wear.

Anyone tempted to post links to copyright material that has not officially been made available for public consumption please re-read the board rules and the reminder in the sticky thread atop this page.


__________
Benedict
Moderator, Music Talk

why do people still care about GnR? hasn't this album been coming out for 10 years now? If you want to hear some really good Sunset Strip hair metal from a band that actually still puts out new music, go buy one of the new L.A. Guns CDs.

http://images.amazon.com/images/P/B00005AMIH.01._SCLZZZZZZZ_.jpg
Man On The Moon (2001)

http://images.amazon.com/images/P/B00006BTBN.01._SCLZZZZZZZ_.jpg
Waking The Dead (2002)

http://ec1.images-amazon.com/images/P/B000A9QKN2.01._SCLZZZZZZZ_.jpg
Tales From The Strip (2005)

I suck! lol images fixed

why do people still care about GnR? hasn't this album been coming out for 10 years now? If you want to hear some really good Sunset Strip hair metal from a band that actually still puts out new music, go buy one of the new L.A. Guns CDs.

http://www.laguns.net/html/discography/covers/lp_moon.jpg
Man On The Moon (2001)

http://www.laguns.net/html/discography/covers/lp_waking.jpg
Waking The Dead (2002)

http://www.laguns.net/html/discography/covers/lp_tales.jpg
Tales From The Strip (2005)

I'd consider it but their album covers suck.

http://teamkyoto.free.fr/data/500/4blind.JPG

Heard some more possible songs from the new album and a few of them sound like Elton John balads. Was Elton John ever thought of as a complete ass when he was in his heavy drug years? Wondering because that style doesn't come off too well when you think of the person as a complete joke/ass.

I heard IRS on a local rock station last night. Definitely not the song I expected to hear, but will give it a few more listens before I make a solid opinion on it. I'm still in kind of a shock. ;)

Listened to IRS yesterday. Clearly, this sounds nothing like GNR. I think those that buy or listen to the new material thinking it picks up where UUI 1 & 2 left off, they are probably in for a disappointment. If you can listen to it as an Axl Rose solo album and ignore the fact that it's still going to be filed under "G", you may have a different opinion. FWIW, I didn't think the track was that bad. Not ground-breaking, but if the rest of the disc has some tracks on par with this, it may not be a bad listen.

If you can listen to it as an Axl Rose solo album and ignore the fact that it's still going to be filed under "G", you may have a different opinion.

I was thinking the exact same thing when I was listening to the tracks the other day. When I buy the album and put it on my iPod, I don't think there's any way that I can label it "Guns N' Roses" and feel good about it. I'm usually a stickler for having things labeled "correctly," but to do so in this case would be an insult to the old guys. I think I'll just call it "The Axl Rose Project" or "The Axl Rose Musical Revue" or something.

But I'm like most of you guys--I didn't think the new stuff sounded that bad. Obviously nowhere near the old Gn'R, but a hell of a lot better than "Oh My God," though, too. I'm a little more optimistic about the record now.

From a duplicate thread:

Leaked Guns N' Roses Tracks Give Fans Hope

NEW YORK - Guns N' Roses fans went into frenzied overdrive when three studio-quality tracks from the mythical "Chinese Democracy" album were leaked onto the Internet.

The leaks came just weeks after frontman Axl Rose ended his hermit-like lifestyle by venturing out to a Korn tour launch party in Los Angeles and to trendy nightclubs for some post-birthday bashes (his 44th) in Manhattan.

Asked at the Korn bash about "Chinese Democracy," which has been in the making for a decade, Rose told Rolling Stone.com that "people will hear music this year."

The tracks leaked Wednesday take a different direction from Rose's traditional raunchy Sunset Strip-style rock. "Better" has emo/industrial touches mixed with Rose's trademark vocals and hard rock backdrop. "There Was A Time" is a rough studio mix of a power ballad with similarities to GNR's classic "Estranged." "IRS" is closer to the sound of yesteryear, with powerful guitar solos and classic rock flavor.

Rose's manager, Merck Mercuriadis, ordered the Internet sites to remove the links, but declined to comment on them. Fans also sent one of the leaked tracks to radio stations. Mercuriadis said cease-and-desist orders were sent to the stations, but some, such as WAAF in Boston, still had "IRS" in heavy rotation Monday night.

News also surfaced Monday that several music festivals, such as the Rock in Rio-Lisboa and the NovaRock festival in Austria, had booked the band to play in May and June, respectively.

Lisa Reed, wife of keyboard player Dizzy Reed, said on her husband's web site that "all signs point to (the album) getting closer and closer," and she pleaded with fans not to leak the rest of the album.

"It's like shaking all your Christmas presents on the 23rd of December," she wrote, "and figuring out what they are."

Guns N Roses.... Emo?

Heard some more possible songs from the new album and a few of them sound like Elton John balads. Was Elton John ever thought of as a complete ass when he was in his heavy drug years? Wondering because that style doesn't come off too well when you think of the person as a complete joke/ass.

When I was in high school in the late 70's he was losing his popularity and it was pretty uncool to be a fan of his. Everyone at my school were into Zeppelin, Cheap Trick, Queen etc. I remember a kid wearing an Elton John shirt to school and being ridiculed. Of course in the mid 70's before he announced his bisexuality, he was the biggest act in the world.

With studio help, as always, Axl's voice can still sound very good. That high note that he hits at the end of I.R.S. is incredible. I love the song just for that. There's no way he can sound that good live. Come to think of it, he always sounded pretty shitty live. God please let this album come out. I need some good hard rock music this year.

With studio help, as always, Axl's voice can still sound very good. That high note that he hits at the end of I.R.S. is incredible. I love the song just for that. There's no way he can sound that good live. Come to think of it, he always sounded pretty shitty live. God please let this album come out. I need some good hard rock music this year.
Reminds me of that performance at the MTV Music Awards (I think) just a couple years ago. All out of breath. Couldn't hit the high notes. Quite embarassing. Alot of talk about it afterwards I remember.

Reminds me of that performance at the MTV Music Awards (I think) just a couple years ago. All out of breath. Couldn't hit the high notes. Quite embarassing. Alot of talk about it afterwards I remember.

He couldn't hit the high notes when I saw him in 1991. He has a great studio voice though, like most singers. I'm listening to Def Leppard right now and Joe Elliot's voice is very similiar to Axl's. Velvet Revolver should've got Elliot as thier lead.

I was a huge GnR fan! I will have to agree that the leaked tracks I have heard sound nothing like GnR. The songs aren't bad though. I'll buy the cd when it comes out.

OK after listening to IRS a few dozen times I've made up my mind about it. It is a good song but not something that should be on an album that is 10+ years in the making. It isn't like the band hasn't been in the studio. Even with the off time they have been in the studio for a LONG TIME.

For big GNR fans I think it is a lot like Perfect Crime. Awesome song with lyrics about what Axl is going to do or did but you never really get to understand what the fuck he is singing about which almost ruin it. You have to be a pretty big GNR fan to remember Perfect Crime and you'll have to be a pretty big fan to remember IRS in 5-6 years.

If IRS' lyrics weren't embarrassingly bad it would be a great song. Oh and I think Axl hit plenty of notes like he did at the end of IRS on the Use Your Illusion albums. Good song. Hopefully it's not the first single that they are banking on to be a huge hit because the thing will sink.

I'm listening to Def Leppard right now and Joe Elliot's voice is very similiar to Axl's.
:hscratch:

They don't sound even a little bit similiar to me.

:hscratch:

They don't sound even a little bit similiar to me.

What? I confuse Wanna Get Rocked for Mr. Brownstone all the time.

Oh and I think Axl hit plenty of notes like he did at the end of IRS on the Use Your Illusion albums.

With more studio help, though. The high notes he's hitting on these recordings sound completely unnatural, compared to what the high notes on the older albums sounded like. And it's highly-unlikely that his voice would have gotten that much better in fifteen years.

Listen to the (oft-forgotten) Live Era album. For people familiar with their live shows, the vocals on the live album sounded totally fake. His high notes sounded nowhere near that clean during their live shows (especially as the show progressed), so they tweaked it in the studio (if they didn't re-record it entirely) to make it "sound better" for the live album.

No reason to think they wouldn't have done the same this time around.

:hscratch:

They don't sound even a little bit similiar to me.

Listen to High N' Dry, where the vocals aren't quite as over-produced as Pyromania and Hysteria. I'm not saying that they sound identical, just that they have very similiar vocal styles.

This press release hit the newswires today

March 06, 2006 12:30 PM US Eastern Timezone
Axl Rose Responds to Lawsuit

LOS ANGELES--(BUSINESS WIRE)--March 6, 2006--W. Axl Rose, on Friday March 3, 2006 responded to one of Saul "Slash" Hudson's baseless lawsuits by filing a counterclaim asking the Federal Court to confirm his ownership of his own creative works. Slash and Michael "Duff" McKagan had previously filed cases both in Federal Court and in the Los Angeles Superior Court making numerous false allegations about Axl. Mr. Rose believes that once apprised of the true facts the Judge or Jury deciding these lawsuits will rule in Axl's favor on every issue before them.

More surprising to Axl are recent media reports that Slash (Saul Hudson) is claiming that he has always been supportive of Axl Rose and the new Guns N' Roses. Slash's actions in recent years have in fact been anything but supportive. Besides the lawsuits filed against Axl Rose, claiming, among other things, that Axl does not own the copyright in the songs that Axl co-authored with his former Guns N' Roses band mates, Slash has continually made negative and malicious statements about Axl in order to garner publicity for himself.

As an example the Federal lawsuit Hudson and McKagan filed was based on a faulty premise from the start. What Hudson and McKagan attempted to portray as egregious misconduct by Axl was in fact -- as Slash and Duff have learned -- nothing more than a clerical error committed by ASCAP. Had Slash and Duff or their representatives bothered to pick up the phone the clerical error could have been easily sorted out without the need for filing an utterly baseless lawsuit which one can only assume had been filed for the purposes of self-publicity at Axl's expense.

The lawsuit also attacks Axl's integrity as Slash and Duff, in a vindictive attempt to aggrandize their own stature, re-write history through false statements, which have been repeated by the media. Their attacks on Axl stand in sharp contrast to Rose's conduct. Axl has at all times worked diligently to maintain the artistic integrity of the band by choosing with great care which properties to license Guns N' Roses songs to and refusing to participate in what he believed were potentially embarrassing projects. He has fought to avoid the release of material that does not live up to the highest of standards demanded by the band's history and it's followers. Axl chose not to respond through the media while taking the high road in the face of Slash and Duff's attacks. Hudson and McKagan, by contrast, have told ever changing - and false - stories regarding the formation of the band and it's history and believe that the band's catalogue should be exploited without careful consideration - for the Guns N' Roses brand and their loyal audience - or Axl's input as if it were fast food by anyone willing to pay for it.

For over 10 years Slash, a consummate press, photo and media opportunist and manipulator, has attacked Axl Rose on a number of levels. Slash's actions whether in or out of Gun's N' Roses have been a complete betrayal across the board of his alleged friendship and business relationship with Axl and the so called brotherhood and band loyalties that are supposed to have existed. Instead Slash has publicly attempted, by soliciting public and media support, to take credit for something that was not his or anyone else's to take, notwithstanding that Slash played a major part in the success of the band as Axl has continually acknowledged.

Mr. Rose's attorney Howard Weitzman commented, "Axl regrets having to spend time and energy on these distractions but he has a responsibility to protect the Guns N' Roses legacy and expose the truth. Axl believes he has been left with no alternative but to respond to these lawsuits. It would have been Axl's preference to resolve disputes with Slash and Duff in private. The courthouse is not his choice of forum. However, Axl could no longer sit quietly and allow the continuing dissemination of falsehoods and half-truths by his former band-mates."

I just saw that Axl and Guns N Roses was added to the Roskilde Festival lineup. I wonder if he'll actually show up.

Axl Unloads on Ex-Gunners

Axl Rose is making his old Guns N' Roses band mates feel unwelcome to the jungle.

GN'R's former ringleader filed court papers Friday asking a federal judge to affirm that Rose has "ownership of all creative works" stemming from his days fronting the legendary rock outfit.

The legal action is the latest salvo in Rose's long-running feud with former guitarist Slash and bassist Michael "Duff" McKagan. The latter musicians filed a lawsuit in August accusing the flame-haired singer of trying to dupe them out of royalties.

Slash and Duff, now members of Velvet Revolver, alleged in their complaint that Rose's "arrogance and ego" kept them from receiving their fair share of a multimillion-dollar publishing deal he signed with Sanctuary Group.

In his counterclaim and a written statement, Rose, 44, says Slash and Duff's suit was "based on a faulty premise from the start."

Rose's lawyer, Howard Weitzman, asserts the "egregious behavior" Slash and Duff accused Rose of was the result of a "clerical error" by the American Society of Composers, Authors and Publishers. Weitzman says in a press release that had Slash and Duff made some calls the problem would have been resolved quickly; however, the attorney says, they decided to pursue the matter in the courts due to their desire for "self-publicity."

"Mr. Rose believes that once apprised of the true facts the Judge or Jury deciding these lawsuits will rule in Axl's favor on every issue before them," Weitzman continues.

The release claims Slash and Duff continue to offer "ever changing and false stories" about how the group got its start and that the two rockers want to commercially exploit Guns N' Roses' roster of hits--including "Welcome to the Jungle," "Paradise City" and "Sweet Child O' Mine"--"as if it were fast food by anyone willing to pay for it."

"Their attacks on Axl stand in sharp contract to Rose's conduct," continues the statement. "Axl has at all times worked diligently to maintain the artistic integrity of the band by choosing with great care which properties to license Guns N' Roses songs to and refusing to participate in what he believed were potentially embarrassing projects."

"Axl regrets having to spend time and energy on these distractions but he has a responsibility to protect the Guns N' Roses legacy and expose the truth," Weitzman says. "Axl believes he has been left with no alternative and but to respond to these lawsuits....[He] could no longer sit quietly and allow the continuing dissemination of falsehoods and half-truths by his former bandmates."

Reps for Slash and Duff did not immediately comment.

Ironically, Rose's dissing of his former mates comes just weeks after Slash gushed to a British radio station that he was looking forward to Rose and his revamped Guns N' Roses lineup finally releasing the forever-in-the-works Chinese Democracy album this year.

Several tracks from the disc were leaked to the Internet in recent days, generating big buzz among fans before Rose's lawyers ordering sites to take down the tracks. The three songs remain in heavy rotation on file-sharing sites, however, and have also popped up on radio station playlists.

There's still no official word on when Chinese Democracy will hit stores, but Rose and his new Gunners are scheduled to play several festival dates this summer in Europe, perhaps to be followed by a full-blown tour.


yahoo.com

I just saw that Axl and Guns N Roses was added to the Roskilde Festival lineup. I wonder if he'll actually show up.

Here's the dates announced so far for their European Tour -

Rock in Rio V - May 27th (Lisboa, Portugal)
Gods of Metal Festival - June 4th (Milan, Italy)
RDS Arena - June 9th (Dublin, Ireland)
Download Festival - June 11th (Donnington, England)
Sazka Arena - June 13th (Prague, Czech Republic)
Legia Stadium - June 15th (Warsaw, Poland)
Nova Rock Festival - June 17th (Burgenland, Austria)
Palais Omnisports de Paris-Bercy - June 20th (Paris, France)
Graspop Metal Meeting - June 24th (Dessel, Belgium)
Globen Arena - June 26th (Stockholm, Sweden)
Roskilde Festival - June 29th (Roskilde, Denmark)
Hartwall Arena - July 5th (Helsinki, Finland)

yay. they're coming to prague. i. can't. wait... i'm very skeptical, suffice it to say.

....VELVET REVOLVER/ex-STONE TEMPLE PILOTS frontman Scott Weiland has slammed GUNS N' ROSES singer Axl Rose for his comments in a recent press release where he claimed that in October of 2005, VELVET REVOLVER/ex-GUNS N' ROSES guitarist Slash visited Axl's house at 5:30 one morning and said he wanted to "end the war" with Rose. Rose alleged that Slash tore into his current bandmates in VELVET REVOLVER, calling singer Weiland a "fraud," saying that he "hates" drummer Matt Sorum and describing bassist Duff McKagan as "spineless."

The press release stated, "It would have been Axl's preference to resolve disputes with Slash and Duff in private...However, Axl could no longer sit quietly and allow the continuing dissemination of falsehoods and half-truths by his former bandmates."

Responding to Axl's comments, Weiland wrote in an open letter, "Get in the ring. Go to the gym, motherfucker, or if you prefer, get a new wig, motherfucker. I think I'll resist the urge to 'stoop' to your level. Oh shit, here it comes, you fat, botox-faced, wig-wearin' fuck! O.K., I feel better now.

"Don?t think for a second we don't know where those words came from. Your unoriginal, uncreative little mind ? the same mind that had to rely on its bandmates to write melodies and lyrics. Who's the fraud now, bitch?

"Damn, I couldn't imagine people writing for me. How many albums have you put out, man, and how long did it take the current configuration of this so-called 'band' to make this album? How long? And without the only guys that validated the name.

"How dare you! Shame on you! How dare you call our bass player 'spineless?' We toured our album over a year and a half. How many shows have you played over the last ten years? Oh, that's right ? you bailed out on your long-awaited comeback tour, leaving your remaining fans feeling, shall we say, a trifle miffed?! I won't even list what I've accomplished because I don't need to. What we're talking about here is a frightened little man who once thought he was king, but unfortunately this king without his court is nothing but a memory of the asshole he once was."The guy has a point, IMNSHO.

;)

I totally agree, benedict! Thanks for that post.

....The guy has a point, IMNSHO.

;)


We'll see who has the last laugh when the new album is released.

Wow! An actual review! Maybe this will see the light of day this year!

http://www.spin.com/reviews/magazine/2006/03/060323_gunsnroses/

Wow! An actual review! Maybe this will see the light of day this year!

http://www.spin.com/reviews/magazine/2006/03/060323_gunsnroses/Seems like an early April Fools Day review.

We'll see who has the last laugh when the new album is released.


Without incredible reviews and a strong single garnering massive airplay I don't see this flying out of the stores. I think a lot of people see Axl as the white Michael Jackson (I know, kind of redundent) because of his eccentric behavior. He may be comercially scarred. I'm betting against it being a hit but I could be wrong.

Sorry if I missed it, but is there an actual release date for this album yet?

Mordred, I think you may be right. Supposedly in the print version, there's a disclaimer at the end of the article saying it's a joke.

Kind of makes sense. Why would they cover "Cowboy Song" and redo "Think About You"?

It's not April 1st though. Then again, the review can't be a bigger joke than Spin.

Mordred, I think you may be right. Supposedly in the print version, there's a disclaimer at the end of the article saying it's a joke.

Kind of makes sense. Why would they cover "Cowboy Song" and redo "Think About You"?

It's not April 1st though. Then again, the review can't be a bigger joke than Spin.

And look at the smug prick who wrote the "review". Chuck Klosterman's head needs to end up on a stick.

And look at the smug prick who wrote the "review". Chuck Klosterman's head needs to end up on a stick.


Wow. For writing a sarcastic review of a pop record? Hate to see what you'd do to a real criminal.

Wow. For writing a sarcastic review of a pop record? Hate to see what you'd do to a real criminal.

:lol: Nah, I'm not upset about the review (don't really care one way or the other about "Chinese Democracy"), I just don't like the guy.

Was head on a stick too... harsh? -confused- -ptth-

Two warm-up dates in New York City were added to their upcoming tour.

So the current schedule is as follows:

2006 Tour Dates

Hammerstein Ballroom - May 15th (New York, New York)
Hammerstein Ballroom - May 17th (New York, New York)
Rock in Rio V - May 27th (Lisboa, Portugal)
Auditorio Juan Carlos I - May 28th (Madrid, Spain)
Budapest Sports Arena - May 31st (Budapest, Hungary)
Rock Am Ring - June 2nd (Nürburgring, Germany)
Gods of Metal Festival - June 4th (Milan, Italy)
RDS Arena - June 9th (Dublin, Ireland)
Download Festival - June 11th (Donnington, England)
Sazka Arena - June 13th (Prague, Czech Republic)
Legia Stadium - June 15th (Warsaw, Poland)
Nova Rock Festival - June 17th (Burgenland, Austria)
Palais Omnisports de Paris-Bercy - June 20th (Paris, France)
Graspop Metal Meeting - June 24th (Dessel, Belgium)
Globen Arena - June 26th (Stockholm, Sweden)
Oslo Spektrum - June 28th (Oslo, Norway)
Roskilde Festival - June 29th (Roskilde, Denmark)
Goffertpark - July 2nd (Nijmegen, Netherlands)
Hartwall Areena - July 5th (Helsinki, Finland)
Hartwall Areena - July 6th (Helsinki, Finland)
Oslo Spektrum - July 8th (Oslo, Norway)

And supposedly there will be a North American tour this fall to coincide with the album's release.

:hscratch: I did not know Rock in Rio was in Portugal.

:hscratch: I did not know Rock in Rio was in Portugal.

Yep, the last one in 2004 was as well.

http://rockinrio-lisboa.sapo.pt/

Seventeen years after their first stint opening for the Rolling Stones, Guns 'N Roses have been tapped to open for the English rock legends at two German shows this summer. GNR will support the Stones July 10 in Nurnberg and two days later in Leipzig.

The dates will come in the middle of GNR's summer European tour, which begins May 27 at Lisbon's Rock in Rio festival. The band will warm up for the jaunt with a May 12, 14-15, 17 stand at New York's Hammerstein Ballroom. As for GNR's eternally delayed new album, "Chinese Democracy," no release date is in the offing,

BILLBOARD.com

http://www.miami.com/mld/miamiherald/entertainment/14529943.htm

Posted on Mon, May. 08, 2006

Axl Rose heralds new Guns N' Roses album

JANET MORRISSEY
Associated Press

NEW YORK - Rock recluse Axl Rose made a surprise radio appearance to
proclaim that Guns N' Roses 10-years-in-the-making "Chinese Democracy" album
will finally hit store shelves this fall.

The comments Saturday on Eddie Trunk's syndicated radio show marked the
first interview the painfully private Rose has given since his failed 2002
comeback tour, which was abruptly scrapped midway amid riots and canceled
shows.

Roses impromptu appearance came when former Skid Row frontman Sebastian
Bach, who was co-hosting the show, called Rose's cell phone and patched the
call through the studio.

Quizzed on when the near-mythical album would come out, Rose said, "Sometime
this fall or late fall." His band could be heard rehearsing in the
background. "It will be out this year."

Trunk invited Rose to drop by the studio, and about an hour later he did.

Asked about the aborted 2002 comeback tour, which ended when Rose failed to
appear for a gig in Philadelphia, Rose told Trunk he felt pressured into
doing it before he was ready. But he insisted he has no regrets, since the
short-lived tour helped the new band members to gel. (The 2002 lineup
included keyboard player Dizzy Reed from the original GNR, former Nine Inch
Nails guitarist Robin Finck, bassist Tommy Stinson from the Replacements,
guitar shredder Buckethead, drummer Brian "Brain" Mantia formerly of Primus,
guitarist Richard Fortus from the former Psychedelic Furs and Love Spit
Love, and keyboard player Chris Pittman.)

"Can you tell people why the tour ended at that point?" asked Trunk.

"Umm, no, not exactly," said Rose, declining to discuss it.

Plans are currently in the works for Rose to relaunch his comeback by
playing four shows at New Yorks Hammerstein Ballroom over the next 10 days,
then head to Europe to play several music festivals.

Rose said the band at the Hammerstein shows will be similar to the one that
played the 2002 tour, except for a new lead guitarist, whom he declined to
identify except to say it's not an old GNR member. Buckethead left the band
in 2004.

However, later in the broadcast, Rose seemed to contradict himself when he
said hes been hobnobbing with former GNR guitarist and songwriter Izzy
Stradlin, and strongly hinted that Stradlin may show up for the Hammerstein
shows.

Former GNR guitar maestro Slash may end up back in the band as well, but
probably not before the Hammerstein shows.

Izzy being back would be great. Don't buy that Slash would come back but if he did so would Duff. Good news.

So what the hell was that SPIN review all about. Is that a joke?

So what the hell was that SPIN review all about. Is that a joke?

Well, it did come out on April Fool's day.

:lol: today my cousin brought me a CD-R. It's labeled GNR "The Chinese Democracy" mixtape. Haven't listened to it all, just sampled it. :)

... listened to it. It's GNR alright. It has IRS, Madagascar [studio/demo & live]... 13 tracks total... blah blah. Just release the damn album already.

Today marks fifteen years since the last full album(s) of original Guns N' Roses material was released.

In that time. . .

. . .Izzy Stradlin released six albums
. . .Slash releas