Enterprise 04-09-03
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Enterprise 04-09-03
This week's episode is titled "Judgment". It's the first part of an arc that will lead through the rest of the season and into next season.
"Archer stands trial before the Klingon Tribunal who have charged him with firing on a Klingon warship and providing aid to refugees on the run from the Klingon empire for which the punishment is death. When the prosecution paints a skewed and violent picture of the events in question, Archer challenges his appointed Klingon legal counsel to buck their cruel justice system and let him present his side of the story in the hopes that he will prevail. In the process, Archer learns that Klingons haven't always been a warrior society and that there are Klingons who want to lead a more peaceful existence."
"Archer stands trial before the Klingon Tribunal who have charged him with firing on a Klingon warship and providing aid to refugees on the run from the Klingon empire for which the punishment is death. When the prosecution paints a skewed and violent picture of the events in question, Archer challenges his appointed Klingon legal counsel to buck their cruel justice system and let him present his side of the story in the hopes that he will prevail. In the process, Archer learns that Klingons haven't always been a warrior society and that there are Klingons who want to lead a more peaceful existence."
#3
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Quoth tanman <HR SIZE=1>This actually sounds like it could be (dare I say it) good.<HR SIZE=1>
I was thinking the exact same thing! Except replace the word "good" with "complete suck."
das
#4
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Given Original Trek called first contact with the Klingons to be "disastrous", I sure hope it starts going that route.
Now that I think about it, Archer isn't the best at first contact so it's only a matter of time.
Since the set in the preview looks exactly the same as STVI, will Archers legal counsel be yet another distant relative of Worf?
Now that I think about it, Archer isn't the best at first contact so it's only a matter of time.
Since the set in the preview looks exactly the same as STVI, will Archers legal counsel be yet another distant relative of Worf?
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Thanks.
Im actually looking forward to this one. Throughout the almost two-year run of this travesty, Dumb & Dumber have inflicted upon us various alien languages that have been totally unstructured and rambling, sounding much like an infant's attempt at inventing speech. Ive developed more coherent dialects in the act of passion or, more appropriately, in the privacy of my bathroom.
In the very first episode, we were treated to a Klingon whos language skills resembled someone in desperate need of the Heimlich Maneuver. While Im certainly no expert, I recognized absolutely nothing that had even the slightest resemblance to Klingonese. Since much work on this has been done long ago, and D&D have chosen to ignore it completely, Im hoping there will be a small amount of Klingon spoken before the UT takes over.
Kplah!
BTW, those guys wouldn't know a story arc if it started spitting out animals two-by-two...
Im actually looking forward to this one. Throughout the almost two-year run of this travesty, Dumb & Dumber have inflicted upon us various alien languages that have been totally unstructured and rambling, sounding much like an infant's attempt at inventing speech. Ive developed more coherent dialects in the act of passion or, more appropriately, in the privacy of my bathroom.
In the very first episode, we were treated to a Klingon whos language skills resembled someone in desperate need of the Heimlich Maneuver. While Im certainly no expert, I recognized absolutely nothing that had even the slightest resemblance to Klingonese. Since much work on this has been done long ago, and D&D have chosen to ignore it completely, Im hoping there will be a small amount of Klingon spoken before the UT takes over.
Kplah!
BTW, those guys wouldn't know a story arc if it started spitting out animals two-by-two...
Last edited by Wizdar; 04-09-03 at 07:48 AM.
#9
DVD Talk Limited Edition
I'm hoping that this episode will lead to something good and the maybe 10 people that are still watching this show will be rewarded for our loyalty (there are six on the boards so far and I know a couple others still watching).
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Loyalty?
Its a tough choice. With this show being rerun on Sunday, itll be hard to resist the repeat of Tremors thatll be playing opposite.
Bandoman doesnt count. Hes not watching, just posting.
Its a tough choice. With this show being rerun on Sunday, itll be hard to resist the repeat of Tremors thatll be playing opposite.
Bandoman doesnt count. Hes not watching, just posting.
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Originally posted by Chew
Given Original Trek called first contact with the Klingons to be "disastrous", I sure hope it starts going that route.
Now that I think about it, Archer isn't the best at first contact so it's only a matter of time.
Since the set in the preview looks exactly the same as STVI, will Archers legal counsel be yet another distant relative of Worf?
Given Original Trek called first contact with the Klingons to be "disastrous", I sure hope it starts going that route.
Now that I think about it, Archer isn't the best at first contact so it's only a matter of time.
Since the set in the preview looks exactly the same as STVI, will Archers legal counsel be yet another distant relative of Worf?
And so far, from those who have already seen it in Canada, there were 2 positives, and 1 really negative on the TrekBBS.
#13
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Here's a positive review from a confessed-basher:
SPOILERS!!!!!!!!
SPOILERS!!!!!!!!
I shall now pass Judgment on:
Enterprise: The Undiscovered Depth.
I make no apologies. I hated the trailer for this ep. It was a re-hash of Star Trek 6 The Undiscovered Country, and once again I laughed at B&Bs insistence of stealing from well made Trek (I mean they dont seem to plagiarize their own movies do they?) and I wondered what trek was coming to. I make no apologies either that I tired of grunting roaring Klingons and long for the smart, sophisticated Klingons of old.
So with that in mind, with all the odds stacked against it, how did it fair?
Grade: B+
What? Grade B+? Reno, have you taken to smoking crack?
The first question I asked was: How did Archer get here? How was he captured? This Im afraid is what let the episode down it was never answered. In fact, as is common with a Berman production, the question is never even asked, in the hope the audience wont notice. Well I did, I always do. Answer the question.
But that is actually quite minor compared to the rest of the ep. The SFX were astonishingly terrific. Absolutely beautiful. Granted they were copies of shots from The Two Towers, and Attack of the Clones, if they werent The Undiscovered Country but to see this stuff in a humble TV show? Blew me away.
I loved the structure of this episode, the fact that it wasnt linear. We start with Archer on trial its a straight lift of TUC then cut to the embarrassing theme tune which immediately takes all the drama out of it.
Yes, my heart sank at this point. But immediately after, Act One gets you. Seeing Archer through Klingon eyes, spouting twisted propaganda was excellent. The battle in the planet rings was stunning. So beautiful. Like some of those Trek novel covers come to life.
The sound track is great, no wallpaper this week.
And then lines of dialogue start creeping why its almost like the writer of this episode had hung out on a BBS and wanted to address the concerns of fans
This human not only committed a crime. This Human has committed am act of War!
Followed not long after by:
He (Archer) is guilty. Of being a self righteous nuisance. Yes, he is guilty of that.
Im thinking he havent we been complaining about that? To address it in a direct way makes you suddenly like that quality about Archer. It works and it works well.
Archer shares a drink with his advocate. Its blood wine. Archer coughs Whats it the blood of ?
Im rubbing my eyes. Is this Star Trek Im watching? Why I think it is!
In Rura Pentha, Archer and his advocate argue.
Youre a fool.
Archer: Youre welcome
Are all Humans like this?
Archer: Whats that? Fair?
Stupid.
Im on the floor. This is how to deal with it.
But we get more than neat one liners here we get a depth to Klingons, their society and we are faced with a very stark realization. Judgment is a tremendous book end to the Klingon question.
Where The Undiscovered Country saw the court as a judgment ending the old warrior way and bringing peace, Judgment is the beginning of the warrior way. We are witnessing the Klingon descent into darker times.
Archers advocate is a noble man. A man of high culture, and his noble sacrifice at the end is made all the more bitter because we know his actions will be in vain.
Theres a depth here. I enjoyed this Klingon episode more than Ive enjoyed a Klingon episode in quite some time. I saw something new. An interesting facet. Even if it was wearing the clothes of past adventures there was more to it than that. Much more.
Kudos to Mr. Goodman. We got a story this week. An Actual story. No fluff.
Ysee, thats all it takes to win over a cynic like me.
Enterprise: The Undiscovered Depth.
I make no apologies. I hated the trailer for this ep. It was a re-hash of Star Trek 6 The Undiscovered Country, and once again I laughed at B&Bs insistence of stealing from well made Trek (I mean they dont seem to plagiarize their own movies do they?) and I wondered what trek was coming to. I make no apologies either that I tired of grunting roaring Klingons and long for the smart, sophisticated Klingons of old.
So with that in mind, with all the odds stacked against it, how did it fair?
Grade: B+
What? Grade B+? Reno, have you taken to smoking crack?
The first question I asked was: How did Archer get here? How was he captured? This Im afraid is what let the episode down it was never answered. In fact, as is common with a Berman production, the question is never even asked, in the hope the audience wont notice. Well I did, I always do. Answer the question.
But that is actually quite minor compared to the rest of the ep. The SFX were astonishingly terrific. Absolutely beautiful. Granted they were copies of shots from The Two Towers, and Attack of the Clones, if they werent The Undiscovered Country but to see this stuff in a humble TV show? Blew me away.
I loved the structure of this episode, the fact that it wasnt linear. We start with Archer on trial its a straight lift of TUC then cut to the embarrassing theme tune which immediately takes all the drama out of it.
Yes, my heart sank at this point. But immediately after, Act One gets you. Seeing Archer through Klingon eyes, spouting twisted propaganda was excellent. The battle in the planet rings was stunning. So beautiful. Like some of those Trek novel covers come to life.
The sound track is great, no wallpaper this week.
And then lines of dialogue start creeping why its almost like the writer of this episode had hung out on a BBS and wanted to address the concerns of fans
This human not only committed a crime. This Human has committed am act of War!
Followed not long after by:
He (Archer) is guilty. Of being a self righteous nuisance. Yes, he is guilty of that.
Im thinking he havent we been complaining about that? To address it in a direct way makes you suddenly like that quality about Archer. It works and it works well.
Archer shares a drink with his advocate. Its blood wine. Archer coughs Whats it the blood of ?
Im rubbing my eyes. Is this Star Trek Im watching? Why I think it is!
In Rura Pentha, Archer and his advocate argue.
Youre a fool.
Archer: Youre welcome
Are all Humans like this?
Archer: Whats that? Fair?
Stupid.
Im on the floor. This is how to deal with it.
But we get more than neat one liners here we get a depth to Klingons, their society and we are faced with a very stark realization. Judgment is a tremendous book end to the Klingon question.
Where The Undiscovered Country saw the court as a judgment ending the old warrior way and bringing peace, Judgment is the beginning of the warrior way. We are witnessing the Klingon descent into darker times.
Archers advocate is a noble man. A man of high culture, and his noble sacrifice at the end is made all the more bitter because we know his actions will be in vain.
Theres a depth here. I enjoyed this Klingon episode more than Ive enjoyed a Klingon episode in quite some time. I saw something new. An interesting facet. Even if it was wearing the clothes of past adventures there was more to it than that. Much more.
Kudos to Mr. Goodman. We got a story this week. An Actual story. No fluff.
Ysee, thats all it takes to win over a cynic like me.
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Here's a negative review
SPOILERS!!!!!!!!
SPOILERS!!!!!!!!
We open with a low rent version of the court from STVI including the same judge costume. Archer is led in and charged with interfering with the empire - sentence: death!
We come back with a standard court scene with the protagonists each telling a different version of Enterprise's encounter with a D-5 cruiser ( nice cross between a D-7 and a Bird of Prey ) the Klingons looking for some non-Klingon "rebels" who've fled an abandoned Klingon colony. Nice space battle in the rings of a Saturn-like planet. Archer convinces his counsul to buck the system and actually defend him - result: Archer gets life on Rura Penthe and his lawyer gets a year.
Now down in the mines, Reed unbelievably pops up stating he bribed his way in on a dilithium freighter, and they just waltz out, The lawyer idealisticly wants to stay.
The best way to describe this episode is thin.
The usual poor script with holes ( no explanation of how Archer ended up in Klingon custody ) and a slapped togeather quick end. ( wich is highly unbelievable )
Nice effects, decent acting, good D-5 cruiser design, cardboard characters ( the Klingon lawyer who Archer convinces to fight the system ) and big suprise, bad writing.
There was one interesting conversation about the classes of Klingon society, and a recent shift toward the warrior class and mindless violence.
Still I give it a D-
We come back with a standard court scene with the protagonists each telling a different version of Enterprise's encounter with a D-5 cruiser ( nice cross between a D-7 and a Bird of Prey ) the Klingons looking for some non-Klingon "rebels" who've fled an abandoned Klingon colony. Nice space battle in the rings of a Saturn-like planet. Archer convinces his counsul to buck the system and actually defend him - result: Archer gets life on Rura Penthe and his lawyer gets a year.
Now down in the mines, Reed unbelievably pops up stating he bribed his way in on a dilithium freighter, and they just waltz out, The lawyer idealisticly wants to stay.
The best way to describe this episode is thin.
The usual poor script with holes ( no explanation of how Archer ended up in Klingon custody ) and a slapped togeather quick end. ( wich is highly unbelievable )
Nice effects, decent acting, good D-5 cruiser design, cardboard characters ( the Klingon lawyer who Archer convinces to fight the system ) and big suprise, bad writing.
There was one interesting conversation about the classes of Klingon society, and a recent shift toward the warrior class and mindless violence.
Still I give it a D-
#16
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Wow, this was an absolutely FANTASTIC episode ...
... and by "absolutely fantastic" I mean, "the same ol' crap."
Pull the sets and plot and entire paragraphs of dialogue from The Undiscovered Country, add some self-important orchestration, slap on a cliche ending, and you've got a winner! Credit to Hertzler who did a very good job, and I agree with the crack-smoking Reno that the development of the Klingons was faily well done, but in the end it's only slightly less hollow and repetitive than the rest.
das
... and by "absolutely fantastic" I mean, "the same ol' crap."
Pull the sets and plot and entire paragraphs of dialogue from The Undiscovered Country, add some self-important orchestration, slap on a cliche ending, and you've got a winner! Credit to Hertzler who did a very good job, and I agree with the crack-smoking Reno that the development of the Klingons was faily well done, but in the end it's only slightly less hollow and repetitive than the rest.
das
#17
DVD Talk Legend
Well, I got my hopes up in the first 20 minutes: no Berman/Braga script, Klingon POV storyline, pretty cool FX shot (the Enterprise approaching the ringed planet).
Then it just all fell apart there. UPN showing STVI indeed.
Had they actually left Archer on Rura Penthe until the season finale, it would of at least ended better for me.
The Klingon guards just let them walk out?
Then it just all fell apart there. UPN showing STVI indeed.
Had they actually left Archer on Rura Penthe until the season finale, it would of at least ended better for me.
The Klingon guards just let them walk out?
#19
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Originally posted by Wizdar
Bandoman doesnt count.
Bandoman doesnt count.
This episode actually didn't completely suck donkey balls.
But..."Duras" the prosecutor? Ah-HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!
#20
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Quoth Bandoman <HR SIZE=1>But..."Duras" the prosecutor? Ah-HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA! <HR SIZE=1>
Didn't he also invoke some rule of Koloth or something? They didn't even try to come up with original Klingon names.
das
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well family names are passed on
Colonel Worf anyone?
and the dilithium mines didn't look too bad. plenty of lighting, unlike 140 years later when it'll be dark for Kirk, but at least kirk got a laser to mine with
and yes, the plot holes were big enough to drive a starship through, just like Nemesis, but that's to be expected with B&B
the episode could have been good, if it hadn't stolen so much from ST6
Colonel Worf anyone?
and the dilithium mines didn't look too bad. plenty of lighting, unlike 140 years later when it'll be dark for Kirk, but at least kirk got a laser to mine with
and yes, the plot holes were big enough to drive a starship through, just like Nemesis, but that's to be expected with B&B
the episode could have been good, if it hadn't stolen so much from ST6
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Originally posted by Bandoman
This episode actually didn't completely suck donkey balls.
This episode actually didn't completely suck donkey balls.
This would have been good, except it was a COMPLETE RIPOFF!!
Kudos to Mr. Goodman. We got a story this week. An Actual story. No fluff.
Bando, I didn't know you were missing a finger.
#23
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Hey now come on guys. I thought it was a great episode. Seriously. Where everyone seems to crack on it for being a rip off, I think it is nice to actually see something that resembles something Star Trek. I thought it did a lot to introduce the Klingons in this time line. We should stick with this much more than those suliban. I thought it was neat how they introduce another Duras and brought back the Uru penthe (sp. whatever). Yeah the plot holes were pretty big. They definately should have actually risked something and left him there for a few episodes. Not everything need to be resolved within the last ten minutes Mr. Berman.
And yes Wizdar, donkeys do have balls.
And yes Wizdar, donkeys do have balls.
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The upcoming episode, "Bounty" stems from what happened in "Judgment". The Klingons are still hunting Archer down and hire bounty hunters to capture him. Then, the Klingons will be back in the season finale, so this was Part 1 of an at least 4 part arc.
#25
DVD Talk Legend
Originally posted by MvRojo
The upcoming episode, "Bounty" stems from what happened in "Judgment". The Klingons are still hunting Archer down and hire bounty hunters to capture him. Then, the Klingons will be back in the season finale, so this was Part 1 of an at least 4 part arc.
The upcoming episode, "Bounty" stems from what happened in "Judgment". The Klingons are still hunting Archer down and hire bounty hunters to capture him. Then, the Klingons will be back in the season finale, so this was Part 1 of an at least 4 part arc.
Another thing bugging me: Did they even bother to explain how Archer ended up in Klingon hands?