Liver&Onions

http://cube.ign.com/news/38642.html

Sweet...now I have to upgrade my receiver...

belboz

So wait, are they not going to support Dolby Digital? Dolby Pro Logic II is a huge step down. I thought they were doing DD 5.1?

Liver&Onions

From what I have read, DD is very tough if not impossible to do on the fly... so DPL2 is better than nothing. PS2 uses DD in cut-scenes only, and will use DTS for in game...

after reading the hands-on impression the guys said aboot the DPL2, it sounds as if it is a very good thing...

Groucho

Here's another article that goes more in-depth on their choice of Pro Logic 2:

http://cube.ign.com/news/38639.html

It's a good read.

belboz

I haven't heard Dolby Pro Logic II, so I'll reserve judgment on that part. It may well turn out to sound very close to DD 5.1, though I'm highly skeptical.

For any software developer to try and characterize DPL2 as a 5.1 channel surround sound seems pretty sleazy. There's a very clear distinction between 6 discrete channels vs. 6 virtual channels matrixed into 2 discrete channels. And to try to spin it as uncompressed and full range, is total marketing BS.

It sounds like the hardware's just not up to real-time DD 5.1 encoding. That's too bad.

Flay

I guess I will have to suffer with Dolby Digital in most of my XBox games.

Liver&Onions

and suffer with latency....

the interview Groucho posted says some good stuff about DOlby Digital and games...if you haven't read it yet, I suggest doing so.

jeffdsmith

Indeed DD is very difficult to do on the fly in a interactive game. Any game that supports DD at this time will suffer the same non-interactive audio that the Playstation did. In addition there will also be an extra load on the hardware.

In other words, when a sudden enemy were to pop on the screen, the backround audio would remain a constant stream with simple "effects" overlapping. That is if the developers chose not to include a seperate "track" for that paticular scene. Where as using a seperate different sudio format actually allows you to create a truely interactive world with less limitation.

So in the end you are sacrificing audio quality, for an overall video game quality if you will. Some people see it as trival, but many hardcore gamers prefer the later to a standard red-book audio style format. After all, it is about the game, not the music exactly.

Pertaining to RS2 directly, the audio is being done by Factor 5, which also did the N64 version. They do amazing things in audio quality so I think we have little to fear there.

Flay

I may be suffering with latency, but my pocketbook will be just fine. I won't have to dish out the dough for a Dolby Pro Logic II receiver.

Latency may be an issue with the Gamecube's hardware. None of the XBox developers are complaining about latency. They find it quite easy to program in Dolby Digital on the XBox from what I have read over at IGN.

Liver&Onions

I'm not making this into a console war, but PS2 has the option of using DD, but are not. THey use DTS for their 5.1 output. And like the previous post stated, DD can be used for non-interactive sounds but you will miss out on other ingame interactive sounds.

Flay

The PS2 will use real time DTS 5.1 in 2 games so far, SSX tricky and NHL 2002.

The XBox is slated to use real time DD in the majority if not all of the 30 games at launch. And hopefully in every game after that.

Liver&Onions

As my granny used to say...the proof is in the pudding. Since I have not heard any of these consoles in a surround environment, it's tough to comment. However, based on information I have read on DD, and DPL(2), and DTS, there is inevitiable latency with DD in real-time games...infact a time was listed... 50 - 100ms, for DD.

I stopped reading info on the Xbox soon after I came to terms with it being a glorified PC...and after hearing of the windows blue screen making an appearence or two, I still stay away from it's info... but come Jan 2002, I will give each system a fair shot... latency or not...

belboz

I finally got around to reading that article that Groucho linked. It sounds like the mixing and encoding for DD 5.1 is significantly more processor intensive than DPL2. They stated that they saw latency times of 50 to 100 ms, but that's a function of hardware. I assume that those times are what they saw in tests with the Gamecube.

I'm not sure if the problem is in the DSP or in the system design, like maybe there's a memory bottleneck somewhere. Anyway, it's apparent that while capable of DD 5.1 output, the Gamecube was never designed to use DD 5.1 in-game as a primary feature.

That said, one video frame lasts a bit over 33 ms, so if they can get it down to below that, I'm guessing it'd be fine. They're not so far off, that it's impossible to imagine some developer figuring out a way to do it in the future.

It's interesting that the PS2 also hasn't shown any ability to do DD 5.1 in-game, probably because of the latency issue as well; but yet reports are that some developers will soon be using DTS 5.1. I've always guessed that DTS encoding was probably easier to do than DD encoding, so this sort of reinforces that.

Anyway, maybe someone will figure out how to do DTS 5.1 with the GC as well. That'd be nice, since the DTS decoder in my receiver has been virtually useless to me so far.

Aghama

Anyone know of a Denon dealer in south florida that takes trade-ins?

Josh H

This is a cool idea. However, even though I'm getting a GC and Rogue Leader, I'm not about to upgrade my receiver just to get better sound in a video game. I play to have fun, I really don't care about audio quality or graphics as long as the game is fun to play. From the interview it sounds like the game will still sound very good in plain Pro-logic, or even stereo for those without a home theater system.