If "Windtalkers" can get one why not "Hard Target" and "Face/Off", which in my view where better films.
Tarantino
02-20-04, 11:35 AM
Maybe those are already his 'directors versions'.
SFranke
02-20-04, 11:36 AM
And also because those pictures didn't lose $100 million.
bluesxman
02-20-04, 11:41 AM
I know there's a longer version of "Hard Target", I have it on VHS. It was cut several times to get an R, i think like 10mins was cut. Not sure about any extra footage for "Face/Off" but the current DVD sucks anyway.
SidneyGreenbach
02-20-04, 11:44 AM
I've heard of that longer version of Hard Target, and Woo was asked of that cut while in Seattle years ago and he basically said that Universal had no interest in the movie anymore. That's what they get for taking Van Damme's side at the moment than Woo's.
bluesxman
02-20-04, 11:53 AM
Guess I'll have to buy the current version of it then. But "Face/Off" deserves a better package. Anyone see the extended "Windtalkers", I've been putting off buying that too.
PixyJunket
02-20-04, 12:08 PM
Originally posted by Tarantino
Maybe those are already his 'directors versions'. :up:
steebo777
02-20-04, 01:07 PM
Originally posted by evitagen
And also because those pictures didn't lose $100 million.
:lol:
matome
02-20-04, 01:20 PM
Originally posted by bluesxman
I know there's a longer version of "Hard Target", I have it on VHS. It was cut several times to get an R, i think like 10mins was cut. Not sure about any extra footage for "Face/Off" but the current DVD sucks anyway.
If so, it will soon be able to be rented from one of DVDtalk's sponsers.
ThatGuamGuy
02-20-04, 02:11 PM
Didn't the studio cut almost an hour out of 'Mission: Impossible 2'?
Mostly, all the set up and character stuff that made the romance believable? [Or, at least, they thought it did; it certainly wasn't in the final cut.]
I can't believe there's more demand for an extended 'Windtalkers' than an extended 'M:I2'.
And also because those pictures didn't lose $100 million.
Do the studios think people are more likely to buy a movie that didn't do well if it's a different cut? I'd think it was the other way around. If I wasn't interested in 'Windtalkers', I'm certainly not interested in 'Windtalkers, plus an hour'.
SFranke
02-20-04, 02:22 PM
Rereleases equate to more money. Some would argue they are the lifeblood of Anchor Bay. If you were MGM, teetering on bankruptcy (I don't know if they still are), you would do what you could to make money, which they decided could be done by making an overblown set that hardcore DVDphiles would be hard-pressed to ignore. Also, sometimes theater peformance and video performance are radically different. Mallrats made $600K at the theater, but the DVD has been a cashcow for Universal. The video rental and sales profits of Austin Powers allowed for the sequel to happen, despite less than stellar performace at the box office.
John Spartan
02-20-04, 02:28 PM
The Japanese cut and several of the Euro cuts (eg, UK definitely) of Hard Target have slightly longer action scenes and some extra dialogue as compared to the US edition. Nicheflix is probably renting out the UK DVD.
Peep
02-20-04, 02:37 PM
It's the Korean cut and I know it's longer and "harder" than the US release. My question is, is it the "Director's Cut" (which is supposedly very violent) or something in between the US version and the DC?
RaynMan2019
02-20-04, 03:05 PM
I want even longer cut's of Woo's Hong Kong stuff. ESPECIALLY his Yun-Fat collaborations.
A Better Tomorrow
A Better Tomorrow II
Bullet in the Head
Once a Thief (which in real life I regretably once was.)
Hard Boiled
The Killer
Drunken Master
There are some others which I'd like to see get the Director's Cut treatment but are way too many to list.
PixyJunket
02-20-04, 03:07 PM
Originally posted by Peep
It's the Korean cut and I know it's longer and "harder" than the US release. My question is, is it the "Director's Cut" (which is supposedly very violent) or something in between the US version and the DC? Probably in between.. Woo was never given the chance to do any sort of DC with it, so it's probably put together from a rough cut, or put together using deleted footage w/o Woo's final word. I remember seeing it on VHS a while back.
ThatGuamGuy
02-20-04, 05:40 PM
Rereleases equate to more money.
That's an absurd generalization. The only way it could be true as a flat rule, as you imply it is, is if DVD production cost $zero, and we all know it doesn't.
you would do what you could to make money, which they decided could be done by making an overblown set that hardcore DVDphiles would be hard-pressed to ignore.
I understand that, but I'd submit that it's more likely that they're teetering close to bankruptcy because their film output is so bad that, when they were looking through their catalog for a quick easy cash-cow, the best thing they could come up with was the director's cut of 'Windtalkers'.
I'm a pretty hardcore DVDphile, but I'd have to have every other John Woo movie before I even considered buying 'Windtalkers'.
Also, sometimes theater peformance and video performance are radically different.
That's true, but 'Windtalkers' didn't do well on video either.
Mallrats made $600K at the theater, but the DVD has been a cashcow for Universal. The video rental and sales profits of Austin Powers allowed for the sequel to happen, despite less than stellar performace at the box office.
Well, yeah, but it's very, very rare for audiences to go see comedies in theaters, especially in the middle '90's. Comedies (almost) *always* make more money on video than in theatres. Even when a comedy is successful in theaters, it becomes uber-successful on video (they often released them priced-to-own immediately, which was rare at that point), because people don't mind watching comedy on a small screen.
Compare that to a giant John Woo epic war movie? I mean, I'm sure there are some people, but I think most people generally like their action and explosions on the bigscreen. (Not to say people won't watch it on TV, I just mean that people won't say, "Oh, I'll wait for video to see that eye candy movie.")
I'll submit the question again, though, since you didn't answer it; why are you saying that a studio is more likely to release a director's cut of a failed movie than a successful one? Because that it what you said, and seem to be trying to defend. I don't understand why you're saying it, and would like to.
QuiGonJosh
02-20-04, 06:30 PM
I just want 5.1 mixes of Killer...Hard Boiled...Better Tomorrow 1&2...and Bullet in the Head...screw Hard Target and Broken Arrow...those are fine...gimme the real stuff!
Schuyler
02-20-04, 06:44 PM
But none of those films were originally released with 5.1 mixes.
I just want 5.1 mixes of Killer...Hard Boiled...Better Tomorrow 1&2...and Bullet in the Head...screw Hard Target and Broken Arrow...those are fine...gimme the real stuff!
QuiGonJosh
02-20-04, 06:59 PM
I dont care...I'd like at least a Dolby Surround mix...man Mono on these flicks sucks! Can you imagine what a really great DTS mix on these films would sound like?
RaynMan2019
02-20-04, 07:09 PM
Yeah! Don't forget an Anamorphic transfer if there isn't one already available.
Yocke
02-20-04, 08:46 PM
They'd have to replace every sound in the movie. And that would just be bad.
bodomnet
02-20-04, 10:25 PM
I agree. I'd buy them. Hard target was a poor dvd (extras wise)
QuiGonJosh
02-21-04, 07:45 AM
Originally posted by Yocke
They'd have to replace every sound in the movie. And that would just be bad.
Nah...well maybe the gunshots and some stuff...but no biggie...
Yocke
02-21-04, 08:50 AM
Originally posted by QuiGonJosh
Nah...well maybe the gunshots and some stuff...but no biggie...
If they did that, everything else would stand out like a sore thumb. Every sound effect in these movies are tinny and sounds hollow. Even if they would replace every sound effect, and all the music, the speech would still stand out.
achau9598
02-21-04, 11:07 AM
Originally posted by ThatGuamGuy
That's an absurd generalization. The only way it could be true as a flat rule, as you imply it is, is if DVD production cost $zero, and we all know it doesn't.
The costs associated with DVD production is a drop-in-the-well compared to the costs involved with making the actual film.
Re-releasing a bad film at least gives them a chance to make a little back.
Julie Walker
02-21-04, 12:10 PM
Actually the Catonese language Mono mixes sound excellent on the dvds. The gunfire is LOUD & full of power. Meanwhile the dubbed English track on the dvd sounds tiny like coming through a tin can & such. So if you are hating the sound based on that track. View it subtitled in Catonese & you will see the real film. No need for a stereo or 5.1 mix! :)
As for Hard Target. I would LOVE an uncensored release of this film. It is not a perfect film,but has some kickass action sequence & is fairly entertaining. But the censorship of the violence really hurts the flm,since it is so obvious. Could this pass uncut with an R today since the MPAA has let more graphic violence slip by with Rs today(though with minor trims in most cases)?
pat00139
02-22-04, 03:42 AM
I just finished watching the R3 Face/Off on DTS and I'm sure it's much better than the Paramount R1 edition. It's not especially great but it's decent. The picture is pretty bad at times.
Anyway, ThatGuamGuy said: ' why are you saying that a studio is more likely to release a director's cut of a failed movie than a successful one?'
Well, maybe the successful movie WAS the director's cut. If it wasn't then maybe it wasn't in the director's contract. Maybe John Woo's contract said that MGM could do what they wanted to the movie for the theatre, but the DVD would have to be good.
Incidentally, if anybody actually has the DVD, you know the extras really suck. I was really disappointed. THe MI2 DVD was WAY better and that was just one disk. (Keep in mind I've only heard the Actors' commentary on the Windtalkers DVD). So even if it is a Special Edition, the DVD isn't anything special.
bluesxman
02-22-04, 07:25 AM
wonder what the specs. for the 'paycheck' dvd will be like? I think Woo was added as director at the last minute to replace the guy that did 'Rush Hour.' so I wont be expecting much.
I would also like to see the full print of 'Bullet in the head', i think the current DVD is 120mins, not sure how much longer the full is.
But Miramax owes it now, and 'hardboiled' and 'the killer', so if they ever decide to release it expect 'bullet" and the others too be cut.
On side note, American studios need to let John Woo do his thing. "Face/Off" was really the only movie that I got that feeling. Wonder what kind of movies he would have made if he stayed in HK.
QuiGonJosh
02-22-04, 08:56 AM
well hes makin a movie now with Chow Yun and Nic Cage that looks to be going back to his HK roots...which Im all for...and I've really enjoyed his american movies...
theneobez
02-22-04, 10:59 AM
It's not going to be an action flick, but I'm still excited.
And as much as I've loved Woo in the past, NO ONE forced him to do a crap movie like Paycheck.
QuiGonJosh
02-22-04, 01:25 PM
Paycheck was a good flick...suprised me...
but Im an Affleck...Uma...and Woo fan...so...
Josh Z
02-22-04, 06:47 PM
Originally posted by QuiGonJosh
I dont care...I'd like at least a Dolby Surround mix...man Mono on these flicks sucks! Can you imagine what a really great DTS mix on these films would sound like?
There's an anamorphic/DTS release of Hard Boiled in Hong Kong. The DTS sounds pretty awful.
RaynMan2019
02-22-04, 06:52 PM
I guess what I'm figuring from you guys is that you'd want a correctly done DTS transfer/mix. I also came to the conclusion that it doesn't matter that even if you do want DTS, it also has to do how well it's presented on the DVD...
BTW, The Hunt for Red October doesn't sound good at ALL on DTS. Wanna know why?! BECAUSE IT SOUNDS EXCELLENT! Ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh yeah!
Ray
Gyno Rhino
02-22-04, 07:47 PM
Another thread hijacked.
RaynMan2019
02-22-04, 07:51 PM
I highly recommend the Jack Ryan series, Special Colletor's Editions of course, if you want to hear a really kick ass DTS mix!
This example is 100% true for me.
QuiGonJosh
02-23-04, 06:43 AM
back to real good movies...I just checked the Mono tracks last night...I dont think I had watched these movies on since I got my sound system...and damn they do sound really sweet...I forgot...screw DTS on these movies!
QuiGonJosh
02-23-04, 12:09 PM
so any word on Bullet in the Head? Does any Region 1 company own it and gonna release it...I hate to pay $50 for a single DVD with no extras at all!
bluesxman
02-23-04, 12:37 PM
miramax owes Bullet In The Heas, as well as The Killer and Hard Boiled. I bet if they ever decide to release them, look for them to be cut, true to Miramax's past.
Julie Walker
02-23-04, 01:23 PM
Miramax planned all three of those for release sometime last year or the year before,but quickly dropped out of it. They never came about & were never announced to this very day. Mostly alot of fan uproar was going on over the films being cut etc etc. So I guess Miramax got cold feet.
Still that just proves the patheticness of the 'policy' & why studios should not bother with anti-unrated/NC-17 rules for home video & stop trying to butchur films for mass acceptance,since these are cult films,not mainstream films!
Buy: