metman86

Can someone please explain the difference between a Mitsubishi WS-48413 and a WS-48313. I can not find a difference. except in price, and I believe that I have seen both at some point cost more than the other. Any help would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks.

Spyfy

I believe Quad-Shield focus and NetCommand are the major ones. Check out Mitsu's website or search over at avsforum. I've got a 65313 and have been very pleased thus far with it.

boston lou

I was comparing these last night. And the Quad Shield focus and NetCommand are the only things I could notice.

I'd love the Quad Shield (i think) but the NetCommand just sounds like an expensive Universal Remote replacement for people who aren't tech savvy?

jscout

In some ways, NetCommand is better than a universal remote. Imagine being able to point the remote at the TV, choose a device/input, and then the TV does all the necessary switching for you. The best part? Unlike many universal remotes where you have to keep the remote pointed until all the macros have finished, with NetCommand you don't have to keep the remote pointed. As long as the supplied IR emitters are pointed at your components, NetCommand takes care of everything. One thing it can't do is turn down your lights.

Bagheera

heh heh

I posted this exact same question about two weeks ago.

The answer I got was that some people felt the quad field makes a better picture and others think its complete BS. I could care less about the remote when you consider there is like a $300 price difference. I just want to get rid of jaggies.

metman86

thanks all, I went ahead and bought the 413. Waiting for Saturday delivery, can't wait.

jscout

Congratulations. You're gonna love the TV. A really good investment is Digital Video Essentials. It's cheaper than Avia and more up to date. I have both, but I usually recommend DVE to all my friends.

Some people say let it break in before calibrating, but I say do it right away. If you own your own copy of DVE, you can recalibrate during and after the break-in period. Your initial go with DVE will get contrast/brightness/color, etc. down to a reasonable level. Then you can watch it until it's broken in and recalibrate. Besides, practice makes perfect. I recalibrated my TV four times in the first six months (although I also performed several tweaks too).

drmoze

Just as great an investment for your Mitsu is hometheaterspot. There you can learn how to access the service menus to adjust overscan and, as a real bonus, linearity so the convergence grids are nice and straight everywhere. Makes a real difference.

jscout

Yes, indeed. I forgot to mention HomeTheaterSpot, cuz I had to run off to a meeting. All of the tweaking that I refered to above came from the Spot.

Drifter

Hate to sound like a dam newbiw but what is "DVE"? I have the Mits. WS-65869 and have had it for about 1 year! Where can I get DVE?

chipmac

DVE = Digital Video Essentials. Either this disc or one called Avia are DVDs with test screens and intructions on how to check and set up your display properly rather than by eye. They also have audio tests to calibrate your surround setup. DVE is newer but harder to use while Avia is more expensive but easier to use. Avia is also missing tests for DTS and is known for not having an accurate greyscale test.

Bagheera

I finnally found a place with a side by side compare of the 313 v. 413 and man it is a huge difference. I could not belive how awful the 313 looked compared to the 413

chipmac

Unless they were both calibrated equally there is absolutely no way you can compare the PQ of them side by side. Although I would buy the 413 on specs alone you just can't compare the two on a showroom floor. You'd probably be very surprised how close they really are once properly setup.

Bagheera

Hey if you think these are similar enought then say so, I can get a much better deal on the 313 at best buy with the rebates and promos they have then if i buy the 413 at a high end store.

chipmac

Then yes I do think they're similar enough that you'll be happy with either one once they're calibrated professionally or tweaked by the user to bring it close to a pro calibration. However my point was that you could compare two 55313s and still have vastly different results unless they're calibrated the same. That's why I said that comparing them in the store is useless. With an RPTV the focus, geometry, convergence, greyscale, normal user settings as well as source signal will play a very large part in PQ from set to set and brand to brand when compared in the store. But once all of these are set to a calibrated standard any brand or model will give PQ that you'll be happy with. I recommend to people to look beyond those things and find out how reliable a brand or model is, look at features that are important to you and finally price.

metman86

DVE... how important is this right out of the box? I was hoping to just be able to relax and watch tv. Until now my biggest concern was which movie I was gonna watch first. Ugh. Is DVE complicated to use? How expensive and or necessary is a professional calibration? Are these calibrations different from the convergence alignment? Yes, I am new to this, in case you couldn't tell. The tv is due in tomorrow morning, cant wait.
Thanks again folks I really appreciate your help and information.

Bagheera

chipmac

do you know anything about last years models, I know that they dont have DVI but they are selling the 55311 for 1699 right now. How is the quality of the 311 model compared the the 413 models of this year?

drmoze

Out of the box, FIRST turn the contrast down and everything else to approximate levels. (Contrast and color on Mitsus should be about 40%, brightness about 50%, tint in the middle or a notch toward the green side.) Note: The picture should look 'natural' so that people and objects appear similar to the physical objects around your tv in an averagely-lit room--then turn the lights down a bit but not off. Too many people crank up the color and contrast way beyond reallistic levels. Proper contrast in particular will help avoid burn-in.

NEXT, order DVE and join hometheaterspot. Find and read the Mitsu tweaks. Read carefully because you can mess stuff up if you're not careful.

THEN, get DVE, do basic calibrations pluis tweaks.

FINALLY, enjoy your Mitsu even more. Recalibrate once in a while if things seem off, as your tv burns in. Check convergence more frequently and reconverge if you ever move the tv at all.

chipmac

I don't have first hand experience and only know from playing around with them in stores and from what I've read. As with every year's Mits models the 311 and 511 are the same except for the built in tuner and the 411 and 611 are the same for the exact same reasons but are supposed to have better optics and a few more features. This year's 413 and 613 as well as the 313 and 513 are the same way. Some people claim that the 313 has a slightly more noisey picture than the 413 but that could be due to a variety of things like signal, cables and source. Besides DVI, the biggest PQ improvement you'll find from last year to this year is the improved line doubler for 480i source signals and the improved stretch modes for both SD and HD sources. As I have said before, once calibrated or tweaked most people will be very happy with either the lower end or the higher end models but the improvements to this years line with the improvements I listed are enough to pass over any deals you might find on last year's leftovers IMO.

metman86 - Convergence really isn't a tweak. It's a necessary task to help you get the sharpest image you can. I've never used DVE but have used Avia so I can't compare but either one shouild be used as soon as possible when you first get your TV. If you decide to hold off then at least follow drmoze's guidelines to put you in the ballpark. A full pro level calibration is a very involved process that sets things up to a known standard for color, tint, contrast, brightness, greyscale, gamma, overscan amount and geometry, convergence linearity, optics cleaning and red push removal. Almost all of this can be done yourself if you want to spend the time learning and studying the tweaks section at the HomeTheaterSpot.com which is open to paid members. To get things really precise requires highlevel equipment and experience which is why many hire a pro to do it but a DIYer can get very good results and a big improvement from the OOB state.

Bagheera

man you great thnks alot chip

jscout

BTW, the best of the "easy" tweaks you can find at HomeTheaterSpot once you become a paid member (no affiliation other than being another paid member) is the red push tweak. I believe that for all new Mits, you can do it via the service menu. Once I fixed the red and recalibrated, everything suddenly looked natural. Before the fix, there was always a hint of neon-ness in the red no matter how I adjusted the red in the tint setting. Even if I did get red to look good, green was always off.

I might be wrong, but I think I remember reading somewhere that all CRT RPTVs have this problem where there's just too much red. It's a factory setting thing, along the lines of high contrast out-of-the-box. Toning down the red in the tint doesn't really fix the problem, it justs shifts it. The best way is to fix it so that the red is proper to begin with.

P.S. Don't bother posting to ask for it for free. You'll only get the response recommending that you join. Consider it a right of passage. But I can tell you, it's a great club to be in.

kthemmes

anyone know of any sites that offer this information for free. as much as I like websites that offer information on wide range of topics, I just cant afford to sign up to every site that becomes a pay site. Nothing against Homrtheaterspot.com, Im sure its paid content is excellent, but there has to be other resourses available on th net.

chipmac

I'm not aware of any other sites that have the kind of specific info to Mits that the Spot has. You really don't need to pay to find the tweaks as they're only posts and threads that are moved to a specific tweaks area for better organization. Most if not all can still be found in other ways at the site by searching and reading other's posts. However the threads that have been moved to the tweaks area are not only better organized and condensed to just the essential info needed but many have pictures and warnings about what not to do. I understand where you're coming from about pay sites but when you pay $2000 to $5000 for a TV what's another $50 for a copy of DVE and a Spot membership. Just lay off a couple of DVD movie purchases and it's done and the benefits to a serious tweaker far outway the cost.

chipmac

Also in case you've never visited the Spot and don't already know this your paid membership entitles you to other things like discounts coupons for BetterCables.com, group buys on other electronics from OneCall.com and StudioExperience.com. So besides the $25 membership helping to keep the SPot going and giving you information on pretty much how to do your own calibration you can get that money back in savings on other things. This might help make the small membership fee seem a lot less painful.

jscout

I totally agree with the concept of free info on the web. I too cannot afford to join every site that becomes a paid site. In fact, the Spot is the only site that I have paid a membership to. As far as I'm concerned, it was the only one that was worth it.

For me, the key to the tweaks section is that it was compiled by a professional calibrator. Many of these tweaks are the same tweaks a good calibrator would perform if you hired one to come to your home. As you can expect, they're not cheap either, costing $300-$700 and up. The extended warranty doesn't usually include calibration. Sure they say they come "clean" your set, but that's about it.

For $25 and a bit of effort, I got a great education and a TV with one hell of a picture. BTW, DVE and Avia can be found online for $17 and $37 shipped, respectively, from DDD.